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Do any AMD GPUs pass thorough 5.1 via HDMI?

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#51
Getting a new video card will simplify things, for sure. If you are only going to use the receiver for sound, install the new video card, disable your onboard sound in the BIOS, set the Windows mixer for as many speakers as it will allow you to. Games will pass as many channels of sound as they are coded to to the receiver. If you want to play back DVDs, keep in mind that Media Player can only pass 2.0 PCM or 5.1 DD, not any DTS. If you want to play back Blu-ray and your receiver supports it, you will need a playback app that supports the passing of hi-res DD and DTS type soundtracks. Otherwise, you will only get regular DD tracks from your Blu-ray playback software. It's confusing, but not difficult to understand after you use such a system for a while.
 
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#52
Hahaha Enjoy your HDMI & PC adventures. Best you'll get with HDMI is PCM passthrough.

Take the hint from the audio card MFGs and their complete & utter removal of ANY HDMI based card/s ;)

4Yrs, 2 HDAV 1.3s, countless drivers/firmwares and a shitload of useless Asus "techs" later I still only get PCM...

My AVR is a Yamaha DSP z7....

Fuck Asus and fuck HDMI! Useless cash grab interface.

DVI & analogue/optical outs FTW :rockout:

Edit: Asus wont even take these cards back from me! If that doesn't say it all...
 
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#53
So yeah, the 660 Ti itself will no doubt be better audio wise, but I'm a bit concerned about the way to hook up the HDMI cables as I've been saying.

Does ARC typically work to return just TV audio to the receiver, or can it also pass PC audio from the TV to the receiver if I hook the PC to the TV vs the receiver.

I tried connecting the PC to the receiver via one of the open HDMI ports, and got no picture from the PC on the TV even when in that HDMI mode on the receiver's remote.

@CJ,
Actually I have a Panasonic Blu-ray player. I have however recently reinstalled MPC HC since I read great reviews on the latest versions running MadVR, LAV and ReClock. I thought the latest VLC had big improvements, but this blows me away. I watched a recording of Breaking Bad on it and couldn't tell the picture and sound from an HDTV broadcast, amazing. I've yet to install the DTS HD plugin, which I forgot whom makes, but I rarely get a hold of recordings that have that anyway. That's what my Blu-ray rentals are for. Thank God for Netflix.

@m1dg,
Wise guy, eh? Are you trying to break my HDMI confidence again? Coincidentally I just saw the modern version of The Three Stooges the other night. Somehow seeing actors portraying them in color on Blu-ray just loses a lot. More is sometimes less as they say.
 
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VipZUK

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#54
LOL, I thought most of us gamers let go of the audiophile 192 temptation long ago. I did anyway.
hehe it was a case of curiosity and why not :)



I connect 7970 -> Yamaha RX-V2065 -> Sammy 40" TV
Personally haven't used ARC due to my HDMI spec on AVR and TV, but I would still opt for my current connection setup.
 
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#55
HDMI is shit. Get over it. Cut your losses :cool:

The "new" 3 Stooges wont even get a 2nd glimpse from me, saw a couple previews and just shook my head. I grew up with the Stooges, shit my dad even saw them perform live back in the day! I wouldn't want to sully those memories :)
 
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#56
I connect 7970 -> Yamaha RX-V2065 -> Sammy 40" TV.
OK, so I guess the obvious is you have the main out on the receiver to the main in on the TV, but what port do you run your PC into the receiver with?

Also, have you checked how that connection compares to going straight into the TV as far as input lag in games?

The way you're doing it is the way a guy at Magnolia said I should hook it up. I just don't get why I didn't see my PC boot up on the TV with it hooked up that way.

You do have just the one HDMI cable from your receiver to the TV right?

@m1dg,
I'm thinking nothing is "shit" unless most can't get it working. If most can, then there's something wrong with either product or installation that the rest are using.

That said, I HAVE read that ASUS wasn't particularly good at licensing their onboard Realtek chips for 5.1 encoding when Gigabyte was on some of their's, but then it's more common for MB manufacturers not to than to pay for that.

