AMD Processor ECC Memory Support: Why So Hinky?

[cin5]

Two years ago I had a custom desktop pc built using this ECC RAM supporting board and processor.
https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/W480M-VISION-W-rev-10#kf
https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/212265/intel-xeon-w-1370-processor-16m-cache-up-to-5-10-ghz.html

I chose that CPU for its processing speed but at least as much for its ECC RAM support and (at least for Intel CPUs) its relatively low 80 watt TDP. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_design_power

It’s been often claimed that AMD processors are more efficient than Intel’s. But which, if any, AMD processors which are comparably fast to the above Intel CPU have 80 watt or lower TDPs-and offer ECC memory support?

I’ve also read at Reddit and at other forums that only the fastest AMD CPUs claim to support ECC RAM, and even ECC error detection from those SKU numbers was found some times to crap out.

How difficult can it be for AMD and for AMD/ECC supporting motherboard brands to get ECC RAM support done right?

And also to offer ECC RAM support for it slower processors?

 

[datnoz]

But which, if any, AMD processors which are comparably fast to the above Intel CPU have 80 watt or lower TDPs-and offer ECC memory support?

From what I've read, all ZEN (exept laptop, zen+) do support ECC but needs the mobo to support it
Thought ZEN2 needs to be from the PRO SKU to support ECC
R7 5800 is cheap and would be better than the w1370

And also to offer ECC RAM support for it slower processors?

It's already there.

How difficult can it be for AMD and for AMD/ECC supporting motherboard brands to get ECC RAM support done right?

I don't use ECC RAM but on all the PCs that I had, I never had a compatibility problem with my RAM kits not being on the QVL.

 

[ShrimpBrime]

You've been fooled. The Intel chip is 80w at its base frequency, Not it's all core boost frequency.

Also, All DDR5 is unregistered ECC on any platform.

Want registered ECC, it will require a server or workstation motherboard for full support as mentioned above.

 

[R-T-B]

Also, All DDR5 is unregistered ECC on any platform.

Data-at-rest ECC is not full unregistered ECC. That would imply data in transit as well.

Don't believe me? Google some ddr5 ecc unregistered sticks. They still exist.

 

[Solaris17]

Data-at-rest ECC is not full unregistered ECC. That would imply data in transit as well.

Don't believe me? Google some ddr5 ecc unregistered sticks. They still exist.

Thank you for understanding.

 

[Vincero]

How difficult can it be for AMD and for AMD/ECC supporting motherboard brands to get ECC RAM support done right?

Get a workstation board in that case. Some consumer AMD boards have supported ECC on CPUs that have supported it (unofficially - in the sense that AMD don't support its use but it's there to turn on) since the Phenom days.
Asus, ASRock, Gigabyte, and I'm sure others, will sell you 'workstation'/'pro'/'commerical' boards that definitively support its use. Get a Ryzen 'Pro' branded CPU and AMD officially support it's use.

It’s been often claimed that AMD processors are more efficient than Intel’s. But which, if any, AMD processors which are comparably fast to the above Intel CPU have 80 watt or lower TDPs-and offer ECC memory support?

In most cases you can find 'Pro' branded CPUs with lower TDPs than the non-Pro ones.
Also, as the Skylake/14nm++++++++++++++++ architectures progressed the gap between base vs boost TDPs got pretty large, in some cases more than 3x the difference between base TDP and boost/turbo.
Unless Intel are using particularly good samples I doubt the Xeon W1370 is pulling 5.1GHz across all cores within the 80W TDP window.

 

[AnotherReader]

Two years ago I had a custom desktop pc built using this ECC RAM supporting board and processor.
https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/W480M-VISION-W-rev-10#kf
https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/212265/intel-xeon-w-1370-processor-16m-cache-up-to-5-10-ghz.html

I chose that CPU for its processing speed but at least as much for its ECC RAM support and (at least for Intel CPUs) its relatively low 80 watt TDP. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_design_power

It’s been often claimed that AMD processors are more efficient than Intel’s. But which, if any, AMD processors which are comparably fast to the above Intel CPU have 80 watt or lower TDPs-and offer ECC memory support?

I’ve also read at Reddit and at other forums that only the fastest AMD CPUs claim to support ECC RAM, and even ECC error detection from those SKU numbers was found some times to crap out.

