Second-hand console games more costly than PC piracy

[claylomax]

http://www.techspot.com/news/43866-lionhead-second-hand-console-games-more-costly-than-pc-piracy.html

 

[hat]

That's because piracy makes a copy of the original, and said pirate may be spurred on to actually buy a copy for himself. If someone buys a 2nd hand copy, they wouldn't buy another copy because they already have a legitimate copy.

 

[micropage7]

coz hardware cant be duplicated so the cost is higher than duplicate apps

 

[claylomax]

But second-hand games are sold in most game shops, so it's legal.

 

[erocker]

Don't really care what Lionhead says. 2nd hand games, renting, etc. have existed before their studio even existed. Too bad Lionhead, too damn bad.

 

[streetfighter 2]

I did a thread similar to this a ways back.
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=129784

 

[Jetster]

They need to just quit crying.

 

[happita]

Don't know why they make it seem like its bad just because its video games...
This argument could be said for literally ANYTHING....used cars, used hardware, used software, used cell phones, used tvs...etc. etc....
These other things cannot be pirated, so in reality, it makes it even worse for the economy.
But am I against it? Not at all whatsoever. It's just the way business is. Used is cheaper and more rational to the conservative consumer.

 

[LAN_deRf_HA]

I don't understand why anyone even tolerates or reports on this idiocy. People buy used goods. They'll always buy used goods, they always have bought used goods. What insanity makes them think it's reasonable to try and curtail this? Not even that, but to publicly complain about it as if this is some isolated thing that only effects their poor little wallets. Bull bull bull bull and a punch in the face.

 

[DrPepper]

How dare someone buy something then sell it later on at a lower value since it has depreciated in cost due to age and W&T.

 

[erocker]

I'm waiting for car manufacturers to say the same thing. Maybe one day we'll just buy a license to drive a car, we won't actually own it. Used car sales will be prohibited.

 

[lilhasselhoffer]

Don't really care what Lionhead says. 2nd hand games, renting, etc. have existed before their studio even existed. Too bad Lionhead, too damn bad.

Reasonable, logical, and factual arguments. Good god, they are trying to take the high ground...Seriously?

I agree with the sentiment. If it isn't used games, it's rentals. When it wasn't rentals it was piracy. When it isn't piracy it was used games. They try to drum up sympathy from the groups they alienate every other week. As a consumer I think they're grasping at straws, and trying to blame me without actually blaming me. WTF?!?

Lionhead brings up an interesting point, in so far as it has not already been openly hostile to players. That said, this song and dance is already mighty old.

I'm waiting for car manufacturers to say the same thing. Maybe one day we'll just buy a license to drive a car, we won't actually own it. Used car sales will be prohibited.

You have no idea...

As an engineer I have some friends working in the automotive industry. The newest "security" features in the R&D labs require users to be programmed into ROM within the vehicle. If you need to get the user profiles changed you're either going to a dealer, or voiding your warranty by playing with internal electronics. They haven't left the lab yet for some very good reasons (no elaboration can be given without serious lawsuit potential), but that doesn't mean that automotive companies aren't looking towards this as a way to keep tighter restrictions on mechanical work.

I really wish I was exaggerating. Oh how I wish this wasn't true...

 

[happita]

As an engineer I have some friends working in the automotive industry. The newest "security" features in the R&D labs require users to be programmed into ROM within the vehicle. If you need to get the user profiles changed you're either going to a dealer, or voiding your warranty by playing with internal electronics. They haven't left the lab yet for some very good reasons (no elaboration can be given without serious lawsuit potential), but that doesn't mean that automotive companies aren't looking towards this as a way to keep tighter restrictions on mechanical work.

I really wish I was exaggerating. Oh how I wish this wasn't true...

Oh, I definitely believe it. The amount of security that is going into things these days is ridiculous. Pretty soon we'll need finger print & eyeball scanners just to unlock the front door to our houses
Conspiracy theories at their finest

 

[RejZoR]

It will suck when they lock console games to each console. Yes, i still have good old PS2 which is not a comparison for today's consoles but it still has one of the finest games (Burnout series, GT4 etc). But i also bought some random games that i didn't like and have sold them later. NFS Undercover that i bought on PS2 for some couch racing but found out it's totally different than PC version and it looked horrible. So i just sold it. Same for some rally game that i found was just too difficult to drive. So i sold it. Both were second hand games for someone. But i don't see anything wrong with this. I bought a legal retail version, didn't like it and sold it afterwards.

