Wednesday, October 18th 2017

ASUS Confirms Z270 Platform Could be Compatible with Intel Coffee Lake CPUs

In an interview with Bit-tech, ASUS ROG motherboard product manager Andrew Wu has let the proverbial cat out of the bag: apparently, compatibility of Z270 boards with Coffee Lake processors wouldn't have been impossible after all. When asked why the new Coffee Lake CPUs aren't compatible with the previously released Z270 platform, Andrew Wu explained that it" (...) depends on Intel's decision." Andrew Wu also went on to mention that Intel's stated power delivery reasons don't "make much difference", and that ASUS themselves could make their Z270 motherboards compatible with Coffee Lake. For that, however, they'd need "(...) an upgrade from the ME [Management Engine] and a BIOS update", for which "Intel somehow has locked the compatibility."

It seems all of that extra "pin-count" doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of the current Coffee Lake lineup with up to six core processors - the CPU socket and platform as designed with Z270 would have been able to handle the increased core counts and power loads. The question gets murkier with Intel's ability to release an 8-core CPU to the Z370 platform though - that particular amount of cores might indeed prove to be too much for Z270's power delivery. Making an educated guess, it would seem that Intel could have allowed for Coffee Lake compatibility on Z270 motherboards on CPUs up to 6 cores, but would need the new revisions on the Z370 platform to allow for operation of 8-core Coffee Lake chips.
Naturally, if Intel were to allow backwards compatibility, that would eat into sales of current-gen Z370 boards, so the company decided to increase the Z370 platform's attractiveness by locking all Coffee Lake processors behind it. It's not much of a platform sale point to say that it will be eventually compatible with unannounced 8-core CPUs. And let's be honest: ASUS and all other motherboard manufacturers probably love this game themselves, since they do get to sell more motherboards this way.Source: Bit-tech
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72 Comments on ASUS Confirms Z270 Platform Could be Compatible with Intel Coffee Lake CPUs

#1
EntropyZ
Anyone remember how Z170 motherboards could overclock locked Skylake SKU's with a simple BIOS flash? I 'member.

Intel was quick to pull the plug on that. Way to ruin everyone's fun.
Posted on Reply
#2
john_
Vya Domus said:
Not many though , reviews sites and forums make it look like people are buying millions of these and they are by far the most important products. They aren't , in actual fact few are willing to drop 450$+ on a new platform that gets you 10% better gaming performance. For that reason , no , I do not expect the market to be flooded by sh Kaby Lake kits. There might be a ton of Intel fanboys out there but at the end of the day their wallets have a limit.
I think they are much more than you probably think. i7 7700K was the top selling model in the Kaby Lake line and the i7 6700K model the top selling model in the Skylake family, based on Mindfactory numbers.
Sockel 1151 -> INTEL Desktop -> Prozessoren (CPU) -> Hardware | Mindfactory.de - Hardware, Notebooks

Now, if I go and add the numbers from all other Kaby Lake models, i7 7700K sales will be much less than 50% of the total, but in any case it is the top selling product. So there are many people willing to pay close to $350-$400 for a processor and two extra cores is a good excuse to pay $50 more. At least in markets such as the German and probably the American where people does have a good income. OK, in Greece i7 7700K will sell much less. 10 years ago politicians where calling a wage of 700 euros a disgrace, today is a pre-election promise and commitment.

The only thing that keeps most of those from selling their Kaby Lake and rushing to a 6 core 12 threads Coffee Lake, is the lack of availability of Coffee Lake models. People who buy expensive processors and keep upgrading often, rush to sell their platform before it loses more value.
Posted on Reply
#3
IceScreamer
GorbazTheDragon said:
I'm shocked that you're shocked
I mean it was sarcasm of course, and now I'm confused.
Posted on Reply
#4
uuuaaaaaa
Furunomoe said:
So all we need is something like this?


I actually have one of these :D
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#5
UrbanCamper
Well this article did it for me. Was debating the new 8700k as an update to my 6600k on my 270mb. Knowing full well that I would also have to upgrade my mb. However these tactics by Intel have just pushed me to get a Ryzen 8 core. Since I game at 2 k, there won't be much of a difference fps wise and streaming and recording will be smoother likely with those extra cores.

Lets not forget that AMD has already said that the am4 socket will be compatible through 2020 and the Zen 3 platform.
Posted on Reply
#6
9700 Pro
Imsochobo said:
CL = KL refresh = SKL refresh.
Yeah I know since the IPC is identical between those.
Posted on Reply
#7
Basard
UrbanCamper said:

Lets not forget that AMD has already said that the am4 socket will be compatible through 2020 and the Zen 3 platform.
But you'll be stuck with PCI-E 3.x instead of 4.x!! Bua hahahaha!:laugh:
Posted on Reply
#8
dirtyferret
behind the scenes image at Intel's customer relations meeting after someone asked "what about the customers we will screw over?"


