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PSU Guide

panchoman

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okay, aux. psu up.
 

Wile E

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okay, aux. psu up.
Looking good. Couple of notes. Most people run a 12v aux psu for TECs, as most TECs used in computers, are designed to operate in the 12-15v range. Note: that's most, but not all. Mine is rated for 12v, but will run happily at 14v. You should probably mention that somewhere along the lines.

Also wanted to add that you could use a 12v Mean Well to power a gfx card, if you desired. It is a switching psu with pfc. You would just have to make your own PCIe lead. (Plus all the other fabrication associated with running one) You could easily buy one of those molex to PCIe adapters, and cut the molex connectors off, and use that to hook to the card and the psu.
 

panchoman

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Looking good. Couple of notes. Most people run a 12v aux psu for TECs, as most TECs used in computers, are designed to operate in the 12-15v range. Note: that's most, but not all. Mine is rated for 12v, but will run happily at 14v. You should probably mention that somewhere along the lines.

Also wanted to add that you could use a 12v Mean Well to power a gfx card, if you desired. It is a switching psu with pfc. You would just have to make your own PCIe lead. (Plus all the other fabrication associated with running one) You could easily buy one of those molex to PCIe adapters, and cut the molex connectors off, and use that to hook to the card and the psu.
oh okay, i'll edit it in a bit, i didn't know i the mean well would power the cards or not, i know like the itx psu's that are built for that can, but wasn't sure bout the mean well.

thanks for the update. you're already on the list of contributors btw.
 

panchoman

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okay, aux psu stuff updated wile e, finally got around to updating it, the rest of the guide i think will be updated on monday, have the day off so.
 
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is cooler master a good brand of PSU? I'd like to get the 600W iGreen for my new rig.
 
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im looking for reccomendations on a new psu. ive currently got a powerstream 520 but id like to upgrade to something a little more powerfull as ill be adding an extra pump and more fans and quite possibly a x1950. ive been trying to find a powerstream 620 but i cant find one, im looking for something with a SINGLE 12v rail NOT 2,3 or 4 12v rails i dont need them and i think that 1 12v rail is more stable than multiples. ive already got 33a? on the 12v so itll have to be higher than that.

seems like all i can find are multi-rail psu's

thanx TPU!
:toast:
 

KennyT772

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There is a reason you can pretty much only find multi-rail psus, its part of the ATX12v spec. Find something with 45a combined. There are a variety of 600w and 650w units that will provide that, check the first page of the thread for some options.

Not to insult you but what you think about rails is wrong. There is no difference in stability, power output, or general quality of power. If you read my information on this thread you will see that. Running a single rail psu is a lot like having a home with no breaker box, just a master breaker. With no individual breakers and you overload a wire theres nothing to stop it. Now if you have a breakers for everything, you set a maximum current over those wires. Just a safety precaution. Change your mind?
 
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what do i look like a LAMB? :laugh:

NO you didnt change my mind. thnx 4 trying. :slap:

"not to insult you but what you think about rails is wrong" i dont think so.

just because i ask advice on what to buy doesnt mean that i dont know what im buying. you bump your head lately? and NO i will not sit here and have a flamewar with you. my e-penis is lrg enough already.

SPECIFICALLY IM LOOKING FOR A SINGLE 12V RAIL PSU WITH GOOD EFFICIENCY AND MORE THAN 33a @ 12v. THNX.

i dont need or want a multi rail psu.

thnx TPU!

heres another GOOD psu guide http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/showthread.php?t=136602

:toast:
 
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Wile E

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what do i look like a LAMB? :laugh:

NO you didnt change my mind. thnx 4 trying. :slap:

"not to insult you but what you think about rails is wrong" i dont think so.

just because i ask advice on what to buy doesnt mean that i dont know what im buying. you bump your head lately? and NO i will not sit here and have a flamewar with you. my e-penis is lrg enough already.

