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VDroop/LLC Load Line Calibration Question.....

Discussion in 'Overclocking & Cooling' started by 20mmrain, Jan 24, 2010.

  1. 20mmrain

    20mmrain

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    I have been doing a lot of research on this subject lately and want to know what you guys think about it?
    In Over clocking leave LLC/V-Droop enabled or Disable it. A lot of people on the web say that you should leave it off until you find a stable over clock and then you should re-enable it. To see if you can push your voltages even further.

    While some others say that you should leave it enabled at all times because it will actually increase the life span of your CPU. They say that if you disable it...... you will get spikes in your voltage and you will almost definitely shorten the life of your CPU.

    Then there is the final group of people.... (who I guess I am a part of) that says leave it off when over clocking period. You will get a more accurate reading in CPU monitoring programs as well as you will get a more stable Over clock. You can also then on your own lower and lower the voltages until you find the ones that will give you the best temps and the most stability. Also if your voltages with out V-Droop are with in your CPU's spec you should create no damage anyway.

    So the reason I ask this question is that I tried enabling V-Droop today with my Over clock and then ran Intel Burn Test On High Memory settings for 35 reps. Well by the second rep I failed.
    But if I run the same test with V-Droop Disabled I can run the test without error.

    Is this maybe because I already found my close to my lowest possible voltage...??? I believe so. Also since my Over clock is a mild one my voltages are with in Intel's Spec.

    So here are my specs right now if we want to use my specs as a talking point..... but otherwise the general question is here...... what do you think With or Without V-Droop/LLC?

    CPU Multi: (x20)
    CPU Freq: 180
    PCIe: 100
    QPI Feq: 4.270GTs
    MCH: Auto
    Bootup VCore: 1.268v
    Eventual Vcore: 1.250v
    DIMM Voltage: 1.50v
    Bootup CPU VTT: 1.125v
    Eventual CPU VTT: 1.125v
    CPU PLL: 1.80v
    PCH: 1.10v
    V-Droop (Disabled)
    RAM Ratio: Standard(2:8)@1442MHz
    Timings 9-9-9-24-74 CMD:1T
  2. DirectorC

    DirectorC New Member

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    That is some retard logic right there. That makes no sense. Mostly all that LLC does is not push unnecessary volts through your CPU while it's idle. In 'Load Line' your voltages drop a little AFTER the CPU is in load, and you have high voltage going through it in idle. I have no idea why. This is what LLC helps calibrate.

    Anyway, LLC doesn't affect how quick you find your max voltage, it just keeps the voltage steady between power shifts.
  3. 20mmrain

    20mmrain

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    I also forgot to mention one big talking point. I guess temps in my view would have a big thing to do with it too.
    Like for instance again relating to my example.

    Right now I Idle Without V-Droop at around 23C which about what you would idle with a stock Intel HSF. (If I were clocked to stock speeds)
    My load temps are 53C at 100% max load after 50 runs with Intel Burn test. Again which is about what you would have if you were using a stock Intel HSF (if I were clocked to stock speeds)

    So the people out there saying that it is important to have that feature enabled or it will cause damage to your CPU.....I don't think saying that has much merit as long as you are staying with in the stock operating temps.

    Just to throw this opinion out into the conversation also. Maybe I have my opinions completely wrong. I have been over clocking only for a short time.
  4. 20mmrain

    20mmrain

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    I thought it was some retard logic as well. I am not the one who is suggesting that logic. I am only bringing it up to ask! Since I have little experience compared to some of you guys.

    Also in some posts I have read that LLC and Vdroop options are related. Am I wrong? Isn't that what the Without Vdroop options does as well. Keeps Voltage stable between loads?

    it also seems that everyone has a different definition of these two options. That is why I put them together.
  5. DirectorC

    DirectorC New Member

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    LLC actually has very little effect. It's just a minor tweak. Overclockers like it because they don't like to see their voltages jumping up and down all over the place. Even with LLC enabled I see 1.31 normally and drops to 1.29 under load.
  6. 20mmrain

    20mmrain

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    I thought they were different options too until recently. When I started looking around on the net about these options.
    There seems to be a whole hoard of people out there then that seems to think they are they same option.
    Also that is the same affect I used to get on my EP45-UD3R MOB. When I had LLC enabled it just used to keep my Voltages from drooping too much between loads.

