RTX 4090 & 53 Games: Ryzen 7 5800X vs Core i9-12900K

[JorgeRod]

Comparing a i9-12900k priced at 699,90€ with a 339,90€ ryzen7 5800x?? Should be a Ryzen 9 5950X (614,90€) maybe.

 

[Kapone33]

Should I test 5800X3D or faster RAM speed?

Faster RAM speeds with tighter timings but nothing that the average power user could not replicate.

 

[RandallFlagg]

Comparing a i9-12900k priced at 699,90€ with a 339,90€ ryzen7 5800x?? Should be a Ryzen 9 5950X (614,90€) maybe.

I think their point alluded to in the verbiage was to compare their test bench system (5800X) to the alternative test bench.

It's not really a CPU comparison but 'what would it look like if we used this instead to benchmark GPUs'.

So now we know Zen 3 basically isn't fast enough for the fastest of GPUs.

I'm going to hazard a guess that no current CPU can keep up with a 4090 at 1080P though.

 

[sector-z]

Should I test 5800X3D or faster RAM speed?

The 2, ram make so much difference on AMD platforme, that 5800X was really handicaped by that very poor kit of ram. Take a fair B-Die 4000MHz Cas 14 or 15 but not 20 !! In a 1:1 ratio.

13900K(Not bios restricted)
7950X (With PBO)
5800X3D

You can add the 5800X with the new ram in bonus

That the Battle people want to see With a good 420mm AIO at least or Custome loop, people dont want Temps throttled CPU but what they can offer at stock unrestricted.

 

[seventy]

Should I test 5800X3D or faster RAM speed?

The reason 5800X3D is generally considered a much faster processor is because it completely offsets suboptimal ram the processor usually tested with.
It's common knowledge for overclockers that even with tightly overclocked b-die performance of 5800x3d doesn't improve much.
So I would vote for faster ram, as it would be more useful for the average person to know how much impact it actually has on zen.

The 2, ram make so much difference on AMD platforme, that 5800X was really handicaped by that very poor kit of ram. Take a fair B-Die 4000MHz Cas 14 or 15 but not 20 !! In a 1:1 ratio.

13900K(Not bios restricted)
7950X (With PBO)
5800X3D

You can add the 5800X with the new ram in bonus

That the Battle people want to see With a good 420mm AIO at least or Custome loop, people dont want Temps throttled CPU but what they can offer at stock unrestricted.

b-die at 4000MHz with 14-14... etc timings is basically the best ddr4 that you could get for zen.
The "cheap" dual-ranked 3200cl14 kits people usually buy would not clock that high without extensive babysitting. And off-the-shelf kits are too expensive. Something like tight 3600cl14 or 3800cl14 would be more reasonable imo.

 

[RandallFlagg]

The 2, ram make so much difference on AMD platforme, that 5800X was really handicaped by that very poor kit of ram. Take a fair B-Die 4000MHz Cas 14 or 15 but not 20 !! In a 1:1 ratio.

13900K(Not bios restricted)
7950X (With PBO)
5800X3D

You can add the 5800X with the new ram in bonus

That the Battle people want to see With a good 420mm AIO at least or Custome loop, people dont want Temps throttled CPU but what they can offer at stock unrestricted.

Then why not use DDR5-7200.

I mean you can't even buy 32GB of DDR4-4000 C14. You then have to OC it past XMP settings, you're playing silicon lotto at this point.

DDR4-4000 C16 is the best you can do on XMP, and only about 5% of Zen 3 will let you run IF 2000 1:1

Why not just use the standard test bench, which represents what probably 80%+ of what people can actually do (DDR5-6000 and DDR4-3600 C14).

 

[qubit]

@W1zzard 53 games: yer defo a masochist! Look forward to reading it.

It's my contention that buying a powerful card can sometimes make sense when pairing it with a weak processor, with the classic "devil's in the detail" making or breaking that case.

 

[W1zzard]

DDR5-7200

Actually DDR5-7400 results coming from me this week

 

[RandallFlagg]

Actually DDR5-7400 results coming from me this week

Zen 4 and Raptor Lake?

A lot of these X670 and Z790 motherboards are touting the ability to run that kind of speed now.

 

[TheinsanegamerN]

So.....WTF happened in DMC 5? Most forward looking game engine?

 

[bobmeix]

On the conclusion page, did you mean performance gains instead of 6.4-6.6% performance games?

 

[Haile Selassie]

@W1zzard, can you check your Cinebench score with IFRAM 1:1 @ 4000 (2000)? My system starts acting up over 1900MHz IF. It's Prime stable, Memtest86 stable, however the performance degrades severely. Like, 60% Cinebench score of what you get at 1900IF.

 

[jinxjx]

LOL, 16gb vs 32gb of ram, and not even their best cpu ! why does this place hate AMD so much!....

 

[W1zzard]

@W1zzard, can you check your Cinebench score with IFRAM 1:1 @ 4000 (2000)? My system starts acting up over 1900MHz IF. It's Prime stable, Memtest86 stable, however the performance degrades severely. Like, 60% Cinebench score of what you get at 1900IF.

I have reviewed over 100 graphics cards on this config, it is stable and trouble-free, or I wouldn't use it. can't risk having wrong scores in my reviews .. retail CPU btw

 

[Haile Selassie]

@W1zzard - Totally understood. I had this set up for 3 months not knowing what was wrong.
If you have the time just do a sanity check via Cinebench. Like I said, mine exhibited total system stability.
Used DDR4-4000 C16-16-16 (high bin Samsung B) and later DDR4-4600 18-22-22-44-76 tight-as-it-goes Micron (69-70GB/s on 5900X, 58ns).

