• Welcome to TechPowerUp Forums, Guest! Please check out our forum guidelines for info related to our community.

Ryzen 3rd gen thermal paste application questions

Joined
May 5, 2020
Messages
58 (0.04/day)
My 3900X arrives next week and I've been hearing from multiple people that the classic "pea-sized dot" method in the middle no longer applies to 3rd gen Ryzens?

Looking at the dies, to me, it looks like it shouldn't matter:




Do I just apply a little bit large pea-sized dot than on my i7-8700, mount the cooler and forget about it? Or is that completely the wrong thing to do on third gen Ryzen? I heard the edges of the IHS heat up considerably on this gen.
 
Joined
Jun 7, 2020
Messages
241 (0.17/day)
System Name Yin/Yang
Processor Ryzen 7 3700x
Motherboard msi mag x570 tomahawk
Cooling CoolerMaster ML240V2 / asiahorse fs9002 120mm fans
Memory 2 x 16gb g.skill trident z neo 3600
Video Card(s) msi gaming X 2070 super 8gb
Storage 1tb sabrent rocket nvme / 1tb samsung evo 860 sata ssd / 3tb Toshiba hdd
Display(s) lg ultragear 2560x1440 144hz 1ms 27"ips
Case nzxt h510i
Audio Device(s) logitech g635 / creative sound blaster
Power Supply evga supernova 750ga 80 plus gold
Mouse logitech g402 hyperion fury
Keyboard corsair k55
to be honest there is no need to make it more complicated than it really is. You could probably draw a weener with the paste right in the middle of the chip and be just fine. alternatively if you really want to take a subjective look at it you can try each method when you get the chip and monitor the results. Personally i apply roughly a pea sized drop like you said and then i spread it evenly across the entire chip with a plastic applicator. When you remove the cooler and look at the chip/socket/and the base of the heat pipe that should tell you all need to know really. Different strokes for different folks though (as always)
 
Joined
Jan 25, 2006
Messages
1,470 (0.22/day)
Processor Ryzen 1600AF @4.2Ghz 1.35v
Motherboard MSI B450M PRO-A-MAX
Cooling Deepcool Gammaxx L120t
Memory 16GB Team Group Dark Pro Sammy-B-die 3400mhz 14.15.14.30-1.4v
Video Card(s) XFX RX 5600 XT THICC II PRO
Storage 240GB Brave eagle SSD/ 2TB Seagate Barracuda
Display(s) Dell SE2719HR
Case MSI Mag Vampiric 011C AMD Ryzen Edition
Power Supply EVGA 600W 80+
Software Windows 10 Pro
My 3900X arrives next week and I've been hearing from multiple people that the classic "pea-sized dot" method in the middle no longer applies to 3rd gen Ryzens?

Looking at the dies, to me, it looks like it shouldn't matter:




Do I just apply a little bit large pea-sized dot than on my i7-8700, mount the cooler and forget about it? Or is that completely the wrong thing to do on third gen Ryzen? I heard the edges of the IHS heat up considerably on this gen.

A pea sized amount is still adequate IMO, or you could use the spatula spread method if you wanted to be certain, try both and post up your results, but I'm sure there would be little/no difference

You could probably draw a weener with the paste right in the middle of the chip and be just fine
This got me dead, well done :clap: :roll:
 
Joined
May 5, 2020
Messages
58 (0.04/day)
I've decided to go with putting 5 dots of MX-4, one in the middle and 4 around it but not too close to the edges. Now hopefully I won't have to spin my cooler 360 degrees in order to take it off the next time I need to.

I'm still up to discussion.
 
Joined
Jun 7, 2020
Messages
241 (0.17/day)
System Name Yin/Yang
Processor Ryzen 7 3700x
Motherboard msi mag x570 tomahawk
Cooling CoolerMaster ML240V2 / asiahorse fs9002 120mm fans
Memory 2 x 16gb g.skill trident z neo 3600
Video Card(s) msi gaming X 2070 super 8gb
Storage 1tb sabrent rocket nvme / 1tb samsung evo 860 sata ssd / 3tb Toshiba hdd
Display(s) lg ultragear 2560x1440 144hz 1ms 27"ips
Case nzxt h510i
Audio Device(s) logitech g635 / creative sound blaster
Power Supply evga supernova 750ga 80 plus gold
Mouse logitech g402 hyperion fury
Keyboard corsair k55
A pea sized amount is still adequate IMO, or you could use the spatula spread method if you wanted to be certain, try both and post up your results, but I'm sure there would be little/no difference


This got me dead, well done :clap: :roll:

Did you miss the "different strokes for different folks" pun to accompany it? :roll:
 
Joined
Jan 25, 2006
Messages
1,470 (0.22/day)
Processor Ryzen 1600AF @4.2Ghz 1.35v
Motherboard MSI B450M PRO-A-MAX
Cooling Deepcool Gammaxx L120t
Memory 16GB Team Group Dark Pro Sammy-B-die 3400mhz 14.15.14.30-1.4v
Video Card(s) XFX RX 5600 XT THICC II PRO
Storage 240GB Brave eagle SSD/ 2TB Seagate Barracuda
Display(s) Dell SE2719HR
Case MSI Mag Vampiric 011C AMD Ryzen Edition
Power Supply EVGA 600W 80+
Software Windows 10 Pro
Did you miss the "different strokes for different folks" pun to accompany it? :roll:
You have to be from the UK with that sense of humour?

