First ever GPU WaterBlock install - Need Help

[Nicholas Peyton]

Hi,

Okay EK doesn't officially do a full waterblock for the 1080 Classified; but I've got my hands on the EK 780 Classified waterblock (as a few guys on EVGA forums managed to get it to fit).

This is 1st time I've ever installed a block on a GPU (so it doesn't help that the block isn't even specifically designed for my card).

In the instructions it says:
"EKWB recommends using small drops of thermal grease on each phase regulator (that is being covered with thermal pad) in order to even further improve the thermal performance of the water block."

So I have 3 questions:

Question 1) what part is the 'phase regulators'? (I've put numbers beside each part in picture) Can someone please say which one is the phase regulators?

Question 2) Which of these parts (with corresponding numbers) actually gets hot? (Generates the heat and gets actively cooled)? 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 or 6?

Question 3) Which ones (1, 2, 3, 4, 5 or 6) do the thermal pads go on?

Thanks so much

Nick Peyton

 

[okidna]

As far as I know, the name of the components based on your labels :

1. solid tantalum capacitors (SMD based)
2. solid polymer capacitors
3. inductors or chokes
4 & 5. MOSFETs (one of them can be high-side MOSFETs and the other can be low-side MOSFETs, I think #5 is high-side, and #4 is low-side)
6. MOSFET's driver (I'm not sure)

To answer your questions :

Q1 : phase regulators is 4 & 5
Q2 : 4 & 5 are the hottest part of a VRM, 6 also tend to get hot. As far as I know, 4,5, and 6 are covered by default Classified heatsink.
Q3 : 4, 5, & 6, and maybe also 3.

 

[Nicholas Peyton]

As far as I know, the name of the components based on your labels :

1. solid tantalum capacitors (SMD based)
2. solid polymer capacitors
3. inductors or chokes
4 & 5. MOSFETs (one of them can be high-side MOSFETs and the other can be low-side MOSFETs, I think #5 is high-side, and #4 is low-side)
6. MOSFET's driver (I'm not sure)

To answer your questions :

Q1 : phase regulators is 4 & 5
Q2 : 4 & 5 are the hottest part of a VRM, 6 also tend to get hot. As far as I know, 4,5, and 6 are covered by default Classified heatsink.
Q3 : 4, 5, & 6, and maybe also 3.

a million thanks

 

[FireFox]

Oh Man.

Can't you just wait till Alphacool release their new waterblock for the 1080 Classified?

 

[theonedub]

@okidna pretty much covered it. Only cover 3 if it will make contact with the block and you have enough thermal pads after covering the important components (and the RAM, of course).

 

[the54thvoid]

What about the VRam chips? Are they covered properly by the block? I had to mod my block by removing a stand off and use thicker pads on a section.
The SAS motto is who dares wins. This feels more like fools rush in.
Good luck regardless.

 

[uuuaaaaaa]

As far as I know, the name of the components based on your labels :

1. solid tantalum capacitors (SMD based)
2. solid polymer capacitors
3. inductors or chokes
4 & 5. MOSFETs (one of them can be high-side MOSFETs and the other can be low-side MOSFETs, I think #5 is high-side, and #4 is low-side)
6. MOSFET's driver (I'm not sure)

To answer your questions :

Q1 : phase regulators is 4 & 5
Q2 : 4 & 5 are the hottest part of a VRM, 6 also tend to get hot. As far as I know, 4,5, and 6 are covered by default Classified heatsink.
Q3 : 4, 5, & 6, and maybe also 3.

6's act as phase doublers as well I think :| But I don't know much about this!

 

[Nicholas Peyton]

What about the VRam chips? Are they covered properly by the block? I had to mod my block by removing a stand off and use thicker pads on a section.
The SAS motto is who dares wins. This feels more like fools rush in.
Good luck regardless.

Not sure yet r.e VRam chips but someone on the EVGA forums claims it fitted perfectly even with the stock pads that come with the block.

I've not even broken the seal on the bag yet (I'm still waiting on EK getting back to me with confirmation from their R&D department on compatibility (after I sent them pictures and links of other people who have got the EK 780 Classified block to fit their 1080 Classified).

I sent them extensive measurements and offered to support them in every way possible to *test* this so they could also officially support the 1080 for all customers with this block. (I think the problem was partly due to EVGA wouldn't send them samples) and they anticipated demand would be minimal so no checks were ever actually done.

