• We've upgraded our forums. Please post any issues/requests in this thread.

Gtx 275 Physx, need tips on poor physx performance

shevanel

New Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2009
Messages
3,464 (1.13/day)
Likes
396
Location
Leesburg, FL
#1
Gtx 275 Physx, need tips on poor physx performance (update 9.3.09)

Reiteration (sp) update !!!

batman AA demo would dip below 15-10 fps on physx heavy areas on a Gtx 275/e6600 @ 3ghz using 185.85, 190.38 or 190.62 with windows Vista 32 and 4gb ram

Ut3 maps all play flawlessley but ageia physx maps "torando" and "lighthouse" on same settings run at 10-15 fps..

updated physx drivers no help, tried various video drivers no help.

reinstalled vista 32 fresh, new drivers andit did no fix at all...

installed windows 7 32b and used same 190.38 drivers and settings and the batman aa physx area frame rates during the zaz scene have increased by nearly 300%

Will test UT3 physx maps soon...
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jul 28, 2008
Messages
2,525 (0.74/day)
Likes
506
System Name Desktop | Poweredge r410
Processor i5 6500 4.5GHz@1.275V | 2 x E5620 @2.4GHz
Motherboard ASRock Fatal1ty Gaming | Intel 5500
Memory 16GB DDR4 2400MHz | 32GB ECC DDR3
Video Card(s) RX480 8GB |On-Board
Storage 250GB SSD + 512GB SSD|4x320GB
Display(s) 27" Dell + 2 x 24" LCD Setup
Case Fractal Design Define Nano S
Software Windows 10 | Server 2012 r2
#2
Your main card has enough power for both. And performance benefit from 8400GS is smaller than the effort of the computer to dedicate some work to 8400GS.
 

newtekie1

Semi-Retired Folder
Joined
Nov 22, 2005
Messages
24,280 (5.51/day)
Likes
10,372
Location
Indiana, USA
Processor Intel Core i7 4790K@4.6GHz
Motherboard AsRock Z97 Extreme6
Cooling Corsair H100i
Memory 32GB Corsair DDR3-1866 9-10-9-27
Video Card(s) ASUS GTX960 STRIX @ 1500/1900
Storage 480GB Crucial MX200 + 2TB Seagate Solid State Hybrid Drive with 128GB OCZ Synapse SSD Cache
Display(s) QNIX QX2710 1440p@120Hz
Case Corsair 650D Black
Audio Device(s) Onboard is good enough for me
Power Supply Corsair HX850
Software Windows 10 Pro x64
#3
I've been told, but I don't know how true it is, that the GTX200 cards have a dedicated section on the GPU that does PhysX, it isn't like the older cards that have to sacrifice shaders to do PhysX. So you shouldn't need a dedicated card, and the dedicated section on the GTX275 core might be better than the 8400GS. And the 8400GS no longer meets the minimum requirements for the latest version of PhysX.
 

DrPepper

The Doctor is in the house
Joined
Jan 16, 2008
Messages
7,482 (2.07/day)
Likes
799
Location
Scotland (It rains alot)
System Name Rusky
Processor Intel Core i7 D0 3.8Ghz
Motherboard Asus P6T
Cooling Thermaltake Dark Knight
Memory 12GB Patriot Viper's 1866mhz 9-9-9-24
Video Card(s) GTX470 1280MB
Storage OCZ Summit 60GB + Samsung 1TB + Samsung 2TB
Display(s) Sharp Aquos L32X20E 1920 x 1080
Case Silverstone Raven RV01
Power Supply Corsair 650 Watt
Software Windows 7 x64
Benchmark Scores 3DMark06 - 18064 http://img.techpowerup.org/090720/Capture002.jpg
#4
8400GS is slower than using your 275 for physx.
 

shevanel

New Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2009
Messages
3,464 (1.13/day)
Likes
396
Location
Leesburg, FL
#5
Ok. I'll accept the fact that the 8400gs is too slow to achieve what I had hoped it would achieve.

