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[HELP] Please help me pick a vid card and bit more

ryanlaw

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#1
Hi All,
I am new here, and I would like to ask for some help of picking up a good video card as I am having some difficult time to make this decision.
I am currently building a new rig:
CPU: i7 4770K (Should I wait for i7 4930k? I can't find any useful information about its releasing date besides Q3 2013, Sep?)
MB: ASUS Maximus VI Extreme(As for 4930k, it is an Ivybridge-E CPU means it uses x79 motherboard? I am not sure whether ASUS will push a new motherboard to replace their own ASUS Rampage IV Extreme motherboard or not)
RAM: 32GB GSkill
Monitor: Dell U2713HM x 3
Graphic: xxx (sli/CF/Tri SLI/Tri CF)
My selection is among these cards:
1. Gigabyte GTX 770 OC EDITION (the only 4GB card available here, ~ $600 each)
2. EVGA GeForce GTX 780 Superclocked 3GB (~$800 each)
3. ASUS Radeon HD7970 DirectCU II TOP 3GB (~$470 each)
4. Sapphire Radeon HD7970 GHz Edition 6GB Vapor-X Edition (The only 6gb card, ~$600,each)

My questions are:
1. Do I have to connect only one ATI card in order to make Eye infinity work when CF enabled. How about nvidia surround? My last rig was HD 4870 x2 CF HD 4870, and I wasn't able to make eye infinity work when CF enabled.
2. Based on their performance, which setup will be the best as my budget only able to afford either:
A. GTX 770 x 3 / 7970 3GB x3
B. GTX 780 x 2 / 7970 6GB x 2
I will be using water cooling for the entire system including CPU, motherboard and those card.
I may able to put the extra card in later (at least a year later, as this system already cost me a leg and an arm plus couple fingers already)
3. As you guys see, I still deciding the cpu/mobo as not sure whether it worth to wait for the new ones which are coming soon(let's say 3 months time). But I have bought the monitors a day before I sold my old rig.
4. Should I wait for the new AMD release of its real 8 series? (How long am I looking at? will it available at Q3 2013? I could work on a NAS while waiting)

Sorry for my English as it is not my first language :)
All suggestions are always welcome

Thanks
 
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#2
1) Eyefinity works with Crossfire. Nvida surround requires you to have multiple cards anyway.

2) I believe HD7970 6GB Triple Crossfire would give you the most FPS, but as of now Crossfire has some serious issues (micro-stuttering). So, I'd say go with the GTX770's, especially since they are 4GB models. GTX780 might run into trouble way sooner than the GTX770 at that behemoth of a resolution, because of lack of memory (i.e. 3GB). However, if you are waiting for the 4930K, I say evaluation the situation then. AMD might have a proper fix by that time for their Crossfire issues. However, if you are thinking about a 4th card, then Nvidia doesn't seem to officially support quad SLI saying that the driver doesn't perform very well after tri-SLI and the gains are not worth it. The best thing would be to wait for the 4930K, hopefully the HD8970 would be out by then and you will have the crossfire fix as well. HD8970 would (it better!) perform better than HD7970 and GTX770.

3) I think waiting for the 4930K would solve a lot of your questions.

4) The rumours are that they will come out in Q3. But rumours are rumours. If you can wait, I'm sure you will get served well.

Bottom line is,

If you cannot wait: get the 4770K, MVIE, GTX770 x3 and be done with it. :)

If you can wait a month: AMD's supposed Crossfire fix driver would come out in June or July. I'd say wait and see how it goes. You will still have to go with the 4770K setup.

If you can wait about 3-4 months: Compare 4930K's performance to 4770K. Hopefully HD8970 would be out by then. Hopefully AMD will have fixed their driver problems. You will probably go with 4930K and 8970 Tri-CFX. Who knows :)
 
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#3
Nvida surround requires you to have multiple cards anyway.
As of GTX680, it is possible to run nVidia surround on a single card.
 
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#4

RCoon

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#5
3) I think waiting for the 4930K would solve a lot of your questions.