SPECIFICALLY IM LOOKING FOR A SINGLE 12V RAIL PSU WITH GOOD EFFICIENCY AND MORE THAN 33a @ 12v. THNX.

i dont need or want a multi rail psu.

thnx TPU!

heres another GOOD psu guide http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/showthread.php?t=136602

:toast:
I won't go into the single vs multi debate, there's no definitive evidence for either being better, but I will make a couple recommendations that are seemingly against your wishes, but trust me, they are not.

Corsair 520 and 620 HX. They're listed as multi rail, but they actually are not. They are split "after the fact". Even if it was a true multi rail, there's no OC protection on the rails, so all power will go thru one rail if you desire. I have the 620, and I would recommend it to absolutely anyone that doesn't need more power than that. 50A on the 12v, 40A for the 520.

Here's Jonny Guru's review. http://www.jonnyguru.com/review_details.php?id=32

Make sure to read the addendum.
 
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I wont go into the single vs multi debate. Corsair 520 and 620 HX. They're listed as multi rail, but they actually are not.
so dont. i am well aware that these psu's operate on a single 12v rail IF they do not detect devices attached to +12v2/+12v3. however i think these are equvalent to my current psu as its been stated that OCZ underrated the powerstream series. what good is a psu with no OC protection? good reccomendation.
 

Wile E

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what good is a psu with no OC protection? good reccomendation.
Because it behaves as a single rail. And on these psus, they do not suffer from adverse effects from loading 1 rail more than 18A. Did you read the Jonny Guru review of it?
 

Namslas90

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Because it behaves as a single rail. And on these psus, they do not suffer from adverse effects from loading 1 rail more than 18A. Did you read the Jonny Guru review of it?
to be honest i stopped reading your post when i saw that YOU were reccomending a psu with no over current protection.

reviews from web partners ARE USELESS i want real peoples opinions not an opinion formed by a paycheque. thnx

thnx namslas90 are you using either of these?

my budget is $100-$150
 

KennyT772

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Then take mine. Do you even know what rails do in a power supply? They are the over current protection. You should under no circumstance be able to load say a PCI-E 6pin + a string of molex connectors over 18a, if you do, you have a serious problem on your hands. Rails are simply overcurrent protection placed over a set of 12v wires to prevent melting wires and frying components.

You are the one asking for no over current protection. Do not say we are telling you to get one without OC protection when you do not even understand what you are referring to.
 

Namslas90

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...thnx namslas90 are you using either of these?

my budget is $100-$150
No, I'm a Enermax fanboy, too much for your budget. Both are reputable manufacturers.
 

Wile E

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to be honest i stopped reading your post when i saw that YOU were reccomending a psu with no over current protection.

reviews from web partners ARE USELESS i want real peoples opinions not an opinion formed by a paycheque. thnx
Hahahahaha. An opinion formed by a paycheck? Wow. OK, whatever man. Don't trust the review then, but JonnyGuru never did me, or anyone else I know, wrong.

I recommend the Corsair so much due to my personal experience with it, and just use JonnyGuru as a good reference on it.

As far as no OC protection, that's not to say it doesn't have overload protection, it will just let you load any of the 12v "rails" beyond the supposed 18A limit, so long as you don't exceed it's overall rated output. And it handles that load on one "rail" with ease. If you exceed the unit's rated output, it still shuts down. OC protection is only for the rails on a multi rail psu.

Either way, those are my recommendations. If you don't like them, that's fine, but they do what you are after in terms of being high quality, and they're still a single rail, whether you would like to believe it or not.
 
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panchoman

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is cooler master a good brand of PSU? I'd like to get the 600W iGreen for my new rig.
its a decent psu, but i'd recommend somehting else.. perhaps a cheap ocz 600w instead? perhaps silerstone?
 

panchoman

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please no more multi rail or single psu debate. we've had enough of it. everything is marketing bs. heres the facts:

a multi rail psu has its load divided over multiple wires "or rails" to prevent over loading the wires

theres no true multi rail psu. all psu's out there have only 1 transformer

you can bridge points on a multi rail psu and make it run as a single rail, you will hardly notice a difference other then maybe overloaded wires, etc.

generally multi rail psus tend to be cheaper because they use lower quality wires which are not built to carry the whole load of the psu as opposed to the single rail psu's

with multi rail psus, theres a great possibility most of the time that it will not take out the whole system because the dangerous voltage spike will probably not happen across all rails.

