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Anyone should be fine, I'm not a fan of Code Geass, but it is good.
Last s;g0 is a huge gut punch.
 
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Ok next up on my watch eventually list are Steins Gate, Code Geass, and MHA. I'm leaning towards MHA first because it's lighter than AoT and already has a ton of episodes to back it up. Thoughts?
Can't speak for MHA - haven't seen it, but the other two really come down to what you're up for. They can be a bit "difficult" to watch. They're both really good. Code Geass is one of my favorites. But I don't know if I'd recommend to just go and watch it whenever. It's more for when you're really up for an "experience." You know? Try to watch it too passively and you'll get bored/lost. And honing in on it can be exhausting at times. You kinda gotta go all in. That's just the nature of the pacing and the storytelling. It's all very grand and full of subtleties, with a lot of different sub-plots tied together elaborately. The plot generally isn't hard to follow, but the impact isn't what I'd call straightforward, if that makes any sense at all. Steins;Gate is a little less so, but still in that same category. They're heavy... ...or maybe "dense" is a better word.

I think anybody who likes anime should watch them. It's a hell of a ride. But that's the thing. They're both kind of a journey that you kinda gotta be in the mood to go on to get the full enjoyment out of. Differen't flavors... S;G is this kind of this subtle, homey, brooding thing that you kind of settle into as it gets you thinking. A lot going on, but you don't feel that way until it gets along - billowing I guess is a word. Geass is more of an all-out, over-the-top drama type of deal, where you know big stuff is going down pretty much all of the time.
 
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I never liked Code Geass art style.. but the story is decent. But now I know what it partly stole from: LoGH. With a side of cringy evil mastermind from Death Note to boot.
 
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I've never cared too much for CLAMP's general style. The weird elongated proportions don't do it for me. Actually really turned me off of Geass the first time around. Glad I stuck it out but it still gets to me. It's not overtly bad, but it's overdone and I feel like some of the animators really struggled to replicate it properly. Like, when things are off with those proportions, they're really off. It's not like other shows where you just happen to catch on to those faces in that one scene looking weird. It just looks like, in your face wrong in this really stark and uncanny way. You say to yourself "...maybe they're supposed to look like that? o_O"

Bringing LoGH into this isn't fair. That's like, THE absolute most legendary anime. The most dense thing ever to exist in the medium. It has pretty much everything. All other things borrow from it, simply by existing. Almost no point to watching anything else ever again, really. By the time you actually finish it you've hit max level. That's it. It's over. You're done :p
 
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I've never cared too much for CLAMP's general style. The weird elongated proportions don't do it for me. Actually really turned me off of Geass the first time around. Glad I stuck it out but it still gets to me. It's not overtly bad, but it's overdone and I feel like some of the animators really struggled to replicate it properly. Like, when things are off with those proportions, they're really off. It's not like other shows where you just happen to catch on to those faces in that one scene looking weird. It just looks like, in your face wrong in this really stark and uncanny way.

Bringing LoGH into this isn't fair. That's like, THE absolute most legendary anime. The most dense thing ever to exist in the medium. It has pretty much everything. All other things borrow from it, simply by existing. Almost no point to watching anything else ever again, really. By the time you actually finish it you've hit max level. That's it. It's over. You're done :p
Well, I'm still on a high from it.. because I only stumbled on it recently. I feel ashamed for not knowing about it before (I'm 41.. been watching anime awhile).

But now that I do know it, I can't help but comparing it. And yeah, it's hard to see any anime being better now. :(

edit: Well, this along with GitS for film.. and Bebop for episodic series.
 
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Well, I'm still on a high from it.. because I only stumbled on it recently. I feel ashamed for not knowing about it before (I'm 41.. been watching anime awhile).

But now that I do know it, I can't help but comparing it. And yeah, it's hard to see any anime being better now. :(

edit: Well, this along with GitS for film.. and Bebop for episodic series.
Dude, don't sweat it! You're among the few who's actually sat down and watched it. Most people don't make it or even start it. If it makes you feel better, I knew about it for years before I actually managed to sit down and watch it. And another year went by before I finished.

