Friday, June 6th 2008

Western Digital Working on 20,000 RPM Raptor Drive

Sources close to bit-tech.net and the hard drive industry have revealed information that Western Digital is working on a 20,000 RPM Raptor hard drive to counter SSD drives. Just like the company's latest 10,000 RPM VelociRaptor (300GB, SATA 3Gb/s, 16MB Cache), the 20,000 RPM unit will come in a 2.5-inch form factor with custom 3.5-inch enclosure. Other details are still unknown, since the drive is still in development stage. No release date has been unveiled, too.Source: bit-tech.net
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82 Comments on Western Digital Working on 20,000 RPM Raptor Drive

#2
MKmods
Case Mod Guru
[I.R.A]_FBi said:
muffler bearings?
I think you ment "Chrome Plated Muffler Bearings"
:laugh:
(I would love to see a platter failure, from behind a protective barrier)
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#3
twicksisted
aaaah ok... now it makes sense lol

hmmm imagine Raid 0 with 20 of those puppies lolol....:D
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#4
Snipermonkey2
Weer said:
Shows how much you know about SSD's :cool:

An SSD makes this drive so useless, that only people who get excited by the 20k-figure would even think about buying it.
SSD has no problems writing mass amounts of data but when it comes to reading that data it is slower that a normal HD so the 20k RPM drive would give it a run for the money unless they solve that read problem with SSD.
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#5
WarEagleAU
Bird of Prey
So an SSD has to have constant power to it right? Hmm, not sure how helpful that is. I assumed SSDs were uber fast for reading and writing data, but apparently Im wrong. Ive not tested the 10k or 15k drives (unless you call raided servers at work and for the military testing) but I hear they are smoking fast. Seems like 20k will be awesome but I too fear the bearing, motor and noise, cooling factors of it. Wonder how the heads will do.
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#6
[I.R.A]_FBi
and with WD being so unreliable in my climes ...
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#7
Snipermonkey2
[I.R.A]_FBi said:
and with WD being so unreliable in my climes ...
I don't know I think Maxtor takes the cake for being unreliable
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#8
Jizzler
twicksisted said:
aaaah ok... now it makes sense lol

hmmm imagine Raid 0 with 20 of those puppies lolol....:D
Time for the Areca 24port SAS RAID controller :D
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#9
Leon2ky
karlotta said:
hello! a 20,000 rpm hdd will run circles around current SDDs. Really isnt any SDD faster that a Raptor now. There are alot of paper SDD that havent came out yet but are fast... whatever. And they cost way to much. Like a 20,000 rpm raptor... way to much.
Planet are you from? a RAID0 MTRON Hard drive setup on a [Dedicated] Hard drive controller will run circles around a raptor setup, I know I've built them myself for stock traders. And the prices on SSDs will go down, just like they did with modern hard drives.
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#10
Squirrely
This drive will probably break the sound barrier...of the people who reside with you. ("Honey, shut that thing off!") :laugh:

Speed is cool, but mechanical drives running at that speed, there is a point at in mechanics it gets to be impractical. I think WD should just get into SSD's, since they are the future. Lower power consumption, nearly instant random access latency, and the most important thing personally, they are silent. :D
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#11
Snipermonkey2
Squirrely said:
This drive will probably break the sound barrier...of the people who reside with you. ("Honey, shut that thing off!") :laugh:

Speed is cool, but mechanical drives running at that speed, there is a point at in mechanics it gets to be impractical. I think WD should just get into SSD's, since they are the future. Lower power consumption, nearly instant random access latency, and the most important thing personally, they are silent. :D
Snipermonkey2 said:
SSD has no problems writing mass amounts of data but when it comes to reading that data it is slower that a normal HD so the 20k RPM drive would give it a run for the money unless they solve that read problem with SSD.
Sorry I had to repost that but its true. As you could produce the motors out of titanium which can with stand a lot more heat and pressure
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#12
russianboy
And why is WD wasting resources that could be used for improving SSDs?

Face it, mechanical drives are inherently worse, because they are MECHANICAL. WD is trying to make the motor go as fast as possible, but as others have stated, heat, noise, and especially reliability will really bring this drive down.