 

[Neizel]

The 2, ram make so much difference on AMD platforme, that 5800X was really handicaped by that very poor kit of ram. Take a fair B-Die 4000MHz Cas 14 or 15 but not 20 !! In a 1:1 ratio.

4000MHz B-die CL15 is on the tight side of the spectrum and playing with 1.5v+. CL14 is 1.6v+ for sure, so I wouldn't advice to test that for a reliable source of performance for every reader.

The kit used on these test for sure is holding the 5800X back. Going for a 3600-3800 kit is very to run even for new people into PCs.

Should I test 5800X3D or faster RAM speed?

I would go 5800X3D if the ram kit will be the same.

I would go with at least 3600 CL14 XMP kit if you're going to add or keep testing the 5800X. Sweet spot would be 3800MHz but 3600 is where the vast majority of people use when they aren't into tweaking bios.

 

[Silvinjo]

@W1zzard, can you check your Cinebench score with IFRAM 1:1 @ 4000 (2000)? My system starts acting up over 1900MHz IF. It's Prime stable, Memtest86 stable, however the performance degrades severely. Like, 60% Cinebench score of what you get at 1900IF.

For Zen 3 you dont want to go over 3800mhz, if you have APU yes, but "standard" CPU nop since you lose performance (even stated by AMD themselves). I have tested myself with my E-die kit and 5600X, I can run 24/7 stable 4000 CL19-20-20 (2000 IF) but FPS in games were dogshit compared to 3733 CL14-8-18-13 that I have rn. Since I do play games at 1080p and low settings, I'm considering to go lower on frequency (3600mhz) and tighten the timings even more since that would gain probably ~5 more fps, but currently I'm a bit lazy.

 

[Haile Selassie]

For Zen 3 you dont want to go over 3800mhz, if you have APU yes, but "standard" CPU nop since you lose performance (even stated by AMD themselves). I have tested myself with my E-die kit and 5600X, I can run 24/7 stable 4000 CL19-20-20 (2000 IF) but FPS in games were dogshit compared to 3733 CL14-8-18-13 that I have rn. Since I do play games at 1080p and low settings, I'm considering to go lower on frequency (3600mhz) and tighten the timings even more since that would gain probably ~5 more fps, but currently I'm a bit lazy.

Yes, IF2000 1:1 tanked performance compared to IF1900 1:1, same DRAM settings. System stable This is what I have observed on 5900X.

 

[erocker]

AMD should have already had X3D incorporated in the 7 series.

 

[RandallFlagg]

People need to stop with this nonsense of running DDR4-4000 C14 or some such. That's all binned memory and CPUs on $500 motherboards, each part you have < 5% chance of winning on the silicon lottery. That means like 5% of 5% of 5% to score on all 3 counts.

If you all really want to see that here's a video for you.

The short version is, it's a 4-way tie on avgs with 12900K having better 1% lows. All 3 of these chips can max out a 3090 Ti in most titles.

Note: the '4th' is the 12900K with max OC DDR4 vs DDR5.

 

[sephiroth117]

Tbh one of those two CPU peaks near 230W.
I wasn't expecting that big of a difference, I wonder how a 7600X or a 5800X3D would fare tho

 

[wheresmycar]

53 games!!..... W1zzard, TPU members owe you a holiday and then some!

 

[Silvinjo]

Yes, IF2000 1:1 tanked performance compared to IF1900 1:1, same DRAM settings. System stable This is what I have observed on 5900X.

I'm more shocked that this is posted live to the world (and the fact that 53 games were tested with that bad ram) and that someone who has so much systems didnt realize yet that 4000mhz is not go for Zen 3, especially those really high timings. Just to be clear, I dont have 500$ board (I'm on B550 Pro4, 100$ board) and 2x8 Ballistix 3600 CL16 (E-die) that I picked for a bit more than 50€ on amazon.de. Actually, this is ONE of the reason I don't like techpowerup, or atleast, their "testers".

 

[Kapone33]

I'm more shocked that this is posted live to the world (and the fact that 53 games were tested with that bad ram) and that someone who has so much systems didnt realize yet that 4000mhz is not go for Zen 3, especially those really high timings. Just to be clear, I dont have 500$ board (I'm on B550 Pro4, 100$ board) and 2x8 Ballistix 3600 CL16 (E-die) that I picked for a bit more than 50€ on amazon.de. Actually, this is ONE of the reason I don't like techpowerup, or atleast, their "testers".

You RAM kit is killer for AM4 congrats

 

[Silvinjo]

You RAM kit is killer for AM4 congrats

Kind of, I went from 3000 CL16 and saw this for cheap so decided to buy it. First, didnt really notice a difference between 3000 CL16 and 3600 CL16, tho, not long ago I decided to try to clock and test the ram for a week, and saw decent gains on 3733 in both AVG and esepecially 0.1%, with 4000mhz the only thing that I achieved was better latency when testing in Aida64 (it was like 2ns lower then this 3733 setup that I'm getting 55.5 rn), tho, games didnt like it. I'm only bummed about RD that is bad on E-die, I could set it to 17 (from 18) but I would probably need another 0.5v on dimm so decided to settle with this for now, but in the near future I'm definetly aiming for something like 3600 CL13-7-17-11 to get the max possible fps and best possible 0.1%.