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Inside the Artificial Universe That Creates Itself - "No Mans Sky"

FordGT90Concept

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Just FYI, the skybox in Elite Dangerous is not faked. It is based on the things actually around you.
It isn't in Stellar Overload either. I doubt it is a skybox in Space Engineers too. Like No Man's Sky, all of these games let you leave the planet and explore the stars.
 
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It isn't in Stellar Overload either. I doubt it is a skybox in Space Engineers too. Like No Man's Sky, all of these games let you leave the planet and explore the stars.

Good to know. My point is this is no longer a unique feature, and that substantiates it further. :)

Good to have options.
 

FordGT90Concept

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Most games use level of detail for explorable objects. There's a skybox beyond that not unlike, say, X3. Pretty sure No Man's Sky will have a distant skybox too.
 
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Most games use level of detail for explorable objects. There's a skybox beyond that not unlike, say, X3. Pretty sure No Man's Sky will have a distant skybox too.

In X3 the planets weren't even real. Each point of light in Elite is actually a distant star (you can't actually drive to them without hyperdrive sadly, but they are plotted and placed correctly).

The galaxy looks awesome as you get near the core and the star field thickens.
 

FordGT90Concept

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But in Elite, are distant galaxies still not skyboxed?
 
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But in Elite, are distant galaxies still not skyboxed?

In the sense that you can't go to them? Yeah. They move relative to your positioning though, if applicable (the distances involved make this kinda hard to notice in most cases).
 
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Thát is the issue of a game such as this, but it ties a lot into online gameplay and if No Man's Sky finds a way to get persistence in a procedural world, they may sell it to me.

My guess is that NMS will appeal to people who like exploration. There are infinite worlds to discover and you can tell and show people what you found. Anyone who is hoping for depth in any other aspect will likely be disappointed.

It will be a really cool game if the worlds are unique and complex, so that exploration doesn't become monotonous. Ruins with coherent archaeology would be nice. Maybe some galaxy wide mystery to solve? Where the more planets you explore the more pieces of the puzzle you can put together.

In the videos I've seen, they haven't said much about what you can actually do, or what meaningful goals you could have.
 

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The skybox in an ED session is based on the location of your character within their galaxy so the skybox at least according to claims should be pretty accurate in that respect...in that sense it's pretty impressive. Its also disappointing when you're trying to test the "freeness" of space in Elite and end up reaching a destination by measurement but you're stuck in the same instance as RTB put it until you hyperspace out of it and into the next.

Its handled really well IMHO so it doesn't feel immersion breaking. I'm curious to see if Mr. Murray and co. can pull off his ultimate geek wet dream. I've loosely followed this for a while as evidence in my TPU space sim thread.

If the add enough to do, and change and truly leave your mark on with this procedural universe they've created they'll have a winner.

Elite has issues where it is considered a mile wide in expansiveness and only and inch deep in stuff to do. Its saving graces are graphics, flight model and for me combat. Missions are pretty ho hum after a few dozen...power play feels more like a chore...combat zones.and RES are a hoot though...if you enjoy combat... Elite's is almost methodical. Don't get me started about space trucking in Elite...I had done that for dozens of hours to build up money back around Gamma/Release stages...and haven't had a dedicated interest in trading since.

The problem many have with Elite now is that its meant for the long-term self-motivated gamer, someone who is willing to dump hundreds of hours into their own goals...because the game isn't giving you really any goals specifically yet...but more of a sandbox universe to make your own. Which for me is fine...though I do wish there was more to do, more varieties in enemy encounters, and more excitement in general. Regardless, it's still an amazing experience and I can't wait to see it continuing to unfold as it gets better and better with each and every patch!

While being excited for NMS you guys should definitely check out Elite, especially being $29 for the main game, you don't NEED Horizons yet, and being a season thing if you could hold out until next Steam Winter Sale you'll probably be able to pick up Horizon's + next year's "season" release for less than MSRP of the next season release...

If you want more to do, build and affect now...look into Evochron Legacy. Its an excellent indie title from an amazing dev. I've been mixing my time between ED and EL. If I could take.Elites graphics and audio and throw in Evochron for the rest and add a bit of Homeworld/Freespace 2 storytelling for an optional SP experience I'd have the perfect space sim. Though ELs stories works to train and guide you through the galaxy pretty well.

