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Yikes, my 7970 only scores 61.5 on ASIC

Discussion in 'AMD / ATI' started by Frag Maniac, Dec 7, 2012.

  1. Frag Maniac

    Frag Maniac

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    Damn, the Sapphire 7970 OC Boost I just bought at Newegg only rates 61.5 on GPU-Z's ASIC rating. Should I return it? It doesn't seem to want to OC very well at all.
     
  2. AthlonX2

    AthlonX2 HyperVtX™

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    Thats hardly a reason to return a video card.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2012
  3. Naito

    Naito

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    It passed quality control and testing, thus is within specifications. No need to return.
     
  4. W1zzard

    W1zzard Administrator Staff Member

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    that's actually a very good card for extreme overclocking (water/LN2). lower = better for these people.
     
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  5. Frag Maniac

    Frag Maniac

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    Not the response I was expecting on a graphics board of an enthusiast gamer forum. Any avid gamer whom buys an OC model card from a reputable manufacturer I think knows full well an ASIC rating that low is uncommon on an OC model card that should get decent binning of the GPU chip. That's about as low as it gets even on NON OC model cards for top models cards from supposedly reputable manufacturers. A 7950 Vapor-X for $20 less would probably smoke this card. Then again, if I do return it, I'm not sure I trust Sapphire's binning at all regardless of model.

    Anyone else care to weigh in here? I'm about an inch away from calling Newegg and setting up an RMA.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2012
  6. AthlonX2

    AthlonX2 HyperVtX™

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    It seems like you made up your mind already, So go ahead and setup your RMA and dont forget to tell them that your reason for return is it dont overclock very well.
     
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  7. Kaynar

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    Nah my card does 77% ASIC and overclocks till 1125/1500 without voltage increase. ASIC stats do not mean that the card is bad or good since there are SO MANY parameters that will affect the final result (quality). I remember being worried about the ASIC of my card several months ago and I did alot of research on that matter.

    EDIT: seeing in your 2nd post that you are really worried, just go and have a look on other forums where it is extensively said by owners of 7900 series cards that their OC performance is irrelevant to their ASIC. I was going to write some more but Wizzard already covered the topic.
     
  8. Frag Maniac

    Frag Maniac

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    From my understanding the ASIC value scales upward for better efficiency, less heat/voltage leakage, so there's no way a lower number = better, water or not, and water just adds a lot of expense on a card that was bought for it's sale price. I always thought the lower designation on low ASIC values meant you HAVE to use WC just to try and get similar performance to air, which would mean horrible inefficiency in the chip wouldn't it?

    Then again the CPU-Z ASIC chart only says higher power consumption, vs more leakage. So maybe when WC is used it allows that extera power to unleash, much like some high end speakers require a lot of amplification. Either way, I can't stress enough that I do not want to have to buy WCing just to get an acceptable OC out of this thing. I think 99% of gamers whom buy a high end GPU on a sale price would say the same.

    I've seen ASIC ratings range from 49 all the way up to claims of 102. The average always seems to be about 75. This thing starts artifacting with ANY memory bump and struggles to keep from crashing Kombustor at anything over 1100 core, which is crap performance for an OC model card.

    One thing I noticed that was odd after my attempted OCing session though was there were several instances of Kombustor in Task manager for some reason. Am I missing something here? Please explain why a lower number would be better even if I could and wanted to buy water cooling?
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2012
  9. Kaynar

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    Frag Maniac maybe you should try to uninstall the drivers and use Driver sweeper, then install again. If your card does not OC well and you wanted that, maybe you can attempt to return the card and get a new one or another brand, but the company that sold you the card would actually do you a favor cause no one guarrantees the overclocking potential of a card.

    From what I know a high ASIC means that the current or voltage is very well regulated and there are no leaks, thus making the card more energy efficient - which is independent of performance. You might get some more heat though... 1 or 2 degrees celcius extra on a low-asic card compared to high-asic (i'm not sure about that). Good energy regulation reduces the potential of high overclocks. But remember that this is only ONE parameter contributing to the final potential of the card.
     