How difficult can it be for AMD and for AMD/ECC supporting motherboard brands to get ECC RAM support done right?

And also to offer ECC RAM support for it slower processors?

All AMD processors have supported unbuffered ECC DIMMs at least since the socket AM3 days. For AM4 and AM5, you are dependent upon your motherboard though lately it's more often supported. If you don't want to play a guessing game, then the EPYC 4004 series can be paired with a lot of AM5 motherboards. Some of these motherboards come without chipsets which allows all 28 CPU PCIe lanes to be used by you as you see fit.

 

[Sarajiel]

From what I've read, all ZEN (exept laptop, zen+) do support ECC but needs the mobo to support it
Thought ZEN2 needs to be from the PRO SKU to support ECC
R7 5800 is cheap and would be better than the w1370

Rule of thumb for socketed Ryzen 3000 to 9000 CPUs:
- If it's base on chiplets, it supports ECC.
- If it's an APU or a monolithic CPU (aka APU w/o iGPU), it doesn't support ECC, unless it has a "Pro" in the name.

unregistered ECC

Not to be a smart ass here, but the proper term is "unbuffered" not "unregistered", which makes it easier to find when searching for ECC DIMMs that aren't intended for server or workstation platforms. You can easily get unbuffered ECC DIMMs from Crucial or Kingston.

And also to offer ECC RAM support for it slower processors?

You can buy Epyc CPUs from 4 to 128 cores. I guess, there is enough choice for you.

The slowest Ryzen with ECC support that is still sold, would be the Ryzen 3 3100 for ~€50, but you can also spend over €10k for a Ryzen Threadripper PRO 7995WX if that's more your budget range.

 

[R-T-B]

Not to be a smart ass here, but the proper term is "unbuffered" not "unregistered", which makes it easier to find when searching for ECC DIMMs that aren't intended for server or workstation platforms. You can easily get unbuffered ECC DIMMs from Crucial or Kingston.

Well yeah I was just going with the quoted texts lingo but you are correct.

 

[Solaris17]

Well yeah I was just going with the quoted texts lingo but you are correct.

It’s also annoying for consumers I imagine as “Registered” is used. “Unregistered” is also used in poorly written materials and with third parties selling kits.

 

[ShrimpBrime]

Data-at-rest ECC is not full unregistered ECC. That would imply data in transit as well.

Don't believe me? Google some ddr5 ecc unregistered sticks. They still exist.

I never said I didn't believe you. So not sure where that comment comes into play.

Data at rest (ECC). Partially unregistered, unregistered.... you typed in ECC, but doesn't clarify what the OP is asking for.

But thanks for the info!

 

[R-T-B]

I never said I didn't believe you. So not sure where that comment comes into play.

Not really directed at you, more for the inevitable skeptic that comes along.

 

[datnoz]

Not really directed at you, more for the inevitable skeptic that comes along.

I admire that capacity of seeing the future.

 

[R-T-B]

I admire that capacity of seeing the future.

It's an inevitability in the modern world. Skeptics abound.

 

[ShrimpBrime]

Not really directed at you, more for the inevitable skeptic that comes along.

I sometimes am that person. But try and keep an open mind and read people's links and what not.

Loved by 10's, hated by millions.

 

[LabRat 891]

All AMD processors have supported unbuffered ECC DIMMs at least since the socket AM3 days. For AM4 and AM5, you are dependent upon your motherboard though lately it's more often supported. If you don't want to play a guessing game, then the EPYC 4004 series can be paired with a lot of AM5 motherboards. Some of these motherboards come without chipsets which allows all 28 CPU PCIe lanes to be used by you as you see fit.

To my knowledge, AMD has had unmarketed unbuffered ECC support since the 939 and AM2 days.
More than a couple S939 boards support 2GiB DDR1 Unbuffered ECC DIMMs. The IMCs between K8 'Athlon' and K8 'Opteron' were effectively identical. -same goes today for Ryzen/RyzenPro/EPYC

In my limited experience on modern AMD, ASrock boards are the most likely to support 'unadvertised' features (Ex. I have a couple ASrock B450 boards w/ unmarketed PCIe bifurcation support)

 

[R-T-B]

I sometimes am that person. But try and keep an open mind and read people's links and what not.

Loved by 10's, hated by millions.

