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Intel Internal Memo Reveals that even Intel is Impressed by AMD's Progress

Tassadar_

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Additionally, I would say users don't buy a chip. They buy a system. They buy a whole solution that includes software enabling, vendor enabling, validation, technical support, manageability, out-of-box experience, supplier sustained consistency, and more. So, yes, while an OEM or ODM might buy a chip, the end user doesn't generally buy only a chip. We believe that our product pricing vis-à-vis AMD reflects the great deal of added value that specifically comes from buying Intel with our decades of unmatched investments in validation, software, and security

 

Fabel

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I'm going to be the devil's advocate here. This is regarding ICL mobile for now.
Most of these? Positive indeed for the desktop market. That said, for mobile starting very soon:


Their new 10nm lithography is actually quite nice.


ICL is incredibly efficient.


Built-in Thunderbolt 3 controller, large cache, iGPU that competes with Ryzen 3700U's one, on-MCM PCH controller with FIVR fed power.


Similar here on 25W


They did no quite lose it yet with ICL

Again, on desktop and server - mostly agree with what you said. This is something they are going to have to take their sweet time on for many months on now to make a comeback
Their 10nm is almost non existent by now, and way inferior to their arguably awesome 14++, I will be pretty surprised if in its current incarnation it is able to match clocks, so yeah pretty well suited for mobile, where they are still leading. And of course at low clocks it is easy to stay efficient.

But Innovation? TB?! Really? oh please they failed miserably on TB and had to open source to salvage it in USB4, and playing catch up in the iGPU isn't innovating either..

Yeah they are pushing partners to try to keep AMD out of the mobile segment, but not by the means of innovation. Intel Athena blah blah blah

IMHO no real innovation.

Funny enough AMD powered notebooks are better balanced in terms of CPU/GPU power at least for gaming workloads. All those i7 with low end discrete GPUs are pretty ridiculous, when an i5 with a better discrete GPU can do the job... and then game. But of course that does not benefit their bottom line.
 
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Memo to refocus their employees and talk to the press at the same time I guess. Kinda reads like Intel acknowledges they were out engineered.

Also... Funny having the pcperspective website called out by name... wonder why? ;)
 
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When I read posts like this I sometimes wonder if English being my second language is the cause of me not understanding them or if the poster is just talking gibberish.
The first one... English isn't my first language too, but I understood what he meant.
 

bug

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If you remove all the BS in there, all that's left is: go Zen2, there's no point in waiting for Ice Lake. That's sad, Intel. That's sad.
 
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They should check the security pillar. I think it's made of jello.
 
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This totally wan't intended to be leaked from the let go of course, but what is it, the script for an infomercial?

While giving some credit to AMD, and I think some unnamed recognition to Lisa Su, they are totally disconnected from reality if they really think this thing paints their new reality.
To be fair it reads like the internal posts we see where I work (another very large global tech company) - lots of marketing speak as sales tend to read these and paraphrase the responses to customers where needed. The materials here will be re-used in competitive playbooks for sales as well. It's also necessary to acknowledge the threat so that employees know that the business is aware of the problem and looking at how to fight back. The employee responses I usually see internally are either people looking to suck up to whichever exec had their name on the post (which will have been ghost written), or disgruntled employees looking for somewhere to vent.

Intel know they're weak in the CPUs themselves so need to make sure that everyone knows the other value props they go to customers with (valid or not). If they didn't communicate these messages internally then they may as well give up as these messages will be repeated internally to people who don't bother reading these blogs, some of whom will be customer facing to some extent.
 
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This made my day and the comment section ^3, all in good spirit.
 
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They didn't become complacent in that sense, but rather, they believed they were so far ahead
This is what happens when a company drinks so much of their own Kool-Aid that they get drunk on it, they lose focus and direction and most importantly they lose sight of what the market and their customers want.
Their 10nm is almost non existent by now, and way inferior to their arguably awesome 14++
Except for the fact that their 14nm+++ (++++++++++++) runs as hot as the surface of the sun when you pack more cores onboard.

Sure, when you're dealing with only four cores it's not so bad but once you ramp up to six and eight cores the thermals quickly get out of hand. Look at the 8700K, it runs as hot as a mofo (partly due to the paste TIM that they use) but even the 9900K run hot too when being put under load. This isn't exactly spelling out a win here for Intel, they desperately need 10nm and their load temperatures show it. Too bad they failed pretty damn hard when it comes to 10nm, they should have been able to do it. Like @birdie said, they have all the money in the world and some of the best engineers in the world; how the fuck did they fail so hard at this?
Funny enough AMD powered notebooks are better balanced in terms of CPU/GPU power at least for gaming workloads. All those i7 with low end discrete GPUs are pretty ridiculous, when an i5 with a better discrete GPU can do the job... and then game. But of course that does not benefit their bottom line.
Linus talked about this, I'd have to find the YouTube video though.
 