  10. the54thvoid

    the54thvoid

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    ASIC quality is not a consumer level property. We only get to know it because W1zz writes the software to read it.

    If this isn't the response you'd expect from a top tech forum perhaps you're being naive? As W1zz says, lower ASIC is better for extreme OC.

    Although to be fair, my MSO OC 7970 is 59.2 ASIC quality. But it still holds stable comfortably on stock volts at 1050/1500 core/mem. Though my Powercolor is 80.2 ASIC and it hit 1300/1600 :D

    Also, your RMA would be refused unless you got lucky. The card works at it's stated OC, there is nothing wrong with it. And as W1zz says in every gpu review, overclocking is not a right, it's a luck of the draw kinda thing unless you specifically buy a model (Matrix/Lightning) that is specifically binned.
     
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  11. Frag Maniac

    Frag Maniac

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    Can anyone tell me why Kombustor would be loading up several instances of it's exe in Task Manager, and if that might have caused it to freeze and get the graphics driver stopped responding error?

    I can see how to a degree voltage regulation would be separate of performance, but leakage is always more prevalent on less efficient GPUs, as is higher temps, which keeps you from getting as good OCs on air.

    Just feeling like a I got a lemon here. Funny thing is, until I started seeing the OC results, I was thinking it was playing MoH Warfighter pretty well maxed out on Ultra at 1080p and VSync at a solid 60 FPS. I'm used to a GTS 250 though, so almost anything is going to look good compared to it.

    I guess I'll try running this at 1100 or so and no mem boost for a while and see if it can manage not crashing my GPU driver. Not sure reinstalling the GPU driver is going to do any good though, since I didn't get the graphics driver stopped responding error until I started OCing.

    I'm using Cat 12.11 though, and although it's got improved performance, it's also just a beta, so maybe the final will be more stable for me.
     
  12. Mathragh

    Mathragh

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    My 7950 has 64% quality, but even at 1,25V with a terrible Vdrop(0,08V) it hits 1160 MHz on the core without getting over 82 degrees with the smallest cooler(on auto) ever to be put on these cards.

    So from my experince i can say that your 61% would certainly not mean its a bad chip, since the 64% for me ment I could still OC it close to 50% over its stock clock(which is quite insane when you think of it like that).
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2012
  13. Frag Maniac

    Frag Maniac

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    You only get 1125 core on a 7970 with a 77% ASIC rating?

    Mind linking to something that explains ASIC in depth, because I can't find anything but forums with ASIC scores.

    I'd also like to get an answer on why Kombustor would be loading up several instances of it's exe in Task Manager, and if it could be contributing to the graphics driver crashing.

    I'm beginning to wonder if I should just try another OC tool. Afterburner's settings page is just so screwy. Half the time I can't get the tabs at the top to show even with the taskbar at the right of the screen.

    Unwinder says he's going to leave it the way it is, even though the page with the most on it (Monitoring) has blank space at the bottom, he wants to leave the GUI needlessly tall.
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2012
  14. Mathragh

    Mathragh

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    I never used kombustor to measure anything relevant, since it just isnt really relevant compared to any real life scenario. The best way to test for stability is to just play games(or if you're lucky like me, run some pre-programmed benchmarks/runthroughs like metro 2033 has).

    Also, i'd say that the multiple instances are mostly likely a software bug not related to your card directly.
     
  15. EarthDog

    EarthDog

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    :toast:

    No doubt. And besides, that rating isnt the end all either as there are many exceptions to that. Returning a card because it doesnt overclock well is just silly to me. Ive been caught with PLENTY of dud overclockers, and not once would I return a perfectly functioning card.

    I wouldnt return it... and agree here, you lost in the lottery, it happens. You want another better clocker, do the right things and sell this one then buy another. Dont pass the cost on to the consumer for bad luck of the draw. ;)


    PS - Both the HIS 7970 X Turbo and 7970 Iceq X2 I have (think Lightning/Matrix level for the X, and 'normal' card with IceQ X2) both have quite a low ASIC value and I can reach 1200/1700 24/7 on them. I can even bench 1283/1800 on the X and 1260/1800 on the IceQ X, both have similarly very low ASIC values.
     