Posted on Reply
#9
Totally
Basard said:
But you'll be stuck with PCI-E 3.x instead of 4.x!! Bua hahahaha!:laugh:
Has there been a real demand for anything beyond 2.x in the consumer space. :rolleyes:
Posted on Reply
#10
xorbe
In other shocking news, water is wet, story at 11.
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#11
theoneandonlymrk
But but intel showed the changed pinouts ,you couldn't write better tech comedy then intel.:D
Posted on Reply
#12
fullinfusion
Vanguard Beta Tester
dirtyferret said:
behind the scenes image at Intel's customer relations meeting after someone asked "what about the customers we will screw over?"



You hit the nail on the head with that one.
Posted on Reply
#13
TheinsanegamerN
UrbanCamper said:
Well this article did it for me. Was debating the new 8700k as an update to my 6600k on my 270mb. Knowing full well that I would also have to upgrade my mb. However these tactics by Intel have just pushed me to get a Ryzen 8 core. Since I game at 2 k, there won't be much of a difference fps wise and streaming and recording will be smoother likely with those extra cores.

Lets not forget that AMD has already said that the am4 socket will be compatible through 2020 and the Zen 3 platform.
I would also like to point out that AMD said the same thing about FM1, then FM2, only to replace them with FM2 and FM2+, respectively.

I'm curious why everyone is up in arms about this. It's not like the feature set of a 370 is so amazingly better then a 270 or 170, and the CPUs themselves are not a huge jump in per core performance anyway. Sure, you can get more cores, but most wanting more cores have HDET or jumped to AMD already.

Given how long CPUs and mobos last these days, why be upset over not being able to use a new one? Heck, why upgrade already? Unless you are on sandy bridge, this doesnt do much more. Im still on ivy, waiting for something to convince me to upgrade. Nothing is unplayable, I have PCIE 3.0, USB 3.0, and SATA III. I suppose M.2, but the speed is almost worthless over a good sata III drive in real world benches, so it doesnt make a huge difference to me.
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#14
Pure Wop
Well for new gaming only builds CL may make sense, but hardly for any KL SKL users upgrading. For gaming only, performance increase is minimal (even for 1080p) and not worth a new mobo along with the CPU. For truly multithreading tasks where 50% more cores counts, why upgrade to Intel at all?
Posted on Reply
#15
Gmr_Chick
Vya Domus said:
Not many though , reviews sites and forums make it look like people are buying millions of these and exaggerate their relevance. They aren't , in actual fact few are willing to drop 500$+ on a new platform that gets you 10% better gaming performance. For that reason , no , I do not expect the market to be flooded by sh Kaby Lake kits. There might be a ton of Intel fanboys out there but at the end of the day their wallets have a limit.

Every company tries to milk their customers , except Intel is entitled to do it thanks to their vast and loyal fanbase. Just like Apple or other companies where the brand far outweighs the product. A potion where you as a company would like to be but as a consumer your getting ripped off.
This. So much. If I could REP+ you more than once, I would. :clap:
Posted on Reply
#16
skates
InVasMani said:
I play at at around 1440p to 4K 60Hz :rolleyes: so I'm good w/Ryzen/ThreadRipper for gaming and multitasking more cores and multi threading combined with great power and efficiency plus minimal heat and it would better utilize my 64GB DDR4 3200MHz ram that I bought when it was dirt cheap for like $300's.

I'm not loyal to most tech companies even the best ones at the end of the day it's who can provide the best product at the best price which right now for CPU's is AMD with Ryzen and CL doesn't change that bit at all for me. Sure if you gave at 1080p on 144Hz displays CL is better typically at least provided you don't stream. For those of that play at 1440p/4K it's not worth it though.
Hi InVasMani: I have a large 4K monitor which I game on and have a 1080Ti and i7 4770. I was thinking of going 8700K, but am also looking at AMD to tie me over until Icy Lake. You mentioned that AMD works better for 4K gaming which is intriguing to me because of cheaper cost and most importantly AVAILABILITY. Is it true AMD is better at 4K and if so, would you recommend the Ryzen 1700? I'm looking to squeeze out more FPS with my 1080Ti with an updated CPU.
Posted on Reply
#17
Durvelle27
skates said:
Hi InVasMani: I have a large 4K monitor which I game on and have a 1080Ti and i7 4770. I was thinking of going 8700K, but am also looking at AMD to tie me over until Icy Lake. You mentioned that AMD works better for 4K gaming which is intriguing to me because of cheaper cost and most importantly AVAILABILITY. Is it true AMD is better at 4K and if so, would you recommend the Ryzen 1700? I'm looking to squeeze out more FPS with my 1080Ti with an updated CPU.
I’d go 1700
Posted on Reply
#18
newtekie1
Semi-Retired Folder
Yeah, ASUS says you could run a 6-core Coffee Lake without the extra power pins. Asus also is the ones that think running a 4-core with HT on a 3-phase VRM is ok, and then the VRM dies right after the warranty expires... I think Intel actually would prefer the platform last longer than that.
Posted on Reply
#19
JackOne
...and yet we have people here on this board that defend Intel everyday. Intel is one of the advancement killers of today. AdoredTV made a pretty good video on what Intel actually is (hint: Intel is just about money, nothing else):