Oh, BTW, mechanial drives also have limited read/writes. Read/write on an SSD is actually much better than on a standard drive AFAIK.

20,000 RPM cooling fans, anyone? That would kick so much ass (and chop so many fingers off).
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#13
Haytch
SSD has been proven to be unreliable over long durations of time, so the ssd technology is far from ready to take over, regardless of the unreliablility factor a 20k rpm hdd would have.

My 10k Raptor is pretty much faster then then my 15k Cheetah.
That said, the 20k WD will be the most dominant performing hdd available vs price untill ssd prices are reduced significally.

Heat and cooling is only an issue for those that have issues! Try moving to a more computer friendly country as opposed to bitching about ambient temps.

20,000 rpm isnt just a random number. Its to symbolize how fast we can read the cornflakes box.
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#14
Snipermonkey2
Haytch said:
SSD has been proven to be unreliable over long durations of time, so the ssd technology is far from ready to take over, regardless of the unreliablility factor a 20k rpm hdd would have.

My 10k Raptor is pretty much faster then then my 15k Cheetah.
That said, the 20k WD will be the most dominant performing hdd available vs price untill ssd prices are reduced significally.

Heat and cooling is only an issue for those that have issues! Try moving to a more computer friendly country as opposed to bitching about ambient temps.

20,000 rpm isnt just a random number. Its to symbolize how fast we can read the cornflakes box.
I love reading the cornflakes box.
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#15
lemonadesoda
RUBBISH concept by WD.

Well actually, its a nice boost, but there are better ways to get extra performance. They are not thinking "out of the box".

1./ If they want better performance, then they need to make sure that each platter and each head reads simultaneously, rather than just one platter/head at a time. AND, multiple heads per arm per platter. The extra mass/momentum of the heads will slow down movement and consequently seek times might increase a little, but it will double the transfer rates without additional noise or power requirements or wear. Basically hardware RAID *within* the HDD itselg.

2./ Hybrid drive. Combination of SSD (say 8 or 16GB) with 500GB HDD on 2 separate partitions. That would be perfect. We install the OS on the SDD partition. Data on the HDD. Imagine that for laptops. CHEAP with the benefits of a SSD and the price/capacity of HDD:
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#16
[I.R.A]_FBi
you guys also realize 2.5 drives have less inertia than 3.5 due to its smaller size



also less kinetic energy due to its lower mass

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#17
[I.R.A]_FBi
lemonadesoda said:
RUBBISH concept by WD.

Well actually, its a nice boost, but there are better ways to get extra performance. They are not thinking "out of the box".

1./ If they want better performance, then they need to make sure that each platter and each head reads simultaneously, rather than just one platter/head at a time. AND, multiple heads per arm per platter. The extra mass/momentum of the heads will slow down movement and consequently seek times might go down a little, but it will double the transfer rates without additional noise or power requirements or wear. Basically hardware RAID [B]*within* the HDD itself.[/b]

2./ Hybrid drive. Combination of SDD (say 8 or 16GB) with 500GB HDD on 2 separate partitions. That would be perfect. We install the OS on the SDD partition. Data on the HDD. Imagine that for laptops. CHEAP with the benefits of a SDD and the price/capacity of HDD:
sounds like a good idea ...
Posted on Reply
#18
lemonadesoda
Can you do the ACTUAL numbers for us please IRA. Based on 7200rpm and 10000rpm 3.5" and a 20k 2.5" drive. Those formulas are making my HeadDrives spin. LOL. Thanks! :cheers:

OK, the 1st formula is OK, rotational. But the second isnt. That kinetic energy of a mass moving on a straight line. Not a valid formula here.

Forgive the scaling on these calcs. I'm keeping it simple:

2.5" rotational formula = m x 20*20 x 2.5"

3.5" rotational formula = m2 x 7.2 * 7.2 x 3.5"

and m2 is bigger than m due to size = m x 3.5 x 3.5 / 2.5 x 2.5 (approx) and thickness x 3.5 / 2.5 (approx)

hence 2.5" factor = 1000 x m units

and 3.5" factor = 497 x m units

NO, these 20K 2.5" drives have TWICE the angular momentum of the 7200 3.5" drives.