I've decided to go with putting 5 dots of MX-4, one in the middle and 4 around it but not too close to the edges. Now hopefully I won't have to spin my cooler 360 degrees in order to take it off the next time I need to.

I'm still up to discussion.
Do it, see what temps you get, you should be fine, btw what cooler do you have for that beastly CPU?
 
Joined
May 5, 2020
Messages
58 (0.04/day)
Do it, see what temps you get, you should be fine, btw what cooler do you have for that beastly CPU?
NH-D15 chromax black. Sitting beside my desk along with three Noctua NF-A14 chromax fans, because the Ryzen & mobo aren't here yet.
 
Joined
Jun 7, 2020
Messages
241 (0.17/day)
System Name Yin/Yang
Processor Ryzen 7 3700x
Motherboard msi mag x570 tomahawk
Cooling CoolerMaster ML240V2 / asiahorse fs9002 120mm fans
Memory 2 x 16gb g.skill trident z neo 3600
Video Card(s) msi gaming X 2070 super 8gb
Storage 1tb sabrent rocket nvme / 1tb samsung evo 860 sata ssd / 3tb Toshiba hdd
Display(s) lg ultragear 2560x1440 144hz 1ms 27"ips
Case nzxt h510i
Audio Device(s) logitech g635 / creative sound blaster
Power Supply evga supernova 750ga 80 plus gold
Mouse logitech g402 hyperion fury
Keyboard corsair k55
no xman, New york.

Well have fun with your new build anyway fleetwire! I'm sure you will and I'm sure you will love your 3900x as well :rockout:
 
Joined
Jul 25, 2006
Messages
12,014 (1.86/day)
Location
Nebraska, USA
System Name Brightworks Systems BWS-6 E-IV
Processor Intel Core i5-6600 @ 3.9GHz
Motherboard Gigabyte GA-Z170-HD3 Rev 1.0
Cooling Quality case, 2 x Fractal Design 140mm fans, stock CPU HSF
Memory 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4 3000 Corsair Vengeance
Video Card(s) EVGA GEForce GTX 1050Ti 4Gb GDDR5
Storage Samsung 850 Pro 256GB SSD, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB SSD
Display(s) Samsung S24E650BW LED x 2
Case Fractal Design Define R4
Power Supply EVGA Supernova 550W G2 Gold
Mouse Logitech M190
Keyboard Microsoft Wireless Comfort 5050
Software W10 Pro 64-bit
I don't pay attention to any of those suggestions. Here's what I do and I have never had any problems.

First, thoroughly clean the mating surfaces. I use 91 - 93% isopropyl alcohol and a cotton pad. The typical 73% isopropyl alcohol can leave a film.

Then I snip off the end of a Q-Tip (cotton swab), and bend about 1/2 inch of that end over to form a little hockey stick applicator.

Then I apply a small dab of TIM (thermal interface material) to the CPU IHS and use my little applicator stick to spread the TIM evenly over the IHS, like spreading icing on a cake. I make sure the layer of TIM is as thin as possible while achieving full coverage. It is much easier to add a little more TIM than to remove excess. So start with a small amount.

Remember, the TIM only needs to fill the microscopic pits and valleys in the mating surfaces to keep insulating air out. Any excess TIM is in the way and counterproductive to the most efficient transfer of heat.
 
Joined
May 5, 2020
Messages
58 (0.04/day)
Sorry but spreading is not something I'll ever do.

I decided to go with this method:



Good enough.
 
Joined
Jul 25, 2006
Messages
12,014 (1.86/day)
Location
Nebraska, USA
System Name Brightworks Systems BWS-6 E-IV
Processor Intel Core i5-6600 @ 3.9GHz
Motherboard Gigabyte GA-Z170-HD3 Rev 1.0
Cooling Quality case, 2 x Fractal Design 140mm fans, stock CPU HSF
Memory 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4 3000 Corsair Vengeance
Video Card(s) EVGA GEForce GTX 1050Ti 4Gb GDDR5
Storage Samsung 850 Pro 256GB SSD, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB SSD
Display(s) Samsung S24E650BW LED x 2
Case Fractal Design Define R4
Power Supply EVGA Supernova 550W G2 Gold
Mouse Logitech M190
Keyboard Microsoft Wireless Comfort 5050
Software W10 Pro 64-bit
Sorry but spreading is not something I'll ever do.
Why?