But yes, it's true what they say. It's the oldest, longest, bestest anime ever. I promise you it does get better. You can still appreciate everything for what it is, too. I know it's like meeting the love of your life after a lifetime of heartache and disappointment... and then going all the way, only to lose her before its time. I know the other girls can't compare to her love. So just have some fun and don't worry about whether its the best or not. Maybe take some time to just do you and bask in the fact that you got a taste of the best there is. It's easier that way :p

Like, I know I joke, but it's so real, man. It takes you along, makes you an offer you can't refuse and you stay even though it's hard. And then just after making you the happiest you've ever been it rips a huge hole in your chest. And you're never the same after that. But you regret none of it, heh.

And hell yeah, GitS and Bebop are what got me officially into anime 15 years ago. I always keep coming back to them. They are such a cliche at this point that people almost don't take them seriously... ...like you shouldn't even need to mention them ever, but everyone does because there's really nothing else like them. In their arena, nothing comes close. Sometimes there is no substitute. It's almost not fair to other works to hold them to that. All you can do is re-watch when you get stuck.

But that's the other thing... ...if you're stuck, you can always go back. ;)

That begs the question... ...what happens when you watch it twice? Has anybody ever done that?
 
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Anyone watched Digimon Adventure Tri? Is it worth a watch? The first OVA was a bit boring for me despite loving season 1 and 2. Watched season 1&2 in english when it was released in the UK TV and then watched it all again in japanese.
 
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Dude, don't sweat it! You're among the few who's actually sat down and watched it. Most people don't make it or even start it. If it makes you feel better, I knew about it for years before I actually managed to sit down and watch it. And another year went by before I finished.

But yes, it's true what they say. It's the oldest, longest, bestest anime ever. I promise you it does get better. You can still appreciate everything for what it is, too. I know it's like meeting the love of your life after a lifetime of heartache and disappointment... and then going all the way, only to lose her before its time. I know the other girls can't compare to her love. So just have some fun and don't worry about whether its the best or not. Maybe take some time to just do you and bask in the fact that you got a taste of the best there is. It's easier that way :p

Like, I know I joke, but it's so real, man. It takes you along, makes you an offer you can't refuse and you stay even though it's hard. And then just after making you the happiest you've ever been it rips a huge hole in your chest. And you're never the same after that. But you regret none of it, heh.

And hell yeah, GitS and Bebop are what got me officially into anime 15 years ago. I always keep coming back to them. They are such a cliche at this point that people almost don't take them seriously... ...like you shouldn't even need to mention them ever, but everyone does because there's really nothing else like them. In their arena, nothing comes close. Sometimes there is no substitute. It's almost not fair to other works to hold them to that. All you can do is re-watch when you get stuck.

But that's the other thing... ...if you're stuck, you can always go back. ;)

That begs the question... ...what happens when you watch it twice? Has anybody ever done that?
I'll definitely watch LoGH another time. If anything, to use Shazam on some of the music that I have to hunt down.

One thing that I'll never adjust to after these anime were made (post 80s/90s) is practically everything is for kids.. or about kids.. or takes place at schools. lol. Not everything, but a great deal. Even stuff I like, mind you.. but still. Anime centered on a specific demographic for some reason. I know Sailor Moon was popular back in the day, but it didn't make up a majority of anime types.

edit: Also has a tendency to repeat itself once a "bankable" idea comes about. This is why I poked fun at all the "lost in a fantasy world" anime that seemed to have come about recently. They're everywhere! Half of the time, it doesn't even seem like they have cool setups. Like some chick literally will drop out of the sky and change some highschooler's life, transporting him to a world where he has to play hero. Compared to that, even "Sword Art" had a decent setup (although the video game thing is overused now too).
 
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Enjoy the cheeky nudes in Legend of the overfiend?? I accidentally got exposed to this monstrosity at age of 14 lol.
I quite enjoy the DC animated movies..So far the ones i've seen are:
Batman : Under the redhood
Son of Batman
Batman vs Robin
Batman Bad Blood
Justice League Vs Teen Titans
Teen Titans Judas Contract

Watched 3rd episode of AOT and need more...

