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Motherboard hunting.

eidairaman1

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#76
Erm a mobo change would cost less considering he can get a sli capable board and 2 vc for less than a cpu, Board and 2 vc considering intel fetches a riduculous price for something that only shows perf gain in synth tests but real world isnt better than a Sandybridge chip...
 

de.das.dude

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#77
Maybe its just me, but 2x660 sli would be much better for gaming improvement compare to platform change. Let see 10-20% improvement maybe in some cases because of new cpu+mb. Up to +90% from sli. If your goal is gaming with better fps, i would go sli.
p.s. can u borrow another 660 just to try it?
thats just dreaming dude. you can never get more than 80% sli scaling on a good day. expect 50-70% as an average. also. nvidia cards have their sudden death issue which will mean 2x the chance of failure with SLI.

i bought a sli/crossfire board. but decided single cards are worth way more.

also when you finally upgrade from an sli you will not get back your investment as its already too old or probably broken.
 
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#78
I think changing to a 4690k would probably be best. I just gotta find a AM3+ board to see if my FX-6300 is dead or not.
 
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#79
Any news about that RMA? Asus not accepting it?
 
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#80
Any news about that RMA? Asus not accepting it?
I've gotta go and check up on it. I'll do that now.

EDIT: Nope. It's over the 30-day thing so NewEgg won't RMA it.
 
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#81
thats just dreaming dude. you can never get more than 80% sli scaling on a good day. expect 50-70% as an average..
i had litteraly 100% Sli scaling in many games with 8800gt (crysis 20 one 40+ in sli, cod4 40+ one 70-80+ for sli. ut3 same. world in conflict 90+% ). it was 6 years ago. so please dont tell me they got worse over the years. if scaling is 50-70% something else in the system has an effect. so maybe i got lucky but i had wonderful experience with my sli setup. except for micro stuttrler.
 
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#82
I've gotta go and check up on it. I'll do that now.

EDIT: Nope. It's over the 30-day thing so NewEgg won't RMA it.
Should be able to go to the manufacturer for an RMA then. So you need to open a ticket with Asus.
 

de.das.dude

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#83
i had litteraly 100% Sli scaling in many games with 8800gt (crysis 20 one 40+ in sli, cod4 40+ one 70-80+ for sli. ut3 same. world in conflict 90+% ). it was 6 years ago. so please dont tell me they got worse over the years. if scaling is 50-70% something else in the system has an effect. so maybe i got lucky but i had wonderful experience with my sli setup. except for micro stuttrler.
explain this please
http://www.anandtech.com/show/2365/12

 
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#84
CPU Bottleneck
 
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#85
Well my laptop charger just came in, so no more AIO bs. (Yay)
 
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#86
Okay, so a family friend might be able to get me an i7 for cheap. So now I need a motherboard that'll go with an i7 4770k/4790k with a budget of $125.
 
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#87
"explain this" cpu bottleneck and another reason very early test even before crysis was out. i used my system with e8400@3.8 and about 6-8 month after this review.OP enjoy your new system.
 

de.das.dude

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#88
Yes. In doubt it. You probably haven't heard of an and tech. But their scores are as reliable as can be. Look at the test setup. Its not being bottle necked.
 
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#89
Anandtech make great reviews, but at least for the CoD4 one I am 100% certain it is a CPU bottleneck. The game runs on a single thread and an X6800 is far from great in single thread performance. My 3.2GHz ivy bridge CPU struggles to keep the game running at over 150FPS, so taking into account the older architecture of the CPU used in the benchmarks, and the fact that they don't seem to have overclocked it (so it runs at 2.93GHz) I would be surprised if that is not the bottleneck.

It also coincides with the fact that the lower 3 resolutions tested the SLI setup gives about the same FPS, while the single cards are already falling off slightly.
 

de.das.dude

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#90
i doubt its a CPU bottleneck the core 2 duo extremes were great in their day. if there is something wrong it might be drivers. nothing else. and i doubt a good driver will make a huge difference.

you are comparing mobile CPU with desktop. which are very very different. your mobile CPU never gives peak performance because it is thermally restricted and it keeps throttling down.

and in any case newer cards arent supplied with as good drivers as before. neither are the newer games coded as efficiently.
hence 80% max at best. that too subjected to high resolutions.

since most cards can already play the demanding games at ultra at 1080p for a very reasonable price of around 200$ i dont think SLI is specially useful. not at this time.
 