multi rail psus cannot reroute the voltage all onto a single rail because each is rail capped. this means that you cannot really run high amp requiring things (excluding grafix cards) such as tecs, compressors, etc. this is the only advantage of single rail psu's

most high wattage psu's are multi rail


i stopped reading this after the multi rail vs. single rail stuff started. go back a few pages and READ rather then go through this again.

edit: one more hting, just read a few lines from that link.

however Dual Rail PSU's that follow the specs can not power highend SLI systems.
COMPLETE BS. THERE ARE MANY DUAL RAIL PSU'S THAT HAPPEND TO BE CERTIFIED BY NVIDIA TO RUN SLI. i refuse to accept any more of that article since it still contains factual errors and does not provide valid info
 

KennyT772

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kenny read this please http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/showthread.php?t=136602

wile e i knew about the corsairs already. thnx for your vote.

no i dont trust reviews from anyone thats paid to do it. sorry.
The link you posted only applies to multi transformer units, aka 1000w and up units. Good try proving me wrong, but their post does not include any design breakdowns of various units and descriptions of where dual transformer and multi rail are different. Having two transformers is the one and only way you can have voltages more than +/-.1v of each other.

Plain and simple rails are nothing more than a safety feature, they do not affect performance. Do not confuse this with multi transformers. Know the product you are buying, read reviews. Even if you don't trust the numbers that are given by the review, learn how the unit was assembled, look at the diagrams, the rail outputs. Example being my OCZ700w. I can tell you which cable is placed on which rail, that way I can evenly load the unit. Ignorance with computers is nothing more than stupidity.


Edit - Pancho

There are many dual transformer power supplies today. Most 1000w and up units are currently dual transformer, as a single cannot handle all of the current.


http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTM4MywzLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==

Example of a triple transformer unit, notice the extremely long case. Currently very very few multi-transformer units can fit inside of the standard ATX psu form factor. I have yet to see or read of one but I'm guessing there is one or two in existance.
The only larger than spec units will be multi-transformer, and even then most are in the form of a single 12v transformer plus a second for the other currents, 3.3v, 5v, -12v, 5vsb, etc.
 
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panchoman

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Processor Amd Athlon X2 4600+ Windsor(90nm) EE(65W) @2.9-3.0 @1.45
Motherboard Biostar Tforce [Nvidia] 550
Cooling Thermaltake Blue Orb-- bunch of other fans here and there....
Memory 2 gigs (2x1gb) of patriot ddr2 800 @ 4-4-4-12-2t
Video Card(s) Sapphire X1950pro Pci-E x16 @stock@stock on stock
Storage Seagate 7200.11 250gb Drive, WD raptors (30/40) in Raid 0
Display(s) ANCIENT 15" sony lcd, bought it when it was like 500 bucks
Case Apevia X-plorer blue/black
Audio Device(s) Onboard- Why get an sound card when you can hum??
Power Supply Antec NeoHe 550-manufactured by seasonic -replacement to the discontinued smart power series
Software Windows XP pro SP2 -- vista is still crap
The link you posted only applies to multi transformer units, aka 1000w and up units. Good try proving me wrong, but their post does not include any design breakdowns of various units and descriptions of where dual transformer and multi rail are different. Having two transformers is the one and only way you can have voltages more than +/-.1v of each other.

Plain and simple rails are nothing more than a safety feature, they do not affect performance. Do not confuse this with multi transformers. Know the product you are buying, read reviews. Even if you don't trust the numbers that are given by the review, learn how the unit was assembled, look at the diagrams, the rail outputs. Example being my OCZ700w. I can tell you which cable is placed on which rail, that way I can evenly load the unit. Ignorance with computers is nothing more than stupidity.
there have multi transformer units know? this sooo explains why thermaltake psu's are like freaking double the size of a standard psu. and you can check the multi transformity of your psu by checking the voltage on 2 leads.
 

