how much space do I need to Chia be profitable?

[Deleted member 193792]

your source is a twitter handle called @hasoverride wth is this. no.

this thread is useless and needs to be locked. learn proper primary sources.

So Chia consumes more electricity than the global banking infrastructure? You didn't answer this. You don't seem to have any proper counterarguments, you're just angry. Temper your anger and then maybe we can discuss.

Next time I'll ask for permission from sanctimonious... internet strangers about "proper" sources. No. WTH. <-- see, I can do that too, it's not "smart" at all.

This thread is indeed useless when people like you don't want to be educated with facts (I answered all your questions, unlike you) and instead behave like cultists.

 

[80251]

OK:

Chia is even less than BTC.

Gold mining produces something of actual use (it's used minimally in electronics) as does the banking industry (loans to expand businesses, personal loans, mortgages, jobs to service all those needs etc.) . What goods or services does any type of cryptocurrency create (aside from money laundering, financing islamic terrorism, the illegal arms trade, drug cartels, child pornography)?

 

[Deleted member 193792]

Gold mining produces something of actual use (it's used minimally in electronics) as does the banking industry (loans to expand businesses, personal loans, mortgages, jobs to service all those needs etc.) . What goods or services does any type of cryptocurrency create (aside from money laundering, financing islamic terrorism, the illegal arms trade, drug cartels, child pornography)?

Nice FUD attempt. You're no better than Medieval Church religious zealots claiming that "You'll rot in hell, infidel!" if you don't do what the cult dictates.

Chia isn't even anonymous to begin and yet, it funds... terrorism? How so? Same for BTC/ETH. You don't even know which cryptos provide true anonymity.

Bitcoin Is a ‘Boon for Surveillance’, Says Former CIA Director - Decrypt

The technology behind Bitcoin is a “boon for surveillance” should be by governments to fight crime, according to a report by an ex-CIA boss.

decrypt.co

Get your facts straight and leave emotional BS arguments out. Is this place a hive mind?

 

[xrror]

Noob questions here: Does Chia actually need high performance I/O? I assume it does else the big players would just buy as much spinning rust as possible. 2nd Chia seems to murder NAND storage pretty consistently (read/write cycle) so at what point does it factor in where having to replace those 4TB and 8TB SSD's every 6/12 months make a dent in profit?

I'd assume xPoint would be ideal for this, but it's cheaper to burn out NAND drives before committing to the big xpoint drives?

Again just questions from a noob.

 

[Final_Fighter]

i picked up some more hdds to have on hand. not for mining tho. i know that ill need more storage and this coins looking to do to hdds what eth did to gpus.

 

[Deleted member 193792]

Noob questions here: Does Chia actually need high performance I/O? I assume it does else the big players would just buy as much spinning rust as possible. 2nd Chia seems to murder NAND storage pretty consistently (read/write cycle) so at what point does it factor in where having to replace those 4TB and 8TB SSD's every 6/12 months make a dent in profit?

I'd assume xPoint would be ideal for this, but it's cheaper to burn out NAND drives before committing to the big xpoint drives?

Again just questions from a noob.

First, I suggest to wait for pools. Solo farming is a huge gamble with the current difficulty. Not worth the investment on HDDs (if you don't have them already), you're going to be disappointed. Solo farming made sense if you were there @ day 1.

Second, depending on how many plots you want to create and your SSD endurance (TBW), you may or may not kill it at all.

For example, my SSD cost $130 and I sacrificed roughly 1/4 of its health according to SMART. It won't die any time soon. Chances are I will replace it when PCIe 5.0/DDR5/5nm arrive and it will still be usable.

My current profit is several times higher than the entire PC cost (let alone the SSD cost!) and I still use the PC for daily tasks. No harm done.

It's Chinese whales that will probably burn through many SSDs to build their mega-farms. Small farmers (people like me, who only have 1 PC and built it long before the crypto craze kicked in) are not a problem.

 

[R-T-B]

excellent more electricity usage for nothing but short term greed. I do hope they figure out how to use RAM as crypto next, humans don't deserve this planet.

Chia is designed to address the PoW energy problem you are complaining about. It is comparably quite green.

I still wish it offered encrypted decentralized cloud storage, like filecoin. That was actually cool. This... is kinda useless by comparison, IMO.

OK:

Chia is even less than BTC.

I'm curious how they came to those figures. They link/cite what appears to be a user post on medium.com. I know bitcoins environmental impact is often overplayed, but Is the banking system really that inefficient?

 

[95Viper]

How about everyone stays on topic.
And, not insult each other.
Keep it civil and discuss the topic, not each other.

Thank You.

 

[Deleted member 193792]

I'm curious how they came to those figures. They link what appears to be a post on medium.com. Is the banking system really that inefficient?