    But in essence that is the same thing I use the Without V-Droop option for on my EVGA MOB. That and of course disabling the usual C1E,Speed Step, Exc.....

    I do agree with your statement though that the first Idea posted up on top is a retarded one. I mean I thought the whole Idea is too keep your voltages as stable as possible when over clocking. So you don't have any rises or falls in voltages.
  7. DirectorC

    DirectorC New Member

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    Yeah bingo :D
  8. theonedub

    theonedub habe fidem

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    There was a really good article that explained the need for Vdroop, you should search for it and read it. Im too busy to search and link it right now.
    Crunching for Team TPU
  9. 20mmrain

    20mmrain

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    I think I will do you know who wrote it? Was it here? There is a chance I might of already read it though from all the research I have been doing about it over the past few days. :)

    I have not read this whole article yet but...from what some of the people who have read it in EVGA Forums.... they say it suggests that you leave it on. Or do the the first retard Idea I mentioned in the first part of my post.

    http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=3519&p=6

    Here is the link to the EVGA fourm post.....

    http://www.evga.com/FORUMS/tm.aspx?m=74529
  10. DirectorC

    DirectorC New Member

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  11. 20mmrain

    20mmrain

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    Nice find Director I will read it later it looks Dry but informative. Check out the Links I have above telling someone to leave it on. I think you might laugh:)

    That Andy Tech article also seems to be telling people that it is a good Idea to enable Intel Speed Step for 24/7 over clocking. Again another setting that I thought was not a good idea?
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2010
  12. DirectorC

    DirectorC New Member

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    I have actually thought about given it a try several times because I like the idea of the processor not always running at max. But I don't know how it would affect the overclock and I hate constantly rebooting to do stability testing.
  13. 20mmrain

    20mmrain

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    I thought about it too...... But the only thing i could think of if I did that was..... Okay so it lower the multiplier. That's fine but because your voltages were still locked in wouldn't it still create a lot more heat defeating the purpose for it?
    I could be wrong on how that works but ..... it just sounds like we would have competing interests running against each other canceling each other out.
    Maybe if someone is out there who it doing that could elaborate that would be great. If not..... since I am still working on my over clocks and going higher maybe I will give it a try for us tomorrow and report back here. So keep an eye out.
  14. DirectorC

    DirectorC New Member

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    Frequency and voltage affect the lifespan and temperature of a processor independently from each other. The lower you can get either at any point in time the less heat you'll see and the longer the lifespan will be. However, most overclockers tend to see the benefit of EIST as being too small to bother with.
  15. imperialreign

    imperialreign New Member

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    My personal take on both . . . vdroop is an evil that we must live with, so-to-speak . . . all setups must deal with it, some more-so than others (ASUS boards) . . .

    vdroop control/LLC (or by ASUS' boards, CPU Voltage Damper) - or whatever name the manufacturer wants to come up with - helps to reduce the difference in vCore between idle/load state, as well as the difference between the value set in BIOS, and what you actually get (can sometimes range from .005 - .125, depending on the board - ASUS tends to be on the higher side of the spectrum) . . .

    I tend to leave vdroop disabled with lower SYS clocks, for the most part, one can typically get moderate clocks stable without needing it . . . I generally set vcore just a tad higher than what I find to be a stable setting - it leaves me just a little headroom for when the system goes under severe load very quickly.

    If you do need vdroop control to get a moderate SYS clock stable, you should re-evaluate your OC. Although, as most of these "fine tuning" BIOS settings will help to milk stability out of an OC, they're more aimed at extreme OCs . . . a lot of these "fine tuning" settings can end up being dangerous to your hardware as well - especially if set "out of range" of where they really should be.

    Excersize caution, and of course, research . . . asking around here is a great start, and the link DC provided earlier has some great info as well. :toast:

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