Intel Skylake De-lidded, Reveals Tiny Die

[Sempron Guy]

No, and that's what I am trying to explain to you. Obviously those partners are not good enough and cannot offer new production capacity in order to AMD stay competitive.

AMD has the full right to turn to the only other fab that is capable - that is Intel..

And I don't see what your problem is - look at Apple and Samsung, not the same situation with different outcome?

Just admit that you are wrong.

Just give up blaming intel Intel is an immortal company that bears no fault whatsover. It's totally AMD's fault why Intel chooses TIM instead of solder in between the ihs and the skylake die. And the new design in their retail boxes you can put that on AMD's tab too.

 

[Agreemenot]

@Agreemenot which uncompetitive practices does Intel engage in? You mention P4 times, AMD was riding high then and Intels was shit.

As to bundling a gpu in the cpu, that's what AMD's APU are, and they were doing it first. Intel jist played catchup. Because Intel is a well-run company, the made up for lost time quickly.

You're right about AMD not having much for funds to do R&D, marketing, etc. But it's not Intel's fault. Intel has merely done what every company's shareholders demand: Make money. Have you read up on why AMD is where they are now? They have done it to themselves. Bad decision, bad strategy, bad management.

Can they recover? Maybe, with alot of effort, but they are going to have to do it themselves. I hope they do, because no company is ever going to help a competitor, and we need them to compete fiercely.

Intel didnt do nuffin! Why dont you read up upon what they were charged on? You obviously think its easy and simple to compete with someone that has so much more than you, connections, funds, ties etc., something other than a product.

 

[midnightoil]

Its not the TIM thats crap, its the black adhesive they use that expands when it gets hot so it causes a gap between the die and the IHS.

I don't know how crap the TIM they use now for Haswell / Broadwell / Skylake is, but the stuff they used for Ivy Bridge (when they stopped using solder) was only marginally more effective than toothpaste, but significantly better than a slice of processed cheese at load ... that's how bad it was. I have to think that it's been improved by now, but for IB it was absolutely abysmal (plus that huge amount of adhesive being problematic as you identify). Getting rid of the adhesive and cleaning the toothpaste off and replacing it with Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra yielded a reduction in load temperatures of 32-34C for my 3770k.

Looking forward to Zen even more now that Intel have shafted us with a wad of glue and TIM again, instead of solder. April can't come soon enough ...

 

[Tatty_Two]

Intel didnt do nuffin! Why dont you read up upon what they were charged on? You obviously think its easy and simple to compete with someone that has so much more than you, connections, funds, ties etc., something other than a product.

Noone is denying the power and influence of Intel, the point is a while ago, OK a long while ago, AMD was not only competitive but offered CPU's that generally out performed Intel's offerings, so how is it that Intel in the last 10 years has come such a long way and AMD have not? AMD had the market share and so I assume the profitability back then but it would at least appear that Intel's strategy, business models, innovation, investment and intent has got them to where they are now, yes perhaps with some dodgy dealing along the journey but it would appear that AMD's strategy etc just failed, perhaps I am over simplifying things but it's what I see from my view sadly.

 

[Joss]

so how is it that Intel in the last 10 years has come such a long way and AMD have not?

Because AMD is a badly run company in the sense of always taking the wrong strategic decisions (Bulldozer/Piledriver "module" design) and poor tactical management (290/290x's botched release).
Intel may be guilty of using its clout in unfair ways (like influencing benchmark tools to favour its CPUs) but AMD has only itself to blame for their griefs.

 

[Octopuss]

Intel didnt do nuffin! Why dont you read up upon what they were charged on? You obviously think its easy and simple to compete with someone that has so much more than you, connections, funds, ties etc., something other than a product.

Oh look, someone is successful, that's wrong, let's stop him!
Sounds like communist thinking. Are you for real?

 

[rtwjunkie]

@Agreemenot As several others before me have said, Intel used to be the one without the money and clout and power. AMD squandered their lead, pure and simple.

Fear not though, AMD will not disappear, since a monopoly would not be allowed. So if they don't find a way to be profitable again, or if someone doesn't buy them, they will get propped up by government before being allowed to fold, so in effect, the poor little guy will get rewarded for countless bad decisions that put them where they are.

Don't take my words wrong, I want them to be successful and regain status. It's better for their employees, the economy and for all consumers due to lower prices on Intel and Nvida products. I'm just able to tell you, without emotion, what the truth behind their downfall is.