Of course it is inefficient, since there are so many bank branches, offices etc. Those things consume electricity.

I don't know if you read financial news at all, but they plan to increase efficiency by abolishing cash (you know, the thing that drug lords/terrorists have been using long before BTC came out...) in favor of CBDCs and closing many retail banks.

I think money competition is a good thing overall and nobody should have a monopoly in issuing money. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. This is the thing that many people don't get. This monopoly is responsible for many wars.

Some food for thought:

WTF Happened In 1971?

"I don't believe we shall ever have a good money again before we take the thing out of the hands of government, that is, we can't take it violently out of the hands of government, all we can do is by some sly roundabout way introduce something that they can't stop." - F.A. Hayek 1984

wtfhappenedin1971.com

IMHO, cryptos are a nice alternative to preserve your wealth (long-term it tends to go up, unlike fiat currencies).

If you want to stay in the middle class by 2030 and beyond, even a small exposure to cryptos wouldn't hurt. Fiat will just get devaluated even more from 2025 and onwards (CBDCs, UBI etc). Inflation is already over 4%. Be prepared and stay vigilant.

 

[LFaWolf]

I could never understand coin mining. With this one where you have tens of drives all spinning and running (and seeing someone is eyeing some enterprise drives, the noisiest of all), how do you deal with the heat and noise??? The noise alone would drive me insane and the heat could possibly cook me alive!

 

[xrror]

I could never understand coin mining. With this one where you have tens of drives all spinning and running (and seeing someone is eyeing some enterprise drives, the noisiest of all), how do you deal with the heat and noise??? The noise alone would drive me insane and the heat could possibly cook me alive!

Bulk (spinning) storage is kinda... already a solved problem? You wouldn't have all those storage racks in the room with you for the exact reasons you state. If you're running enough drives to compete with BackBlaze then you're probably not the hobby miner either

This all assuming that spinning storage is even... desirable for this? All the panic I see about Chia is causing shortage on SSD drives. I'm guessing it's more profitable to run the Chia algorithm on fast I/O??? else why bother with SSD when if all you need is storage HDD's absolutely dominate there cost-wise.

Again as a noob I don't know - but to directly address your question noise and heat might not be nearly as much a problem if there are NO mechanical drives involved!

 

[lexluthermiester]

OK:

Chia is even less than BTC.

Citations are required for such stats. Those numbers are NOT trustworthy unless backed by a reliable source that can be verified. Otherwise it's just set of pretty graphs that mean nothing..

 

[Deleted member 193792]

Citations are required for such stats. Those numbers are NOT trustworthy unless backed by a reliable source that can be verified. Otherwise it's just set of pretty graphs that mean nothing..

I will ask one last time: do you need a source to know that Chia consumes far less electricity than BTC (ASICs) & ETH (GPUs)?

Hopefully I will get an answer this time...

 

[user112]

personally I think buying coins directly is always better than mining. I have no doubt high frequency trading software on a coin exchange would put any miners profit to shame with less risk and lower upfront investment. the only thing stopping that from being more of a thing is the lack of people with both investor knowledge and programming skill. also the only advantage to SSDs is that it takes less time to do the initial ploting of an entire drive. but I don't think saving a days in the setup process is enough of a lead to really beat cheaper higher capacity storage that has atleast 2x the durability.plus if NVME was actually a requirement you'd need fiber internet with a multi-gigabit connection to mine chia. though if your building a farm LTO tapes are far better than HDDs.

 

[lexluthermiester]

I will ask one last time: do you need a source to know that Chia consumes far less electricity than BTC (ASICs) & ETH (GPUs)?

Hopefully I will get an answer this time...

Yes. HDD's/SSD's use power and CPU's use power to run the mining algorithm. Verifiable stats are required here. However, your graphs list cryptocoin in general and that is the context which is in question.

 

[Deleted member 193792]

personally I think buying coins directly is always better than mining. I have no doubt high frequency trading software on a coin exchange would put any miners profit to shame with less risk and lower upfront investment. the only thing stopping that from being more of a thing is the lack of people with both investor knowledge and programming skill. also the only advantage to SSDs is that it takes less time to do the initial ploting of an entire drive. but I don't think saving a days in the setup process is enough of a lead to really beat cheaper higher capacity storage that has atleast 2x the durability.plus if NVME was actually a requirement you'd need fiber internet with a multi-gigabit connection to mine chia. though if your building a farm LTO tapes are far better than HDDs.

NVMe is related to FTTH? How so? I think you confuse plotting bandwidth (high) with internet p2p bandwidth (low).

