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New Rig, New Questions

Kwod

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#26
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System Name AMD "Gaming Evolved"
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Cooling CoolerMaster Hyper 212 EVO
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#27
Anyone know the diff between these 2?

Also, the Pro says it has a front USB 3 header, does this mean that I can plug the front USB 3 cable from the Antec 1100 directly to the mobo...?
Otherwise I'd need to buy an additional adapter as Antec only have it as a mobo input.
From what i've read, the difference between the terminologies would be External USB Headers mean they're routed out the I/O Shield at the BACK of your stack, whereas Front or Internal Headers means you can route the cables from within the case, meaning you don't have to have extra long cables to run from your front bezel through the case and out the back and then into the rear, instead you just run them from the Mobo to the front bezel internally :) I could be wrong, but that's the information i've managed to gleam so far.
 
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Storage 1TB Seagate Barracuda / 64GB Crucial M4
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Case Corsair Carbide 300R Windowed
Power Supply Corsair CX600M
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#28
ASUS for motherboards is probably your best choice. Intel boards are excellent too if they still make them. Since ASUS is the dominant motherboard maker and sell the most boards, they will probably have a longer support cycle and there's a bigger community out there when you need help troubleshooting something.

SLI/CF:
1. Great when it actually scales well
2. 2x the cost
3. Almost 2x power consumption
4. Known to be unreliable(drivers). You'll need to wait for drivers to catch up after game comes out.
5. Need to substantially upgrade PSU.
6. Stuttering still an issue
7. 2 GB+ 2GB = 2GB. data is VRAM is duplicated across all the cards.
8. Twice the failure, twice the space, twice the heat
9. Some poorly designed cards can blow heat directly onto each other.
10. Really high synthetic benchmark scores

Conclusion: Unless a 7950 or 670 does not meet your needs, there's no point in doing it.
Thanks again Tokyo, from what i've been looking at so far the ASUS M5A97 Evo is around £80, whilst the ASRock 970 EXTREME 3 is around £70, and can be found sometimes cheaper too, now i've seen a lot of people using the ASRock with Phenom II's whilst the FX series seems to be used more with Gigabyte / MSI / ASUS motherboards, and from what i've read the FX-4170 isn't even a true quad-core! It's a dual with hyper-threading! And that's seriously putting me off of the FX series, which leads me down the road of the Phenom II X4 965, which by all accounts is a beautiful CPU straight off the bat, and i know it'll play modern games as a couple of my friends have them and run the games i wish to play easily.

As for the notion of XFire / SLi, don't worry about that, i won't be doing it :)

Look at my system specs. Everything I have is highly recommended at a great price. Enjoy. :toast:
Thanks Ravenas, although that MSI and other 990FX boards are a little too pricey for my liking despite working 10x better with the FX Series than the 970's, but i'm not actually sold on taking the newer CPU's from AMD over the Phenom II, considering the 4100 / 4300 and all between are physical dual-cores with HT to create a quad, instead of the Phenom's physical quad, i'm seriously considering taking the older CPU because it at the very least matches the performance in real terms of the new FX and is somewhat cheaper too.
 
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#29
Code:
considering the 4100 / 4300 and all between are physical dual-cores with HT to create a quad, instead of the Phenom's physical quad, i'm seriously considering taking the older CPU because it at the very least matches the performance in real terms of the new FX and is somewhat cheaper too.
and from what i've read the FX-4170 isn't even a true quad-core! It's a dual with hyper-threading! And that's seriously putting me off of the FX series
No disrespect. But what have you been reading?

The FX-4170 has four physical cores each with independant cache and shared cache.

Hyperthreading is only a technique, because it's virtual there is no real cores or cache.

It's nothing like hyperthreading.

Granted prior to FX realease, AMD was trying to market it's four REAL cores as a solution to Intels FAKE cores but later back tracked.

which leads me down the road of the Phenom II X4 965, which by all accounts is a beautiful CPU straight off the bat
BTW how much is the Phenom II X4 965 these days? You can pick up an FX-6300 Hexacore is only £25-35 more.
 