They're a busy company. But I've been persistant, not just with trying to get 1080 Classified waterblock support. It was me who asked Kingpin for an updated 1080 Classified voltage tool and 2 days later we got one

Anyway I ordered block *before* getting this confirmation because I'm on holiday for a week after today and the shipping time is 5 days+ from Slovenia. (I ordered it praying for good news) which I'm still waiting for....

the54void did you remove standoff with an EK 780 Classified block? or your bitspower one in your system specs? (According to EK configurator the '980ti Classified Kingpin' wasn't compatible with this block but the '980ti Classified' was. I'd assume the 1080 Classified would be more compatible than a 980TI Classified KPE as EVGA have used the same PCB for all their classified cards for years (with the KPE being the only exception)?

From a quick visual inspection the only *possible* compatibility issue EK thought I *might* have (still to be confirmed) was with the resistor below (circled in red):

 

[the54thvoid]

You had to do that with the EK 780 Classified block? or your bitspower one in your system specs?

The Kingpin block I modded was designed for a 980, not a ti, so the memory chip placement was different, and therefore the block was also different. A stand off needed to be removed (otherwise it would have either cracked the PCB or not allowed proper contact from block to GPU) and an extra thickness of thermal pad was required to make contact with the block-Vram area. Classifieds are the same as Kingpins in layout for the most part but between models with different memory modules and also chip die area, the contact area of the block may be significantly different.

If you're going to try volt adjusting your Classy with a poorly optimised two gen old waterblock - you may have serious problems. There is but a tiny difference between your eagerness to do things and your impatience to get them done. I appreciate you may be well educated on matters at hand but if you've never even mounted a GPU water block before you need to be extremely careful. As @Knoxx29 has said - why not just wait for the correct block to come out?

780ti classy top, yours below. Double check block shape matches the die and memory area.

 

[Nicholas Peyton]

The Kingpin block I modded was designed for a 980, not a ti, so the memory chip placement was different, and therefore the block was also different. A stand off needed to be removed (otherwise it would have either cracked the PCB or not allowed proper contact from block to GPU) and an extra thickness of thermal pad was required to make contact with the block-Vram area. Classifieds are the same as Kingpins in layout for the most part but between models with different memory modules and also chip die area, the contact area of the block may be significantly different.

If you're going to try volt adjusting your Classy with a poorly optimised two gen old waterblock - you may have serious problems. There is but a tiny difference between your eagerness to do things and your impatience to get them done. I appreciate you may be well educated on matters at hand but if you've never even mounted a GPU water block before you need to be extremely careful. As @Knoxx29 has said - why not just wait for the correct block to come out?

Originally I was going to wait for the proper block (yes).. I was... but people over at some other enthusiast forums that I am also active on have been quite critical of the alphacool block because it is only a hybrid (and not a TRUE) full cover block. Water only passes over the actual GPU die. The memory and VRM are only passively cooled.....

Now being an AMD-FX owner.... with a big TDP CPU (as far as CPU's go) I know from experience that a hot VRM can heat up the GPU die by at least 10c. So no matter how good your block is you're never going to get it as cool as you could with a full cover block.

For example: If I remove my extra fan cooling motherboard VRM (and allow VRM to heat up to anything over 60) I quickly see a huge increase on CPU temperature too (the heat conducts along the circuitry/board).

Now... with that in mind (and on the back of that) the 1080 Classified also has a MASSIVE stock air cooler (much bigger than the FTW or any other brand) -- my temperatures already only max out at around 55c on air during normal gaming at 100% fan. So with all of this in mind; is an alphacool block really going to give me much of a temperature drop? Compared to what I have now?

I've been pondering and fighting with myself trying to make a decision on the two for ages (one way or another) and because I'm on holiday next week I thought "blast it - lets give the EK one a try - other guys have managed it so lets do it"... that might of been the wrong decision (I just hope not) :-(

 

[FireFox]

I will keep mine Air cooled, i don't see the need to be messing around with a 800€ GPU.

lets give the EK one a try - other guys have managed it so lets do it"... that might of been the wrong decision (I just hope not) :-(

Good luck.

 

[Nicholas Peyton]

i'll need it, lol

 

[Nicholas Peyton]

The Kingpin block I modded was designed for a 980, not a ti, so the memory chip placement was different, and therefore the block was also different. A stand off needed to be removed (otherwise it would have either cracked the PCB or not allowed proper contact from block to GPU) and an extra thickness of thermal pad was required to make contact with the block-Vram area. Classifieds are the same as Kingpins in layout for the most part but between models with different memory modules and also chip die area, the contact area of the block may be significantly different.