I get 10 fps on my rig on the 2 physx addon maps from ageia.

Whenever papers fly or tiles break in batman : AA it goes from 40-55 frp to 7-12 fps

Is a GTX 275 already too weak to handle phsyx? Or is it a driver problem?
 

DrPepper

The Doctor is in the house
Joined
Jan 16, 2008
Messages
7,482 (2.07/day)
Likes
799
Location
Scotland (It rains alot)
System Name Rusky
Processor Intel Core i7 D0 3.8Ghz
Motherboard Asus P6T
Cooling Thermaltake Dark Knight
Memory 12GB Patriot Viper's 1866mhz 9-9-9-24
Video Card(s) GTX470 1280MB
Storage OCZ Summit 60GB + Samsung 1TB + Samsung 2TB
Display(s) Sharp Aquos L32X20E 1920 x 1080
Case Silverstone Raven RV01
Power Supply Corsair 650 Watt
Software Windows 7 x64
Benchmark Scores 3DMark06 - 18064 http://img.techpowerup.org/090720/Capture002.jpg
#6
The 275 is more than enough to play the game and physx at the same time. Try it with the 8400GS then without and see what is better.
 

newtekie1

Semi-Retired Folder
Joined
Nov 22, 2005
Messages
24,280 (5.51/day)
Likes
10,372
Location
Indiana, USA
Processor Intel Core i7 4790K@4.6GHz
Motherboard AsRock Z97 Extreme6
Cooling Corsair H100i
Memory 32GB Corsair DDR3-1866 9-10-9-27
Video Card(s) ASUS GTX960 STRIX @ 1500/1900
Storage 480GB Crucial MX200 + 2TB Seagate Solid State Hybrid Drive with 128GB OCZ Synapse SSD Cache
Display(s) QNIX QX2710 1440p@120Hz
Case Corsair 650D Black
Audio Device(s) Onboard is good enough for me
Power Supply Corsair HX850
Software Windows 10 Pro x64
#7
Seems like you have some other kind of problem. As even a single 9600GSO can handle the PhysX addon maps of UT3 with better framerates than that. Haven't tried Batman:AA yet, but I hope to soon.
 

DrPepper

The Doctor is in the house
Joined
Jan 16, 2008
Messages
7,482 (2.07/day)
Likes
799
Location
Scotland (It rains alot)
System Name Rusky
Processor Intel Core i7 D0 3.8Ghz
Motherboard Asus P6T
Cooling Thermaltake Dark Knight
Memory 12GB Patriot Viper's 1866mhz 9-9-9-24
Video Card(s) GTX470 1280MB
Storage OCZ Summit 60GB + Samsung 1TB + Samsung 2TB
Display(s) Sharp Aquos L32X20E 1920 x 1080
Case Silverstone Raven RV01
Power Supply Corsair 650 Watt
Software Windows 7 x64
Benchmark Scores 3DMark06 - 18064 http://img.techpowerup.org/090720/Capture002.jpg
#9
The box recommends a 8800GTS 512 or 9800GTX for physx :wtf:
 

OnBoard

New Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2006
Messages
3,033 (0.74/day)
Likes
379
Location
Finland
Processor Core i5-750 @ 3.6GHz 1.136V 24/7
Motherboard Gigabyte P55A-UD3, SATA 6Gbit/s & USB3.0 baby!
Cooling Alpenföhn Brocken HeatpipeDirectTouch
Memory Geil Ultra Series 4GB 2133MHz DDR3 @ 1440MHz 7-7-7-24
Video Card(s) Gigabyte GTX 460 1GB OC (mostly stock speeds)
Storage OS: Samsung F3 500GB Games: Samsung F1 640GB
Display(s) new! Samsung P2350 23" FullHD 2ms / Mirai DTL-632E500 32" LCD
Case new! Xigmatek Midgard/Utgard side window with red cathodes, 1x140mm & 3x120mm fans
Audio Device(s) new! ASUS Xonar DG & JVC HA-RX700 headphones
Power Supply Cougar CM 700W Modular
Software Windows 7 Home Premium x64
Benchmark Scores Logitech UltraX Premium & G5 laser v2 + Ulti-mat Breathe X2 for fragging
#10
I've been told, but I don't know how true it is, that the GTX200 cards have a dedicated section on the GPU that does PhysX, it isn't like the older cards that have to sacrifice shaders to do PhysX. So you shouldn't need a dedicated card, and the dedicated section on the GTX275 core might be better than the 8400GS. And the 8400GS no longer meets the minimum requirements for the latest version of PhysX.
That was just a rumor that someone came up on some forum and then it got copied everywhere. There is no physics portion in any card. Reason GT200 cards do so well in it because they have so much shaders to spare.