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#30
Code:


No disrespect. But what have you been reading?

The FX-4170 has four physical cores each with independant cache and shared cache.

Hyperthreading is only a technique, because it's virtual there is no real cores or cache.

It's nothing like hyperthreading.

Granted prior to FX realease, AMD was trying to market it's four REAL cores as a solution to Intels FAKE cores but later back tracked.



BTW how much is the Phenom II X4 965 these days? You can pick up an FX-6300 Hexacore is only £25-35 more.
Uhhh, Phenom II X4 965 is between £82 and £84 i think, new, from eBay (no other sources of them found as of yet).

To be honest with you, i can't remember where i read it, it was on an overclocking forum from the UK, of that i'm fairly sure.

This is the main problem i'm having, sourcing reliable information and attempting to make decisions off my own back, but if the info i'm finding on my own isn't good, then i'm concerned over making a large mistake such as buying something and finding out i could've gotten something FAR better for the same price / less OR buying the complete and utter wrong item alltogether, hence why i'm here.

I've been watching videos on YouTube aswell, comparing the PII X4 vs the FX4100 and 4170, and as far as i can tell the 4170 consumes more power under load than the Phenom, yet only outperforms it by a mild margin, and the PII still matches the 4100 / beats it in some cases, so i'm trying hard to make an informed and proper decision between CPU's based on it's ability to perform in gaming and general tasking, and it's maximum power under load (to help me choose a sufficient PSU).

In all honesty i suspect the newer CPU to be the better choice for length of service, and power efficiency, but i'm not SURE, and that's why i'm asking for info from those that've done it before me :)
 
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#31
why buy the four core phenom, when you can purchase a six core phenom or fx for a margin extra. Best to shop around, i once saw an 8150 for £105. wish i bought it now!

someone suggested this site to me; http://uk.hardware.info/
 
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#32
I've been watching videos on YouTube aswell, comparing the PII X4 vs the FX4100 and 4170
, and as far as i can tell the 4170 consumes more power under load than the Phenom, yet only outperforms it by a mild margin, and the PII still matches the 4100 / beats it in some cases, so i'm trying hard to make an informed and proper decision between CPU's based on it's ability to perform in gaming and general tasking, and it's maximum power under load (to help me choose a sufficient PSU).
Stop relying on YouTube and read reviews from Tom Hardware, Tech Power Up, Guru of 3D etc.

The FX is always a better choice for overclocking, on air Phenom tops out at around 3.8 - 4.2GHz whereas the FX can hit anywhere from 4.5 - 5GHz.

Also why are you looking at the FX4100 anyways, it's based on the older Bulldozer architecture. If you want quad core you should be looking the FX4300 based on the newer Piledriver architecture.


Uhhh, Phenom II X4 965 is between £82 and £84 i think, new, from eBay (no other sources of them found as of yet).
Makes no sense, £20 more gets you a brand new Piledriver FX 6300 X6.

AMD FX-6300 3.5GHz Socket AM3+ 14MB Cache Retail B...
 
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#33
Uhhh, Phenom II X4 965 is between £82 and £84 i think, new, from eBay (no other sources of them found as of yet).

To be honest with you, i can't remember where i read it, it was on an overclocking forum from the UK, of that i'm fairly sure.

This is the main problem i'm having, sourcing reliable information and attempting to make decisions off my own back, but if the info i'm finding on my own isn't good, then i'm concerned over making a large mistake such as buying something and finding out i could've gotten something FAR better for the same price / less OR buying the complete and utter wrong item alltogether, hence why i'm here.

I've been watching videos on YouTube aswell, comparing the PII X4 vs the FX4100 and 4170, and as far as i can tell the 4170 consumes more power under load than the Phenom, yet only outperforms it by a mild margin, and the PII still matches the 4100 / beats it in some cases, so i'm trying hard to make an informed and proper decision between CPU's based on it's ability to perform in gaming and general tasking, and it's maximum power under load (to help me choose a sufficient PSU).

