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Problems with getting stable 3800mhz RAM with Ryzen 3900X and timings to check

Gegu

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Hello.

The platform I have is:

- Ryzen 3900X (chip from this year, bought few months ago) undervolted by - 0.1V
- ASUS Crosshair VIII Hero WiFi motherboard with the latest bios
- RAM DDR4 32GB (4x8GB) G.Skill Tridentz Neo 3800mhz CL14 1.5V

I have problems with maintaining stability on 3800mhz memory clock. Well, sometimes the PC boots properly with the XMP profile turned on (but always the second time it turns on, rarely the second time), and sometimes it tries to turn on several times, but eventually it doesn't turn on with the XMP profile and then the RAM has 2133mhz clocking.

Memory voltage according to XMP profile is 1.5V. However, the motherboard registers 1.496V at this value, so I have to set the memory to 1.51V for the motherboard to register the full 1.5V

For the XMP profile to work sometimes I have to set the FCLK value in bios manually to 1900mhz - setting the auto option causes pc to have even more problems with boot.

If I can already boot a PC with XMP profile enabled, then Infinity Fabric works well in 1:1 mode.

After reducing the memory clock to 3733mhz and setting the FCLK manually to 1866mhz everything works very well - the computer boots immediately, there are no problems and the memory always works.

Do you have any idea what I could do with these memories to make them work well with XMP profile turned on? Maybe some options in BIOS? Or am I just not lucky and my chip is not stable at IF 1900mhz?

By the way, I'm asking you to judge the timings - I've been reducing it based on DRAM Calculator and some knowledge from the Internet, but I don't know about it and maybe there are some values to correct.
 

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Tatty_One

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What are your VCCSA and VCCIO set at? Some boards just don't play as nice with all 4 RAM slots populated, if those voltages are set at auto in the Bios sometimes manually tweaking them upwards a little can help, if they are auto the Bios should tell you what voltage it is actually giving them...……. however for 24/7 operation you should try to stay under 1.25v …. well I do!
 

Gegu

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What are your VCCSA and VCCIO set at? Some boards just don't play as nice with all 4 RAM slots populated, if those voltages are set at auto in the Bios sometimes manually tweaking them upwards a little can help, if they are auto the Bios should tell you what voltage it is actually giving them...……. however for 24/7 operation you should try to stay under 1.25v …. well I do!
thanks for help - i will check it and try change if they are on auto
 

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If you feel that it is the Infinity Fabric causing the issue, manually set it to 1600 and see if the RAM runs without issue.

Also, if it wont run with XMP, it is highly unlikely that lowering the timings is going to magically fix things (IE the screenshot of 14-13-13 timings).

I believe what you are looking for from @Tatty_One is called SOC.
 

Gegu

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If you feel that it is the Infinity Fabric causing the issue, manually set it to 1600 and see if the RAM runs without issue.

Also, if it wont run with XMP, it is highly unlikely that lowering the timings is going to magically fix things (IE the screenshot of 14-13-13 timings).

I believe what you are looking for from @Tatty_One is called SOC.
I set it to 1833 and it is running without issue, only 1900 1:1 IF is causing boot problems - sometimes is booting with XMP and working, sometimes not. I tightened timings not for fixing it, only for fun :)
 

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I set it to 1833 and it is running without issue, only 1900 1:1 IF is causing boot problems - sometimes is booting with XMP and working, sometimes not. I tightened timings not for fixing it, only for fun :)
Seems like you have your answer already then. With my 3900X I do not have to change anything to get 1900 IF stable. And I am on the same motherboard. I would hazard to guess you may be banging your head against a hard wall trying to get 1:1 at that speed.

You do realize that you can also set 3200MHz ram speed, and then try to test the IF on its own to see where it tops out? They do not have to be linked to test to see if they run.
 