4) The rumours are that they will come out in Q3. But rumours are rumours. If you can wait, I'm sure you will get served well.

Bottom line is,

If you cannot wait: get the 4770K, MVIE, GTX770 x3 and be done with it. :)

If you can wait a month: AMD's supposed Crossfire fix driver would come out in June or July. I'd say wait and see how it goes. You will still have to go with the 4770K setup.

If you can wait about 3-4 months: Compare 4930K's performance to 4770K. Hopefully HD8970 would be out by then. Hopefully AMD will have fixed their driver problems. You will probably go with 4930K and 8970 Tri-CFX. Who knows :)
This is good advice, though I would say, the less cards in SLI/Crossfire the better.
A 2 GPU setup will scale better than a 3 GPU setup, and will have far less multi GPU issues games will inevitably bring.

My vote is for the 780 x2
 
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#6
This is good advice, though I would say, the less cards in SLI/Crossfire the better.
A 2 GPU setup will scale better than a 3 GPU setup, and will have far less multi GPU issues games will inevitably bring.

My vote is for the 780 x2
You do have a valid point. Those displays are real trouble eh? 3x 1440p is crazy.

But do you think 3GB VRAM would suffice? That's like running a single 1440p display with just 1GB card. I guess the best thing to do would be to wait for the 8970 and hope that the divers will be fixed and the card comes with 6GB VRAM at least. If he goes along with your recommendation, I guess he needs to upgrade the cards to Titans. Not for the raw performance (because once overclocked, both perform almost the same), but for that 6GB frame buffer.
 

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#7
You do have a valid point. Those displays are real trouble eh? 3x 1440p is crazy.

But do you think 3GB VRAM would suffice? That's like running a single 1440p display with just 1GB card. I guess the best thing to do would be to wait for the 8970 and hope that the divers will be fixed and the card comes with 6GB VRAM at least. If he goes along with your recommendation, I guess he needs to upgrade the cards to Titans. Not for the raw performance (because once overclocked, both perform almost the same), but for that 6GB frame buffer.
3 x 1440p is essentially begging for bad framerates.
Yeah, you're right, two titans for the memory would be great, shame they're so overpriced. Perhaps a 780 4 or 6GB option will get released.

"hey all... just thought i'd share my experience so far...

only tested 1 game in surround and only running 1 gpu but damn am i happy i went 4gb!

Dirt 2 - 7950x1440 bezel corrected everything maxed out except AA (turned that off)
RAM Usage: Around 3400-3500mb
Avg FPS: 48
Lowest FPS: 40

VERY happy with that result given the high resolution and i'm only running 1 card on slightly old hardware :D just for a comparrison it used about 1300-1400mb at 2560x1440... the increased resolution really pushes up the vram requirements
"
 

ryanlaw

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#8
Thanks guys for all your reply, just get back from work, and I will reply one by one :roll:

1) Eyefinity works with Crossfire. Nvida surround requires you to have multiple cards anyway.

2) I believe HD7970 6GB Triple Crossfire would give you the most FPS, but as of now Crossfire has some serious issues (micro-stuttering). So, I'd say go with the GTX770's, especially since they are 4GB models. GTX780 might run into trouble way sooner than the GTX770 at that behemoth of a resolution, because of lack of memory (i.e. 3GB). However, if you are waiting for the 4930K, I say evaluation the situation then. AMD might have a proper fix by that time for their Crossfire issues. However, if you are thinking about a 4th card, then Nvidia doesn't seem to officially support quad SLI saying that the driver doesn't perform very well after tri-SLI and the gains are not worth it. The best thing would be to wait for the 4930K, hopefully the HD8970 would be out by then and you will have the crossfire fix as well. HD8970 would (it better!) perform better than HD7970 and GTX770.

3) I think waiting for the 4930K would solve a lot of your questions.

4) The rumours are that they will come out in Q3. But rumours are rumours. If you can wait, I'm sure you will get served well.

Bottom line is,

If you cannot wait: get the 4770K, MVIE, GTX770 x3 and be done with it. :)

If you can wait a month: AMD's supposed Crossfire fix driver would come out in June or July. I'd say wait and see how it goes. You will still have to go with the 4770K setup.