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Did you guys see this part?

Brian said:


I'm on P2CA team supporting our DCG business. I can't speak knowledgeably about our perception in the client enthusiast world. In the data center we're perceived positively as taking security seriously. Second Generation Xeon Scalable processors include hardware fixes for existing side-channel vulnerabilities. And based on my experience working on the L1TF response, we have a world class team in IPAS [editor: Intel Product Assurance and Security] that proactively works with customers ahead of citing disclosures to ensure they understand the situation and have a viable mitigation strategy.
Brian appears to have is head so far up his own ass he can't see the forest for the trees.

The fact that in the data center the customers are evaluating and buying AMD instead after being Intel shops for so long speaks to them not being confident in Intel's security and performance per dollar.
 
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This memo proves something that most of us didn't suspect: The Intel fanboys are worse than Intel empoyees in their blindness for the reality CPU market is facing. So, the next reply to any Intel fanboy should be: "You are worse than an Intel employee and although they have a serious reason to protect their company they see clearer than you"
 

Tassadar_

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They lost me on their 5th pillar - 'security'. ROFL

Not that their process is any better either...
You didn't understood. As I posted before, Intel has a great sense of humour and this...

buying Intel with our decades of unmatched investments in validation, software, and security.

this is an hilarious comment that proves that Intel can laught about himself.

decades of unmatched investments ---> A decade selling the same quad cores spending near to zero on research and development, only reducing manufacturing process to reduce manufacturing cost and increase profit. Of course, changing the motherboard compatibility every year of two maximum (a great way to demonstrate that they're a company "focused on the customer satisfaction").

software
--> Do you know what "great software" are they talking about? (I don't) Does this software make their plattform better than the AMD?

security: you see? they're clearly joking.

Regards
 

bug

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This memo proves something that most of us didn't suspect: The Intel fanboys are worse than Intel empoyees in their blindness for the reality CPU market is facing. So, the next reply to any Intel fanboy should be: "You are worse than an Intel employee and although they have a serious reason to protect their company they see clearer than you"
You think you can rank fanboys and conclude Intel's are worse/better than AMD's, Nvidia's, Apple's or whoever's?
 
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seems intel employees build for themselves amd pc's lol
 

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seems intel employees build for themselves amd pc's lol
It's been like this back in Netburst's days. It took Intel a few years to ready their answer. In the meantime, AMD was able to move Athlon -> AthlonXP -> Athlon64 -> Athlon 64 X2/X4. And Intel didn't have any fab woes during that time, so you do the math.
 
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Additionally, some software is licensed per core and therefore more cores from the AMD solution results in higher licensing costs.
Wow! Really? Is this a real argument?
Single core CPUs for servers NOW, to lower licensing costs!
 
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Wow! Really? Is this a real argument?
Single core CPUs for servers NOW, to lower licensing costs!
Yes. It is and can be a good one depending on use cases. It can EASILY blow the monetary savings of the cpu (core vs core and thread vs thread) right out the door. Over buying on cores and threads in a DC environment can be quite detrimental to the bottom line on many fronts.
 
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The easy way of getting around that is to limit the visible cores inside the virtual machine where the licensing cost limited software is running.
Over buying on cores and threads in a DC environment can be quite detrimental to the bottom line on many fronts.
I don't see it that way, I see it as a way to pack more computing power into less space and remember, space (specifically, rack space) is limited in a data center. More cores and more threads means you can run more virtual machines while consuming less rack space.
 
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If this is real, this is really good for Zen 2. Intel is internally preparing to stop the bleeding before the bleeding has even started. Like I said with the price cut rumors, this is so good for us the buying public. We can expect at least a few years of innovation and competition! I still find it disturbing that Intel needs AMD to push them along.
 
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I don't see it that way, I see it as a way to pack more computing power into less space and remember, space (specifically, rack space) is limited in a data center. More cores and more threads means you can run more virtual machines while consuming less rack space.
To those not in the data center/capacity planning/licensing side of things, we can see how one can jump to your conclusion.
 
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this is so good for us the buying public
Now if only they can get their thermals under control because many of Intel's enthusiast chips run very damn hot. This is where 10nm is desperately needed.
I still find it disturbing that Intel needs AMD to push them along.
This has always been the case with companies that have sat on the golden throne for too long, they get drunk on their own Kool-Aid. It's happened across dozens of industries, not just the computing industry.

To those not in the data center/capacity planning/licensing side of things, we can see how one can jump to your conclusion.
Again, as I said previously, you can limit the number of cores that the software sees inside the virtual machine. For instance, if you only have an MSSQL server license for six cores then limit the virtual machine to six cores and be done. There are ways around software licensing issues while thinking intelligently about how to pack as much computing power as possible in as little space as necessary. More servers equal more required physical space, power usage, cooling, and other added costs. If you can reduce that you can spend the saved money on other parts of your business.
 
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