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Gegu

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What are your VCCSA and VCCIO set at? Some boards just don't play as nice with all 4 RAM slots populated, if those voltages are set at auto in the Bios sometimes manually tweaking them upwards a little can help, if they are auto the Bios should tell you what voltage it is actually giving them...……. however for 24/7 operation you should try to stay under 1.25v …. well I do!
Do you mean both VDDP voltage options? I cant find in bios anything named VCCSA and VCCIO
 

sneekypeet

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Do you mean both VDDP voltage options? I cant find in bios anything named VCCSA and VCCIO
See the end of post #4 ;)
 

sneekypeet

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Yea, right :) But isnt SOC related somehow to CPU?
yep...

"SOC voltage is what drives all of the System on Chip devices, such as the I/O controller, Memory controller, etc. When you are overclocking you should set SOC to 1.1v, and you can increase that voltage up to 1.2v or 1.25v depending on who you listen too (AMD has not released any guidance around max SOC voltage)."

^^ borrowed from reddit.
 

Gegu

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yep...

"SOC voltage is what drives all of the System on Chip devices, such as the I/O controller, Memory controller, etc. When you are overclocking you should set SOC to 1.1v, and you can increase that voltage up to 1.2v or 1.25v depending on who you listen too (AMD has not released any guidance around max SOC voltage)."

^^ borrowed from reddit.
Thank you for answer, im bad in OC so im asking :)
 
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If 3733 work well I would stick with that, there is very little gain from 3733 to 3800. 1.5V is a bit on the high end on the ram. As for timings, why not use the fast preset i dram calc and tune further? Some of your timings now are far from optimal speedwise. tRRDS and tRRDL should be 4 if possible. tFAW is derived from tRRDS and is always tRRDS x 4, minimum effective value is 16. tWR should be 10-12.
 

Tatty_One

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Do you mean both VDDP voltage options? I cant find in bios anything named VCCSA and VCCIO
Yeah apologies, I was talking in Intel speak :)
 

Gegu

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Yeah apologies, I was talking in Intel speak :)
Thanks - I tried changing SOC voltage, but it didnt help. What voltage for both VDDP options would you recommend for better RAM stability?

If 3733 work well I would stick with that, there is very little gain from 3733 to 3800. 1.5V is a bit on the high end on the ram. As for timings, why not use the fast preset i dram calc and tune further? Some of your timings now are far from optimal speedwise. tRRDS and tRRDL should be 4 if possible. tFAW is derived from tRRDS and is always tRRDS x 4, minimum effective value is 16. tWR should be 10-12.
Thanks, ill aplly that
 

Tatty_One

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Thanks - I tried changing SOC voltage, but it didnt help. What voltage for both VDDP options would you recommend for better RAM stability?


Thanks, ill aplly that
What is auto setting them to?
 

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What is auto setting them to?
SOC should be like 1.08v. Never needed more than 1.18v on my C8H, but my IF can run 1900 without the need to bump it. This is why I feel the OP hit a hard wall, and that lowering ram for 1:1 without dropping the IOH to half its speed in the attempt might be the better solution as taraquin put in his post.
 

Gegu

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Yeah apologies, I was talking in Intel speak :)
Unfortunatelly uppering this values didnt make my RAM run on 3800mhz - ive tried many settings. I think that ill stay with 3733, its not bad to be honest
 

Sround14

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Hello.

The platform I have is:

- Ryzen 3900X (chip from this year, bought few months ago) undervolted by - 0.1V
- ASUS Crosshair VIII Hero WiFi motherboard with the latest bios
- RAM DDR4 32GB (4x8GB) G.Skill Tridentz Neo 3800mhz CL14 1.5V

I have problems with maintaining stability on 3800mhz memory clock. Well, sometimes the PC boots properly with the XMP profile turned on (but always the second time it turns on, rarely the second time), and sometimes it tries to turn on several times, but eventually it doesn't turn on with the XMP profile and then the RAM has 2133mhz clocking.

Memory voltage according to XMP profile is 1.5V. However, the motherboard registers 1.496V at this value, so I have to set the memory to 1.51V for the motherboard to register the full 1.5V

For the XMP profile to work sometimes I have to set the FCLK value in bios manually to 1900mhz - setting the auto option causes pc to have even more problems with boot.