 

[Agreemenot]

Noone is denying the power and influence of Intel, the point is a while ago, OK a long while ago, AMD was not only competitive but offered CPU's that generally out performed Intel's offerings, so how is it that Intel in the last 10 years has come such a long way and AMD have not? AMD had the market share and so I assume the profitability back then but it would at least appear that Intel's strategy, business models, innovation, investment and intent has got them to where they are now, yes perhaps with some dodgy dealing along the journey but it would appear that AMD's strategy etc just failed, perhaps I am over simplifying things but it's what I see from my view sadly.

Question, is it easier now to rival Intel or was it harder back then?

Oh look, someone is successful, that's wrong, let's stop him!
Sounds like communist thinking. Are you for real?

Seems you like monopoly. Are you for real?

@Agreemenot As several others before me have said, Intel used to be the one without the money and clout and power. AMD squandered their lead, pure and simple.

Fear not though, AMD will not disappear, since a monopoly would not be allowed. So if they don't find a way to be profitable again, or if someone doesn't buy them, they will get propped up by government before being allowed to fold, so in effect, the poor little guy will get rewarded for countless bad decisions that put them where they are.

Don't take my words wrong, I want them to be successful and regain status. It's better for their employees, the economy and for all consumers due to lower prices on Intel and Nvida products. I'm just able to tell you, without emotion, what the truth behind their downfall is.

AMD squandered their lead, pure and simple? Simple is what YOU want it to be. Its much more complex than that. AMD vs Intel case shows that. As if it is Intel vs AMD products and not some or any nationalist(location), zionist, political(corruption/jobs) or military/agency factor involved also and more.

 

[rtwjunkie]

Question, is it easier now to rival Intel or was it harder back then?


Seems you like monopoly. Are you for real?


AMD squandered their lead, pure and simple? Simple is what YOU want it to be. Its much more complex than that. AMD vs Intel case shows that. As if it is Intel vs AMD products and not some or any nationalist(location), zionist, political(corruption/jobs) or military/agency factor involved also and more.

Youare a complete conspiracy theorist and nutjob. Ever hear of the free market, or does that not exist in your obviously socialist head? Good grief, I'm actually going to have to use the ignore button finally.

 

[MxPhenom 216]

Youare a complete conspiracy theorist and nutjob. Ever hear of the free market, or does that not exist in your obviously socialist head? Good grief, I'm actually going to have to use the ignore button finally.

I think him and Sony are friends. Makes sense.

 

[Agreemenot]

Youare a complete conspiracy theorist and nutjob. Ever hear of the free market, or does that not exist in your obviously socialist head? Good grief, I'm actually going to have to use the ignore button finally.

You're just reaffirming my point, that you want it to be seen and taken simply as it suits you. Also Free = Opportunity = Affordability, Market = Choices. What choices do you get now? Z170 and 6600K/6700K ,eh? How am i socialist when i point out that governments propped up Intel without competitive bidding? http://www.ecommercetimes.com/story/37286.html

 

[Octopuss]

I have to leave the thread before I start calling people female genitals out of pure frustration over infinite idiocy.

P.S. Intel is part of the big Judeo-Masonic conspiracy

 

[Sony Xperia S]

I think him and Sony are friends. Makes sense.

I think you just are too silly and confused, with blind eyes.

It doesn't make sense for people with AMD's products nicknames to be such.

 

[Agreemenot]

I have to leave the thread before I start calling people female genitals out of pure frustration over infinite idiocy.

P.S. Intel is part of the big Judeo-Masonic conspiracy

Bait. Jews and Israel are no joke. Merely you who do not know or understand how sophisticated the Israeli military is and how they need appropriate hardware to run their software(battle management/bc), like a P3 lv/ulv and such.

 

[radrok]

I think you just are too silly and confused, with blind eyes.

It doesn't make sense for people with AMD's products nicknames to be such.

I think his name isn't derived from an AMD product, I recall it was about motorbikes, and even if it was so, why would it matter?

This thread is becoming a general nonsense one.

I'm also wearing a double tinfoil helmet (a simple hat would be useless here).

 

[Sihastru]

There's a lot of misinformation going on in this thread...

As to bundling a gpu in the cpu, that's what AMD's APU are, and they were doing it first. Intel jist played catchup. Because Intel is a well-run company, the made up for lost time quickly.

AMD's first CPU with integrated GPU (or APU as they call it) was announced in January 2011. They called it Llano/Brazos.