If you can wait about 3-4 months: Compare 4930K's performance to 4770K. Hopefully HD8970 would be out by then. Hopefully AMD will have fixed their driver problems. You will probably go with 4930K and 8970 Tri-CFX. Who knows :)
Thanks for your detailed explanation, but I got more to ask after reading.
About the micro-stuttering, I believe it does existing in any multicard configuration (please correct me if I am wrong).
The reason I am having trouble is based on some information I have here.
Comparing with GTX770 with 7970 and GTX 780, that GTX 770 is a type of video card that just a rebrand from GTX 680 even with 4GB vram, but the architecture is last generation which leaves this card a bad position, as it is good but it is dated and it has its own trouble which is the memory bandwidth, we all can see both N and A is moving toward at least 384 bit, A maybe even goes with higher than than(who knows spec comes with the 8xxx).
And as for GTX 780, is has good bandwidth, but lack of Vram (why not 4 GB/6 GB), plus it is over priced(15% performance gain but almost 67% price increment comparing with GTX 770 even 4 GB version), if it is comes with 6GB ram I might willing to sell one of my kidney along with leg and arm for two of them
For Titain, it is a top notch card nothing complaint about, but it cost my entire body which I needed for other pieces in the rig :banghead:
Lastly not the least, 7970 3GB is lack of Vram and 6 GB might have problem to utilize the memory pool?

Waiting for 4930k will lead me towards AMD 8 card for sure, if A releases them in Q3(fringer crossed).

in summary, if I don't want to wait my best bet maybe 7970 6gb CF for now, as the third card will pump the price for video card towards $1800+. On the otherhand, if I could wait long enough, I may get 4930k with x79 platform and 8970 cards?

Thanks again

As of GTX680, it is possible to run nVidia surround on a single card.
Nice to know that N cards could support surround with only one card, but it won't handle these three monitors in a decent fps :banghead:

This is good advice, though I would say, the less cards in SLI/Crossfire the better.
A 2 GPU setup will scale better than a 3 GPU setup, and will have far less multi GPU issues games will inevitably bring.

My vote is for the 780 x2
Yea, tri cf/sli will gain less performance against price, but GTX 780 with 3 Vram will not sufficient for these 1440p monsters:(

You do have a valid point. Those displays are real trouble eh? 3x 1440p is crazy.

But do you think 3GB VRAM would suffice? That's like running a single 1440p display with just 1GB card. I guess the best thing to do would be to wait for the 8970 and hope that the divers will be fixed and the card comes with 6GB VRAM at least. If he goes along with your recommendation, I guess he needs to upgrade the cards to Titans. Not for the raw performance (because once overclocked, both perform almost the same), but for that 6GB frame buffer.
:respect:the problem is the 1440ps, but for eye infinity, 24inchs will also run into vram issue just the matter of time, and titans are just too expensive, $1200+ each here

3 x 1440p is essentially begging for bad framerates.
Yeah, you're right, two titans for the memory would be great, shame they're so overpriced. Perhaps a 780 4 or 6GB option will get released.

"hey all... just thought i'd share my experience so far...

only tested 1 game in surround and only running 1 gpu but damn am i happy i went 4gb!

Dirt 2 - 7950x1440 bezel corrected everything maxed out except AA (turned that off)
RAM Usage: Around 3400-3500mb
Avg FPS: 48
Lowest FPS: 40

VERY happy with that result given the high resolution and i'm only running 1 card on slightly old hardware :D just for a comparrison it used about 1300-1400mb at 2560x1440... the increased resolution really pushes up the vram requirements
"
Thanks for your info, so I maybe need at least 4gb at least, as for future games I need 6GB maybe...which leaves me 7970, titan for current stage or 8970 later this year

1) Eyefinity works with Crossfire. Nvida surround requires you to have multiple cards anyway.