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#91
During the tests I was running I had the CPU pinned to 3.2GHz and it was not by any means thermally restricted. Maximum temperatures in game were rarely over 65c. The only game I have played that the CPU can't maintain 3.2GHz is BF3, where I have to downclock it to 3.1GHz to avoid a TDP throttling scenario.

The x6800 is a dual core, but since ioquake is single threaded that doens't really make a difference (I think it is safe to assume that there were no background programs eating up CPU time), but given that the architecture has lower IPC than ivy bridge and runs at a lower clock speed than my CPU, on top of the possibility of other restrictions (memory bottlenecking, PCIe, etc) I would not at all be surprised if it is something other than the GPUs that is limiting the SLI (and even the singe card) setups at the lower resolutions.

Now for the OP, I would suggest getting a single card later on (GTX 870 or AMD equivalent) rather than another 660. I don't really see the point in having SLI outside the top end GPUs.

For the board I would suggest spending $15 extra and getting a Z97x-UD3H, Z97x-gaming5, or Z97-A. Even though you are not a big overclocker, it is so easy on Haswell that there is no excuse not to.
 
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#92
"and in any case newer cards arent supplied with as good drivers as before. neither are the newer games coded as efficiently.
hence 80% max at best"
that's a good point. anyway there were few games that liked 3.5Ghz+ on the cpu 3.0 and 3.5+ had some difference.
you backed your point with proof, but that straight line with 2x8800gt surely CPU bottleneck. I think we can finish this, it doesn't really matter as OP decided to go for new platform and our sli debate is not worth it anymore.
 
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#93
If you want to save cash and don't mind losing overclocking, sli, and other features you could go with the cheaper chipsets.
 

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#94
During the tests I was running I had the CPU pinned to 3.2GHz and it was not by any means thermally restricted. Maximum temperatures in game were rarely over 65c. The only game I have played that the CPU can't maintain 3.2GHz is BF3, where I have to downclock it to 3.1GHz to avoid a TDP throttling scenario.

The x6800 is a dual core, but since ioquake is single threaded that doens't really make a difference (I think it is safe to assume that there were no background programs eating up CPU time), but given that the architecture has lower IPC than ivy bridge and runs at a lower clock speed than my CPU, on top of the possibility of other restrictions (memory bottlenecking, PCIe, etc) I would not at all be surprised if it is something other than the GPUs that is limiting the SLI (and even the singe card) setups at the lower resolutions.

Now for the OP, I would suggest getting a single card later on (GTX 870 or AMD equivalent) rather than another 660. I don't really see the point in having SLI outside the top end GPUs.

For the board I would suggest spending $15 extra and getting a Z97x-UD3H, Z97x-gaming5, or Z97-A. Even though you are not a big overclocker, it is so easy on Haswell that there is no excuse not to.
the clocks are straight does not mean that its running at full potential. you can lock a chip to 3GHz and it will only consume full power when it is needed not when its not under load. what happens in laptop is they lay back the load a bit. not just underclock.

also as i mentioned before mobile hardware and desktop hardware cannot be compared.

my laptop too runs a quadcore at 2.4ghz, an a crossfire of 7670m. but comparing that to real 7670 cfx is just foolish. it can only run things in high not ultra.
 
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Motherboard MSI Z97-G55 SLI
Cooling Scythe Mugen 2 rev B (SCMG-2100), stock on gpu's.
Memory 8GB G.SKILL Ripjaws Z Series DDR3 2400MHZ 10-12-12-31
Video Card(s) EVGA GTX 760 Superclocked replaced HIS R9 290 that was artifacting
Storage 1TB MX300 M.2 OS + Games, 4x ST31000524NS in Raid 10 Storage and Backup, external 2tb backup,
Display(s) BenQ GW2255 surprisingly good screen for the price.
Case Raidmax Scorpio 668
Audio Device(s) onboard HD
Power Supply EVGA 750 GQ
Software Windows 10
Benchmark Scores no one cares anymore lols
#95
i doubt its a CPU bottleneck the core 2 duo extremes were great in their day. if there is something wrong it might be drivers. nothing else. and i doubt a good driver will make a huge difference.

you are comparing mobile CPU with desktop. which are very very different. your mobile CPU never gives peak performance because it is thermally restricted and it keeps throttling down.

and in any case newer cards arent supplied with as good drivers as before. neither are the newer games coded as efficiently.
hence 80% max at best. that too subjected to high resolutions.

since most cards can already play the demanding games at ultra at 1080p for a very reasonable price of around 200$ i dont think SLI is specially useful. not at this time.
look at the graph! the 8800gt sli at 1280x1024 is just a few frames higher than 2560x1600! ie it is just barely faster at 1.3 megapixels than it is at 4 megapixels! 3x the pixels to generate!

