Who'll be the better president?

[SK-1]

Well, perhaps McCain's ties to ACORN are no more concrete than Obama's?

If this new revelation of a McCorn-ACORN link leads to this matter being dropped, both candidates will be the better off for it.

Maybe now they'll stick to issues, and stop with the baseless accusations.

Who took the MOST money from Acorn?

http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/elections/article852295.ece Mickey Mouse registered by Acorn?? This election is wacked.shadedshu

 

[mdm-adph]

Who took the MOST money from Acorn?

http://www.tampabay.com/news/politic...icle852295.ece Mickey Mouse registered by Acorn?? This election is wacked.

Beats me -- who took the most money from Exxon/Mobil? Microsoft? The Saudi Royal Family?

But yeah -- both Obama and McCain need to both distance themselves from ACORN.

 

[Bigjohn]

Obama paid 800K to Acorn to "get out the vote". And now over 1.3million registrations are in question, because where ever Acorn went, they've found dozens of fraudlent registrations. in Ohio, a couple was found to have driven homeless people (without addresses or proof of identity!!!) to register and VOTE...

 

[DaedalusHelios]

What does a voter registration application prove? Nothing.

Whats the point of somebody scribbling on that sheet. LOL

That doesn't even prove "Mickey Mouse" voted.

Where do you find this stuff? LOL Source?

 

[DaedalusHelios]

Obama paid 800K to Acorn to "get out the vote". And now over 1.3million registrations are in question, because where ever Acorn went, they've found dozens of fraudlent registrations. in Ohio, a couple was found to have driven homeless people (without addresses or proof of identity!!!) to register and VOTE...

In ohio you do not need to have proof of residency. The homeless have no house to list(See Homeless). Some Katrina victims are probably even homeless still.

When people need to get alot of people registered they outsource. Voter fraud is common for both parties. There is no indication that ACORN is doing it illegally. In NC, they just threw out the first wave of voter registration forms we helped the locals fill out. These were almost all democrats. They walked into our downtown campaign location to register. Local officials wouldn't give us a reason why they threw out these filled out forms. We checked ID's and submitted them properly. So pointing fingers is counter-productive. For all you guys know your "source" has fabricated it in the first place. I witnessed what happened here since I volunteer for the local campaign.

 

[mdm-adph]

Obama paid 800K to Acorn to "get out the vote". And now over 1.3million registrations are in question, because where ever Acorn went, they've found dozens of fraudlent registrations. in Ohio, a couple was found to have driven homeless people (without addresses or proof of identity!!!) to register and VOTE...

Please give some proof, or I'm going to call bullshit. Come on, you're slacking up -- you didn't even give a link to Fox News this time.

 

[SK-1]

What does a voter registration application prove? Nothing.

Whats the point of somebody scribbling on that sheet. LOL

That doesn't even prove "Mickey Mouse" voted.

Where do you find this stuff? LOL Source?

I know you are super sensitive to this stuff Helios, due to your direct association with Obamas campaign,but slow down a bit and take a look at the stamp of approval. This is no "LOL" moment dude. When I read this post of yours, I could not help but hear as I read it to my self, a nervousness in your "posting lol voice"

Source is a news paper IN the St. Petersburg Times ....http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/elections/article852295.ece


"Whats the point of somebody scribbling on that sheet. LOL"...throw me a bone please...

 

[Bigjohn]

How about this:
Nevada state authorities seized records and computers Tuesday from the Las Vegas office of an organization that tries to get low-income people registered to vote, after fielding complaints of voter fraud.

Bob Walsh, spokesman for the Nevada secretary of state’s office, told FOXNews.com the raid was prompted by ongoing complaints about “erroneous” registration information being submitted by the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, also called ACORN.

 

[mdm-adph]

How about this:
Nevada state authorities seized records and computers Tuesday from the Las Vegas office of an organization that tries to get low-income people registered to vote, after fielding complaints of voter fraud.

Bob Walsh, spokesman for the Nevada secretary of state’s office, told FOXNews.com the raid was prompted by ongoing complaints about “erroneous” registration information being submitted by the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, also called ACORN.

If you don't start showing definitive links between ACORN and Obama (once again, you didn't even provide a source), I'm going to stop wasting my time responding to the whole ACORN mess.

And that would be bad, because I like talking about this crap.

 

[SK-1]

If you don't start showing definitive links between ACORN and Obama (once again, you didn't even provide a source), I'm going to stop wasting my time responding to the whole ACORN mess.

And that would be bad, because I like talking about this crap.

You really think he is making this stuff up?

 

[mdm-adph]

You really think he is making this stuff up?

Where did I say he was making stuff up? (Though it's true he's not providing any sources.)

What I said is that further information about ACORN is not important if there's no definitive link between ACORN and Obama -- and besides what Obama himself has claimed, there doesn't seem to be.