Sorry...got side tracked. Back on topic...NMS seems more like a hop in and go kinda game...sure it has procedural universe, and physics and all that is handled by their engine, simpler graphics equates to more computing power for the backend grunt work to make such a large universe work on consoles (if all the universe grunt work is done locally rather than on servers a la Elite Dangerous). It seems more about getting out and seeing everything you can see in each session...I am stoked for this game, but it really needs to have some depth or it'll end up being considered a tech demo for a good procedural universe engine. Which isn't a bad thing imho...but it won't sell 100,000's of copies either. Regardless...looking forward to seeing NMS being released and Sean Murray's dream realized...a man so excited for so long about his concept and bringing it to reality hopefully means that it will at least be a helluva lotta fun to enjoy the experience! One can hope at least.

:toast:
 
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My guess is that NMS will appeal to people who like exploration. There are infinite worlds to discover and you can tell and show people what you found. Anyone who is hoping for depth in any other aspect will likely be disappointed.

It will be a really cool game if the worlds are unique and complex, so that exploration doesn't become monotonous. Ruins with coherent archaeology would be nice. Maybe some galaxy wide mystery to solve? Where the more planets you explore the more pieces of the puzzle you can put together.

In the videos I've seen, they haven't said much about what you can actually do, or what meaningful goals you could have.

'Things to do' can be very subtle from one game to the next, and game A may do everything right, while game B with almost similar 'activities' fails miserably. The devil is in the details.

To continue on the subject of ED: it hás all the activities, and the actual way these activities work in the game, just doesn't really stick for repeated play. I think Kursah is referring to the same thing; you really need to be able to keep thinking up your own story to make it work. The activities themselves are actually not immersive and interesting enough to stay entertaining on themselves. This ties a lot into the way you 'feel' progression in ED, and it ties a lot into the amount of (or lack of) persistence in the world.

See, I like exploring and the first couple of hours in ED, exploring was awesome. The skyboxes, the sense of size and expansiveness, the incredible number of place to visit... it adds a great deal to immersion. But when you are past that, there has to be something to keep a player in the game. ED lacks that. Exploring is the best example of how ED lacks that depth that is required to keep playing. You can explore places, you can make pictures (this is an out-of-game feature, you make screenshots and post them, so it's an example of 'players creating content to do', not one of game design) and if you are lucky, you find some place that no one has ever been to, you make a surface scan, and you tie your name to the discovery.

.... and that was exploring. Apart from the occasional 'first', exploring offers nothing in terms of actual gameplay. It also doesn't reward the player properly / relative to the time invested. I can't drop a probe or anything to 'do' something with my discovery later on. I can't leave my mark on any place that has already been visited by someone else. I can't share my knowledge with others. My knowledge doesn't 'earn' me anything in terms of mastery of progression in the game.

This example is what plagues ED and procedural games in general. The lack of persistence, lack of progression, lack of a main activity to follow (or story to progress). I like to compare it with LEGO. LEGO is a 'procedurally generated toybox'. You've got building blocks, and every time you use them, you can build and expand on your world, using the very same blocks. But for a new build, I need to tear down what I had built before, unless I have an infinite number of blocks.

Open universe/world procedural games that can offer an infinite number of blocks and allow me to revisit what I've done before, automatically introduce these concepts in a good way: persistence can exist, progression can be made visible.
 
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This game looks really cool. I cant wait to give this a go.

Its up for pre-order on steam.
 

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Also available on GOG, for those that prefer that.
 

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I honestly believe this will be a dissapointment, at least to me. Exploration for the sake of exploration can be excellent, but it's easy to make it shoddy. My hopes are not up.
 

FordGT90Concept

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I agree. Exploration for the sake of exploration can easily be considered grinding. A reason is needed to explore: a carrot to chase. For example, Spore's carrot wasn't big enough. Yeah, there's the center of the galaxy but there's so much grinding to reach the center of the galaxy, it gets boring long before most people reach it. I haven't seen anything in No Man's Sky that represents the carrot. It could easily be one of those games I play for a few hours and then decide the carrot is tasty but it's too much work to get it and quit. XD

 
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Somehow I feel a sudden urge to eat carrots...

Looking forward to this game. Will await reviews first, though.
 
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I honestly believe this will be a dissapointment, at least to me. Exploration for the sake of exploration can be excellent, but it's easy to make it shoddy. My hopes are not up.

