How do you see Luna's market value from $10 billion to 0 within 3 days?

[chrisevan]

In April, Luna’s price rose to a peak of $116 from less than $1 in early 2021, minting a generation of crypto millionaires. A community of retail traders formed around the coin, hailing Mr. Kwon as a cult hero. Mike Novogratz, chief executive of Galaxy Digital, which invested in Terraform Labs, announced his support by getting a Luna-themed tattoo.
But last week, Luna and another currency that Mr. Kwon developed, TerraUSD, suffered a spectacular collapse. Their meltdowns had a domino effect on the rest of the cryptocurrency market, tanking the price of Bitcoin and accelerating the loss of $300 billion in value across the crypto economy. This week, the price of Luna remained close to zero, while TerraUSD continued to slide.

How do you see Luna's market value from $10 billion to 0 within 3 days?

 

[Deleted member 24505]

How do you see Luna's market value from $10 billion to 0 within 3 days?

With lots of joy and happiness

 

[Beertintedgoggles]

I'm still waiting on tulips to rebound.

 

[qubit]

Crypto is a scam. Crashes like these which keep happening are the proof.

 

[R-T-B]

Crypto is a scam. Crashes like these which keep happening are the proof.

By that definition so is the stock market, because most companies eventually fail. Both crypto and the stock market are overall up over long time periods though.

How do I see it? Coins fail, particularly poorly managed ones. Not much to see. The only embarassing thing is how much major coins got tied up in a minor coins mess.

This is another place where more regulation would help, not hurt, crypto.

 

[dragontamer5788]

By that definition so is the stock market, because most companies eventually fail. Both crypto and the stock market are overall up over long time periods though.

Most companies offer dividends and distribute their real profits back to their shareholders. The ones that don't offer dividends are at least making a profit and are investing into CapEx (new factories and what-not, which likely will make more profits next year).

Coins will never make a profit. Coins will never produce a dividend. You're purely speculating upon the value without any reference point. BTC in particular has hard limitations on its transaction rates and requires an external chain ("Lightning Network") to speed things up.

How do you see Luna's market value from $10 billion to 0 within 3 days?

Slowly, then quickly. The trouble started weeks ago, and a lot of doomsayers were keeping an eye upon deposits of UST and noticing some strange behavior.

Once the world "agreed" upon the collapsed state, it only took 3 days for the market to consolidate and discover the new price. Some people were more interested in numbers, rather than the social understanding / global psychology behind the community. But remember, all of these "numbers" are just psychology / social events. When the community lost faith in UST and Luna, it was over, no one was buying and therefore the price dropped.

Those 3 days were the traders who refused to believe the change of opinion, and required a number to think for themselves. But Anchor's 20% APY rates on UST were well known and many people were instinctively worried about the stability of UST because of it.

 

[Thimblewad]

Stable coins can't work if there are whales, just like the case with Luna and probably many others. Cofezilla covered this topic nicely.

It was all a combination of this being a ponzi, the "master" being a total douchebag and the fact that the coin is completely useless.

This is going to happen with more and more coins as we move on and the bubble for each pops. In the end only the big ones will probably remain.

Can't buy anything with it? Pretty much valueless.

Crypto is a scam. Crashes like these which keep happening are the proof.

Just rich people playing games mostly

 

[dragontamer5788]

This whole stablecoin thing just seems like a grossly inefficient and poorly-regulated bank-account.

If you were just going to require that USD be held in reserve, all you're doing is reinventing fractional reserve banking. Except with an incredibly inefficient "mining" operation requiring "gas fees" and "transaction fees" to perform even the most simple of tasks.

Yes. You can invent new "stablecoins" and trick large swaths of the population into thinking its equivalent to USD. But as far as I can tell, the "correctly done" stablecoins with "USD Reserves" are still shady as all heck (offering APY rates way above what is possible in today's financial market, suggesting somebody is making a significant risk here behind the scenes). You can't make 6% or 7% APY gains reliably in this market, not even for 3 months or 6 months.

 

[R-T-B]

Most companies offer dividends and distribute their real profits back to their shareholders. The ones that don't offer dividends are at least making a profit and are investing into CapEx (new factories and what-not, which likely will make more profits next year).

I never said they were directly comparable, only that the criteria he was using to declare "crypto is a scam" was quite flawed. There are far better metrics to use, as you correctly point out.

Except with an incredibly inefficient "mining" operation

Most if not all stablecoins operate without PoW mining. Transaction fees I am unsure about, but are likely a valid point.

offering APY rates way above what is possible in today's financial market, suggesting somebody is making a significant risk here behind the scenes

I think we went over this before.