More problematic for them are those players who buy a game, finish it and then quickly sell it.
But quite frankly i don't know anyone who would do that. Like me, most ppl buy a game and then have it on a shelf. When you get a bit nostalgic you can play it again. And i do that very often.

Besides, i don't get it why they are complaining so much. We used to lend games between each other with friends in the past (original games). When a friend had the game i couldn't play it. We didn't make a copy so this is hardly a piracy. Same here. The game is not duplicated, it's removed from your possession and "placed" into someone's else. They are complaining in a way like you weren't allowed to sell a car either once you already have it or a mobile phone or a graphic card. World is full of second hand goods, why should games be any different? What makes them so damn special and better than the rest of the manufacturers in the world? AMD would make more profit if ppl weren't selling old graphic cards. Samsung would make more profit if ppl weren't selling second hand mobile phones. Volkswagen would make more profit if ppl weren't selling second hand cars that they don't get anything from those second hand buyers. So why is then stupid gaming and music industry constantly complaining over this. WHY!? They are greedy bastards and they never have enough. They sell millions of copies and they are still never happy with it. I miss the days when gaming iindustry was partialy there for the profits and partially for the sheer passion of making great games. Today it's just profit, profit and again profit.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

http://www.techspot.com/news/43866-lionhead-second-hand-console-games-more-costly-than-pc-piracy.html

I bet we're going to see console games requiring online serial registration soon. They've been doing that on PC for years now because game publishers hate second-hand sales for some reason (oh, right, they already got their money and don't make anymore on those transactions).

 

[claylomax]

The last sentence of the story is the best: "He also believes that the only way to stop a pirate from not paying for a game is to have a face to face conversation with him or her, in order to explain the consequences of their actions"

 

[xenocide]

The last sentence of the story is the best: "He also believes that the only way to stop a pirate from not paying for a game is to have a face to face conversation with him or her, in order to explain the consequences of their actions"

How about not making shitty products? I understand the misconception is that you can make a subpar game and it should sell 100m copies as long as you market it and add a bunch of $20 DLC, but maybe that doesn't help? I know WoW Expansions sell well each time around, because they are good quality products, I guarantee Diablo 3 will sell well, guess why!?

The fact is, Piracy is rampant because of multiple reasons;

1. There is no incentive to actually buy the game. Witcher 2 has a standard edition that comes with a butt load of extra content, compare that to most games, like Dragon Age 2, where you essentially just get the game, and are asked if you want to buy DLC immediately upon starting it up. Doesn't exactly send a good message.
2. Low Quality Products. I refuse to buy a game that costs $60, and was clearly pushed out the door as fast as possible. Day 1 Patches? Zero Day DLC? This all ridiculous crap. Dragon Age 2 shipped without HD Textures. Are you ****ing, kidding me? Could they have made it any more apparent that they rushed that game out for some quick cash?
3. Diminished Creativity. Who wants to buy 3 different versions of Guitar Hero each year? What about 3-4 CoD-clones? The sad part is that this actually happens. One game does something well, and then everyone beats the shit out of the concept. People don't want to keep buying the same game at full price.

 

[Kreij]

As for the second hand game market causing a loss in profits, I'm not even going to comment on that as it is total crap and has more potential to increase their profits through game longevity.

As for piracy, maybe the game market should look at the application software market for ideas. If I buy an app at full price, I usually am tempted by the developer to get the next version at a reduced cost (upgrade) for being a loyal customer.

Did you buy DA:O? Get DA 2 for a reduced price for being a good customer.
Not so far fetched, is it?

Just a bit of rambling from yer old Uncle Kreij.

 

[RejZoR]

They haven't heard for extra game content or DLC. And i mean proper DLC's that are worth the money, not some stupid maps and weapons or skins that you should get in teh first place. I mean proper story extensions, mini campaigns, HD texture refresh and new effects after i don't know 1 year or so. Give gamers a reason to buy extra stuff and you don't have to restrict them with retarded restrictions, online activations and other nonsense. They could keep games alive for longer this way and give players a reason to stick with them and not sell them after they are done with it.