Intel HD Graphics 1st gen was introduced in January 2010 with Clarkdale/Arrandale. True, it was a multi die design, but it shared the CPU's package. One full year before AMD. In January 2011, Intel's HD Graphics gen 2 was launched with Sandy Bridge.

Just calling it an "APU" doesn't make it special in any way, the CPU and GPU work mostly independently for both AMD and Intel.

So who was first?

And I don't even know what to say about Sony Xperia S... The only logical explanation is that he's Richard Huddy. But not exactly Huddy, but some kind of failed clone. If we take Aliens for example, and we consider that it takes 8 tries to get a clone right(ish), then Sony Xperia S is attempt number 4. You know, the clone that is rejected before it reaches the factory for Soylent Green.

Sony, dude, your ramblings hurt even the brains of the most avid AMD fans. If we are to believe you, Intel and nVIDIA are to blame for everything that's wrong with the world. And I'm not saying it is not possible, but the way you fabricate illogical conspiracies in your convoluted mind... there's not enough tin foil in the universe.

Peace!

 

[tabascosauz]

Look.

This needs to stop. This was about the new quad-core Skylake die being delidded. Why is it that out of the past 10 threads in which I've participated/come across, half of them have to do with me doing my best to stop the bullshit nonsense that propagates from people like Sony Xperia S, rather than discussing something productive?

I'm not going to mince words. No one invited conspiracy theorists and far-left socialists into this thread. This thread is about the new Skylake die. Whoever made the connection between die size and the lack of competition from AMD needs to go home with his tail between his legs and be silenced permanently. Why is it that some people think that you can have a Mount Everest of silicon on a CPU without it having side effects pertaining to heat and power consumption? Hello? Are physics different in your universe? I assume that most users here are level-headed and are able to understand why Skylake's die is so small, unlike the nutjob who assumed that pressure from AMD will cause Intel to shit its pants and drop massive amounts of silicon onto every CPU. AMD doesn't even have a goddamned iGPU on the quad-module CMT die and it's so damned big! It ain't Intel's fault that AMD is stuck on 32nm for its "enthusiast" platform and has no plans to go further. Oh wait, it probably is, according to all the conspiracies here. Want more cores? AMD has AM3+, and Intel has LGA2011. There's the door. You know what to do.

Moreover, when Intel was behind in '04-05, they knew that they could not sustain their business by crapping in their pants and adding more stuff on the die, because there were already more than enough heat-generating components on die. Intel's engineers found out the hard way, with Pentium D (as AMD's engineers are experiencing with Bulldozer), that they needed a fresh new design that directly addressed their problems: a terrible pipeline, heat and power consumption. 2011's release of Bulldozer had AMD looking the opposite direction instead; K10 was good, but it could use improvements in the cache speed and size (with Phenom X6, cache was no longer abundant per core), as well as a new process and small improvements elsewhere in the core. AMD's solution? Bulldozer said to K10 "you know what, f**k your problems, I'm going to take a dump all over them so we have to clean up both things later."

Free speech is a beautiful thing. It looks like some idiots are hell bent on pushing it to the boundaries of what common sense allows. The problem with all these random, shitty claims of foul play on Intel's part is that it spreads misinformation, metric tons of shit at a time.

Oh, and what about the guy who created an account here, more or less, for the sole purpose of shitting on this thread, which actually featured some interesting information about Skylake? Are YOU for real? How about you ask yourself the same question before dismissing others over their supposedly flawed political views? Hey, why don't you go and work for AMD? I'm sure they'd like a helping hand in political, conspiratorial bullshit with their upcoming Zen architecture. And color me surprised if you don't end up blaming Intel if Zen doesn't turn out that great.

One doesn't need to be an Intel fanboy to see how AMD has disastrously managed itself over the past few years. They literally sacrificed their CPU division by throwing away K10. That has nothing to do with Intel's shady dealings with OEMs.

*calms down, braces for inevitable shitstorm of incoming ignorance regarding more of how Intel and Intel solely is to be the death of AMD"

 

[rtwjunkie]

Nope, no shitstorm from me.

 

[MxPhenom 216]

I think his name isn't derived from an AMD product, I recall it was about motorbikes, and even if it was so, why would it matter?

This thread is becoming a general nonsense one.

I'm also wearing a double tinfoil helmet (a simple hat would be useless here).

Indeed. Has to do with motocross(MX) and 216 was my number.

Now that thats overwith. @tabascosauz hit the nail on the head. Now lets talk about Delidding, and Skylake.

 

[Agreemenot]

I'm not going to mince words. No one invited conspiracy theorists and far-left socialists into this thread.