 

[cvaldes]

By that definition so is the stock market, because most companies eventually fail.

The stock market is not a casino. Those shares are equity in a company that does something. Makes PCs, dishwashers, baby food, toilet paper, music streaming services, et cetera.

Most small businesses fail. Large publicly traded companies fail far less frequently. As a long term investment, something like an S&P index fund is better than investing in a bunch of small local companies because large companies don't fail as much.

Remember that SEC regulations (many of them written in the 1930s to prevent what happened with the stock market crash of 1929) are there to provide disclosure to investors (current and potential).

Apple's large market capitalization isn't because it's a popular company. They make lots and lots of money. They also have lots of competition which they mention in their quarterly SEC filings.

Cryptocurrencies aren't even really currencies. A more accurate name would be cryptotokens.

 

[R-T-B]

The stock market is not a casino.

See above. Never claimed it was.

Cryptocurrencies aren't even really currencies. A more accurate name would be cryptotokens.

This is the sad reality due to high transaction fees.

There have been attempts to fix that. Sadly, they largely depend on centralized systems thus far, sort of defeating the entire point.

 

[dragontamer5788]

There have been attempts to fix that. Sadly, they largely depend on centealized systems thus far, sort of defeating the entire point.

Isn't lightning decentralized?

Like, I find it fishy, but its certainly not a "centralized system".

 

[R-T-B]

Isn't lightning decentralized?

Like, I find it fishy, but its certainly not a "centralized system".

I legit forgot about lightning. Shows how much I use bitcoin.

I was refering more to the "free" transaction fees between books of select exchanges.

 

[chrisevan]

With lots of joy and happiness

that means you are short short luna and make a lot of profit?

I'm still waiting on tulips to rebound.

em,I bought 100 million with 100 BUSD ,But it looks like they're about to fork

Crypto is a scam. Crashes like these which keep happening are the proof.

This is too narrow, and the continuous issuance of US dollars is not a scam?

By that definition so is the stock market, because most companies eventually fail. Both crypto and the stock market are overall up over long time periods though.

How do I see it? Coins fail, particularly poorly managed ones. Not much to see. The only embarassing thing is how much major coins got tied up in a minor coins mess.

This is another place where more regulation would help, not hurt, crypto.

yes,smart insights,Algorithmic stablecoins are definitely a good direction.The failure is just the failure of LUNA not the cryptodoge

I never said they were directly comparable, only that the criteria he was using to declare "crypto is a scam" was quite flawed. There are far better metrics to use, as you correctly point out.


Most if not all stablecoins operate without PoW mining. Transaction fees I am unsure about, but are likely a valid point.


I think we went over this before.

yes,luna offers rates above market , making looks closer to ponzi scheme,This is the root cause of this crash

I legit forgot about lightning. Shows how much I use bitcoin.

I was refering more to the "free" transaction fees between books of select exchanges.

The technical principle of lightning is the side chain, which is also decentralized

 

[ir_cow]

Most alt coins will fade away at some point.

Most are considered scam coins.

Crytpo is just gambling. Easy to win, easy to lose.

 

[Keullo-e]

No problem. I don't fool around with play money so haven't lost anything.

All play money should be illegal IMO.

 

[micropage7]

crypto now is more dangerous than forex trading but many just go all in coz they say some make $$$$ profit in one night

 

[Outback Bronze]

I feel sorry for Do Kwon and all the investors. Its a sad tragedy. He had a shot at making money (which we all do) and now he's facing legal prosecution in South Korea.

It seems the reason why this happened is because his Algorithms were out of whack. There's probably a lot more to it than that.

Looks like you really need to know what your doing (in crypto) before you start playing with Billions of peoples dollars.

 

[Bones]

Crypto is a scam. Crashes like these which keep happening are the proof.

Must agree - In fact crypto (To me) is one of the biggest scams/fools games/money laundring tools/ect.... That's ever been created to date.
I see nothing good at all about it.

Stable coins can't work if there are whales, just like the case with Luna and probably many others. Cofezilla covered this topic nicely.

It was all a combination of this being a ponzi, the "master" being a total douchebag and the fact that the coin is completely useless.

This is going to happen with more and more coins as we move on and the bubble for each pops. In the end only the big ones will probably remain.

Can't buy anything with it? Pretty much valueless.


Just rich people playing games mostly

You can bet ONLY those well established in it will win.
This is setup so you cannot "Win" going it alone, instead you're just another sheep to be sheared... And you will be.

And if you decide to get into a mining group, that's been proven to be full of backstabbing too for profit - A literal pyramid scheme in many cases which collapses leaving you holding the bag with those further up the pyramid making off with anything perceived of value.