 

[Bigjohn]

http://www.clevelandleader.com/node/7203

http://boortz.com/more/video/obama_acorn_shape_agenda.html

http://www.wral.com/news/local/politics/story/3719906/

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/14492.html

just a few sources...

 

[FordGT90Concept]

Try to get your facts straight -- Obama doesn't want out "now," as far as I've heard. Last I heard he wanted out in 16 months or so, which coincidentally is the same amount of time that the Iraqi government wanted the US out in.

We can try to follow tentative guidelines for withdrawl but nothing it war is ever concrete. Should the situation change on the ground, the commanders need access to resources to fight back. If that means bringing in another 20,000 it means bringing in another 20,000. Moreover, the time tables for planned withdrawl should never be stated publically (which the Dems love to do). If the enemy knows how many troops are there, they know how strong/weak the presence is. As such, they know when the people there will be most vulnerable. It's best the enemy thinks there is 160,000 troops there when there is actually only 40,000.

Well, you sure let politicians get you into the war in the first place, didn't you?

Colin Powell and George W. Bush made a strong case for war but it turned out to be based on flawed intelligence. There's only one way to find out if intelligence is flawed...satellites.

Once you start a war, you can't just leave and say your sorry. You have to follow through or else you make a lot of enemies. I was in favor of the going to Iraq in 2003 and I am in favor of a victory today.

I'm stupid, and the thing that I remember from the debates most about "over there" is this:Obama wants to put more focus back on Afghanistan while McCain thinks we should stay the course in Iraq, and our victories there will trickle to Afghanistan.

McCain wants to see Iraq war conclude in victory and make sure we do what needs to be done in Afghanistan to turn it around (namely, buy some napalm and burn all the weed they're growing ). If Iraq falls to the enemy, it will provide a major morality boost to them. The same goes for Afghanistan.

What does a voter registration application prove? Nothing.

Whats the point of somebody scribbling on that sheet. LOL

That doesn't even prove "Mickey Mouse" voted.

Where do you find this stuff? LOL Source?

Voter registration is to apply to vote. If all these fraudulent registration forms got approved by the county auditors, the applicants could vote many times for a candidate under various aliases. There are many places to catch the fraudulent activity but if it is not caught, the election could be swayed one way or another. That would result in criminals deciding the election instead of the people. The nation could implode if that was plainly obvious.

There is no indication that ACORN is doing it illegally.

They are under investigation for voter fraud in 12 states since 2004. Here's some of the recent ones:
Nevada: http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/07/acorn-vegas-office-raided-voter-fraud-investigation/
Ohio: http://www.clevelandleader.com/node/7195
Missouri: http://www.kmbc.com/politics/10214492/detail.html
North Carolina: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2008/10/13/20081013acorn-ncarolina1013-ON.html

If you don't start showing definitive links between ACORN and Obama (once again, you didn't even provide a source), I'm going to stop wasting my time responding to the whole ACORN mess.

And that would be bad, because I like talking about this crap.

This pretty much explains it: http://www.glennbeck.com/content/articles/article/198/16762/

If you want more, google "ACORN $800,000" or "ACORN $832,000," you'll get over 40,000 sources and 99% of them are reporting the same thing (Obama's Campaign contributed over $800,000 to ACORN).

 

[mdm-adph]

http://www.clevelandleader.com/node/7203

http://boortz.com/more/video/obama_acorn_shape_agenda.html

http://www.wral.com/news/local/politics/story/3719906/

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/14492.html

just a few sources...

Thanks for trying to find some sources. But did you read them?

The first link (the one with the most redeeming value) once again doesn't link Obama any better to ACORN (thought it does have a nice picture), other than unsubstantiated claims made by a few ACORN members of "meeting" with Obama and "being friends." Without proof, these mean nothing. Just talking with someone doesn't make you complicit in their actions.

The second link? Really, Neal Boortz? The same Neal Boortz that once suggested that Hurricane Katrina victims prostitute themselves in order to get by while stranded? I'm not giving that link the benefit of a listen. You're welcome to tell me the points it makes, if you want to watch it.

The third link doesn't even mention Obama.

The fourth link clearly states that any claims of Obama's connections come directly from "the McCain campaign" -- you're going to have to do better than that.

Try again.

 

[DaedalusHelios]

1. http://www.clevelandleader.com/node/7203

2. http://boortz.com/more/video/obama_acorn_shape_agenda.html

3. http://www.wral.com/news/local/politics/story/3719906/

4. http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/14492.html

just a few sources...

1. Your cleveland leader link was debunked in its comments section. No nervousness here "BigJohn".

2. Neal Boortz is a known republican mudslinger. Just look at his site. The link only shows Obamas link to community organizers. Obama was a community organizer in Chicago to help the poor, so he spoke at a conference. Thats not a bad thing caring about the poor or middle class IMO.