2) I believe HD7970 6GB Triple Crossfire would give you the most FPS, but as of now Crossfire has some serious issues (micro-stuttering). So, I'd say go with the GTX770's, especially since they are 4GB models. GTX780 might run into trouble way sooner than the GTX770 at that behemoth of a resolution, because of lack of memory (i.e. 3GB). However, if you are waiting for the 4930K, I say evaluation the situation then. AMD might have a proper fix by that time for their Crossfire issues. However, if you are thinking about a 4th card, then Nvidia doesn't seem to officially support quad SLI saying that the driver doesn't perform very well after tri-SLI and the gains are not worth it. The best thing would be to wait for the 4930K, hopefully the HD8970 would be out by then and you will have the crossfire fix as well. HD8970 would (it better!) perform better than HD7970 and GTX770.

3) I think waiting for the 4930K would solve a lot of your questions.

4) The rumours are that they will come out in Q3. But rumours are rumours. If you can wait, I'm sure you will get served well.

Bottom line is,

If you cannot wait: get the 4770K, MVIE, GTX770 x3 and be done with it. :)

If you can wait a month: AMD's supposed Crossfire fix driver would come out in June or July. I'd say wait and see how it goes. You will still have to go with the 4770K setup.

If you can wait about 3-4 months: Compare 4930K's performance to 4770K. Hopefully HD8970 would be out by then. Hopefully AMD will have fixed their driver problems. You will probably go with 4930K and 8970 Tri-CFX. Who knows :)
Thanks for your detailed explanation, but I got more to ask after reading.
About the micro-stuttering, I believe it does existing in any multicard configuration (please correct me if I am wrong).
The reason I am having trouble is based on some information I have here.
Comparing with GTX770 with 7970 and GTX 780, that GTX 770 is a type of video card that just a rebrand from GTX 680 even with 4GB vram, but the architecture is last generation which leaves this card a bad position, as it is good but it is dated and it has its own trouble which is the memory bandwidth, we all can see both N and A is moving toward at least 384 bit, A maybe even goes with higher than than(who knows spec comes with the 8xxx).
And as for GTX 780, is has good bandwidth, but lack of Vram (why not 4 GB/6 GB), plus it is over priced(15% performance gain but almost 67% price increment comparing with GTX 770 even 4 GB version), if it is comes with 6GB ram I might willing to sell one of my kidney along with leg and arm for two of them
For Titain, it is a top notch card nothing complaint about, but it cost my entire body which I needed for other pieces in the rig :banghead:
Lastly not the least, 7970 3GB is lack of Vram and 6 GB might have problem to utilize the memory pool?

Waiting for 4930k will lead me towards AMD 8 card for sure, if A releases them in Q3(fringer crossed).

in summary, if I don't want to wait my best bet maybe 7970 6gb CF for now, as the third card will pump the price for video card towards $1800+. On the otherhand, if I could wait long enough, I may get 4930k with x79 platform and 8970 cards?

Thanks again

As of GTX680, it is possible to run nVidia surround on a single card.
Nice to know that N cards could support surround with only one card, but it won't handle these three monitors in a decent fps :banghead:

This is good advice, though I would say, the less cards in SLI/Crossfire the better.
A 2 GPU setup will scale better than a 3 GPU setup, and will have far less multi GPU issues games will inevitably bring.

My vote is for the 780 x2
Yea, tri cf/sli will gain less performance against price, but GTX 780 with 3 Vram will not sufficient for these 1440p monsters:(
 
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#9
Thanks for your info, so I maybe need at least 4gb at least, as for future games I need 6GB maybe...which leaves me 7970, titan for current stage or 8970 later this year
If you were to touch 7970's only get two. Three would be runt-frame-suicide. I think 4-6GB of VRAM is a good choice.
I think you're underestimating how good the 770's are. If i had to choose between two 7970's and two 770's, id go for the two 770's with 4GB VRAM. Better frame latency in SLI, and a little better performance too.
 

ryanlaw

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#10
If you were to touch 7970's only get two. Three would be runt-frame-suicide. I think 4-6GB of VRAM is a good choice.
I think you're underestimating how good the 770's are. If i had to choose between two 7970's and two 770's, id go for the two 770's with 4GB VRAM. Better frame latency in SLI, and a little better performance too.
I have read a lot of reviews about gtx 770 vs 7970's, some reviews says the gtx 770s is slightly worse than 7970's, and some says the other way around which causing confuse to me.
I do like N card for sure, if I have enough budget, I'd go titan for sure, gtx 780 just lack of vram.