You realy need to watch Tokyo Ghoul its the embodiment of Japanese anime and how far its gone culture wise same as Attack on Titan parts 1 and 2
 
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You realy need to watch Tokyo Ghoul its the embodiment of Japanese anime and how far its gone culture wise same as Attack on Titan parts 1 and 2
Watched Tokyo Ghoul season 1&2, I was interested in the whole build up from season 1 but then season 2 dropped the ball for me and just felt overall bit disappointed and really boring.
I'm sorry but my taste in anime is very different to others nowadays, lot of shows that "wowed" people from the majority just doesn't cut it for me.
If you go back to my post on "Your Name" which wowed critics and everyone else, I was left with "yeah it was alright, but nothing that wowed me".

For me the 80-90s is the embodiment of japanese Anime as it is what kick started the change of artstyle in lot of shows we see,the maturity and real start to the western culture.
The modern Anime from the Naruto era and up definitely pushed the popularity to making it more acceptable and accessible to buy merchandise etc.
Thanks to growth of DC+Marvel TV+Movies, Video games and even Big Bang Theory the whole "nerd/geek" culture has become more acceptable among peers.
Edit:
Of course Anime gets tied with the whole nerd/geek culture.
 
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I'll definitely watch LoGH another time. If anything, to use Shazam on some of the music that I have to hunt down.

One thing that I'll never adjust to after these anime were made (post 80s/90s) is practically everything is for kids.. or about kids.. or takes place at schools. lol. Not everything, but a great deal. Even stuff I like, mind you.. but still. Anime centered on a specific demographic for some reason. I know Sailor Moon was popular back in the day, but it didn't make up a majority of anime types.
Just the biggest demographic in Japan. Though sometimes I wonder if that's because the industry targets them more than anything. I've long suspected that if they targeted adults more, or did more shows in that transition area where both demographics can be drawn in, adults might be more interested and we could then have more shows with adults in mind. But the way it is right now, they don't see money in it. And when you look at anime now it kinda makes sense to think it's really for the kids. Mature stuff doesn't do as well, so you only get that stuff as like, fringe passion projects. People don't always like to admit it, but we've largely gotten what we asked for.

But sometimes I think a lot of adults do watch... ...like even grown-ups don't necessarily always like to watch grown-up stuff. I mean, people of all ages watch and love Shounen.

School shows drive me nuts though man. I'm tired as hell of it, though I've seen a lot that I liked. I could see the best one I've ever seen at this point and just feel nothing. Ecchi stuff and the romance stuff are no-gos for me, too. I'm 28 years old... ...I've been around too much to relate at this point. After you're past it, you look back at the stupid crap you thought was important... ...your whole world at the time... and you just cringe internally, like "Geez." And once you're at that level in your development, that crap gets really hard to take seriously. You're just so far beyond everything depicted that it can be hard to care, unless it brings back specific memories or something. I'll be at one of those big payoff moments and it's kinda like, yeah... ...I remember how I would've felt back then, but I don't feel that way now and I'd feel awful silly if I did.

It's almost like if I were to go hang out with a bunch of 16 year olds, now, as a grown man who has been through shit no kid has any concept of. Could be fun in some ways but it's just so weird and I'd feel so totally out of place, like I don't belong there. It's very alienating.

edit: Also has a tendency to repeat itself once a "bankable" idea comes about. This is why I poked fun at all the "lost in a fantasy world" anime that seemed to have come about recently. They're everywhere! Half of the time, it doesn't even seem like they have cool setups. Like some chick literally will drop out of the sky and change some highschooler's life, transporting him to a world where he has to play hero. Compared to that, even "Sword Art" had a decent setup (although the video game thing is overused now too).
Haha, and then after that comes the meta-phase, where everybody starts trying to make shows that are the same thing, with an ironic twist. "Like oh look at this show... look, see you think were like that but we're totally nott! We know those shows. You like those right? Aren't we cheeky? XD" But the real twist is that they are more that thing than the originals ever were. They always cross that line where the parody becomes like the ultimate form of its target. It's a really clever way of slipping through the SOS and having people applaud it for standing out, even though its sickeningly derivative. Next level crazy there. Blows my mind how that happens every time.