But these greedy companies only see "oh noes they are selling games and we don't make any profit out of it" instead of actively do something to prevent that in a good way. But no, it's the easiest to constantly complain like a freakin retard. That's what they all do. Complain all the time but they don't do shit to improve anything. Facepalm.

 

[Batou1986]

To be fair the game industry needs to shut up and quit whining they are making more money on games then ever before.
How bout all the money they make off of steam and other services ~60$ no box no manual no disc nothing so its pure profit for them.
They made there money the first sale its not like Gamestop made another copy from the original, this shit just comes down to greed.

Secondly im not against used games but the major retailers ie gamestop are getting ridiculous with there trade in values VS pricing.

For example i buy Madden 2011 for $60 bucks the day of its release, come back a week later they will give you $15 bucks for it then turn around and sell it for $54

Once again pure simple greed thank god for Gamefly, Wonder what game fly buying tens of thousands of games does to boost there sales numbers

 

[RejZoR]

I agree with the nonsense pricing of second hand games in dedicated stores. I get it that they need to make something out of it but not doing it a 4x of the cash you got back from it.
One of the reasons why i prefer to keep game for myself even if its just collecting dust.

 

[Kreij]

For example i buy Madden 2011 for $60 bucks the day of its release, come back a week later they will give you $15 bucks for it then turn around and sell it for $54

You have to factor in the overhead costs of running a "brick and mortar" business.
Building lease, insurance, utilities, employees, employee insurace and benefits, taxes, licensing, accounting, advertising, refunds, support costs, etc. etc. etc.
It's not cheap.
The age of the game does not guarantee them an additional sale (but it does increase the potential). If a game sucks and people know it, they will be sitting on useless inventory that will be a loss even if they pay only 20% of the original purchase price.
They can write off the losses on taxes, but they still have to fork over the operating cash at the time of transaction and that does not pay day to day expenses.
Buy low, sell higher is the only way to stay in business ... and even then you have to be business wise in order to stay afloat.

 

[Ray_Rogers2109]

The ONLY reason why I torrent games is to see if I'll enjoy them enough to buy them and to see if they run alright on my computer. Certain titles past a certain date are no goes for the computer I'm using. I'll be torrenting games even more after the computer I'm building is finished.
It's so I don't waste money buying a crappy game I don't want and the ones I do want to buy I do eventually. Same exact thing I'm doing for several XBOX 360 titles I own. There's a PC counterpart which I know will play utterly shit on the pre-built I'm using so I'm playing the 360 release in the meantime before buying it for PC.
More companies need to have demos for their games which I'd be more than willing to download and I'd torrent far less instead of a full game. I heavily support retail/manufactured releases of titles anyway so the digital distribution gimmick is not appealing to me.
Well I'll be torrenting still only to see what certain games are capable of through the set-up. The main reason why I'm building a completely new computer is because I torrented Wolfenstein and I want to be able to buy and play this game on a PC which will more than handle it.
So yes I approve of torrenting since demos are practically non-existant. How am I supposed to know if "X" title is any good if I dont play a bit of it first? No I don't consider it piracy since there are several titles I'll be buying which I enjoyed and others I'm not. Do video game companies honestly think we'll buy any game anymore?
Yes, there are a few games which I torrented which are difficult to find. Soon as I found said title I scrapped the burnt out disc and put the retail in its place. It feels more empowering to actually have the retail/manufactured release sitting on a shelf instead of a stupid CD-R/DVD-R in a binder. I'd much rather support the video game industry with a retail/manufactured title compared to digitally.

With the 360/PS3 comparison, I usually do the research for the PC counterpart then buy said game for either console because there's absolutely no damn way my pre-built piece of utter shit will play the PC release right now. I could even make a long list of titles I've torrented which I'm very eager to buy which are on my Amazon Wishlist. I guess it's considered "Piracy" when I don't care for the crap games I don't have any interest in buying.
It's what hat typed for the second post. I've been buying more games because of torrenting because otherwise I wouldn't've been able to play them. So yes more demos from Video Game companies would be nice instead of them bitching and moaning about "Piracy" please.

 

[erocker]

Nice thread necro. You're also off topic as the topic is about second-hand console games. I doubt anyone here cares if you "torrent" and/or what your excuse is to do so.