*** all this assumes your formulas are correct).
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#19
[I.R.A]_FBi
lemonadesoda said:
Can you do the ACTUAL numbers for us please IRA. Based on 7200rpm and 10000rpm 3.5" and a 20k 2.5" drive. Thanks! :cheers:
id need more data and above 1 year physics :|
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#20
Bundy
lemonadesoda said:
Can you do the ACTUAL numbers for us please IRA. Based on 7200rpm and 10000rpm 3.5" and a 20k 2.5" drive. Those formulas are making my HeadDrives spin. LOL. Thanks! :cheers:

OK, the 1st formula is OK, rotational. But the second isnt. That kinetic energy of a mass moving on a straight line. Not a valid formula here.

Forgive the scaling on these calcs. I'm keeping it simple:

2.5" rotational formula = m x 20*20 x 2.5"

3.5" rotational formula = m2 x 7.2 * 7.2 x 3.5"

and m2 is bigger than m due to size = m x 3.5 x 3.5 / 2.5 x 2.5 (approx) and thickness x 3.5 / 2.5 (approx)

hence 2.5" factor = 1000 x m units

and 3.5" factor = 497 x m units

NO, these 20K 2.5" drives have TWICE the angular momentum of the 7200 3.5" drives.

*** all this assumes your formulas are correct).
You have struck on the main factor - the platter average velocity is approximately 2 times faster and this is what delivers the performance boost.

In terms of reliability, 20000 rpm isn't that special these days. There are industrial devices that have rotational speeds much faster. The bearing will run a bit hotter and needs to run longer but thats not that much of a challenge to deal with. I think they avoided the most obvious problem (IMO platter stretch from centrifugal forces) by keeping the platter smaller.
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#21
ShadowFold
7200.10 is fast enough for me :D Only 60$ too! Im guessing these will be over 500$ since the new 10k rpm raptor's are 300$.
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#22
[I.R.A]_FBi
lemonadesoda said:
Can you do the ACTUAL numbers for us please IRA. Based on 7200rpm and 10000rpm 3.5" and a 20k 2.5" drive. Those formulas are making my HeadDrives spin. LOL. Thanks! :cheers:

OK, the 1st formula is OK, rotational. But the second isnt. That kinetic energy of a mass moving on a straight line. Not a valid formula here.

Forgive the scaling on these calcs. I'm keeping it simple:

2.5" rotational formula = m x 20*20 x 2.5"

3.5" rotational formula = m2 x 7.2 * 7.2 x 3.5"

and m2 is bigger than m due to size = m x 3.5 x 3.5 / 2.5 x 2.5 (approx) and thickness x 3.5 / 2.5 (approx)

hence 2.5" factor = 1000 x m units

and 3.5" factor = 497 x m units

NO, these 20K 2.5" drives have TWICE the angular momentum of the 7200 3.5" drives.

*** all this assumes your formulas are correct).
i was a bit imprecise what i meant a 20K 3.5 hdd is going to have more inertia than a 20K 2.5 drive.
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#23
MilkyWay
So a combo of a hdd and a ssd that effectivly you have working as one?
Like the ssd is only for the operating system? well i think id want the ssd to have programs for fast access times and the

a 100gb ssd will do me for games and id have another hard drive for all the rest like video and music and small programs ect

this is fast but you can bet it will cost LOADS :nutkick:
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#24
GJSNeptune
I think Newegg has the 640GB AAKS drive for $100 shipped. If not them, then maybe ZZF.
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#25
DrPepper
The Doctor is in the house
MilkyWay said:
So a combo of a hdd and a ssd that effectivly you have working as one?
Like the ssd is only for the operating system? well i think id want the ssd to have programs for fast access times and the

a 100gb ssd will do me for games and id have another hard drive for all the rest like video and music and small programs ect

this is fast but you can bet it will cost LOADS :nutkick:
How about the SSD as a pagefile :confused:
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