If you're going to try volt adjusting your Classy with a poorly optimised two gen old waterblock - you may have serious problems. There is but a tiny difference between your eagerness to do things and your impatience to get them done. I appreciate you may be well educated on matters at hand but if you've never even mounted a GPU water block before you need to be extremely careful. As @Knoxx29 has said - why not just wait for the correct block to come out?

780ti classy top, yours below. Double check block shape matches the die and memory area.

on yours; your memory seems to "stick out more" towards the edge (take up more space) than mine; so I may hopefully be In luck

 

[Nicholas Peyton]

Update: Just received this email from: EVGATech_MDecker

****************************
DO NOT REPLY TO THIS MAIL.
THIS EMAIL IS SENT FROM AN UNMONITORED ADDRESS.
****************************
EVGATech_MDecker sent you a private message at Saturday, November 26, 2016 1:20 PM, titled
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re: Escalation issue
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Hello,
I asked the team to respond directly in your forum thread. However due to recent events and the time of year (holidays and such) the product management team is currently a bit behind the ball.
I did do some digging and research and found that many customers with the 1080 Classified were able to fit the 780ti Classified block just fine. Obviously this cannot be officially confirmed by EVGA, this is just research done on user forums.
Thank you
~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[newconroer]

Hmm, my EK block came with thermal pads. Wonder why they require paste for a rebranded model GPU.

Aren't all the late generation Nvidia GPUs supposed to have such well performing VRMs that you don't need any type of extra cooling and hence why there's no temperature sensor for them any more?

I will keep mine Air cooled, i don't see the need to be messing around with a 800€ GPU.



Good luck.

You say that, and I would say that with some GPUs.. though the investment this time around was worth it. Skyrim whistles along at 36c at 96fps/96hz. ARK has been my big heat dump at 44c thanks to eating 99% GPU utilization all the time.

Given that Nvidia's thermal threshold gets lower and lower (I heard it's 50c for Pascal) means even a 'great' air cooling solution that averages 65c, is still losing significant clock speeds.

 

[Nicholas Peyton]

Hmm, my EK block came with thermal pads. Wonder why they require paste for a rebranded model GPU.

Aren't all the late generation Nvidia GPUs supposed to have such well performing VRMs that you don't need any type of extra cooling and hence why there's no temperature sensor for them any more?

You say that, and I would say that with some GPUs.. though the investment this time around was worth it. Skyrim whistles along at 36c at 96fps/96hz. ARK has been my big heat dump at 44c thanks to eating 99% GPU utilization all the time.

Given that Nvidia's thermal threshold gets lower and lower (I heard it's 50c for Pascal) means even a 'great' air cooling solution that averages 65c, is still losing significant clock speeds.

 

[Onglar]

Put thermalpads on 4 and 5, and memory, you dont need to use thermalpaste in addition to the pads on the memory; id do it for the VRMs though. And thats about it, screw it up and slap it in.

 

[Nicholas Peyton]

Okay just received email back from EK_Grega this minute.

I'm so disappointed :-( spent over £150 including shpping :-(

Here is the email:

EKWB Support (Grega) (EKWB Support)

Nov 27, 00:27 CET

Hello Nick,

did my best with the information I had (thank you again for detailed pictures).

Here is a sketch of how the contact area goes. The memory ICs are not completely covered and there is still a potential issue with the capacitor (marked red).
To rule out this issue we would need to physically check or have an actual model of the graphics card.
As such, I can't officialy confirm that the water block will fit.

Best regards,
Grega

 

[FireFox]

Okay just received email back from EK_Grega this minute.

I'm so disappointed :-( spent over £150 including shpping :-(

Here is the email:

EKWB Support (Grega) (EKWB Support)

Nov 27, 00:27 CET

Hello Nick,

did my best with the information I had (thank you again for detailed pictures).

Here is a sketch of how the contact area goes. The memory ICs are not completely covered and there is still a potential issue with the capacitor (marked red).
To rule out this issue we would need to physically check or have an actual model of the graphics card.
As such, I can't officialy confirm that the water block will fit.

View attachment 81391


Best regards,
Grega

Sorry to hear that.

 

[Caring1]

That looks like a good fit to me, dremel the contact area near the capacitor and use thermal pads on the memory chips.
I've seen worse contact on factory fittings.

 

[FireFox]

Read these advices once again.

If something happens to the Card Evga won't give you a new one and no one who is pushing you to do it will help you to buy a new one.