As long as they aren't videos I actually tend to. No secret I hate youtube and similar lol. /OT

 

[A Computer Guy]

The downside to AM4 support to ECC is for those non-PRO CPU's that have it enabled it's tricky to validate ECC is working.
I ended up validating OS was reporting corrected errors by overclocking the RAM timings to the edge of instability. Early UEFI versions allowed Memtest86 error injection to work with Zen+ CPU's but that ended up being closed off sometime after Zen2 - at least with the few ASRock motherboards I tried it with.

With AM5 + DDR5 ECC I haven't had a chance yet to test Memtest86 error injection or the OC method to verify reporting with the OS.

 

[Wirko]

When an uncorrectable error is detected, the system is supposed to lock up, right? Do any Ryzen and Core-based systems, along with client editions of Windows, implement this part of ECC?

 

[AnotherReader]

When an uncorrectable error is detected, the system is supposed to lock up, right? Do any Ryzen and Core-based systems, along with client editions of Windows, implement this part of ECC?

It depends where the uncorrectable error is detected. The options are listed below in order of the severity of the impact:

• If it occurs in unused memory, then the system can continue normally
• if it occurs in an user space application's memory, then you can let it terminate (or invoke its signal handler)
• If it affects kernel space, then the error is unrecoverable

 

[SL2]

And also to offer ECC RAM support for it slower processors?

Power usage is the least of your trouble these days, just set it to whatever you want. Buy a 105 W or 170 W and set it to 80 W, done.

 

[jarablue]

It's hinky cause it's stinky!

 

[cin5]

It's hinky cause it's stinky!

What's stinky, if I'm correct, is that there's only a 3% or less speed bump with using ECC as opposed to non-ECC RAM. Would a bump that size really impede the rate of human progress, however defined?

You've been fooled. The Intel chip is 80w at its base frequency, Not it's all core boost frequency.

Also, All DDR5 is unregistered ECC on any platform.

Want registered ECC, it will require a server or workstation motherboard for full support as mentioned above.

I'm no expert on any of this, but regarding my ECC supporting board https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/W480M-VISION-W-rev-10/support#support-dl-driver , as it supports my Xeon 1370 CPU how can it not support ECC RAM, as Gigabyte claims it does?

Also, I did look for registered ECC RAM but couldn't find any from Kingston or Crucial, so I got the unregistered ECC from Kingston.

 

[A Computer Guy]

What's stinky, if I'm correct, is that there's only a 3% or less speed bump with using ECC as opposed to non-ECC RAM. Would a bump that size really impede the rate of human progress, however defined?

Did you mean 3% less speed? I thought ECC is usually always a bit slower than non-ECC due to the parity checking.

I'm no expert on any of this, but regarding my ECC supporting board https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/W480M-VISION-W-rev-10/support#support-dl-driver , as it supports my Xeon 1370 CPU how can it not support ECC RAM, as Gigabyte claims it does?

According to the spec Xeon 1370 supports ECC. I don't understand what you are saying here. Note the CPU compatibility list says you need UEFI/BIOS F20e or higher with that CPU.

Also per the website

1. Support for ECC Un-buffered DIMM 1Rx8/2Rx8 memory modules
   * To support ECC, you must install an Intel® Xeon® processor.
2. Support for non-ECC Un-buffered DIMM 1Rx8/2Rx8/1Rx16 memory modules

What modules do you have installed? Is it not operating in ECC mode? How do you know?

Also, I did look for registered ECC RAM but couldn't find any from Kingston or Crucial, so I got the unregistered ECC from Kingston.

The board spec says it uses unbuffered ECC only. ( in other words does not support ram listed as registered or buffered )

 

[cin5]

Yes, 3% less speed due to parity checking.

At the time that Gigabyte board was the only Xeon supporting microATX board my builder and I could find. Presumably, only the full sized ATX boards support buffered ECC RAM. Again, more stinky than hinky, as I wanted this new build for a reasonably sized HTPC, not some big ass workhorse. Here's my case. Kinda sexy, yes?
https://www.silverstonetek.com/en/product/info/computer-chassis/GD05/

I forgot how my builder explained how to use this to verify ECC RAM functionality. I hope this proves that I'm getting some level of error detection. Trouble is, I've get to do any routine CRC checks; and would need a refresher tutorial to do that.

I