Bulldozer, AM3 or new socket?

FordGT90Concept · May 31, 2010

If it is AM3, that is very bad news, very bad news indeed. That basically means it stands no hope against Intel LGA 1366 platform because it can't keep up on memory demands. There's no way AMD could get tri- or quad-channel memory support out of AM3, there simply isn't enough pins.

manchesterutd81 · May 31, 2010

FordGT90Concept said:
If it is AM3, that is very bad news, very bad news indeed. That basically means it stands no hope against Intel LGA 1366 platform because it can't keep up on memory demands. There's no way AMD could get tri- or quad-channel memory support out of AM3, there simply isn't enough pins.

Exactly so they have to be giving us a whole new platform...! :respect:

jagd · May 31, 2010

? what about intel 1156 cpus ?what is the difference between dual channel 1156 8xx cpus and triple channel socket 1366 i7 9xx cpus at real life applications clock for clock ? Sooo early to predict doom and gloom

PS:Excluding crippled pci-e lanes at socket 1156.

FordGT90Concept said:
If it is AM3, that is very bad news, very bad news indeed. That basically means it stands no hope against Intel LGA 1366 platform because it can't keep up on memory demands.

FordGT90Concept · May 31, 2010

When you got 8 cores (32 threads) all craving data (which Bulldozer probably will reach before it is all said and done), memory becomes a choke point. That's why Intel added tri-channel support (6 cores, 12 threads + two way capable) and there's already talks of quad-channel coming. The more channels you got, the more collective bandwidth is available.

And yes, there's that bit of being able to hand more bandwidth to the motherboard (memory aside).

If they don't increase the number of contacts, they have to increase the workload each contact carries.

Wile E · May 31, 2010

FordGT90Concept said:
If it is AM3, that is very bad news, very bad news indeed. That basically means it stands no hope against Intel LGA 1366 platform because it can't keep up on memory demands. There's no way AMD could get tri- or quad-channel memory support out of AM3, there simply isn't enough pins.

Yeah, I'm gonna have to say new socket as well. I just don't believe they'll stick it back on AM3. If they do, that tells me they are still way behind Intel in the IPC per core race.

FordGT90Concept · May 31, 2010

And I'd certainly hope not. 4 threads per core is unprecedented. At the same time, there really isn't a connection between IPC and contacts.

btarunr · May 31, 2010

Those which are APUs will have a new socket, but the same dual-channel DDR3 memory. Those without, will continue to have a slightly developed AM3 socket.

The first APUs are based on K10.

Fourstaff · Jun 1, 2010

btarunr said:
Those which are APUs will have a new socket, but the same dual-channel DDR3 memory. Those without, will continue to have a slightly developed AM3 socket.

The first APUs are based on K10.

Are you saying that we will have 2 flavours of Bulldozer, one which goes into AM3 and the other into a new socket?

jagd · Jun 1, 2010

No ,not 2 flavours of bulldozer , Llano (cpu +gpu one ) will not have bulldozer core but 32nm athlon X4 core +gpu at first .
What btarunr said is we will have 2 sockets one for integretad gpu (codename Llano ) and AM3 for reguler cpus.

Fourstaff said:
Are you saying that we will have 2 flavours of Bulldozer, one which goes into AM3 and the other into a new socket?

TheMailMan78 · Jun 1, 2010

I'm so F@#king confused now.

IINexusII · Jun 1, 2010

it could just be am3 but with a new chipset like 980fx?

jagd · Jun 2, 2010

sorry for confussion

,
1-AMD told new desktop bulldozer parts will use socket AM3
2-New cpus with integrated graphics (codename Llano ) will have tweaked athlon X4 on cpu side first (not bulldozer core Fourstaff thought ,it was what i wanted to say ) bulldozer cores with integrated graphics will come later (noone knows how much later at the moment but AMD told architecture is very flexable ) . Llano cpus will have a new socket according to rumours .
Result : One socket for Llano (integrated graphic ones ) and one socket (=AM3 ) for reguler cpus (without integrated graphic)
http://www.semiaccurate.com/2010/02/10/amd-finally-outs-32nm-llano-core/

TheMailMan78 said:
I'm so F@#king confused now.

DriedFrogPills · Jun 2, 2010

i thought the lower end parts the APU/Lliano parts where going to be based on the Bobcat core not bulldozer

nt300 · Jun 10, 2010

Zambezi
Family: Bulldozer
Cores: 4 to 8
Process: 28nm
Socket: AM3
Onboard GPU?: No
Platform: Scorpius
Role: Performance Desktop
Launch date: Late 2010

Ontario
Family: Bobcat
Cores: 2-4
Process: 28nm
Socket: N/A
Onboard GPU?: Yes
Platform: Brazos
Role: Ultra Thins, Netbooks
Launch date: 2011

Llano
Family: Stars (Athlon II)
Cores: 4
Process: 28nm
Socket: N/A (AM3 rumored)
Onboard GPU?: Yes
Platform: Brazos
Role: Mainstream notebook, mainstream desktop
Launch date: 2011