Oh Man.

Can't you just wait till Alphacool release their new waterblock for the 1080 Classified?

What about the VRam chips? Are they covered properly by the block? I had to mod my block by removing a stand off and use thicker pads on a section.
The SAS motto is who dares wins. This feels more like fools rush in.
Good luck regardless.

If you're going to try volt adjusting your Classy with a poorly optimised two gen old waterblock - you may have serious problems

There is but a tiny difference between your eagerness to do things and your impatience to get them done.

I appreciate you may be well educated on matters at hand but if you've never even mounted a GPU water block before you need to be extremely careful. As @Knoxx29 has said - why not just wait for the correct block to come out?

Obviously this cannot be officially confirmed by EVGA, this is just research done on user forums.

The memory ICs are not completely covered and there is still a potential issue with the capacitor (marked red).
To rule out this issue we would need to physically check or have an actual model of the graphics card.
As such, I can't officialy confirm that the water block will fit.

Aren't all the late generation Nvidia GPUs supposed to have such well performing VRMs that you don't need any type of extra cooling

 

[newconroer]

Hi Nicholas,

I remember now..I had heard they recommended to put the paste and the pad. I called EK and said more or less 'who was high when they wrote this guide?' The guy laughed and said he doesn't know and it's not necessary.
If you are careful with the thermal pads, they will not tear and therefore no bare component will be exposed.

As for the overall block not fitting on the chips and capacitor. If those RAM chips get hot from the center outwards, then it looks like they will be fine. I can't speak to the capacitor other than that as long as some type of (even if it's got a tiny bit of thermal pad between it), it will passively dissipate.

 

[FireFox]

Hi Nicholas,

I remember now..I had heard they recommended to put the paste and the pad. I called EK and said more or less 'who was high when they wrote this guide?' The guy laughed and said he doesn't know and it's not necessary.
If you are careful with the thermal pads, they will not tear and therefore no bare component will be exposed.

As for the overall block not fitting on the chips and capacitor. If those RAM chips get hot from the center outwards, then it looks like they will be fine. I can't speak to the capacitor other than that as long as some type of (even if it's got a tiny bit of thermal pad between it), it will passively dissipate.

Do you mind to stop telling him bull $#¡+, or will you buy him a new card if something happens?

 

[Nicholas Peyton]

Sorry to hear that.

Received another reply from EK (after expressing my disappointment) EK_Grega had another look in his own spare time.

This guy is amazing.

Anyway here is the latest which I think I am definitely going to attempt.

HOWEVER: The grinding may actually NOT BE REQUIRED: If you zoom in on the 2nd (bottom) picture very closely you will see that the 'step' on the block does indeed appear to "miss" the "side" of the resistor (marked red). But ONLY by a tiny tiny amount (I'd be surprised if they weren't actually touching). But I could easily use thin electrical tape to insulate.

If it DOES overlap I doubt the 'step' on the memory block would need to be grinded very much (probably less than 0.5mm would do.


However there are indeed guys at EVGA Forums who never had to grind the step who also spent hours checking contact with step & memory.
One has actually just PM'd me personally just to confirm this:

His name is AHowes.

I bought the 780TI classified block.. It fit no problem. I did the GPU core check where you mought it and remove to make sure its getting solid contact and it was. Yes the memory part is a little off but enough of the memory is covering so no worries there. Did not notice that little cap in the way as I did check everything from every angle to make sure the block was flat on the memory and making perfect contact with the provided pads.
I did this to 2 1080 classifieds and so have others without issue.. no worries!
Allen

EK_Grega also just sent me another email:

Given that there are reports that users were able to install it I do think it should go withouth any modifications.
It would be the best to contact the user that already installed 780 Classy water block to the 1080 Classified and let him explain if he did some modfifications to the water block.

As for the installation.
I would use 0.5mm pads on RAM and 1mm pads on VRM part. Do check if there is proper contact on VRM (marked green). If not, then add 0.5mm thermal pad.

 

[Nicholas Peyton]

Installing 780 TI Classified block on 1080 Classified
http://www.overclock.net/t/1601288/official-nvidia-gtx-1080-owners-club/8250#post_25675926

I'll write this up properly for techpowerup too tomorrow (too tired need sleep so I'll do it in the morning) -- in the meantime anyone whose desperate to see how I got in can read it on the link above


P.S. I did try - but pictures linked from other site were coming up as [X]'s and I got fed up trying to fix it and link everthing properly.

See you all tomorrow, have a nice night