  16. Frick

    Frick Fishfaced Nincompoop

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    Asic?
     
  17. EarthDog

    EarthDog

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    Right click on GPUz and in that context menu, you will see it...
     
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  18. brandonwh64

    brandonwh64 Addicted to Bacon and StarCrunches!!!

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    Crunching for Team TPU
  19. Frick

    Frick Fishfaced Nincompoop

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    Oh, it's for you people with fancy cards. :laugh:

    So what is it?
     
  20. Frag Maniac

    Frag Maniac

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    Well, I just reset Afterburner to the defaults, exited out of it, then ran the DX11 version of Kombustor by itself using CCC this time to OC. For some reason leaving the fan at 50% and/or using the DX11 Kombustor keeps the GPU much lower temp, but I still get Kombustor freezing and the graphics driver stopped responding crash if I so much as go beyond 1140.

    Despite Prime95 tests passing long term, I think I might up my CPU voltage to 1.3 on my 4GHz i7 950 OC, just to see if it by chance makes any difference.

    This is definitely upsetting though. My understanding is that low ASIC = low efficiency/high leakage, and not typical of binning on a OC model card, that is IF they're doing any kind of diligent binning at all.

    I was going to try Trixx btw, but at this point I doubt ANY PC tool would make a difference. Going to run the WEI test before upping the CPU voltage just to see if it goes through that without any problems.
     
  21. cadaveca

    cadaveca My name is Dave

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    Actually, the lowest ASIC possible, while still stable, is best for those that run LN2. I've posted an explanation as to why a few times on here. Leakage is required for chips to work(they give off heat this way). When you cool chip, leakage lowers, nature of this semiconductor. Cool too far, the chip can't leak at all, and you get a "coldbug". A chip with higher leakage can be colder further than one that has less leakage.


    So, in essence, this card is a good choice for extreme OC guys. Water is not extreme.

    Of course, this was one of the major issues I expected when OC went more mainstream. If you want a good, low-leakage card, you'll have to look at the early release cards, not the boost cards, IMHO. OF course, finding one of the original cards still in store is gonna be hard.
    You perspective is just simply skewed here. I understand why you feel the way you do, but you shouldn't.

    I mean, if all you are after is ASIC quality, I got a 78.625 chip here, but it's a 7950. I'll trade ya!

    :p
     
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  22. Frag Maniac

    Frag Maniac

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    Again, what tell me is the point of adding at least $200 of WCing to the price of a GPU just to get a decent OC out of it? If it came to that don't you think two 7950s would be a far better choice?

    OK, I get it, better on water and the mad scientist techno geek nitro jazz. Whoo hoo, I'm thrilled to hear that. I think I'll start building an entire lab around the project. Always wanted a cryo tank in my living room. :rolleyes:

    Meaning, I'll just take your word for it guys, but it need not be reiterated umpteen times because no matter what you say, it's not cost effective. It's a waste of time for myself, and most for that matter. Low ASICs IMO are not appealing, no matter how you cut it.

    Ran the card at 1100 core and stock 1450 mem through several levels of MoH Warfighter last night without issue. That was after getting artifacts in the intro cutcsene of the PETN raid just at 1120, which IMO was utterly ridiculous.

    WTF, I guess I'll keep it, and only because at $330 it still probably beats a stock GHz Edition when run at 1100, and those start at $420. Needless to say the PC gaming hardware industry catches you coming and going. You either pay through the nose for the high binned first batches of a GPU model, or get stale bread when the prices drop.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2012
  23. mediasorcerer New Member

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    My asic is 74.0 on my 7950, good thread, just learnt something.
     
  24. animal007uk

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    LOL you think your ASIC quality is bad? Mine is only 60.3% but guess what? i do not care the card works as intended.

    At lest you can clock better than i can, i am lucky if i can hit 1050mhz stable
    [​IMG]
     
  25. drdeathx

    drdeathx

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    Try loading the AMD beta drivers 12.11
     

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