There was a certain amount of, shall we say, experimenting, after MS dropped HAL, but all seems more sorted as of late.
 
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VipZUK

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#57
OK, so I guess the obvious is you have the main out on the receiver to the main in on the TV, but what port do you run your PC into the TV with?

Also, have you checked how that connection compares to going straight into the TV as far as input lag in games?

The way you're doing it is the way a guy at Magnolia said I should hook it up. I just don't get why I didn't see my PC boot up on the TV with it hooked up that way.
For most part I would say my AVR has done nothing to affect my input lag, if anything is current setup is better than just TV.

The key things would be to set the AVR to do pass though etc on the video signal and avoid AVR doing any work there. Also for example my TV, each HDMI input behaves differently, some more compatible and other sharper so this is something you could also try. So from graphics card to AVR it would be both audio/video then AVR would decode and strip the audio from the signal leaving video to go to the TV.

I also have the issue with my H67/2400S HTPC that bios/windows boot doesn't show on TV, only once in Windows does the display work. My old AMD 5850 or 7970 doesn't have this issue.
 
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#58
For most part I would say my AVR has done nothing to affect my input lag, if anything is current setup is better than just TV.

The key things would be to set the AVR to do pass though etc on the video signal and avoid AVR doing any work there. Also for example my TV, each HDMI input behaves differently, some more compatible and other sharper so this is something you could also try. So from graphics card to AVR it would be both audio/video then AVR would decode and strip the audio from the signal leaving video to go to the TV.

I also have the issue with my H67/2400S HTPC that bios/windows boot doesn't show on TV, only once in Windows does the display work. My old AMD 5850 or 7970 doesn't have this issue.
As I said I have a Yamaha too, so the menu navigation should be similar. Can you tell me where to set it for pass through video? I was also wondering if it might have been a combination of not showing the BIOS splash screen and just taking a while to do the HDMI "hand shake" thing for the first time being hooked up that way. Maybe I just didn't give it enough time.

Anyways, it's 7:30 AM here and I should have gone to bed several hours ago, so I have to catch some shut eye. Thanks for all the responses guys, and keep them coming if you have anything more to add. I'll check back in when I look and feel less like a zombie. :twitch:
 
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#59
Talk to Bumblebee I think thats his name. He know more than I do
FYI Bumblebee is not a dude. And that's pretty sweet; definitely an expert.
 

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#60
As I said I have a Yamaha too, so the menu navigation should be similar. Can you tell me where to set it for pass through video? I was also wondering if it might have been a combination of not showing the BIOS splash screen and just taking a while to do the HDMI "hand shake" thing for the first time being hooked up that way. Maybe I just didn't give it enough time.

Anyways, it's 7:30 AM here and I should have gone to bed several hours ago, so I have to catch some shut eye. Thanks for all the responses guys, and keep them coming if you have anything more to add. I'll check back in when I look and feel less like a zombie. :twitch:
Na, you will probably be better off just looking at the manual or take a poke around in the options, the menus got quite an upgrade from the xxx65 to xxx71 from what I read. But you basically looking for video function and HDMI control. I wasn't able to fix my HTPC issue so just use VGA if I need BIOS access, not a big deal to me.
 
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#61
Of course! It's my fault. All my fault. PEBKAC :rockout:

Have fun pulling your hair out :toast:
 
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#62
Geez, m1dg, that's not really what I implied, unless you look at only the bad half. In fact from what I've just gleaned and experienced, it often has more to do with the age and model/brand of parts you're using. That doesn't mean those parts aren't improved upon though. No manufacturer in their right mind refuses to change the way they do things after getting lots of consumers disgruntled. Keep in mind much of that was experimental evolution of video cards, not just neglect. It's part of the process of PC "progress".

Just talked to a Yam tech and he said a more modern GPU may be needed for both audio and video pass through. He says it should work with the PC connected to the TV or the receiver, but leaned toward hooking it to the TV since it's a more direct video route and there should be no latency with ARC sending audio to the receiver. Actually he said there shouldn't be any lag either way, but less chance of it that way.