There is no conspiracy. If you knew the meaning and origin of Banias, Dothan, Yonah and Merom then you might had understood. That Intel is the largest private-sector employer according to this 2012 article: http://www.zdnet.com/article/israel-inside-a-history-of-intels-r-d-in-israel/ in Israel means that Intel is important for Israel and Israel is important for Intel. So tell me, whats the conspiracy?

Free speech is a beautiful thing. It looks like some idiots are hell bent on pushing it to the boundaries of what common sense allows. The problem with all these random, shitty claims of foul play on Intel's part is that it spreads misinformation, metric tons of shit at a time.

Oh, and what about the guy who created an account here, more or less, for the sole purpose of shitting on this thread, which actually featured some interesting information about Skylake? Are YOU for real? How about you ask yourself the same question before dismissing others over their supposedly flawed political views? Hey, why don't you go and work for AMD? I'm sure they'd like a helping hand in political, conspiratorial bullshit with their upcoming Zen architecture. And color me surprised if you don't end up blaming Intel if Zen doesn't turn out that great.

One doesn't need to be an Intel fanboy to see how AMD has disastrously managed itself over the past few years. They literally sacrificed their CPU division by throwing away K10. That has nothing to do with Intel's shady dealings with OEMs.

Why thank you for your kind words, its just that i dont simply blame AMD for how things have turned out due to some of Intel practices and nor do i disregard other factors that may be involved as well.

There are clear and good reasons to be dissatisfied with Intel, and what it has to offer. Deal with it.

 

[tabascosauz]

There is no conspiracy. If you knew the meaning and origin of Banias, Dothan, Yonah and Merom then you might had understood. That Intel is the largest private-sector employer according to this 2012 article

Hahah. Nice try at trolling.

Banias - Pentium M <------------ Basically the origin of the Core architecture, here the development started to supplement P4 because it was so bad and Intel was getting its ass handed to it by AMD | Hebrew word
Dothan - 2nd gen Pentium M <--------------- 2nd iteration | Hebrew word
Yonah - First Core family, the Core Duos and Core Solos <------------- First appearance of the superior Core over Netburst, the fruits of Intel Israel's labours | Hebrew word?
Merom - Core 2 Duo mobile family, was to mobile as Conroe was to desktop (no shit Sherlock, this thing sitting beside me is called a T7100 and I'm well aware of the family of CPUs to which it belongs) <--------------- Core 2 is released to market, finally ending Pentium 4 | Hebrew word

Big deal. So Intel wanted to kill off Netburst, and Intel Israel did most of the work. What's the problem with honouring the country that turned Intel around by developing out of the old Pentium M? So, you tell me; what's your problem?

Disclaimer: I do not support Israel's political agendas, but I don't see a problem with honouring the work of the Israelis, which paid off with Core 2 after many long years and brought us the architecture that we know of today.

Like I said, why don't you send an email to Lisa Su and tell her about your opinions? I'm sure she'll be happy to hear what you have to say, since you're an extremely important driving factor in the industry. In any case, take your "deal with it" attitude somewhere else. We come here to get our images of the 6700K's die, not to endure you.

It's about time someone came around and locked this thread. There isn't much to be said about Skylake (BORING in itself), which is the topic of the news post, since we know everything already and hardly anything has changed about delidding since Haswell (unless...but that's for another news post). This is going on and on, and this newcomer, who we would've otherwise welcomed, has led this thread off topic for long enough.

 

[Sony Xperia S]

There isn't much to be said about Skylake

You didn't mention a single time how many square mm that thingie is. And I kindly asked you to do so...

and then we are speaking bout attitudes

 

[RCoon]

This thread is about Skylake and delidding. I should thank you to keep the discussion to that, and leave politics, Israel and for some obscure bat-s*** insane reason, leave Jews out of it too. If you want to complain about a business using conspired shady practice, take your opinion to a forum that discusses such things, like GN. While you're at it, you can stop using products from businesses that do such things, which leaves you with, oh, I don't know, the Graze Box company? Enjoy eating your roasted nuts in the forest.

Back to tech. First and last request.

 

[MxPhenom 216]

You didn't mention a single time how many square mm that thingie is. And I kindly asked you to do so...

and then we are speaking bout attitudes

I'm pretty sure a simple google search will give you that information. Not that it matters.

 

[Tatty_Two]

When politics enter any mix on a technical forum a slippery slope usually follows so it stops now, any more and I will not only start deleting posts but I will issue holiday passes...... thank you.