_JP_ · Jun 10, 2010

nt300 said:
Zambezi
Family: Bulldozer
Cores: 4 to 8
Process: 28nm
Socket: AM3
Onboard GPU?: No
Platform: Scorpius
Role: Performance Desktop
Launch date: Late 2010

Ontario
Family: Bobcat
Cores: 2-4
Process: 28nm
Socket: N/A
Onboard GPU?: Yes
Platform: Brazos
Role: Ultra Thins, Netbooks
Launch date: 2011

Llano
Family: Stars (Athlon II)
Cores: 4
Process: 28nm
Socket: N/A (AM3 rumored)
Onboard GPU?: Yes
Platform: Brazos
Role: Mainstream notebook, mainstream desktop
Launch date: 2011

That is very nice,

but can you give the source, please?

cadaveca · Jun 10, 2010

I dunno that his source is AMD directly, however, that IS the info that has been given by AMD.

I mean really, look at erocker's post on the first page...same stuff I said, too, although many argued against AM3 socket being used for Bulldozer...

Just one bit there seems wrong though...Stars should come on an "updated" S1 socket...

cdawall · Jun 10, 2010

i'm going AM3+ with quad channel support there are enough pins for it to work AM3 still carries blanks

_JP_ · Jun 10, 2010

cadaveca said:
I dunno that his source is AMD directly, however, that IS the info that has been given by AMD.

I mean really, look at erocker's post on the first page...same stuff I said, too, although many argued against AM3 socket being used for Bulldozer...

Just one bit there seems wrong though...Stars should come on an "updated" S1 socket...

Yeah, I argued too.

But I just can't see AMD fitting all that tech that I saw on press releases + all of the one you said here (that I wasn't yet aware of) in that socket (Even with blank pins). Even Intel had to change their sockets to accommodate new tech and architecture...but I guess that is corporate policy for them anyways. :laugh:

And, I also was wondering about the mobile platform. It has been S1 for so long...and currently is S1G2. The shift to an AM3 desktop socket doesn't make much sense. I would bet on a renewed S1 socket (like S1G3)...or a new one, named S2. But that's just my 2 cents...

cdawall · Jun 10, 2010

_JP_ said:
Yeah, I argued too.
But I just can't see AMD fitting all that tech that I saw on press releases + all of the one you said here (that I wasn't yet aware of) in that socket (Even with blank pins). Even Intel had to change their sockets to accommodate new tech and architecture...but I guess that is corporate policy for them anyways.

And, I also was wondering about the mobile platform. It has been S1 for so long...and currently is S1G2. The shift to and AM3 desktop socket doesn't make much sence. I would bet on a renewed socket...or a new one. Named S2. But that's just my 2 cents...

intel changes there socket just because they feel like it (1156 dead 1155 now) anyone remember socket 423?

_JP_ · Jun 10, 2010

cdawall said:
intel changes there socket just because they feel like it (1156 dead 1155 now) anyone remember socket 423?

Sure I do, not only it made my socket 370 P!!! look outdated after I bought it in 4 or 5 months, a socket 423 P4 @ 1.6GHz would cost some bloody 500€ (or something like that).

cdawall · Jun 10, 2010

_JP_ said:
Sure I do, not only it made my socket 370 P!!! look outdated after I bought it in 4 or 5 months, a socket 423 P4 @ 1.6GHz would cost some bloody 500€ (or something like that).

comparing AMD to intel sockets is night and day AMD has a much better track record of keeping sockets for extended periods of time

_JP_ · Jun 10, 2010

True. I currently own a motherboard with the longest lasting Intel socket, that I can think of. The 775 has lasted very long and withstood AMD's change from 939 to the AMx sockets.
But even AMD could realize that changing the socket now isn't that bad. If they do it right, the new one could last as long as the current AM2/+/3 series, carrying the new technology and leaving room for even more.

cdawall · Jun 10, 2010

_JP_ said:
True. I currently own a motherboard with the longest lasting Intel socket, that I can think of. The 775 has lasted very long and withstood AMD's change from 939 to the AMx sockets.
But even AMD could realize that changing the socket now isn't that bad. If they do it right, the new one could last as long as the current AM2/+/3 series, carrying the new technology and leaving room for even more.

only thing i complain about 775 is that even if it lasted try popping a 8600 into a i945 board no pop a thuban into a geforce 6100 board all it took was a bios update (i understand 580x died but all of those boards are phenom II capable with a BIOS update they just lack the update)

nt300 · Jun 11, 2010

_JP_ said:
That is very nice,
but can you give the source, please?

Here's link.
http://tech.icrontic.com/articles/what-we-know-about-amds-next-generation-processors/
Just change 32nm to 28nm. I think AM3 will work with 1st Bulldozer but others to come may be on another socket because more pins are needed.

Flanker · Jun 12, 2010

are there any info regarding to TDP numbers yet?
it looks like the biggest drawback of amd processors atm is their power consumption,
I'm hoping bulldozer can significantly improve efficiency

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Bulldozer, AM3 or new socket?

Bulldozer, what socket?

New Socket

AM3, but new NB/SB so backwards compatible

AM3, fully compatible with current tech

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where the hell are my stars

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