Like you said latest divers from NVIDIA finally tell some minimum requirements for PhysX and that is 32 shaders. 8400GS is way overpowered. My 8500GT already run Cryostasis slower than GTX 280 all alone.

Minimum for PhysX stuff would be 8600GT/9500GT with NVIDIA specs and tested working card (that I've seen benchmarks) that boosts framerate is 9600GT. Haven't tried Batman AA yet either, so can't comment on how taxing it is, but based on videos it isn't going to be less.

For the Batman demo, I'd guess it's newest drivers time, or waiting for next PhysX set, if there are bugs. Anyhow, it should work with GTX 275 alone just fine.
 

shevanel

New Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2009
Messages
3,464 (1.13/day)
Likes
396
Location
Leesburg, FL
#12
when batman glides from the gargoyle and kicks zaz to the floor breaking the tiles it drops to 12 fps still while using the newest drivers..

Im swapping my e6600 for a q9450 this week, maybe that will offer a small boost since there will be vista and background services left for idle core? would be nice.

this game comes out in 15 days for Pc and I want to be able to enjoy it fully. sucks I might have to play with physx disabled or buy a new video card
 

newtekie1

Semi-Retired Folder
Joined
Nov 22, 2005
Messages
24,280 (5.51/day)
Likes
10,372
Location
Indiana, USA
Processor Intel Core i7 4790K@4.6GHz
Motherboard AsRock Z97 Extreme6
Cooling Corsair H100i
Memory 32GB Corsair DDR3-1866 9-10-9-27
Video Card(s) ASUS GTX960 STRIX @ 1500/1900
Storage 480GB Crucial MX200 + 2TB Seagate Solid State Hybrid Drive with 128GB OCZ Synapse SSD Cache
Display(s) QNIX QX2710 1440p@120Hz
Case Corsair 650D Black
Audio Device(s) Onboard is good enough for me
Power Supply Corsair HX850
Software Windows 10 Pro x64
#13
That was just a rumor that someone came up on some forum and then it got copied everywhere. There is no physics portion in any card. Reason GT200 cards do so well in it because they have so much shaders to spare.

Like you said latest divers from NVIDIA finally tell some minimum requirements for PhysX and that is 32 shaders. 8400GS is way overpowered. My 8500GT already run Cryostasis slower than GTX 280 all alone.

Minimum for PhysX stuff would be 8600GT/9500GT with NVIDIA specs and tested working card (that I've seen benchmarks) that boosts framerate is 9600GT. Haven't tried Batman AA yet either, so can't comment on how taxing it is, but based on videos it isn't going to be less.

For the Batman demo, I'd guess it's newest drivers time, or waiting for next PhysX set, if there are bugs. Anyhow, it should work with GTX 275 alone just fine.
Yeah, that is why I said I don't know how true it is, I've only heard about it.

There were minimums set for PhysX previously, however it used to be any 8,9, or 200 series card with a minimum of 256MB of RAM dedicated RAM. However, I'm guess now that PhysX has been implemented to a larger extent in games, it is requiring more GPU power to run, and nVidia had to up the minimums to at least 32 Shaders as well as the 256MB of RAM.

I think if I was going with a dedicated PhysX card right now, I would get at least a 9600GT, just to make sure I was ready for the next time nVidia ups the minimum requirements.
 