Watch it. It's totally worth the time.
Posted on Reply
#20
9700 Pro
newtekie1 said:
Yeah, ASUS says you could run a 6-core Coffee Lake without the extra power pins. Asus also is the ones that think running a 4-core with HT on a 3-phase VRM is ok, and then the VRM dies right after the warranty expires... I think Intel actually would prefer the platform last longer than that.
The solution is simple; do not make a CFL bios to crappy motherboards.

I've been repeating this to anyone who have said "the VRMs on some motherboards aren't enough for CFL" when it was made public that the old 1151 doesn't support CFL. I'm pretty sure that my Z170 Pro Gaming for example wouldn't have any problem running a CFL, even when overclocked.
Posted on Reply
#22
R0H1T
TheinsanegamerN said:
I would also like to point out that AMD said the same thing about FM1, then FM2, only to replace them with FM2 and FM2+, respectively.

I'm curious why everyone is up in arms about this. It's not like the feature set of a 370 is so amazingly better then a 270 or 170, and the CPUs themselves are not a huge jump in per core performance anyway. Sure, you can get more cores, but most wanting more cores have HDET or jumped to AMD already.

Given how long CPUs and mobos last these days, why be upset over not being able to use a new one? Heck, why upgrade already? Unless you are on sandy bridge, this doesnt do much more. Im still on ivy, waiting for something to convince me to upgrade. Nothing is unplayable, I have PCIE 3.0, USB 3.0, and SATA III. I suppose M.2, but the speed is almost worthless over a good sata III drive in real world benches, so it doesnt make a huge difference to me.
I'd say the ability to change your mobo, or replace it when one fails, without having some inane socket or pin out incompatibilities is highly desirable. I think this was stated by another member here, but when your Zxx MB dies five years from now & you are looking for a replacement then having a new socket or MB released each year, making the previous ones obsolete, is the last thing you want!
newtekie1 said:
Yeah, ASUS says you could run a 6-core Coffee Lake without the extra power pins. Asus also is the ones that think running a 4-core with HT on a 3-phase VRM is ok, and then the VRM dies right after the warranty expires... I think Intel actually would prefer the platform last longer than that.
Nah, Intel only cares so long as their CPU don't get fried, they give less than half a damn about consumers, otherwise they wouldn't lock out non Z OCing multiple times over the last so many years.
Posted on Reply
#23
Gmr_Chick
JackOne said:
...and yet we have people here on this board that defend Intel everyday. Intel is one of the advancement killers of today. AdoredTV made a pretty good video on what Intel actually is (hint: Intel is just about money, nothing else):



Watch it. It's totally worth the time.
Thanks for sharing it. It was totally worth the time. :)
Posted on Reply
#24
newtekie1
Semi-Retired Folder
9700 Pro said:
The solution is simple; do not make a CFL bios to crappy motherboards.

I've been repeating this to anyone who have said "the VRMs on some motherboards aren't enough for CFL" when it was made public that the old 1151 doesn't support CFL. I'm pretty sure that my Z170 Pro Gaming for example wouldn't have any problem running a CFL, even when overclocked.
It isn't about the amount of VRMs. I only mentioned the VRMs to show that ASUS really isn't the one we should be listening to when it comes to their judgement on what is necessary for power delivery.

The issue with Coffee Lake is the number of power pins in the socket itself. There aren't enough in the old 1151 socket to safely provide the power needed for the 6-core Coffee Lake. Does no one remember the burnt pins/pads problem socket 1156 had? Intel learned from their mistake and is making sure there are plenty of pins for power delivery. Yes, you could probably technically get away with the lower number of pins on the old 1151, but when you pass more current through something it gets hotter. Possibly hot enough to start melting/burning things.

When you pass too much currant through too few of pins, this happens:

Posted on Reply
#25
9700 Pro
Wasn't that because of faulty sockets?
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