But yep. It's like I said before, for most of the people with skin in the game, it's about riding trends. Whatever they can hype is what they'll go with. Easier to get people excited about something they're already familiar with, I suppose. That and anime fans tend to be really nerdy and cultish in their ways. They go ham on certain types of storylines, styles, etc. People get seriously upset when the things they dial in on get messed with. And they couldn't care less about anything else... so long as it has the thing. We're an obsessive bunch sometimes. It doesn't always appear to make sense but these things happen for a reason.

I like to say some of my favorite things ever are anime, but I actually don't like anime as a whole. Like, the stuff I like the most is not the norm for anime. And when I do like a popular show, it's not for the typical reasons. Very few things in the medium are truly timeless and original, and stand on their own without any reference point... stuff that's that special kind of universal good is really rare in anime. A defining aspect is that it's self-referential and derivative. For a lot of people that's part of the appeal. It's like being part of this special club who are all in on this very specific, unusual thing. It's not for everyone. It's OUR thing. I don't nessesarily feel that way as much as others, but that's often the attitude.

It is kind of funny, how quick everyone is to copy one another, though. I really do think its sort of an underutilized medium. Don't get me wrong, it works and anime is doing well right now, but it's almost like anime is trapped in its own little bubble no matter what it does. The people putting stuff out there seem more interested in strengthening the bubble than popping it. I get a kick out of people who think anime wants to be high art but just... can't. It doesn't even try to be that. Some of happens to be that, but for the most part it's all junk food. People come to it for instant gratification. Easy entertainment, not stuff that moves hearts and minds. Kind of a different set of standards in mind. Nothing wrong with it. In a lot of ways the current trends have actually made anime more accessible, weirdly enough. It's easier to get into something with clear conventions and simple hooks.

It's only in the west that people care all that much about the medium-bending stuff. Or at least that's my impression. A lot of things that we like are not nearly as well known over there. It doesn't do well and studios aren't rewarded. People kind of know what they want, they know what they like, and they generally only want that. It's meant to be super niche. And on the other side, most any studio can be on the precipice of disaster in no time flat, just for trying to show these people stuff they didn't know they wanted. It's the best and worst thing about it. Sometimes I look at all of the stagnation and repetition and think "Why do I watch this?" But then... ...the stuff I like that's really weird and different probably wouldn't exist if not for that cycle. And it probably wouldn't stand out that much if everything was original. There'd be nothing for anyone to defy or mix up, yanno? Kind of makes sure that when somebody does something weird, they know they'll be punished if they don't work really hard and do it right, because their competition has things they're not gonna have the luxury of resting on.

There comes that point when people are just done with whatever the trends are. Something always gives at that specific saturation point. Just when you think anime is done and it's all the same crap, that's when something new and interesting will pop up and get noticed. And it only happens when studios realize their previous cash cow no longer produces for them. They get desperate and have to make something that's actually different and good, and they've gotta pay up to have good animation and good people. Any other time, it won't sell and they'd blow a tonna cash. Part of the natural order. Really always has been, nonsensical though it may be.
 
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Maybe one day there will be interactive anime where you join in and experience the thrill of being in the series :) maybe this is the foundation for a new type of Anime.... :)
 
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You can tell which ones are done on budget to please audience..ones that are school or girls with big assets lol.
Anyways on a brighter note,what are people currently watching anyways?
For me atm:
Outlaw Star - Got my GF to finally watch it, got another 8 episodes left
Persona 5 - GF is fan of the game and the anime follows the game story really well, so for those that don't have PS4 and want experience this game in different media, the anime does it justice really well
Attack on Titan S3 - Of course this is ongoing at the moment
Gundam Build Divers - On hold until its finished as I can't be bothered to watch it from scratch again
Zeta Gundam - Need get back onto this as I have ZZ Gundam on blu-ray which I have never watched yet
This is still in my top 10 favourite anime songs, despite being a light ecchi novel that got turned into a short TV show.
 
