How to achieve tear free image without FreeSync or V-Sync?

[RejZoR]

So, does AMD have any meaningful control to eliminate image tearing:
- Without V-Sync which induces massive input lag
- Without FreeSync which requires new monitor

I have a 144Hz monitor already, so take that into consideration.

I know AMD has a frame limiter which could do the trick, but as far as I remember, maximum frame limiter target was around 80fps or so. I'd prefer it go up to at least 120fps or even 140fps, just to stay under the refresh rate...

Has AMD changed that recently or do they now have some other controls to achieve this? I'm interested in AMD Vega and I'm collecting resources regarding image tearing elimination features because AMD has no Adaptive V-Sync or Fast V-Sync and I can't stand image tearing...

 

[Xzibit]

As far as I know

Frame Rate Target Control = Up to 200

The current implementation of Frame Rate Target Control works with DirectX® 9, DirectX® 10 and DirectX® 11 titles, and offers targets in the range of 30 to 200 fps.

I believe you can still overclock while doing so to minimize dips

 

[Mussels]

MSI afterburner, install rivatuner statistics server
FPS can to 59, run vsync off.

Glorious PC master race feel.

(90FPS is chosen in this screenshot, it works for me)

 

[agent00skid]

The frame limiter in Radeon Settings seems to go up to 200 FPS for me.

 

[droopyRO]

Did you try 120Hz ? i use mine on 120 and can't rememeber when i last saw tearing. Also if you have that 980 from your specs activate Fast Sync(NV control panel) in the profile for your game.

 

[Jack1n]

Did you try 120Hz ? i use mine on 120 and can't rememeber when i last saw tearing. Also if you have that 980 from your specs activate Fast Sync(NV control panel) in the profile for your game.

Read the whole post.

 

[CAPSLOCKSTUCK]

enabling frame rate target control made my screen tear like nothing else when i just tried it with HD 7970 and GTA V. Ive gone back to using Vsync.

 

[RejZoR]

Is AMD's framerate limiter limited to certain API's or can it work in all of them?

I'm just testing framerate limiting using MSI Afterburner on my GTX 980 to see how things behave. Hopefully AMD's framerate limiter works the same...

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

enabling frame rate target control made my screen tear like nothing else when i just tried it with HD 7970 and GTA V. Ive gone back to using Vsync.

On a game which is GPU heavy set to high settings you can get dips below 60fps hey presto tearing, adjust settings so the minimum FPS is above 60 and your FPS is locked to 60(or read 120 instead of 60 in my post) and it wouldn't tear.
At least that's how I'd use it , I don't mind vsync though because I go ultra settings low FPS route personally ie 40-60fps in GTA V with settings but not all the sliders maxed (cos shadows ten miles away don't matter).

 

[qubit]

@RejZoR The short answer is that without vsync of some sort, you're gonna see image tearing regardless of whether the GPU is rendering above or below the refresh rate - it has to, because by definition it draws a new frame in the middle of the monitor displaying a frame.

The effect does vary though and it can look much more visible depending on the game you're running and the monitor refresh rate. As you have a 144Hz monitor, that high framerate will tend to minimise it (I know, I have one too) but as you've seen, can't eliminate it. Now, it would be interesting to see this on one of those fancy new 240Hz monitors. It may possibly look almost invisible on one of those, I dunno.

Best thing you can do is to use vsync or go NVIDIA and enjoy the glory of FastSync. This is Pascal's killer feature in my book, where you get the best of all worlds. The graphics card works harder for you to achieve it and I like that.

 

[Xzibit]

@RejZoR The short answer is that without vsync of some sort, you're gonna see image tearing regardless of whether the GPU is rendering above or below the refresh rate - it has to, because by definition it draws a new frame in the middle of the monitor displaying a frame.

The effect does vary though and it can look much more visible depending on the game you're running and the monitor refresh rate. As you have a 144Hz monitor, that high framerate will tend to minimise it (I know, I have one too) but as you've seen, can't eliminate it. Now, it would be interesting to see this on one of those fancy new 240Hz monitors. It may possibly look almost invisible on one of those, I dunno.

Best thing you can do is to use vsync or go NVIDIA and enjoy the glory of FastSync. This is Pascal's killer feature in my book, where you get the best of all worlds. The graphics card works harder for you to achieve it and I like that.

With a static refresh rate monitor the issues is tearing above the set refresh rate.

He needs to always exceed his monitors refresh rate monitor (no dips) for the desired effect I believe he is looking for from a FPS limiter to be affective. FastSync introduces a bit of latency (Was explained by Tom Petersen of Nvidia) the fact that its at a higher refresh rate, it is less noticeable.

The real solution is a high VRR monitor FreeSync or G-Sync monitor with a FPS limit at max refresh rate.

 

[qubit]

With a static refresh rate monitor the issues is tearing above the set refresh rate.