If I can already boot a PC with XMP profile enabled, then Infinity Fabric works well in 1:1 mode.

After reducing the memory clock to 3733mhz and setting the FCLK manually to 1866mhz everything works very well - the computer boots immediately, there are no problems and the memory always works.

Do you have any idea what I could do with these memories to make them work well with XMP profile turned on? Maybe some options in BIOS? Or am I just not lucky and my chip is not stable at IF 1900mhz?

By the way, I'm asking you to judge the timings - I've been reducing it based on DRAM Calculator and some knowledge from the Internet, but I don't know about it and maybe there are some values to correct.
Hi, I feel your pain . Not sure if you can help me as I have the same/similiar issue. I have the crosshair hero viii but standard version none wifi and everything was running fine until I did the latest bios update to 2206. I had some crucial ballistix 3600mhz and docp was enabled and working great. After the bios update I could not get this to run at all and just thought it was something to do with the ram so decided to upgrade to the same g.skill 3800mhz cl14 that you have. If I enable docp it just throws a fit and get a black screen. It did launch once, the firsttime but after that it stopped so had to reset bios. I can only seem to get this machine to boot at the bog standard 2133mhz. I dont suppose you can send the screenshots of how you have it setup to run at 3733mhz at 1:1. I have the same 3900x cpu as well and rtx 2080ti gaming z card. I am a complete noob at this but want a real competitive machine. But I am just completely stuck on getting ram to work at a decent speed on this board with the latest bios update. Wish Id just left it at the original bios version which it was out of the box.

Hi, I feel your pain . Not sure if you can help me as I have the same/similiar issue. I have the crosshair hero viii but standard version none wifi and everything was running fine until I did the latest bios update to 2206. I had some crucial ballistix 3600mhz and docp was enabled and working great. After the bios update I could not get this to run at all and just thought it was something to do with the ram so decided to upgrade to the same g.skill 3800mhz cl14 that you have. If I enable docp it just throws a fit and get a black screen. It did launch once, the firsttime but after that it stopped so had to reset bios. I can only seem to get this machine to boot at the bog standard 2133mhz. I dont suppose you can send the screenshots of how you have it setup to run at 3733mhz at 1:1. I have the same 3900x cpu as well and rtx 2080ti gaming z card. I am a complete noob at this but want a real competitive machine. But I am just completely stuck on getting ram to work at a decent speed on this board with the latest bios update. Wish Id just left it at the original bios version which it was out of the box.
And I just have 16gb to sticks not the 32gb like you have
 

Gegu

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Hi, I feel your pain . Not sure if you can help me as I have the same/similiar issue. I have the crosshair hero viii but standard version none wifi and everything was running fine until I did the latest bios update to 2206. I had some crucial ballistix 3600mhz and docp was enabled and working great. After the bios update I could not get this to run at all and just thought it was something to do with the ram so decided to upgrade to the same g.skill 3800mhz cl14 that you have. If I enable docp it just throws a fit and get a black screen. It did launch once, the firsttime but after that it stopped so had to reset bios. I can only seem to get this machine to boot at the bog standard 2133mhz. I dont suppose you can send the screenshots of how you have it setup to run at 3733mhz at 1:1. I have the same 3900x cpu as well and rtx 2080ti gaming z card. I am a complete noob at this but want a real competitive machine. But I am just completely stuck on getting ram to work at a decent speed on this board with the latest bios update. Wish Id just left it at the original bios version which it was out of the box.


And I just have 16gb to sticks not the 32gb like you have

Hi, I'll try to help you :)

First of all - Try to set the XMP (DOCP) profile for RAM in the bios, but set the FCLK (an option in the extreme tweaker in the bios tab) manually to 1900mhz and see if it boots without problems. If so, you can start checking if the IF works in 1:1 mode (e.g. in CPU-Z checking North Bridge frequency (should be 1900mhz), or in Ryzen Master checking if Coupled Mode is on).