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Visual Novel.
 
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Maybe one day there will be interactive anime where you join in and experience the thrill of being in the series :) maybe this is the foundation for a new type of Anime.... :)
Dont do that... dont tell me that now. When i started watching DBZ i dreamed of being a saiyan and shooting kamehamehas everywhere... so now im 35 and if i can do that by now im gonna turn my room into the time chamber and start training with my son lol
 
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Well, a VR Spice and Wolf anime is going to be released. That's as near as you will get for now.
 
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Dont do that... dont tell me that now. When i started watching DBZ i dreamed of being a saiyan and shooting kamehamehas everywhere... so now im 35 and if i can do that by now im gonna turn my room into the time chamber and start training with my son lol
Honestly I'm surprised that doesn't exist in VR yet.

Such a good dad, to do that with your son. I wish my dad taught me to kamehameha when we were kids. Instead he just shook his head and laughed whenever I tried. :/

More real note, I see VR visual novels being a big deal soon enough... ...if VR fully goes mainstream VR chinese cartoon games will sell like crazy. Adult stuff maybe even more lol. But nah think about it. Anime, light novels, things like that... ...they're basically already designed to be the ultimate escape. People drop off of the face of the earth to watch anime and play visual novels. VR is the logical next step.
 
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Not to be a hater, but I couldn't care less about VR Anime. This whole time I've been griping about storywriting trends, so that's where my concern is. I don't need interactivity necessarily.. I just need good stories if I'm going to lose myself in them.

Interactivity wise though, I am a gamer.. so I do value that. Yet I complain about the same thing there too. True "virtual experiences" to me are better storywriting and worldbuilding. The camera/perspective makes no difference. For example, if an RPG is still primitive/isometric with sprites, I'll still be immersed if the world is cool and I have unique/believable choices.
 
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Not to be a hater, but I couldn't care less about VR Anime. This whole time I've been griping about storywriting trends, so that's where my concern is. I don't need interactivity necessarily.. I just need good stories if I'm going to lose myself in them.

Interactivity wise though, I am a gamer.. so I do value that. Yet I complain about the same thing there too. True "virtual experiences" to me are better storywriting and worldbuilding. The camera/perspective makes no difference. For example, if an RPG is still primitive/isometric with sprites, I'll still be immersed if the world is cool and I have unique/believable choices.
I agree. Those are the things I look for too. VR and good looks are more of a gimmick to me. Or I should say that it's, at best, the icing on the cake to good story/worldbuilding/concepts... ...those things have to be there for immersion to happen and even the best artwork, graphics, presentation, or level of interaction possible won't get me to anywhere near the same level.

It's not like fidelity or VR have the capability to capture the imagination on their own. Aesthetic arguably can. But quality and style aren't one and the same. Similarly, level of engagement and level of interaction are not 1:1. That's especially true for VR. Slapping VR on an otherwise shitty game or light novel won't make it any more immersive. It's changing the way you engage with it maybe, but not your ability to be engaged. There's nothing new changing how you process what's presented.

And the thing that gets me, is that we've known this for eons of time. There was a time when all we had were paintings and books... ...and yet those things captivated hearts and minds. Still do! I say don't worry so much about being fancy to trying and get appeal up. I think that's where anime tends to fall right on its face. If you want people to stay for the ride, look at things that don't have all of your gimmicks and tricks, but still suck people in. Do what they do. And then you can use the gimmicks, if you must. But you gotta focus on the core things before branching out to the latest extras.

I've seen a few really incredible, absolutely gorgeous anime that completely failed to suck me in because of this sort of lack of focus on core aspects. Makoto Shinkai has that effect on me. Every frame looks amazing, but I've never felt anything watching them because the characters and stories aren't very interesting, and the pacing is both drudging and jumpy.
 