Joined
May 7, 2009
Messages
5,261 (1.67/day)
Likes
1,451
Location
Marietta, GA USA
System Name ODIN
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 1800X @ 3.9 GHz (all cores)
Motherboard ASRock TaiChi X370
Cooling Cryorig Universal R1
Memory 16 GB G.Skill FlareX @ 2933 MHz 14-14-14-34
Video Card(s) Nvidia EVGA GeForce GTX 1070 SC 8 GB
Storage WD M.2 1TB SSD :: 4 TB RAID 1 Array of 2 drives
Display(s) Dell S2716DG 27" 144 Hz G-SYNC
Case NZXT H630
Audio Device(s) Onboard Audio
Power Supply Antec HCP 850 80+ Gold
Mouse Corsair M65
Keyboard Corsair K70 RGB Lux
Software Windows 10 Pro 64-bit
Benchmark Scores I don't benchmark.
#14
I am not sure, but have you tried the game, like suggested above, with the 8400 GS out using just the GTX 275?
 

shevanel

New Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2009
Messages
3,464 (1.13/day)
Likes
396
Location
Leesburg, FL
#15
yeah ive played it 10 times with the 275 alone but today i tried the 8400gs added because i was sick of piss poor frame rates during physx heavy areas. 8400gs just made it worse

ut3 runs 55-60fps maxed out at 1920x1080 so i don't believe my 275 needs an rma..

plus UT3 physx maps run 10fps on gtx 275 alone. even on fresh install of vista and 1st set of video drivers.
 
Joined
Sep 29, 2004
Messages
879 (0.18/day)
Likes
167
Location
Palm Desert, CA
System Name The Shroomiest One!
Processor AMD FX 8320
Motherboard Asus 990FX Sabertooth R2.0
Cooling Corsair H60
Memory 4x4GB Samsung 1600 Low Profile
Video Card(s) MSI GTX660ti PE OC
Storage Samsung 840 Pro 256GB / Western Digital 2Tb Black
Display(s) LG W2361VG 23" 1080p
Case Corsair Carbide Series 400R Graphite Grey
Audio Device(s) X-FI Titanium Fatal1ty Pro
Power Supply Corsair AX850
Software Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit
#16
sounds like the 8400 isnt up to par. Im running my 4850x2 with a 8800gts 320mb for physx and have no issues what so ever. thats with physx all the up in the settings where it says recommended gtx 260 w/ 9800 for physx. I think my 8800gts is barely up to par for it but it works, you could always try overclocking the 8400. In fluidmark and vantage I get a huge boost from overclockign my 8800gts. plus I can get great overclock since its just a physx card. Temps stay way down.
 

OnBoard

New Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2006
Messages
3,033 (0.74/day)
Likes
379
Location
Finland
Processor Core i5-750 @ 3.6GHz 1.136V 24/7
Motherboard Gigabyte P55A-UD3, SATA 6Gbit/s & USB3.0 baby!
Cooling Alpenföhn Brocken HeatpipeDirectTouch
Memory Geil Ultra Series 4GB 2133MHz DDR3 @ 1440MHz 7-7-7-24
Video Card(s) Gigabyte GTX 460 1GB OC (mostly stock speeds)
Storage OS: Samsung F3 500GB Games: Samsung F1 640GB
Display(s) new! Samsung P2350 23" FullHD 2ms / Mirai DTL-632E500 32" LCD
Case new! Xigmatek Midgard/Utgard side window with red cathodes, 1x140mm & 3x120mm fans
Audio Device(s) new! ASUS Xonar DG & JVC HA-RX700 headphones
Power Supply Cougar CM 700W Modular
Software Windows 7 Home Premium x64
Benchmark Scores Logitech UltraX Premium & G5 laser v2 + Ulti-mat Breathe X2 for fragging
#17
when batman glides from the gargoyle and kicks zaz to the floor breaking the tiles it drops to 12 fps still while using the newest drivers..