 

[Assimilator]

Web3 is Going Just Great

A timeline recording only some of the many disasters happening in crypto, decentralized finance, NFTs, and other blockchain-based projects.

web3isgoinggreat.com

Crypto is a scam and will continue to be a scam until it is properly regulated. Of course, the people who love crypto are by and large the criminals and grifters who are getting rich by scamming others, so more regulation is the opposite of what they want. And of course, once crypto is properly regulated it will demonstrate itself to be no more or less useful as a value store than fiat currency, so it will have no reason to exist. Essentially, regulation will end crypto and I cannot wait.

As for those who lost money, and will continue to lose money, on these so-called "stablecoins", I will continue to enjoy your stupidity and anguish. My salute goes out to the grifters, for figuring out how to make money off people who are too stupid to deserve it. Much like warning labels on cans, there are some problems that should be left to solve themselves.

I feel sorry for Do Kwon and all the investors. Its a sad tragedy. He had a shot at making money (which we all do) and now he's facing legal prosecution in South Korea.

It seems the reason why this happened is because his Algorithms were out of whack. There's probably a lot more to it than that.

Looks like you really need to know what your doing (in crypto) before you start playing with Billions of peoples dollars.

Why would you feel sorry for someone who is in it for no other reason than getting rich, and quite obviously has very little understanding of how basic market forces work?

 

[Totally]

Crypto is a scam. Crashes like these which keep happening are the proof.

I've been saying this for months but have been just have been dismissed by those who are pro-crypto. Jordan Belfort (you know that random guy they made a movie about for no particular reason) is one of the leading people behind the scenes ffs. Can't get a bigger red flag that about something being sus, I hope all those people who have money tied into cryro lose their money.

 

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
Yep suckers were defunded
Looks like a nice scam just more complex than phoning elderly from somewhere for credit/ debit card info for support of a made up issue.

It will take a lot of seizure of accounts and property with long jail time before fakecoins are stopped
Even with people like dogecoin creators admitted it was a joke.

 

[KLiKzg]

This whole stablecoin thing just seems like a grossly inefficient and poorly-regulated bank-account.

If you were just going to require that USD be held in reserve, all you're doing is reinventing fractional reserve banking. Except with an incredibly inefficient "mining" operation requiring "gas fees" and "transaction fees" to perform even the most simple of tasks.

Yes. You can invent new "stablecoins" and trick large swaths of the population into thinking its equivalent to USD. But as far as I can tell, the "correctly done" stablecoins with "USD Reserves" are still shady as all heck (offering APY rates way above what is possible in today's financial market, suggesting somebody is making a significant risk here behind the scenes). You can't make 6% or 7% APY gains reliably in this market, not even for 3 months or 6 months.

Are you all talking about USDT or USDC?

 

[R-T-B]

All play money should be illegal IMO.

*sad monopoly noises*

You would end up having to define what is/isn't "play money" which if you go to "only what the government says is money" pretty much makes coupons illegal.

Crypto is a little more complex than a blatant ponzi scam, and calling it that serves no one because it's easily disprovable via money trails and just shows you are no authority on the subject. It has however, devolved largely into a wild west of market gambling and is in sorry, sad need of regulation, like yesterday. Heck, most of it is not even usable as currency anymore.

 

[The Von Matrices]

If you were just going to require that USD be held in reserve, all you're doing is reinventing fractional reserve banking. Except with an incredibly inefficient "mining" operation requiring "gas fees" and "transaction fees" to perform even the most simple of tasks.

Yes. You can invent new "stablecoins" and trick large swaths of the population into thinking its equivalent to USD. But as far as I can tell, the "correctly done" stablecoins with "USD Reserves" are still shady as all heck (offering APY rates way above what is possible in today's financial market, suggesting somebody is making a significant risk here behind the scenes). You can't make 6% or 7% APY gains reliably in this market, not even for 3 months or 6 months.

You're right in that Terra was fractional reserve banking. These bank runs are what happens when you have a fractional reserve. But don't generalize that to mean all stablecoins are problematic. A number of them, namely USDC (but not USDT) are fully backed by verifiable reserves. To people like me who scrutinize coins before buying anything, Terra was always risky having a fractional reserve and I could not see how some magical algorithm could overcome that like they claimed.

To your other point, the 6-7% interest rate on coins occurs because other people are placing much larger bets in the market and are willing to pay that price to borrow your money. In fact, these investments are better than other common assets like stocks because they are collateralized. If you use a reputable lender, the worst that can happen in a market downturn is that you get your money back and no longer earn any interest. Sure, the borrower loses all his/her collateral because he/she made a poor bet, but that's not your problem.