3. Many of these newly registered voters have had their original registrations invalidated for no known reason. Its mainly because of the rate of people defaulting on house loans in my state. Its hard to prove residency when you have lost your house etc. Some people registered twice under the same name and address because they thought they had to register again. I bet some ACORN like groups were telling people to register and not asking them if they had already registered. Hince the duplicates being thrown out. Because of the way the vote counting works these people will be doing nothing illegal but it would inflate the statistic for registered voters. Thats the only real problem there since a duplicate on the list isn't ever printed.

4. Just an editorial rehash of the same accusations. I will say this again so you understand the link. Obama worked as a community organizer. Obama is a lawyer. Obama then represented an alliance of community organizers in a court case according to this link which is a known republican news source.

The links were weak but shows some sort of implied connection. Not a direct connection though. This link to ACORN is a little crazy. Thats like saying because McCain crashed 5 planes he is linked to war profiteering.

Or being in the Vietnam War means that McCain is linked to the killing of all those innocent people that were murdered and raped in their villages by US soldiers.

Its an implied link from republican News Sources. Are you surprised these sources want to incriminate Obama. He is against everything NeoCons stand for. Think about it.

 

[mdm-adph]

We can try to follow tentative guidelines for withdrawl but nothing it war is ever concrete. Should the situation change on the ground, the commanders need access to resources to fight back. If that means bringing in another 20,000 it means bringing in another 20,000. Moreover, the time tables for planned withdrawl should never be stated publically (which the Dems love to do). If the enemy knows how many troops are there, they know how strong/weak the presence is. As such, they know when the people there will be most vulnerable. It's best the enemy thinks there is 160,000 troops there when there is actually only 40,000.

Yeah, that's nice (you'd make a great General, seriously) -- but not the topic. You didn't answer the accusation -- Obama doesn't want out "now," does he?

Colin Powell and George W. Bush made a strong case for war but it turned out to be based on flawed intelligence. There's only one way to find out if intelligence is flawed...satellites.

Once you start a war, you can't just leave and say your sorry. You have to follow through or else you make a lot of enemies. I was in favor of the going to Iraq in 2003 and I am in favor of a victory today.

And again, that nice, but you didn't answer why it was okay for politicians to get you into the war, but not get you out. If you trusted Bush to get you in the war ("flawed" intelligence or not), you should trust politicians to get you out.

(And you have to "follow through or else you make a lot of enemies" -- could Americans make any more enemies than you've made from the Iraq war? )

This pretty much explains it: http://www.glennbeck.com/content/articles/article/198/16762/

If you want more, google "ACORN $800,000" or "ACORN $832,000," you'll get over 40,000 sources and 99% of them are reporting the same thing (Obama's Campaign contributed over $800,000 to ACORN).

According to that article, he gave that money not to ACORN, but to a subsidiary. Please find me some links regarding the nature of the relationship between that subsidiary and ACORN -- not all "subsidiaries" are directly controlled by their parent organizations.

 

[trt740]

If you don't start showing definitive links between ACORN and Obama (once again, you didn't even provide a source), I'm going to stop wasting my time responding to the whole ACORN mess.

And that would be bad, because I like talking about this crap.

This is america votes as you wish not matter what proof I come out with you have drank so much of th Obama cool aide it wouldn't help. Also if you use the same logic you and the other liberal post here the only new sources that count are liberal and those only count if they say what you want to hear.

 

[trt740]

Yeah, that's nice (you'd make a great General, seriously) -- but not the topic. You didn't answer the accusation -- Obama doesn't want out "now," does he?



And again, that nice, but you didn't answer why it was okay for politicians to get you into the war, but not get you out. If you trusted Bush to get you in the war ("flawed" intelligence or not), you should trust politicians to get you out.

(And you have to "follow through or else you make a lot of enemies" -- could Americans make any more enemies than you've made from the Iraq war? )



According to that article, he gave that money not to ACORN, but to a subsidiary. Please find me some links regarding the nature of the relationship between that subsidiary and ACORN -- not all "subsidiaries" are directly controlled by their parent organizations.

You keep demanding proof but provide none.

 

[ManofGod]

mdm-adph, so far, unless I am thinking of someone else, I have yet too see how someone who supports Ron Paul could possibly think that OBama is a good candidate. Care to explain how either one of those are even remotely alike?

 

[DaedalusHelios]

Voter registration is to apply to vote. If all these fraudulent registration forms got approved by the county auditors, the applicants could vote many times for a candidate under various aliases. There are many places to catch the fraudulent activity but if it is not caught, the election could be swayed one way or another. That would result in criminals deciding the election instead of the people. The nation could implode if that was plainly obvious.

I am saying it was forged. All it takes is one guy ordering a stamp and submitting it. It had no source besides a republican News Source. It wasn't a trusted News Source like AP, Reuters etc.