Im swapping my e6600 for a q9450 this week, maybe that will offer a small boost since there will be vista and background services left for idle core? would be nice.

this game comes out in 15 days for Pc and I want to be able to enjoy it fully. sucks I might have to play with physx disabled or buy a new video card
Have to try the demo tomorrow, feeling too sick at the moment. Or maybe I'll install it and give it a quick try, as I've already downloaded it. If I get same slowdowns with my GTX 280 then it's the game.

And no you should need to buy a new card or disable PhysX, it can't be more demanding than Cryostasis and than ran maxed (water reflection thing disabled) with PhysX ok.
 

shevanel

New Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2009
Messages
3,464 (1.13/day)
Likes
396
Location
Leesburg, FL
#18
The gtx 275 isnt up to par either.

Good thing I have sli options.

Sigh.. another upgrade.. again.

"You are eligible to Trade Up your BFG GTX 275 OC 896 GDDR3 PCIE2 to a BFG GTX 295 1792MB PCIE2. The Trade Up cost is determined by subtracting the price you paid at retail from the MSRP ($509.99) of the BFG GTX 295 1792MB PCIE2. Subject to terms and conditions outlined here"

I might just do this here.. the 295 should be able to handle video games :banghead:
 
Last edited:

OnBoard

New Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2006
Messages
3,033 (0.74/day)
Likes
379
Location
Finland
Processor Core i5-750 @ 3.6GHz 1.136V 24/7
Motherboard Gigabyte P55A-UD3, SATA 6Gbit/s & USB3.0 baby!
Cooling Alpenföhn Brocken HeatpipeDirectTouch
Memory Geil Ultra Series 4GB 2133MHz DDR3 @ 1440MHz 7-7-7-24
Video Card(s) Gigabyte GTX 460 1GB OC (mostly stock speeds)
Storage OS: Samsung F3 500GB Games: Samsung F1 640GB
Display(s) new! Samsung P2350 23" FullHD 2ms / Mirai DTL-632E500 32" LCD
Case new! Xigmatek Midgard/Utgard side window with red cathodes, 1x140mm & 3x120mm fans
Audio Device(s) new! ASUS Xonar DG & JVC HA-RX700 headphones
Power Supply Cougar CM 700W Modular
Software Windows 7 Home Premium x64
Benchmark Scores Logitech UltraX Premium & G5 laser v2 + Ulti-mat Breathe X2 for fragging
#19
The gtx 275 isnt up to par either.

Good thing I have sli options.

Sigh.. another upgrade.. again.
Noo, don't do it, Installing the demo, have to see it with my own eyes that it could be so though :)

There were minimums set for PhysX previously, however it used to be any 8,9, or 200 series card with a minimum of 256MB of RAM dedicated RAM. However, I'm guess now that PhysX has been implemented to a larger extent in games, it is requiring more GPU power to run, and nVidia had to up the minimums to at least 32 Shaders as well as the 256MB of RAM.
Yep, but people find out pretty soon that lower end just wasn't up to it. Although in the start a dedicated card didn't work right and it doesn't seem like it's optimized to the fullest yet. Maybe it's more for game developers to blame as there isn't any limit set on PhysX card.

For me PhysX card shouldn't need additional power cables and this 9600GT would be the limit where it is. Although that was only with the new green versions that got rid of the PCI-E power plug. Perfect PhysX card would be a passive 9400GT, but seems it won't be enough if there is no limits set by NVIDIA for game developers.

And why whould they, if people have to start upgrade their PhysX cards too :/
 

newtekie1

Semi-Retired Folder
Joined
Nov 22, 2005
Messages
24,280 (5.51/day)
Likes
10,372
Location
Indiana, USA
Processor Intel Core i7 4790K@4.6GHz
Motherboard AsRock Z97 Extreme6
Cooling Corsair H100i
Memory 32GB Corsair DDR3-1866 9-10-9-27
Video Card(s) ASUS GTX960 STRIX @ 1500/1900
Storage 480GB Crucial MX200 + 2TB Seagate Solid State Hybrid Drive with 128GB OCZ Synapse SSD Cache
Display(s) QNIX QX2710 1440p@120Hz
Case Corsair 650D Black
Audio Device(s) Onboard is good enough for me
Power Supply Corsair HX850
Software Windows 10 Pro x64
#21
I would assume eventually game developers will need to put options to adjust the level of PhysX in the game to the power of the physx card used.