The first issue is that space travel and the entry into a planet's atmosphere are not detailed, strategic, challenging or even realistic. The process of getting from space through an atmosphere and to successfully land, should be an immense undertaking ; rather than a case of pointing your controller in one direction.

Additionally, planet's need to be massive versions of an ARK : Survival Evolved map, where the world is alive, populated, detailed, interesting and full of adventure.

This could be the beginning of an amazing project that one day sees such things, of which may be enhanced by point of view type movement, virtual reality/headset tracking and other immersive methods.

It will take time though, a lot of time and a lot of creativity - and a lot of patience by consumers.

EDIT: Also, they need to redo the graphics engine - it's way too cartoony.
 

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I wouldn't get my hopes up. This is clearly being heavily funded by Sony for PlayStation 4. Expansive content doesn't generally do well on consoles (e.g. The Sims). If they do intend to expand the game post-release, it would have be driven by Windows sales because the PS4 version isn't likely to get those updates. I put the odds of that happening under 20%.
 

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I think it'll fit a niche and the graphics are fine for what it is, bright, simple, colorful and with decent shader work. I think that's supposed to be part of the appeal of it...at least to me. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy what SC and E:D bring to the table with their graphics...but I would never expect that from this game. I want this to focus on gameplay and fun factor.

I am staying leery of it until release for sure, but am very interested to see how they truly handle the procedural generation and AI aspects, because as the lead dev has made very clear those are kind of the forces behind what is making this game unique. Those technologies could succeed, improve and lead up to what folks want as was detailed by @newconroer , or it could fail and we might need to wait to see if Star Citizen or Elite offers up something similar in a few years-ish or more.

From what little I've seen this seems more like something that would more appeal to more casual gamers than avid gamers imho. Which I happen to be more casual...but I get myself into some pretty in-depth games (simulations, strategy, 4X, etc)...but sometimes it is nice to fire something up that doesn't have to be scientifically correct, doesn't have to follow the rules of physics and modeling that other games are or claim to, and is something unique and able to be fun. If its not fun...then people will pick it apart more-so than is already happening.

I'm hopeful for something fun that is easy to get into for 10-30 minutes, and also enjoyable enough to play for several hours. It will really come down to the variety of places to go, things to see, interact with and do. The battles to fight, the customization options, discoveries to make, etc. We shall see eventually, and I really hope they take their time and release a solid, polished product. I'd rather see a game delayed several times than a beta released on-time. Hopefully this game doesn't suck...time will tell.
 
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Audio Device(s) Sound Blaster AE-7 / Sennheiser HD 660S
Power Supply Seasonic Prime 750W Titanium
Software Windows 11 Pro 64
This looks like a bad console port already.
 
Joined
Sep 15, 2011
Messages
6,471 (1.40/day)
Processor Intel® Core™ i7-13700K
Motherboard Gigabyte Z790 Aorus Elite AX
Cooling Noctua NH-D15
Memory 32GB(2x16) DDR5@6600MHz G-Skill Trident Z5
Video Card(s) ZOTAC GAMING GeForce RTX 3080 AMP Holo
Storage 2TB SK Platinum P41 SSD + 4TB SanDisk Ultra SSD + 500GB Samsung 840 EVO SSD
Display(s) Acer Predator X34 3440x1440@100Hz G-Sync
Case NZXT PHANTOM410-BK
Audio Device(s) Creative X-Fi Titanium PCIe
Power Supply Corsair 850W
Mouse Logitech Hero G502 SE
Software Windows 11 Pro - 64bit
Benchmark Scores 30FPS in NFS:Rivals
The price for the game is really to steep for a 10 years old graphics style.
 
Joined
Jun 14, 2010
Messages
623 (0.12/day)
Location
City 217
Processor AMD Phenom II X4 925
Motherboard Asus M4A78LT-M
Cooling Ice Hammer IH-4***
Memory 2x4GB DDR3 Corsair
Video Card(s) Asus HD7870 2GB
Storage 500GB SATAII Samsung | 500GB SATAII Seagate
Display(s) 23" LG 23EA63V-P
Case Thermaltake V3 Black Edition
Audio Device(s) VIA VT1708S
Power Supply Corsair TX650W
Software Windows 10 x64
Another open world full of empty promises? Say it ain't so!
 
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