I thought 7970 could oc'ed and preform pretty well comparing to 770's, it has the potential to beat 780's? correct me if I am wrong tho
 

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#11
I have read a lot of reviews about gtx 770 vs 7970's, some reviews says the gtx 770s is slightly worse than 7970's, and some says the other way around which causing confuse to me.
I do like N card for sure, if I have enough budget, I'd go titan for sure, gtx 780 just lack of vram.

I thought 7970 could oc'ed and preform pretty well comparing to 770's, it has the potential to beat 780's? correct me if I am wrong tho
7970 and 770 will perform similarly, only the 770's will perform better in SLI, whereas 7970 has the framerate issues in crossfire. Just bare in mind "I can OC and beat the next card up" also means that "the next card up" can OC even higher.
 

ryanlaw

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#12
7970 and 770 will perform similarly, only the 770's will perform better in SLI, whereas 7970 has the framerate issues in crossfire. Just bare in mind "I can OC and beat the next card up" also means that "the next card up" can OC even higher.
Agreed, but what IF (god knows :laugh:) AMD fixed the CF issue in their next CCC release?
 

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#13
Agreed, but what IF (god knows :laugh:) AMD fixed the CF issue in their next CCC release?
Wait for the next set of WHQL drivers, if they do not fix runt frames (which, if you dont know, is when rendered frames become useless and arent actually shown), then dont bother with AMD. I had Crossfire for a year, got sick of it, and switched over to single GPU on NVidia.
 

ryanlaw

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#14
Wait for the next set of WHQL drivers, if they do not fix runt frames (which, if you dont know, is when rendered frames become useless and arent actually shown), then dont bother with AMD. I had Crossfire for a year, got sick of it, and switched over to single GPU on NVidia.
IF (another big if) 1, how about titan, but that's almost triple the price comparing to gtx 770s.....:cry:
 

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#15
IF (another big if) 1, how about titan, but that's almost triple the price comparing to gtx 770s.....:cry:
Totally not worth the price in terms of performance comparison. Unless you bought 2 Titans, I dont think your framerate on 3 x 1440 would be very good at all.
 

ryanlaw

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#16
Totally not worth the price in terms of performance comparison. Unless you bought 2 Titans, I dont think your framerate on 3 x 1440 would be very good at all.
yea, you have the point, I am getting into another dead end...
 

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#17
yea, you have the point, I am getting into another dead end...
Dual 7970's, Dual 770's or wait and pray for AMD's grand deliverance in 4GB+ form.
 

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#18
Dual 7970's, Dual 770's or wait and pray for AMD's grand deliverance in 4GB+ form.
Yea, I think in the end I still have 3 options:
1. wait for 8970 and pray
2. go with 7970 cf and pray for fixing
3. go with 770 sli and happy for one year

:banghead:
GOD, please grants me a titan with price of 770
 

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#19
Yea, I think in the end I still have 3 options:
1. wait for 8970 and pray
2. go with 7970 cf and pray for fixing
3. go with 770 sli and happy for one year

:banghead:
GOD, please grants me a titan with price of 770
It's called a 780, but it doesnt have enough VRAM. Could wait for a 4/6GB 780.
You kinda shot yourself in the foot going to 3 x 1440 and not having a big enough budget for a GPU to run it...
 

ryanlaw

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#20
It's called a 780, but it doesnt have enough VRAM. Could wait for a 4/6GB 780.
You kinda shot yourself in the foot going to 3 x 1440 and not having a big enough budget for a GPU to run it...
indeed :banghead:

Didn't realize it actually require more than 5k+ for this rig without the 1440ps and watercooling
 
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#21
think carefully about this. if you try to save too much money, you'll end up buying those cards you are going to buy AND the Titans/HD8970s both. it's happened to me many times, and i never learn. i still don't and i pay the price few times a year. (not just with PC parts)

the ideal card for you right now is the Titan, and three of them. I would have said it is the HD7970's (6GB) if they didn't have that runt frame issue. That's a big issue btw. You need 6GB cards for that setup. 3GB won't cut it. Neither will 4GB.

the best option you have is wait a month and see what magic AMD comes up with.
 