If the XMP profile is enabled and the FCLK 1900mhz pc does not boot, you have 2 options:

- the first one: you downgrade the bios to the last stable version, i.e. (probably) 2103, and then you check if the pc will boot on according to the instructions given above

- Second: Instead of enabling the DOCP (XMP) profile, you set it to Manually. Then you select the 3733 mhz frequency and set the FCLK manually to 1866 mhz. When setting manually, you must also change the voltages in the DRAM voltage section to 1.5V (or 1.51V for full 1.5V). You check if the computer boots - if it does, then you check if the IF works in 1:1. If it works in 1:1, you go back to bios and change the timings. Because the timings from the manual option are very weak. You can try mine from the screenshot, they are very optimized timings. The only thing you can change is to set tRFC for 260-70 instead of 250 - 250 is a stability limit where it doesn't show errors yet.

Even if it only works in 3733mhz you have nothing to worry about, the difference between 3733 and 3800 with these delays is maybe 1 frame per second in games. Nothing that can be noticed.
 

Sround14

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Hi, I'll try to help you :)

First of all - Try to set the XMP (DOCP) profile for RAM in the bios, but set the FCLK (an option in the extreme tweaker in the bios tab) manually to 1900mhz and see if it boots without problems. If so, you can start checking if the IF works in 1:1 mode (e.g. in CPU-Z checking North Bridge frequency (should be 1900mhz), or in Ryzen Master checking if Coupled Mode is on).

If the XMP profile is enabled and the FCLK 1900mhz pc does not boot, you have 2 options:

- the first one: you downgrade the bios to the last stable version, i.e. (probably) 2103, and then you check if the pc will boot on according to the instructions given above

- Second: Instead of enabling the DOCP (XMP) profile, you set it to Manually. Then you select the 3733 mhz frequency and set the FCLK manually to 1866 mhz. When setting manually, you must also change the voltages in the DRAM voltage section to 1.5V (or 1.51V for full 1.5V). You check if the computer boots - if it does, then you check if the IF works in 1:1. If it works in 1:1, you go back to bios and change the timings. Because the timings from the manual option are very weak. You can try mine from the screenshot, they are very optimized timings. The only thing you can change is to set tRFC for 260-70 instead of 250 - 250 is a stability limit where it doesn't show errors yet.

Even if it only works in 3733mhz you have nothing to worry about, the difference between 3733 and 3800 with these delays is maybe 1 frame per second in games. Nothing that can be noticed.
Thanks for getting back so quickly. I had a right game with this last night. The best I can achieve is turning on xmp/docp and setting the values to dram =3533 and FCLK to 1766. Not ideal but atleast its something. As soon as I set it to 3600mhz it fails to boot. I tried rolling back Bios and it would only let me go back to the previous update, If I tried the one before that or any further back it just said it wasn't a proper bios but its the ones from the asus download site. I have also logged a call with asus. Not sure if anyone has had success with them or I'm wasting my time. Below is some images of how it is currently setup.
 
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From a quick glange at your timings (outside of likely needing more voltage somewhere) your TRFC seems suspect. 250 is really low, try something in the 300 range.
 

Pieruzan

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I have a Ryzen 3700x with aorus elite x570, I have been chasing 1900 IF 1: 1 stable memory clock for months but without success, it was stable at 3733 unstable at 3800, I tried them all, until, by chance, I disabled the spread spectrum, from that moment the ram at 3800 is stable.
I don't know if it can help you.
 

Gegu

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I have a Ryzen 3700x with aorus elite x570, I have been chasing 1900 IF 1: 1 stable memory clock for months but without success, it was stable at 3733 unstable at 3800, I tried them all, until, by chance, I disabled the spread spectrum, from that moment the ram at 3800 is stable.
I don't know if it can help you.
What is spread spectrum?
 

Gegu

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an option, active by default, created to limit magnetic interference but which can also make RAM overclock unstable
Which tab in bios contain it?

I think i solved my problem :) I had to change ProcODT ohms to 36.9 and raise DRAM voltage to 1.53 (default for this b-die kit is 1.5) and now system is booting all the time with IF 1:1 with tightened timings :)
 
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