He needs to always exceed his monitors refresh rate monitor (no dips) for the desired effect I believe he is looking for from a FPS limiter to be affective. FastSync introduces a bit of latency (Was explained by Tom Petersen of Nvidia) the fact that its at a higher refresh rate, it is less noticeable.

The real solution is a high VRR monitor FreeSync or G-Sync monitor with a FPS limit at max refresh rate.

You get screen tearing whether the GPU is rendering above monitor refresh or below, as I said above. The only thing that matters is that it's not synced for tearing to occur.

Yes, for proper smooth stutter-free motion, the GPU must always be able to render above the display refresh and be vsync locked to it so that it doesn't drop any frames.

Yes, a high VRR monitor would sure help with those inevitable dips, too.

Setting an FPS limit on the GPU independent of the monitor refresh is pointless unless you just want the card to run a bit cooler. vsync lock is what you need, whether it's regular vsync, FastSync, or adaptive sync, it's the only way to get rid of tearing. Rej's quest to achieve tear-free animation without vsync is impossible.

 

[Mussels]

58 FPS on a 60hz monitor with Vsync off, definitely gets rid of the tearing without the input latency of Vsync on.

 

[Xzibit]

58 FPS on a 60hz monitor with Vsync off, definitely gets rid of the tearing without the input latency of Vsync on.

Yeah but you can maintain that with a 1080 on modern games and quality settings the op was vague and running a 980 wanting 120 or 144 with a possible AMD setup soon.

 

[RejZoR]

I was playing with NVIDIA Inspector Frame Limiter a bit and it looks like it defaults to using 2 frames less than refresh. When I set the value closest to 60Hz, it defaulted to 58fps. With value closest to 144Hz it defaulted to 142fps.
I do remember getting horrifying image tearing when using 59fps frame limit in CS:GO back on 60Hz monitor. If I limited it to 58, it would be better apparently. Is it possible that odd value framerate lock can actually make things worse opposed to even valued framerate lock?

Been playing with frame limiting for some time now and it seems this is a sufficient solution to eliminate most obvious tearing. Considering my system needs to consistently reach over 144fps in order to tear image, that alone is the reason for not needing to worry much about lack of V-Sync features. Would appreciate them, but thanks to frame limiter, not such a big deal (except it doesn't work with OGL and Vulkan or DX12 games which sucks a lot considering how much AMD is pushing these API's). So far things are looking good for Vega in this regard

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

I was playing with NVIDIA Inspector Frame Limiter a bit and it looks like it defaults to using 2 frames less than refresh. When I set the value closest to 60Hz, it defaulted to 58fps. With value closest to 144Hz it defaulted to 142fps.
I do remember getting horrifying image tearing when using 59fps frame limit in CS:GO back on 60Hz monitor. If I limited it to 58, it would be better apparently. Is it possible that odd value framerate lock can actually make things worse opposed to even valued framerate lock?

Been playing with frame limiting for some time now and it seems this is a sufficient solution to eliminate most obvious tearing. Considering my system needs to consistently reach over 144fps in order to tear image, that alone is the reason for not needing to worry much about lack of V-Sync features. Would appreciate them, but thanks to frame limiter, not such a big deal (except it doesn't work with OGL and Vulkan or DX12 games which sucks a lot considering how much AMD is pushing these API's). So far things are looking good for Vega in this regard

Well thought out opinion.
I am hoping all those APIs update their asses big time and quickly too. I can't weld 2 GPUs in any modern API

 

[TheGuruStud]

Capping framerate doesn't stop tearing. It can reduce it, but I've never seen it eliminated. They get even bigger in my experience (like all the way across the screen).

 

[EarthDog]

I play with in-game settings to keep my FPS right around the refresh rate. In BF1/BF4 I use the resolution scale to improve IQ and lowers tbe FPS to around 60.


I always thought below the refresh rate you don't get tearing.. it repeats the same frame worst case? This is why NVIDIA's adaptive vsync shuts off below the refresh rate as it wasn't needed?

 

[TheGuruStud]

I play with in-game settings to keep my FPS right around the refresh rate. In BF1/BF4 I use the resolution scale to improve IQ and lowers tbe FPS to around 60.


I always thought below the refresh rate you don't get tearing.. it repeats the same frame worst case? This is why NVIDIA's adaptive vsync shuts off below the refresh rate as it wasn't needed?

Adaptive v-sync turns off below refresh b/c there would be a massive amount of stuttering with vsync on (or depending on buffering it locks to 30 fps)

 

[EarthDog]

Also correct. Vsync uses multiples of the monitors refresh rate which causes that stuttering when switching from 60/45/30/15 etc...

 

[TheGuruStud]

Also correct.

Many years ago triple buffering actually allowed smooth gameplay below refresh. Something changed with the platforms/drivers/games and it quit working. If the input latency wasn't bothersome, it was an amazing experience. I haven't seen this mentioned anywhere. It was very frustrating when it stopped working correctly.