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I agree. Those are the things I look for too. VR and good looks are more of a gimmick to me. Or I should say that it's, at best, the icing on the cake to good story/worldbuilding/concepts... ...those things have to be there for immersion to happen and even the best artwork, graphics, presentation, or level of interaction possible won't get me to anywhere near the same level.

It's not like fidelity or VR have the capability to capture the imagination on their own. Aesthetic arguably can. But quality and style aren't one and the same. Similarly, level of engagement and level of interaction are not 1:1. That's especially true for VR. Slapping VR on an otherwise shitty game or light novel won't make it any more immersive. It's changing the way you engage with it maybe, but not your ability to be engaged. There's nothing new changing how you process what's presented.

And the thing that gets me, is that we've known this for eons of time. There was a time when all we had was paintings and books... ...and yet those things captivated hearts and minds. Still do! I say don't worry so much about being fancy to trying and get appeal up. I think that's where anime tends to fall right on its face. If you want people to stay for the ride, look at things that don't have all of your gimmicks and tricks, but still suck people in. Do what they do. And then you can use the gimmicks, if you must. But you gotta focus on the core things before branching out to the latest extras.

I've seen a few really incredible, absolutely gorgeous anime that completely failed to suck me in because of this poor focus. Makoto Shinkai has that effect on me. Every frame looks amazing, but I've never felt anything watching them because the characters and stories aren't very interesting, and the pacing is both drudging and jumpy.
Yeah, I could imagine being in the 1800s by candelight.. or hell, 800BC at a campfire.. and if someone recited/read a story to me, it could still capitivate just on narrative quality alone. I mean, there's a reason why those very stories are still being told to this day.
 
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Yeah, I could imagine being in the 1800s by candelight.. or hell, 800BC at a campfire.. and if someone recited/read a story to me, it could still capitivate just on narrative quality alone. I mean, there's a reason why those very stories are still being told to this day.
Indeed. People often talk of relevance and grade shows by comparing them to one another. I think the creators on the other side do this too. I also think it's total a fallacy - just a sideways way of grading things and setting goals. Just completely missing the point of what immersion is. It's not necessarily about having better this or that, or including such and such idea. It's about the actual tact and execution. I.e., "Why does this need to exist?" If something's only reason to exist is to do something better than another, then it's not gonna hold up. You can do all of that without adding any real heart or sense of identity and probably get some attention for a while, but that's about it. Because next year somebody else is gonna step-up to one up you and just like that, you're not relevant anymore. You don't need a story worth telling to grip people and "make it" but without it, your stay in the limelight will be short.

The best stuff goes beyond that whole way of thinking. Good is just, well... good, without a reference point. Look at the typical gateway shows. Hell, think about your personal gateway shows. Ever find anything quite like them? Can you really even compare them to one another in any meaningful way? Never, ever are they the norm. Think about what they have that you can't seem to find, what impacted you and made you want more for years and years... that is what makes it timeless. That's why those shows draw you in, even knowing nothing about anime. You could know nothing about storytelling period and they would still blow your mind. Good stories are like that. They sort of set their own stage.

A good story is timeless in that it transcends cultural relevance or standards of current mediums in order to convey something in a way that only it ever can. This is what people are supposed to mean when they say something "transcends the medium." You don't need to know it's better than this or that at such and such to feel it. "There is no comparison," people will say. It stands on its own. It creates its own standard - its own set of expectations. And it does so with the goal of leaving something behind that you can take with you, after the experience is done. In the end, even the best of the best is just a distraction - an escape. But there's nothing worse than an escape with no higher meaning. I'm not talkin high art here. Not everything needs to be high art to immerse and captivate. It just needs to create its own reason to exist.