In all honesty i suspect the newer CPU to be the better choice for length of service, and power efficiency, but i'm not SURE, and that's why i'm asking for info from those that've done it before me :)
FX 4000s series has 2 modules. The new Trinity APUs also use these modules.
each module has 2 integer and 1 floating point processor. It also shares the L2 cache.
The whole chip shares L3 caches.

Intel has hyperthreading and that is mostly software based. AMD is mostly physical cores but still rely on OS scheduler to be used correctly.
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/FX8150/2.html

Intel chips are usually more power efficient since they have a superior process node and technology. They are at least 1 year ahead of everyone in the world when it comes to chip manufacturing. IMO, the lead is more like 1.5-2 years because AMD is still on 32nm and Intel has been on 22nm for a while now.

There are review articles here at techpowerup.com that explains it. You can also visit anandtech.com, techreport.com, etc... There's a ton of sites that will pop up if you search "AMD FX 8350 review"
There's only a few minor tweaks between the 4/6/81xxx and 4/6/83xxx series.

For gaming, I would go at least 6300 series or 8000 series. If you're on a budget and absolutely cannot afford the FX 6/8xxx then get the new A10 or A8 APU. They use the same pile driver module as the FX 4170.

If you plan on keeping your CPU for 3 years without upgrading then go for i5 2xxx or 3xxx. Even a used one will be fine. CPUs seems to be one of the most durable parts unless you're overvolting the snot out of it.

I feel bad for Euro people. Here, I can buy an i5 3570k + Asus z77 board for ~$200
I can also get a FX 8320 + board + 212 cooler for ~200.
 
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#34
I feel bad for Euro people. Here, I can buy an i5 3570k Asus z77 board for ~$200
I can also get a FX 8320 board 212 cooler for ~200.
$200?? in britain we pay £200+ = $300+
an 8320 averages £140 ($210) :nutkick:
 

Kwod

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Video Card(s) Saphire 7950 Vapour X
Storage Samsung 250g 840
Display(s) 26in LCD 1920x1200 8 bit+37in 1080p HDTV
Case Antec 1100
Audio Device(s) Xonar DG+Z5500D
Power Supply Antec 650 Hi current
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#35
This is what I got....

i3570+CM 212 HSF
16 gig 1600 ram
P8Z77 V ASUS
Samsung 840 250 gig SSD
Antec 1100 gaming case.
Antec 650w Platnium plus PSU
Saphire Vapour X 7950 hahahhahaaa

Now I gotta build it!
 
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#36
Where's your HDD?
If you all you have is 250 GB then you will notice a storage problem very soon. I would always leave an SSD at least 30% empty. So you'll probably end up with ~240 GB after formatting and subtract 72 GB. You'll end up with roughly 168GB to use.

Looking through my steam library, I don't see any games under 10 GB and most being around 15-30GB overall. I have 10 games that took up about 170 GB.
So windows + 10 games + Office + browsers/small apps/pics/video/etc... I am already over 300 GB. Just giving you a heads up on what to anticipate.
 

Kwod

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#37
Where's your HDD?
.
What I want is one 4t internal, but they're way too hexy atm.
I've got quite a bit of free space on my externals though, so they'll have to act as my slaves:nutkick:
 
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#38
What I want is one 4t internal, but they're way too hexy atm.
I've got quite a bit of free space on my externals though, so they'll have to act as my slaves:nutkick:
haha I wouldn't count on 4TB to be affordable any time soon. Economically speaking, supply is low and demand is low. Their real demand is in servers. Consumers are content at the 2 TB range at the moment. With the movement towards mobile devices and cloud storage, there is little demand for large consumer drives.

I think you will see a 4TB drives becoming affordable after 4HD is the new standard.
 

Kwod

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#39
I think you will see a 4TB drives becoming affordable after 4HD is the new standard.
Then I'll have to bite the bullet and buy one at some point, I also want a 4t external so I can rid myself of all the annoying 2t hanging around my PC:toast:

Anyway, I'm typing this on my new PC, but just started with intel GPU{saphire not installed yet}
CPU temps are all less than 30c using the CM 212.
I got 195gig left on Samsung 840.