And the addition power connector doesn't really bother me, the original PhysX cards requierd one also. And you can get 9800GTs without power connectors now.
 

OnBoard

New Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2006
Messages
3,033 (0.74/day)
Likes
379
Location
Finland
Processor Core i5-750 @ 3.6GHz 1.136V 24/7
Motherboard Gigabyte P55A-UD3, SATA 6Gbit/s & USB3.0 baby!
Cooling Alpenföhn Brocken HeatpipeDirectTouch
Memory Geil Ultra Series 4GB 2133MHz DDR3 @ 1440MHz 7-7-7-24
Video Card(s) Gigabyte GTX 460 1GB OC (mostly stock speeds)
Storage OS: Samsung F3 500GB Games: Samsung F1 640GB
Display(s) new! Samsung P2350 23" FullHD 2ms / Mirai DTL-632E500 32" LCD
Case new! Xigmatek Midgard/Utgard side window with red cathodes, 1x140mm & 3x120mm fans
Audio Device(s) new! ASUS Xonar DG & JVC HA-RX700 headphones
Power Supply Cougar CM 700W Modular
Software Windows 7 Home Premium x64
Benchmark Scores Logitech UltraX Premium & G5 laser v2 + Ulti-mat Breathe X2 for fragging
#22
Well I'm currently kicking some butt on the start with papers flying on the ground and it's constant 40FPS+ with Physics on the normal setting. The high setting says GTX 260+ & 9800GTX for physh, so that shouldn't be even used.

Here's a screenie, ran out of hands to take one in a good spot.


edit: yeah, I'll play a bit further ->
 

OnBoard

New Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2006
Messages
3,033 (0.74/day)
Likes
379
Location
Finland
Processor Core i5-750 @ 3.6GHz 1.136V 24/7
Motherboard Gigabyte P55A-UD3, SATA 6Gbit/s & USB3.0 baby!
Cooling Alpenföhn Brocken HeatpipeDirectTouch
Memory Geil Ultra Series 4GB 2133MHz DDR3 @ 1440MHz 7-7-7-24
Video Card(s) Gigabyte GTX 460 1GB OC (mostly stock speeds)
Storage OS: Samsung F3 500GB Games: Samsung F1 640GB
Display(s) new! Samsung P2350 23" FullHD 2ms / Mirai DTL-632E500 32" LCD
Case new! Xigmatek Midgard/Utgard side window with red cathodes, 1x140mm & 3x120mm fans
Audio Device(s) new! ASUS Xonar DG & JVC HA-RX700 headphones
Power Supply Cougar CM 700W Modular
Software Windows 7 Home Premium x64
Benchmark Scores Logitech UltraX Premium & G5 laser v2 + Ulti-mat Breathe X2 for fragging
#25
Smoke was fine too (charters looks really nice and textures are top notch too)


yeah i get around 35-43 fps on that segment of the game too, wait til you have to kick zaz
Yeah, got there It does indeed bog down there. Something like 19FPS was minimum I hit, screenie is a bit after. Quite a lot of tiles it's pushing there. Seems more like an optimization issue, would need some soft of a buffer, maybe tehy'll tweak it a bit before release, but don't get your hopes up, wasn't it like just a couple days the whole PhysX implementation thing to the game.

dude i never knew you could use evga pt to display temp/fps.. so cool
Yep and take screenshots too :)


edit: have to try the higher PhysX settings to see what happens. Still everything constantly on the screen with physics runs smooth, it's just those tiles that slow down. Breaking then with them batong thing should be fine again. But for such a small part of the game and physics I think you should be fine with your card, if you can bear the couple seconds slowdown. Doubt there is so much jumping on baddies, although it was fun :)
 
Last edited: