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Cryptocurrency rant

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#26
Don't buy new video card now, Wait for Volta?ampere?10nm?7nm TSMC, and get 40-60% faster card at the same price. Let them have it.
 

cdawall

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#27
I think you are seriously overestimating it's worth in relationship with the rest of the world. Don't be so dramatic , it wouldn't be as apocalyptic as you describe it and it wouldn't ruin such an endless amount of lives. And even if it would, it would still not concern me , mining is something you do voluntary.

Whats next , feeling sad for those who are slinging dope ? You know , that "market" is worth billions too and I am sure that in the event of something , many lives would be ruined as well.
I think you are heavily underestimating what 500 billion dollars going poof from the economy just purely out of the coins themselves does. Not to mention the business aspect of this. That is rent that is gone, untold millions of KW/h of electricity, equipment purchasing etc.
 

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#28
I agree, it's pretty frustrating, but there's no silver bullet, unfortunately.

At least you can be joyous that large, faceless, corporations AMD and NVIDIA are both making a killing on selling graphics cards...
Users on R9 290/390 series even
 
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#29
This whole thing just bugs me because I am, by nature, a depressing, negative person with catastrophic thinking styles. I like to buy GPUs quite often, in fact in some communities I'm known to change GPUs more often than underwear (Which isn't true, I change underwear once a day, GPUs more often every 2-3 months). This is because I'm a fickle, unstable sort-of-a-fangirl to whatever company produces the components in my PC at the time of writing.

I'm allowed to be annoyed. When GeForce 20 series comes out, they had better be in stock long enough for me to get 2070 or something. >:|
you're allowed to be anything, but what you just said means you dont deserve it (no literal offense, but it's alarming)

change gpus every few months, wtf? some people actually do not have a budget or time to enjoy what they want to or used to enjoy, some people have a sudden hw failure that forces them into buying a replacement at a high price... are we really talking about current gen cards/games that look & run VERY decently on medium & midrange? it's not like years ago when hardware was not enough

it's extremely important to catch destructive thoughts, to control emotions, & to be familiar with how your mind works, because it may be an optional luxury such as gaming now, but what happens when the same low stock high price situation happens to food or shelter? you cannot lose control when you need to be precise & methodical
 

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#30
I think you are heavily underestimating what 500 billion dollars going poof from the economy just purely out of the coins themselves does. Not to mention the business aspect of this. That is rent that is gone, untold millions of KW/h of electricity, equipment purchasing etc.
It doesn't go "poof," it either gets transferred or lost. Also, tell that to all the companies that folded during previous bubbles that burst. Not exactly extraordinary.

I'm not convinced the market cap of crypto currencies is real. The actual assets backing crypto is likely hugely less. What could happen is someone (probably "Satoshi Nakamoto") withdraws all the real money backing BTC at exchanges and BTC becomes insolvent. Without an infusion of cash to return solvency, BTC's dead.

If BTC collapses, altcoins likely will too. The only ones that might survive are those like tcoin which are regulated and have physical assets backing it (assuming they can afford to actually enforce their own rules).
 

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#31
It doesn't go "poof," it either gets transferred or lost. Also, tell that to all the companies that folded during previous bubbles that burst. Not exactly extraordinary.

I'm not convinced the market cap of crypto currencies is real. The actual assets backing crypto is likely hugely less. What could happen is someone (probably "Satoshi Nakamoto") withdraws all the real money backing BTC at exchanges and BTC becomes insolvent. Without an infusion of cash to return solvency, BTC's dead.

If BTC collapses, altcoins likely will too. The only ones that might survive are those like tcoin which are regulated and have physical assets backing it (assuming they can afford to actually enforce their own rules).
Remember if you were to try and pull something like 500 billion us out of the economy from any market what it will do. AMD didn't do too hot after the last collapse either.
 

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#32
I'd be surprised if it was worth more than a couple billion. If I'm right, the people dealing it would get a slap in the face but the economy at large would shrug it off. Fundamentally, I'm talking about liquidity or rather, the lack thereof.

Just because a company's shares are trading for a lot of money doesn't mean the company is actually worth that. To throw your example back at you: AMD devalued/wrote off billions on their ATI purchase because ATI was overvalued at the time of sale. AMD had a market cap of about $40 billion and ATI was about $5 billion. When the dust settled after the acquisition was complete, AMD had a combined value of $5 billion. $40 billion vanished over the period of a year or two.
 
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cdawall

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#33
And it has taken AMD over 10 years to fix itself from that $40 billion going poof. How do you think the economy will feel with 500 billion gone overnight.
 

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#34
That's what I'm saying: where's the proof it's worth $500 billion? All that is based on is the standard stock math of share price time number of shares. With stocks though, you're talking corporations that have assets and liabilities. With crypto, you're talking about something that has no assets and a lot of liabilities (the alleged $500 billion that is thought to be outstanding/owed). Because the coins are owned by anyone and they have no tangible value, they're only worth more than nothing if there is a buyer willing to pay the asking price. The market is completely dependent on the buyers and, because the market is still tiny ($500 billion in a bucket compared to most legal tender out there), whenever a buyer makes a big purchase, it echos throughout the market because the market is fundamentally illiquid.

Corporations have a lot of means to stay solvent. In AMD's case, it was selling their fabs. How does one even define solvency for crypto? Activity on exchanges, probably, but those exchanges have limits on what they can handle because of it's illiquid nature (exhibit A: Mt. Gox).