Now the exciting process of reinstalling a bunch of stuff{not!!}
 
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#40
Don't worry. Installing everything on your new processor and SSD should be a breeze. At least it was for me :)

I'm jelly of your 840. I saw one for $150 last week. I really wanted to buy it but I seriously don't need a 3rd HD. I think when 500 GB SSD, I will pick up 2 and have it replace my velociraptor. Or maybe velociraptor will have a hybrid drive by then.
 

Kwod

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#41
Damn, some crazy speed back here, over a 100 windows updates took seconds as a reboot!!!!
 

Kwod

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#42
Don't worry. Installing everything on your new processor and SSD should be a breeze. At least it was for me :)

I'm jelly of your 840. I saw one for $150 last week. I really wanted to buy it but I seriously don't need a 3rd HD. I think when 500 GB SSD, I will pick up 2 and have it replace my velociraptor. Or maybe velociraptor will have a hybrid drive by then.
Oh yes, 240/250g suck for size, but if I'm going for 500gig I want the pro model and that's like $540.

http://www.umart.com.au/pro/products_listnew.phtml?id=10&id2=159&bid=2&sid=99788

heh, look at this 800 gig SSD, I should've ponied up for it.
 
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#43
Now you will have new problems. If you have anything set to auto login, it may give you log in fail errors. Your windows will load faster than your wifi/lan can connect so apps throws these errors left and right. It pisses me off everyday enough that I exclude them all from my start up.
 

Kwod

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#44
Now you will have new problems.
I tried to count how long it took to install Malwarebytes, and granted it's not a huge program, but I couldn't even count to one second, it was done!!
Btw, what's the best codec pack to use for W7 64b....?{Home premium}
 
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#45
I used VLC and that's it. I do mostly streaming so I don't really get into players that much. I'm also converted to W8 pro now.

Why aren't you using W7 ultimate?
 

Kwod

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#46
I used VLC and that's it. I do mostly streaming so I don't really get into players that much. I'm also converted to W8 pro now.

Why aren't you using W7 ultimate?
I had a OEM of W7 64 HP from my 2010 update.
I also like VLC, it seems to have some excellent default settings for most stuff.
Oddly enough, I can get youtube to play with IE8/9, but not with Chrome......weird:wtf:
 
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#47
youtube should play with chrome. I think youtube uses flash so update that.
I don't have any players right now besides windows media player on my computer after W8 upgrade or "downgrade". Youtube and chrome behaves perfectly for me.
 

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#48
youtube should play with chrome. I think youtube uses flash so update that.
.

I got 7.6 on my windows performance index, with the lowest score being the CPU at 7.6, but everything else was 7.9{except ram at 7.8}.

I think my old system was 5.1, lol.

Actually, we have nearly the same system, other than GPU.

EDIT: installing dedicated GPU fixed it.
 
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Storage 1 TB Velociraptor, 240GB 840 Samsung
Display(s) 27" Samsung LED X 2
Case Thermaltake V9
Power Supply Seasonic 620 W, CX600M on stand by
Software Win 8.1 64
Benchmark Scores Benches are silly
#49
Your system is a bit faster than mine. I just hate how you guys get robbed in Aussie land when it comes to parts. Europe too but probably not as bad.
 

Kwod

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System Name Crysis 3
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#50
Your system is a bit faster than mine. I just hate how you guys get robbed in Aussie land when it comes to parts. Europe too but probably not as bad.
Maybe, but gone are the days of $6000 PC's that slowed to a crawl in 2yrs.
I upgraded my 2008 system in 2011, but it blew up a few weeks ago, so I'm back with a proper upgrade:rockout:

I was just playing a PC demo....CPU's didn't get above 44c and GPU barely got above 50c in 24c room temps, so can't imagine I'll have to worry about cooling even in the height of summer{30-35c}.

What a joke Intel's IGPU was....HD4000 on the K model Ivy's might be better, but nothing beats a dedicated GPU.