They are under investigation for voter fraud in 12 states since 2004. Here's some of the recent ones:
Nevada: http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/07/acorn-vegas-office-raided-voter-fraud-investigation/
Ohio: http://www.clevelandleader.com/node/7195
Missouri: http://www.kmbc.com/politics/10214492/detail.html
North Carolina: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2008/10/13/20081013acorn-ncarolina1013-ON.html

All red states. Wonder why? Sources don't give enough info to do any fact checking.

mdm-adph, so far, unless I am thinking of someone else, I have yet too see how someone who supports Ron Paul could possibly think that OBama is a good candidate. Care to explain how either one of those are even remotely alike?

I was on the fence about Ron Paul and Obama, until Ron Paul didn't win the republican primaries and he lost all hope of winning because of it.

 

[trt740]

Question I would like answered by Obama

So, to sum up the last few posts:
-we have evidence of McCain speaking at an ACORN rally in 2006, and Obama representing ACORN in a legal case in 1995.

anything else evidentiary?

because you speak at a immigration rally sponsored by Acorn you are some how linked to them? How that the same as you defending them in a lawsuit or giving 900,000 of you campaign money to them? Thats like saying you went to the super bowl sponsored by GMC so you must work for them. He wasn't a Representative of Acorn.



Questions the Media Needs to Ask and Senator Obama Needs to Answer


1. What precisely was the nature of Senator Obama’s relationship with convicted real estate developer Tony Resko? Why did he engage in a real estate deal with Rezko when he was under federal investigation? What “advice” did he give Obama about buying a house in Chicago?

2. Why has Obama proclaimed that he has been fighting alongside ACORN, a radical leftwing organization, his “entire career”?

3. What exactly has been Obama’s experience with ACORN?

4. What was the nature of the “training” Obama provided to ACORN activists in Chicago?

5. What exactly occurred during the “actions” that Obama organized as a community organizer? Did the “actions” involve intimidation by any of the participants Obama led?

6. Why did ACORN activists humiliate bankers into giving bad loans after Obama trained them?

7. Why did Obama seek ACORN’s endorsement in his state senate race?

8. What, if any, support did ACORN provide Obama in his 2004 Senate race?

9. Why was Obama silent on the Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac reform package in 2005?

10. Why did Obama say that sub-prime lending was a “good thing”?

11. Why did Obama support $500 million a year going to ACORN-like organizations in the housing bailout this past summer?

12. Why did the Woods Fund and the Joyce Foundation direct millions to organizations such as ACORN while Obama was serving on the board of those foundations?

13. Why did Madeleine Talbot, one time fiery leader of Chicago ACORN, invite Obama to help train their organizers in the 1990s?

14. Why did Obama attend a fundraiser at George Soros’s home during his 2004 campaign?

15. Why didn’t Obama return campaign contributions from George Soros?

16. Why did Obama vote to raise taxes on people making as little as $42,000 per year?

17. Has Senator Obama or his campaign coordinated with St. Louis law enforcement authorities who are threatening criminal libel charges against critics of Obama who make statements that are found to by law enforcement officials to be “false”?

18. Are the Obama campaign’s “internet action alerts” directing supporters to overwhelm call-in radio show that are critical of Obama consistent with the fair and open campaign the Senator has pledged to run?

19. When did Senator Obama first meet domestic terrorist William Ayers? Did Obama know Ayres as a student at Columbia in the early 1980s?


These are simple questions if any of them are untrue or unfounded then defend yourself and tell us what is true.

 

[ManofGod]

"I was on the fence about Ron Paul and Obama, until Ron Paul didn't win the republican primaries and he lost all hope of winning because of it."

The thing is that these two are so diametrically opposed to where they stand on issues. I would have to say that O'Bama is very dangerous in some of the policies he wants to attempt to implement.

Ron Paul on the other hand seemed as pro American, small government, pro constitution as one could get.

 

[trt740]

In ohio you do not need to have proof of residency. The homeless have no house to list(See Homeless). Some Katrina victims are probably even homeless still.

When people need to get alot of people registered they outsource. Voter fraud is common for both parties. There is no indication that ACORN is doing it illegally. In NC, they just threw out the first wave of voter registration forms we helped the locals fill out. These were almost all democrats. They walked into our downtown campaign location to register. Local officials wouldn't give us a reason why they threw out these filled out forms. We checked ID's and submitted them properly. So pointing fingers is counter-productive. For all you guys know your "source" has fabricated it in the first place. I witnessed what happened here since I volunteer for the local campaign.

What ? your kidding right they are under indictiment by 13 state attorney generals are you serious some are Democrat Attorney generals. The congress is talking about defunding them.

 

[PaulieG]

Guys, lets bring this down a notch, or I will need to start handing out infractions.

 

[SK-1]

Where did I say he was making stuff up? (Though it's true he's not providing any sources.)