I think of this way. A medium is basically the embodiment of a set of ideas and ways of expressing them. The idea is that every new addition is supposed to add something to that set. They take you aside and show you either something you haven't seen yet, or a new way of seeing something you already have. Every single one that doesn't dissolves the meaning of what's already included. It borrows things it doesn't return. There's encapsulating the standards of the medium - using them as tools for expression, which is what they're there for, and then there is finding new uses for them and/or setting new standards. If a new addition fails to do the latter, it wastes everyone time and is quickly forgotten as yet another meaningless diversion. And that's kinda that.

Everybody gets hit by it eventually. People will say you're just too jaded to the conventions. I sort of get that, but I still think it's a bullshit excuse to make for something that simply is not as good as it could be. I think if it is possible to become "too jaded" with enough exposure to a medium, then the medium isn't in good enough health. It's not progressing like it should be. A healthy medium is constantly moving forward in a way that makes you want to see what else is possible. It's not supposed to be so heavily derivative. Tapping the well is okay and honestly to be expected - it's part of the intended purpose... ...a medium is a platform for new ideas... new. In the end things popping up should be additive enough to avoid the sense of repetition that anime is plagued by now.

The widespread jadedness (which let's face it, it's so common it's a meme, and has been forever) only happens when enough works are taking without giving back. Anime has the problem of trying to be good at the wrong things. These shows define themselves by the wrong aspects. And it holds back progress. I think the emphasis on certain side-traits and strange obsessions with niches often discourages the kinds of works that would progress things past all of the crap we are sick to death of (or at least make it worth sticking out in spite of it) and not only make people want to stay, but draw in new people. That's where all of this "more of the same" comes from. They basically prey on the fact that anime fans are anime fans and use it to leverage art with no substance by hitting on as many established things within the medium as they can get away with.

But the thing about it... ...how do I put it... ...as an artist working on something for public consumption, who cares about the direction your art is moving in, you sometimes gotta ask yourself "Would it matter if someone else came along and did this instead? Would it be different?" or "Does anything change by me putting this out into the world?"

At the bear minimum, you need to find a way to speak to something about the human experience in a way that is unique to your voice. Everything else is extra. But it's like anime makes the extras the focal points. They try to pile on as many bonus points as possible, but their base score sucks, so even with multipliers it still doesn't reach the high score, most of the time.

I hope I don't come off as too negative. I like anime. I've been watching it for more than half of my short life and I can name a ton of works from the medium that have definitively shaped who I am, what I like, and the way I see things. But that's why I just want it to be better :p And I want the creators of it to want to be better, instead of living in fear of not capturing a specific audience and chopping their shows' balls off every time.
 
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Indeed. People often talk of relevance and grade shows by comparing them to one another. I think the creators on the other side do this too. I also think it's total a fallacy - just a sideways way of grading things and setting goals. Just completely missing the point of what immersion is. It's not necessarily about having better this or that, or including such and such idea. It's about the actual tact and execution. I.e., "Why does this need to exist?" If something's only reason to exist is to do something better than another, then it's not gonna hold up. You can do all of that without adding any real heart or sense of identity and probably get some attention for a while, but that's about it. Because next year somebody else is gonna step-up to one up you and just like that, you're not relevant anymore. You don't need a story worth telling to grip people and "make it" but without it, your stay in the limelight will be short.

The best stuff goes beyond that whole way of thinking. Good is just, well... good, without a reference point. Look at the typical gateway shows. Hell, think about your personal gateway shows. Ever find anything quite like them? Can you really even compare them to one another in any meaningful way? Never, ever are they the norm. Think about what they have that you can't seem to find, what impacted you and made you want more for years and years... that is what makes it timeless. That's why those shows draw you in, even knowing nothing about anime. You could know nothing about storytelling and they would still blow your mind.

A good story is timeless in that it transcends cultural relevance or standards of current mediums in order to convey something in a way that only it ever can. This is what people are supposed to mean when they say something "transcends the medium." You don't need to know it's better than this or that at such and such to feel it. "There is no comparison," people will say. It stands on its own. It creates its own standard - its own set of expectations. And it does so with the goal of leaving something behind that you can take with you, after the experience is done. In the end, even the best of the best is just a distraction - an escape. But there's nothing worse than an escape with no higher meaning.