As far as settings go he said leave it the way it is, with HDMI Control and ARC turned on. So now I just need to pull the trigger on that GPU, trying hard not to think I can hold out for the 700 series. I mean this 250 has gotten me by, but certainly not without some lag here and there, and it not supporting HDMI properly is making me want to retire it to back-up duties.

I'm pretty sure the 700s will just be a Kepler refresh anyway. The Maxwells aren't due out till 2014 from what I've read. Maxwells are gonna be da bomb cuz they'll have onboard CPUs and less reliance on your system processor. Could make CPU OCing less necessary too.
 
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cdawall

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#63
It DOES have an HDMI port anyway, and as I said it's currently working via at least video as I type this. Whether this particular card in this particular system hardware config can support it's S/PDIF pass through properly, now that's another question, and it may be driver punctuated as well. What worries me is I don't even see an Nvidia HDMI audio option in the W7 sound panel, and no one's offering any ideas on how to solve that in itself, so it's looking grim, at least for this card.
Anything short of the fermi series of cards require you install a spidf cable from the motherboard audio output into the audio input/pass through of the GTX 2xx series cards.

Once that is complete you will have this option inside of windows



I run that into my Harmon/Kardon AVR347 when I feel like playing on the big screen. The AVR347 outputs the video from the receiver into the TV via HDMI while putting out whatever PCM the game/movie runs from 2.0 to 7.1.
 

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#64
Anything short of the fermi series of cards require you install a spidf cable from the motherboard audio output into the audio input/pass through of the GTX 2xx series cards.

Once that is complete you will have this option inside of windows

http://img.techpowerup.org/120927/Capture034310.jpg

I run that into my Harmon/Kardon AVR347 when I feel like playing on the big screen. The AVR347 outputs the video from the receiver into the TV via HDMI while putting out whatever PCM the game/movie runs from 2.0 to 7.1.
if you use SPDIF passthrough, it doesnt work that way. thats how it works with native HDMI only.
 

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#65
Let me make this real simple:

1. Your GTS 250 only has SPDIF pass-through. SPDIF only supports 2.0 PCM or compressed 5.1 Dolby Digital/DTS.

2. A new video card with HDMI 1.0 will support (from Wikipedia) 7.1 LPCM, Dolby Digital, DTS, Dolby Digital Plus, DTS-HD High Resolution Audio, MPCM, DSD, and DST.

3. Computers, by default, always send uncompressed LPCM on HDMI (exception being NVIDIA cards with SPDIF pass-through). PCM is the great equalizer of audio--everything with an HDMI in is going to support it.


With those facts out of the way...
Do any AMD GPUs do 5.1 encoding via HDMI?
No, because 7.1 LPCM is the best. Why decode in the computer, encode to some compressed format, then have the receiver decode it again? This is wasteful which is why all computers output is LPCM.

If your aim is to get 7.1 digital audio support, a new NVIDIA (anything newer than GeForce 200 series) or AMD card will do that if they have an HDMI out.


My argument is they could at least offer ONE model in their line that does. When you figure that HDMI offers superior audio signal throughput to optical, and DD and DTS being better than sim surround, it would be quite a bit better actually. And what about HTPC needs?
No! Encode/decode is inferior to uncompressed! HDMI offers 7.1 192kHz, 24-bit uncomrpessed audio. That's better than even DVD-Audio disks have.

Optical, as in SPDIF, is only 2.0 channel uncompressed.

HTPCs are more than happy with 7.1 uncompressed. :p


Don't you think I'd use something better than optical if I could?
This is why you need a newer card that has 7.1 LPCM output support instead of SPDIF pass-through.


What's your budget for a new graphics card and in what country? We can point you to a graphics card that will fix all your SPDIF pass-through woes.
 
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#66
Dolby ninjas and their trickery.
 