KennyT772

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Video Card(s) XFX 9600GT
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Audio Device(s) Creative X-Fi Extreme Gamer Faitality
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Read my edited post.
 

panchoman

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Processor Amd Athlon X2 4600+ Windsor(90nm) EE(65W) @2.9-3.0 @1.45
Motherboard Biostar Tforce [Nvidia] 550
Cooling Thermaltake Blue Orb-- bunch of other fans here and there....
Memory 2 gigs (2x1gb) of patriot ddr2 800 @ 4-4-4-12-2t
Video Card(s) Sapphire X1950pro Pci-E x16 @stock@stock on stock
Storage Seagate 7200.11 250gb Drive, WD raptors (30/40) in Raid 0
Display(s) ANCIENT 15" sony lcd, bought it when it was like 500 bucks
Case Apevia X-plorer blue/black
Audio Device(s) Onboard- Why get an sound card when you can hum??
Power Supply Antec NeoHe 550-manufactured by seasonic -replacement to the discontinued smart power series
Software Windows XP pro SP2 -- vista is still crap
The link you posted only applies to multi transformer units, aka 1000w and up units. Good try proving me wrong, but their post does not include any design breakdowns of various units and descriptions of where dual transformer and multi rail are different. Having two transformers is the one and only way you can have voltages more than +/-.1v of each other.

Plain and simple rails are nothing more than a safety feature, they do not affect performance. Do not confuse this with multi transformers. Know the product you are buying, read reviews. Even if you don't trust the numbers that are given by the review, learn how the unit was assembled, look at the diagrams, the rail outputs. Example being my OCZ700w. I can tell you which cable is placed on which rail, that way I can evenly load the unit. Ignorance with computers is nothing more than stupidity.


Edit - Pancho

There are many dual transformer power supplies today. Most 1000w and up units are currently dual transformer, as a single cannot handle all of the current.


http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTM4MywzLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==

Example of a triple transformer unit, notice the extremely long case. Currently very very few multi-transformer units can fit inside of the standard ATX psu form factor. I have yet to see or read of one but I'm guessing there is one or two in existance.
The only larger than spec units will be multi-transformer, and even then most are in the form of a single 12v transformer plus a second for the other currents, 3.3v, 5v, -12v, 5vsb, etc.
i c, having a 12v transformer and a 3v-5v transformer seems a lot more sensible, i supposs thats what thermaltake psu's are. they're dual transformer know that much. they are litterally twice the size of a regular psu and dont they need a bracket to hold it up lmao.
 

KennyT772

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Joined
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System Name Raptor
Processor Intel E8400 Wolfdale @3600
Motherboard Asus P5Q-Pro LGA775
Cooling Zalman CNPS9700
Memory 1024mbx2 Crucial Ballistix DDR800
Video Card(s) XFX 9600GT
Storage Seagate 7200.11 500GB
Display(s) Acer AL2216Wbd and Acer AL1717
Case Gigabyte 3DAurora Black
Audio Device(s) Creative X-Fi Extreme Gamer Faitality
Power Supply OCZ GameXStream 500w
I really suggest looking through Hardocp's psu reviews when looking for a new unit. They tear them apart and give not only lots of pictures but also capacitor brands and rail setup.
 

panchoman

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Processor Amd Athlon X2 4600+ Windsor(90nm) EE(65W) @2.9-3.0 @1.45
Motherboard Biostar Tforce [Nvidia] 550
Cooling Thermaltake Blue Orb-- bunch of other fans here and there....
Memory 2 gigs (2x1gb) of patriot ddr2 800 @ 4-4-4-12-2t
Video Card(s) Sapphire X1950pro Pci-E x16 @stock@stock on stock
Storage Seagate 7200.11 250gb Drive, WD raptors (30/40) in Raid 0
Display(s) ANCIENT 15" sony lcd, bought it when it was like 500 bucks
Case Apevia X-plorer blue/black
Audio Device(s) Onboard- Why get an sound card when you can hum??
Power Supply Antec NeoHe 550-manufactured by seasonic -replacement to the discontinued smart power series
Software Windows XP pro SP2 -- vista is still crap
wanna me a link? i can add it to the psu guide.