I think of this way. A medium is basically the embodiment of a set of ideas and way of expressing them. The idea is that every new addition is supposed to add something to that set. They take you aside and show you either something you haven't seen yet, or a new way of seeing something you already have. Every single one that doesn't dissolves the meaning of what's already included. It borrows things it doesn't return. There's encapsulating the standards of the medium - using them as tools for expression, which is what they're there for, and then there is finding new uses for them and/or setting new standards. If a new addition fails to do the latter, it wastes everyone time and is quickly forgotten as yet another meaningless diversion. And that's kinda that.

Everybody gets hit by it eventually. People will say you're too jaded to the conventions. But I think if it is possible to become "too jaded" with enough exposure to the medium, then the medium isn't in good health. It's not progressing like it should be. It's not supposed to be derivative. Tapping the well is okay and honestly to be expected, but in the end things should be additive enough to avoid the sense of repetition that anime is plagued by now. That only happens when enough works are taking without giving. Anime has the problem of trying to be good at the wrong things. These shows define themselves by the wrong aspects. And it holds back progress. I think the emphasis on certain side-traits and strange obsessions with niches often discourages the kinds of works that would progress things past all of the crap we are sick to death of (or at least make it worth sticking out in spite of it) and not only make people want to stay, but draw in new people. That's where all of this "more of the same" comes from.

But the thing about it... ...how do I put it... ...as an artist working on something for public consumption, who cares about the direction your art is moving in, you sometimes gotta ask yourself "Would it matter if someone else came along and did this instead? Would it be different?" or "Does anything change by me putting this out into the world?"

At the bear minimum, you need to find a way to speak to something about the human experience in a way that is unique to your voice. Everything else is extra. But it's like anime makes the extras the focal points. They try to pile on as many bonus points as possible, but their base score sucks, so even with multipliers it still doesn't reach the high score, most of the time.

I hope I don't come off as too negative. I like anime. I've been watching it for more than half of my short life and I can name a ton of works from the medium that have definitively shaped who I am, what I like, and the way I see things. But that's why I just want it to be better :p And I want the creators of it to want to be better, instead of living in fear of not capturing a specific audience and chopping their shows' balls off every time.
I don't think you're negative. And some of those are questions I actually asked myself, as a musician. Years back, I made an honest assessment if I truly had anything to say enough to devote myself to it. I decided that I didn't. Or that others were saying similar things and I'll leave it to their better/capable hands. I still love playing music though, just in private.
 
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I don't think you're negative. And some of those are questions I actually asked myself, as a musician. Years back, I made an honest assessment if I truly had anything to say enough to devote myself to it. I decided that I didn't. Or that others were saying similar things and I'll leave it to their better/capable hands. I still love playing music though, just in private.
Same here, I've been playing guitar for 15 years now and while I do love it, especially on to the end of writing/producing music, I find that a lot of non musicians don't get why I don't "do something with that." And it's just as you said, I don't go that route because I know it's not really contributing anything. I'm decently skilled and I can spin a nice tune, but nothing is really lost if I don't make it big. I always answer with "When I come up with something nobody's ever heard, I'll try it." In the meantime, I'll keep to myself and just enjoy expressing myself and exploring the songwriting process.

Off topic, that's a big thing in music right now. So much more to choose from, and so many artists to seek out, but not a whole lot of tact or substance to go around. With the dissolution of the whole record label model and the rise of bedroom producers, there are a whole fuckton of pretty okay musicians trying to make a living off of a copy of a copy of a copy. No more chart toppers. Only serviceable records that are "good for what it is." You've got [genre] band a,b,c... a1, a2... z65, z66... That's not the kind of life I want for myself lol... ...to be "that guy who sounds like those guys."

When it comes to art in general, the most successful people involved are really good at something only they can do. That's why people put their name to aspects of what they do. Everything else is just filling space. Gotta ask yourself "can I really put my name to this?" If it were me trying to put myself out there, I'd want people to know me as "the guy who does that," not "a guy who does that."
 
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