RCoon

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#22
think carefully about this. if you try to save too much money, you'll end up buying those cards you are going to buy AND the Titans/HD8970s both. it's happened to me many times, and i never learn. i still don't and i pay the price few times a year. (not just with PC parts)

the ideal card for you right now is the Titan, and three of them. I would have said it is the HD7970's (6GB) if they didn't have that runt frame issue. That's a big issue btw. You need 6GB cards for that setup. 3GB won't cut it. Neither will 4GB.

the best option you have is wait a month and see what magic AMD comes up with.
He speaks the truth. Though as long as you disable AA and SSAO I believe 4GB will be your absolute minimum if you NEED a GPU now. I recommend at this point, if you cant afford 2 Titans, you get yourself 1 high end GPU, and dont run eyefinity right now, unless you can cope with medium settings.
 

ryanlaw

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#23
think carefully about this. if you try to save too much money, you'll end up buying those cards you are going to buy AND the Titans/HD8970s both. it's happened to me many times, and i never learn. i still don't and i pay the price few times a year. (not just with PC parts)

the ideal card for you right now is the Titan, and three of them. I would have said it is the HD7970's (6GB) if they didn't have that runt frame issue. That's a big issue btw. You need 6GB cards for that setup. 3GB won't cut it. Neither will 4GB.

the best option you have is wait a month and see what magic AMD comes up with.
Yes, I think I will increase the budget in order to make eye infinity work with high setting, thanks

He speaks the truth. Though as long as you disable AA and SSAO I believe 4GB will be your absolute minimum if you NEED a GPU now. I recommend at this point, if you cant afford 2 Titans, you get yourself 1 high end GPU, and dont run eyefinity right now, unless you can cope with medium settings.
I will go with either titan sli or 8970 cf if I am waiting

think carefully about this. if you try to save too much money, you'll end up buying those cards you are going to buy AND the Titans/HD8970s both. it's happened to me many times, and i never learn. i still don't and i pay the price few times a year. (not just with PC parts)

the ideal card for you right now is the Titan, and three of them. I would have said it is the HD7970's (6GB) if they didn't have that runt frame issue. That's a big issue btw. You need 6GB cards for that setup. 3GB won't cut it. Neither will 4GB.

the best option you have is wait a month and see what magic AMD comes up with.
Sorry guys I am back again because I just found out something.
Actually I ended up with selling my 3 Dell monitors as 2 titan is way too expensive for the performance and I was about to purchase 2 7970 6gb cards.
But I found that I can't get any solid confirmation from google that there is a compatible full cover waterblock for that card (If you know one please tell me :))
I also did research on GTX 680 classified 4gb (AUD$529 here), GTX 770 4GB(gainward AUD$555, gigabtye OC AUD$579, EVGA classified ACX $649), but I can't make the decision right now as I can't confirm whether it is good to go with the last generation card for cheap, or latest version card. Furthermore, I can only confirm from EK site that the gainward ones can be fully covered by their waterblock.
Can you please help me to confirm whether there is a full cover water block for gigabyte OC 4GB or EVGA GTX 770 4gb classified ACX(based on its price, I don't think it is worth to buy the classified ones, please let me know if I am wrong)?
I will go with at least sli (not sure the resell value of them year after).
The reason I am going with 4gb version of 770 instead of 3GB 780, are:
1. 780s are pretty expensive for some reason, the cheapest one I can find here is about AUD 750+
2. Not sure whether the 3GB vram are sufficient, in case I run surround on 3 1080P monitors

Please help again :):toast:
 
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#24
ryanlaw - Start using the edit button buddy, and stop double posting. Thanks :toast:

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