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#67
FYI Bumblebee is not a dude. And that's pretty sweet; definitely an expert.
My bad :D Apologies Bumblebee. Well I'm glad the audio Calvary showed up :roll:
 

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#68
if you use SPDIF passthrough, it doesnt work that way. thats how it works with native HDMI only.
Mine is native HDMI. I simply was stating the only way he would see an HDMI output using a pre-fermi card was using the spidf passthrough.
 

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#69
Mine is native HDMI. I simply was stating the only way he would see an HDMI output using a pre-fermi card was using the spidf passthrough.
no, you dont see anything like that appear. its passthrough, so it shows as your onboard sound.
 

cdawall

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#70
no, you dont see anything like that appear. its passthrough, so it shows as your onboard sound.
Hmmm I never knew that. :laugh: The NV control panel shows it oddly enough that's why I thought it popped up. I used it once a couple years ago on a customers rig. It worked never looked that hard into it however :rolleyes:
 
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#71
Already hooked up the tiny S/PDIF pass through cable my 250 came with, didn't make any difference. Still no HDMI device showing in the sound panel and as others have said (and I agree) it's probably not supposed to since it's technically passing audio through from the Realtk chip vs actually having built -in audio itself. So why would it even show as an audio device?

@FordGT and others talking about multi channel PCM,
When I see 7.1 PCM being mentioned but not 5.1 PCM, it makes me a bit worried, because I did read one post from a user that said he saw a 7.1 PCM option but not 5.1, and he was using a 5.1 audio system.
 

FordGT90Concept

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#72
Already hooked up the tiny S/PDIF pass through cable my 250 came with, didn't make any difference. Still no HDMI device showing in the sound panel and as others have said (and I agree) it's probably not supposed to since it's technically passing audio through from the Realtk chip vs actually having built -in audio itself. So why would it even show as an audio device?
It'll show up as an SPDIF device because of pass-through, not HDMI.


@FordGT and others talking about multi channel PCM,
When I see 7.1 PCM being mentioned but not 5.1 PCM, it makes me a bit worried, because I did read one post from a user that said he saw a 7.1 PCM option but not 5.1, and he was using a 5.1 audio system.
7.1 can do 5.1, 4.0, 2.0, 2.1, 4.1 and pretty much every other combination. It supports up to 8 channels. You select how many speakers are plugged in, and thus, how many channels are sent to the speakers, via the Windows sound settings.
 

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#73
Already hooked up the tiny S/PDIF pass through cable my 250 came with, didn't make any difference. Still no HDMI device showing in the sound panel and as others have said (and I agree) it's probably not supposed to since it's technically passing audio through from the Realtk chip vs actually having built -in audio itself. So why would it even show as an audio device?

@FordGT and others talking about multi channel PCM,
When I see 7.1 PCM being mentioned but not 5.1 PCM, it makes me a bit worried, because I did read one post from a user that said he saw a 7.1 PCM option but not 5.1, and he was using a 5.1 audio system.
its detected based on your receiver and its listed at its maximum setting.

if 7.1PCM is supported, less channels are supported as well.
 

siovhan

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#74
After like 10 hours of research I finally solved this, I installed media player classic (with the Windows Essential Codec pack) and ffdshow. Then I opened a video that has 5.1 audio and right-clicked on the video screen, went to Filters, then ffdshow Audio Decoder, I checked the "Mixer" box, beside "Output speakers configuration" I selected "same as input", then back under the Mixer box I clicked "Input/Output", checked the "AC3" box, then clicked ok.
 

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#75
After like 10 hours of research I finally solved this, I installed media player classic (with the Windows Essential Codec pack) and ffdshow. Then I opened a video that has 5.1 audio and right-clicked on the video screen, went to Filters, then ffdshow Audio Decoder, I checked the "Mixer" box, beside "Output speakers configuration" I selected "same as input", then back under the Mixer box I clicked "Input/Output", checked the "AC3" box, then clicked ok.
thats setting AC3 passthrough (which varies depending on your player/codecs), but that will work with any digital output (optical/coax/hdmi)