So yeah at everything up to 2560x1600 a CPU bottleneck is present. This is normal, GPU's have outpaced CPU's ever since the Voodoo, Geforce, and Radeon lines launched. So you would need a newer cpu to go with the older 8800gt sli to avoid a cpu bottleneck. That being said I don't think there is much of one at 2560x1600 at which point the single 8800gt is hovering just above 50 and the sli is hovering just above 80. 60% for unreal, ~ 50% for COD4. Drivers could make up for the difference, but I still think 80% for 8800gt sli would be max. I have seen up to 90% on my GTX 480 sli, but that's several generations more that they've had to refine it.
 
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Benchmark Scores Technical term is PEBCAK issue, which stands for Problem Exists Between Chair And Keyboard
#96
There goes the main topic. :(
 
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Grunn, Holland
System Name Indis the Fair
Processor i7 4790k Delid 4.7@1.28
Motherboard Asus Z97I-PLUS
Cooling Noctua NH-U14S
Memory Kingston HyperX 2x8GB 1866MHz C10
Video Card(s) Evga GTX 670 FTW
Storage MX100 256GB, WD Red 3TB, and other stuff
Display(s) BenQ XL2430T, LG 24 inch LED IPS thing
Case Phanteks Enthoo Pro M
Audio Device(s) Behringer Xenyx Q1002USB, ATH-M50x
Power Supply Seasonic 860w Platinum
Mouse Logitech G502
Keyboard Corsair K70 (MX Blues, dying blue lights)
Software Win7 x64/Ubuntu
#97
the clocks are straight does not mean that its running at full potential. you can lock a chip to 3GHz and it will only consume full power when it is needed not when its not under load. what happens in laptop is they lay back the load a bit. not just underclock.

also as i mentioned before mobile hardware and desktop hardware cannot be compared.

my laptop too runs a quadcore at 2.4ghz, an a crossfire of 7670m. but comparing that to real 7670 cfx is just foolish. it can only run things in high not ultra.
7670m =/= 7670... The same way the GTX 670m is not the same as the desktop 670, They are based on completely different chips.

The CPU performance of my laptop (when it is not throttling) is exactly the same as any other ivy bridge quad core with HT running at 3.2GHz. The way it works is that if there is thermal headroom it will boost from its base clock (2.4) to anywhere up to 3.2GHz. When the CPU is under load and I am not putting a very heavy load (furmark like) on the GPU the CPU runs at 3.2GHz and performs like a 3.2GHz ivy quad with HT. When there is not enough power (for example when I suck up too much power with the overclocked dGPU) the CPU will throttle to where it can fit within the power limits imposed by the BIOS
 
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Benchmark Scores Technical term is PEBCAK issue, which stands for Problem Exists Between Chair And Keyboard
#98
Thread title changed. Have fun.
 
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System Name Mother PC/XSI PC/ Laptop
Processor I3 6100 Skylake@3.7/Intel Core2Duo E8400@3.0-3.7Ghz/Amd sempron 2100+
Motherboard B150M MSI Night ELF/ASUS P5Q PRO P45/
Cooling Cooler Master Hyper Evo 212/ X 2
Memory Kingston HyperX Fury 2x4GB DDR4@2133 Dual channel /Adata 2x2 GB DDR2@800 dual channel/ 2,5GB
Video Card(s) Gigabyte Windforce 950GTX/MSI 8800GT OC Zilent edition@660/1650/950 / ATI Radeon x1250
Storage 1pc:240GB SSD Kingston HyperX Fury/2PC:Intel 330 SSD 60GB/Samsung 500 GB/Samsung 320GB/80 GB
Display(s) LG 22MP58VQ 1920x1080/ Samsung 2232BW - 22" 1680X1050 and LG Full HDTV 50" / 15" 1280x800
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Benchmark Scores later :)
#99
make some decisions: do you need sli/crossfire. plans to OC. other special features. prices going from 100-400$ so less you need cheaper you can get it
 
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make some decisions: do you need sli/crossfire. plans to OC. other special features. prices going from 100-400$ so less you need cheaper you can get it
No SLI/Xfire. Mild OCing. All I need is two PCIx16's and @x16/x4. One for my GPU and one for my sound card. I'll be running an i7 4770k or 4790k.