Also, tapes really are a bad idea... you don't need lots of bandwidth for farming, but you need fast seek times to provide the hash in a timely manner and no tape is going to provide that.

Yes. HDD's/SSD's use power and CPU's use power to run the mining algorithm. Verifiable stats are required here. However, your graphs list cryptocoin in general and that is the context which is in question.

Alright. I hope you'll switch to... Nintendo Switch to consume less power while gaming. Not even PS4/XB1.

If you don't do so (like Nintendo fanatics say), I'll consider your "ecological" stance hypocritical to say the least. Double standards at its finest.

Or even better: let's ban gaming altogether to save the planet. Less hypocrisy that way, since gaming is a waste of time and produces nothing. Now I'm waiting for you guys to crucify me.

ps: You still didn't answer my question if Chia consumes less electricity vs BTC/ETH. Nice cop-out!

 

[lexluthermiester]

Alright. I hope you'll switch to... Nintendo Switch to consume less power while gaming. Not even PS4/XB1.

If you don't do so (like Nintendo fanatics say), I'll consider your "ecological" stance hypocritical to say the least. Double standards at its finest.

Or even better: let's ban gaming altogether to save the planet. Less hypocrisy that way, since gaming is a waste of time and produces nothing. Now I'm waiting for you guys to crucify me.

Yes, that it's, respond with an attack instead of either providing a citation to your graphs or stating that they might be total bunk..

 

[Deleted member 193792]

Yes, that it's, respond with an attack instead of either providing a citation to your graphs or stating that they might be total bunk..

Trust the FED then. They will surely tell you that cryptos consume more electricity than the global banking system.

When are we going to ban video games for the sake of the planet? Or is human entertainment more important than saving the planet?

And while we're at it, let's also ban cars (even more CO2) and force everyone to take public transportation. USA would love that, don't you think?

 

[lexluthermiester]

Trust the FED then.

Angry much?

They will surely tell you that cryptos consume more electricity than the global banking system.

The global banking system is an integral part of the world economy and essential for everyday life. Crytocoin is NOT.

When are we going to ban video games for the sake of the planet? Or is human entertainment more important than saving the planet?

Gaming isn't and never has impacted the environment like crypto is.

And while we're at it, let's also ban cars (even more CO2) and force everyone to take public transportation. USA would love that, don't you think?

So what you are effectively saying is that your previous post with the pretty graphs are in fact total nonsense. Just a repost of a twitter crap post, yes?

 

[Deleted member 193792]

You're projecting and you have tons of double standards, as you already said. You're being disingenuous.

I'm not angry at all, since I bought GPUs at rock bottom prices (before the mining craze), unlike many of you (who are totally mad about cryptos and GPU price gouging!). Sorry, but it's the truth. Admit it.

 

[64K]

OK:

Those comparisons don't make sense really.

You can't compare gold to bitcoins because gold has considerable uses in manufacturing. It's also used in making jewelry that appeals to people naturally and always has throughout history.

You can't compare bitcoins to the Banking System unless you can offer some evidence of what percentage of people are using the Banking System compared to what percentage of people are Bitcoin Miners.

 

[Deleted member 193792]

Those comparisons don't make sense really.

You can't compare gold to bitcoins because gold has considerable uses in manufacturing. It's also used in making jewelry that appeals to people naturally and always has throughout history.

You can't compare bitcoins to the Banking System unless you can offer some evidence of what percentage of people are using the Banking System as compared to what percentage of people are Bitcoin Miners.

Human vanity (jewelry) is more important than saving the planet?

Many double standards, I see...

I'm pretty sure women can live just fine with no jewerly at all (it's not essential for life). No?

 

[lexluthermiester]

You're projecting and you have tons of double standards, as you already said. You're being disingenuous.

Ah, another attack. This proves you know you're wrong.

I'm not angry at all, since I bought GPUs at rock bottom prices (before the mining craze), unlike many of you (who are totally mad about cryptos and GPU price gouging!). Sorry, but it's the truth. Admit it.

Human vanity (jewelry) is more important than saving the planet?

Many double standards, I see...

I'm pretty sure women can live just fine with no jewerly at all (it's not essential for life). No?

So that makes you better than everyone else?

Cryptocoin mining is a VERY energy intensive activity regardless of the type of mining you engage in. This is fact, provable fact. Your arguements that are specifically aimed at shifting focus, blame and accountability are meritless as they are out of scope of the topic of discussion and lacking context for comparison.

 

[Deleted member 193792]

You're projecting, Lex.

Just tell me: how many people on this forum are angry about cryptos due to GPU prices?

Hint: I'm not one of them. So why should I be angry? I know when it's the right time to buy.

 

[lexluthermiester]

You're projecting, Lex.

Yes, that's got to be it...