TL;DR: the heart of cryptocurrency is a toxic financial instrument.


If I had to guess who "Satoshi Nakamoto" is, I'd guess it is a made up name for a group of Goldman Sachs employees. Inventing financial instruments as new avenues of profit is what they do best.
 
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#35
If I had to guess who "Satoshi Nakamoto" is, I'd guess it is a made up name for a group of Goldman Sachs employees. Inventing financial instruments as new avenues of profit is what they do best.
I don't buy that at all. Shortly before he left, he raged about the EFF accepting bitcoin donations, saying it would "raise exposure to dangerous levels" (or something similar, I am paraphrasing. I'm sure you can find his old posts still). Shortly after a few weird posts about the direction of bitcoin being not for large scale use, he vanished.

That doesn't sound like what you describe.

I'm not sure bitcoin is worth 500 billion, but one thing is for certain: It's solvency alone is in the billions because there have been large, billion plus cashouts (see the Winklevoss twins). It's worth a lot more than ford is arguing.

Activity on exchanges, probably, but those exchanges have limits on what they can handle because of it's illiquid nature (exhibit A: Mt. Gox).
Sorry, but Mt. Gox? No ford, bad argument, no cookie!

If you know what MtGox stands for, you know it was basically a bunch of kids in their basement and not an example by any means of a real, functionally planned business or exchange.

Try coinbase. Here, let me help: They occasionally have transaction delays when a lot of buyers cash out at once.
 
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#36
This is partially AMD's fault. They should have launched Vega at 2 grand per card for a solid year or two, used the profits (because it still would have sold out to miners on launch day, etc) and used the profits to make Vega 2, rinse and repeat, and eventually we gamers would be able to buy Vega 3 at $299 when cryptocurrency eventually dies. France and Germany and the IMF are already eyeing it, fees are high, its already taxed if you change it to fiat... its really only a matter of time now.
 
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#37

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#38
Try coinbase. Here, let me help: They occasionally have transaction delays when a lot of buyers cash out at once.
That's proof of illiquidity. The same thing can happen to huge withdraws at small bank branches: they simply don't have enough cash on hand to withdraw the full amount. The difference is that the branch can request a shipment of cash from their federal reserve and that cash will eventually be made available to you.

What you describe at coinbase, they have no higher power they can call to get more cash. They have to either take out a loan from a real bank or make people wait until people buy the coins they're holding. The former is how the exchange collapses; the latter is how the entire cryptocurrency collapses.
 
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#39
That's proof of illiquidity.
I did say I was helping, didn't I?

However, it's not. Another possibility (very likely IMO) is that the network infrastructure at coinbase , either btc side or webside, is under siege.

Happens on massive buys too, supporting that theory.
 

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#40
Well, BTC is slow to process transactions.

More importantly: what is the financial shape of exchanges like coinbase? How vulnerable are they to big swings in the market? Answer should be "none at all" because they don't actually hold any coin: just facilitate lining up a buyer and a seller and collect a fee on it. If this is the case, then the only risk to those holding coins.
 
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#41
Yep, in coinbase's case the answer is what you'd want to hear. I feel they are the most legit op in crypto.
 

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#42
I got two gtx1070 last year for mining. If it weren't for mining I'd still be rocking my gtx660 ti. Since I started, mining has helped me out a lot with finances.

I'm all for mining cards, it might be a good way to use some less than perfect stock. They could also have some bios tweaks aimed at mining for higher performance. They would have to be cheap enough compared to regular graphics cards to make a difference though, otherwise miners would just buy regular graphics cards along with them indiscriminately.

You've got to realize though that they can't "just make more". Crypto and therefore demand from miners could plummet at any time, and if they make all this stuff and nobody buys it they're out a bunch of money tied up in useless product that isn't moving. That, and they can't just increase production that much. It's not that easy to just build a new fab or just make more, especially when the main reason to do this would be to satisfy the demand of a bunch of people who may not be there in the near future.
 
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#43
Just consider it a good time to upgrade your whole PC! Prebuilt gaming PCs containing GTX 1070s are officially cheaper than buying a 1070!
 
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#44
In a retail/distribution channel model, the manufacturer will sell to distributors at a fixed price whilst giving them a certain discount based on their status/sales, typically anything from a couple of % upto 10-15%+ etc and that's where the distrubutor makes their margin, in turn this works when the distributors sell to resellers with the most active/high status resellers receiving the biggest discount and so on and so fourth, so the price increases have to be coming direct from the manufacturers due to the increased demands. The SKU's aren't anymore costly to produce but there isn't enough supply to go around so they can charge what they are selling for and right now thats around +50% of what should be msrp, and why not as far as NV and AMD are concerned as these are the only ones benefiting from the price increases, I can tell you now it wont be the resellers who sell direct to consumers because if they were trying to gain an extra 20-30% GP from their usual discounted rate then the distributors and vendors (manufacturers) would come down hard on them for such practices. Speaking from experience of working for a software vendor.
 

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#45
All I can say is this, If the card companies wanted prices to come down they can could and have the ability to make that happen. "They know what is going on they want this to go on it makes them huge amounts of cash! This is there boondoggle BOYS SUCK IT UP Buy cheeper cards and live with it. Live with the fact that a mid range card is now the top of the line and buy older stuff too! That hits them where it counts do that for a few years and you would see video cards at 60 buck! LOL !