Please note my spreading method is not something I just concocted out of mid air. Check the link in my sig to determine if I might have some qualifications on this subject. And the 4th line in my sig to see if I take heat seriously. Then note the "spreading tool" that comes with some of the better TIMs - like this one or this one or here too. Yes, bending the end of a plastic Q-Tip to make a spreader was my idea but it came from the the special spreading tool (similar to those shown) we used in tech school where we were formally taught about TIMs and the proper cooling of heat sensitive devices.

Spreading ensures thorough, even coverage and uniform thickness (important!) AND THERMAL PROTECTION across the entire surface, starting the instant the computer is powered on the very first time after application. While your method might be "good enough", it obviously does not provide uniform thickness. There are two ridges with lots of bare space. Your method depends on applied pressure from the heatsink mounting mechanism to distribute the TIM. But obviously again, that distribution will not be across the entire surface, nor will it be immediate. It takes time for the maximum spread to occur.

A CPU can easily go from cool to overheated in just a few clock-cycles. And the 3900x, for example, has at least 3.8 Billion clock cycles in just 1 second! Wouldn't you want the most efficient and thorough coverage starting with the first instant you power on? I sure do.

Remember, even with the world's most efficient TIM, the most efficient transfer of heat (which is what we want) occurs with direct metal-to-metal contact. The TIM need only fill the imperfections, the microscopic pits and valleys in those mating surfaces - to push out insulating air. So any excess TIM is in the way of that desired heat transfer process. Two "ridges" of TIM, or a big "dab" or "grains of rice" do not cover the most surface area or provide uniform thickness.

In the end, if your temps are fine, then your two ridges method is "good enough" and I would not pull the cooler just to redo your application. But for future applications, I would definitely recommend spreading the TIM out as thin and as thoroughly as possible so you have an "even" thickness of TIM between the mating surfaces, and no ridges that may allow insulating air to get trapped in there.
 
Joined
Jun 7, 2020
Messages
241 (0.17/day)
System Name Yin/Yang
Processor Ryzen 7 3700x
Motherboard msi mag x570 tomahawk
Cooling CoolerMaster ML240V2 / asiahorse fs9002 120mm fans
Memory 2 x 16gb g.skill trident z neo 3600
Video Card(s) msi gaming X 2070 super 8gb
Storage 1tb sabrent rocket nvme / 1tb samsung evo 860 sata ssd / 3tb Toshiba hdd
Display(s) lg ultragear 2560x1440 144hz 1ms 27"ips
Case nzxt h510i
Audio Device(s) logitech g635 / creative sound blaster
Power Supply evga supernova 750ga 80 plus gold
Mouse logitech g402 hyperion fury
Keyboard corsair k55
Sorry but spreading is not something I'll ever do.

I decided to go with this method:



Good enough.
I'm confused. And I still think you are taking this too seriously. "speading is not something I will ever do" Seems like a very odd and closed minded point of view from someone who started a thread about various ways to apply paste, no? You do realize that the paste is going to spread regardless, right?
 
Joined
May 5, 2020
Messages
58 (0.04/day)
I'm confused. And I still think you are taking this too seriously. "speading is not something I will ever do" Seems like a very odd and closed minded point of view from someone who started a thread about various ways to apply paste, no? You do realize that the paste is going to spread regardless, right?
I realize, I just don't like doing it. Should've mentioned to not suggest spreading in the original post.

I've been recommended to just place two lines, one over the CCX dies and one over the I/O chip, to get maximum pressure directly over the area where heat is produced. This seems good to me and I don't trust myself with spreading anything over a $450 chip, conductive or not. I was barely able to install my current cooler anyway.
 
Joined
Jun 7, 2020
Messages
241 (0.17/day)
System Name Yin/Yang
Processor Ryzen 7 3700x
Motherboard msi mag x570 tomahawk
Cooling CoolerMaster ML240V2 / asiahorse fs9002 120mm fans
Memory 2 x 16gb g.skill trident z neo 3600
Video Card(s) msi gaming X 2070 super 8gb
Storage 1tb sabrent rocket nvme / 1tb samsung evo 860 sata ssd / 3tb Toshiba hdd
Display(s) lg ultragear 2560x1440 144hz 1ms 27"ips
Case nzxt h510i
Audio Device(s) logitech g635 / creative sound blaster
Power Supply evga supernova 750ga 80 plus gold
Mouse logitech g402 hyperion fury
Keyboard corsair k55
you will get better at installing and removing the cooler and what not with time, that's no big deal. I would encourage you if you are genuinely curious from a performance aspect of things to try try as much combinations as possible. then and only then would it be fair for you to decide what works best. Like i said before though, i really don't think it makes much difference at the end of the day though. It would be much more beneficial for you if you are worried about temperatures to focus on air flow,cooling solution as a whole, or thermal paste choice all rather than thermal paste application. that is just my opinion
 
Joined
May 5, 2020
Messages
58 (0.04/day)
try as much combinations as possible
Yeah that's why I decided to ditch the pea sized method and try the two lines this time.

As for the case ventilation, mine has a mesh front, three NF-A14 case fans and soon a NH-D15 cooler with two 140mm fans on it, and I clean dust filters and the insides of my case regularly. I'm not at all worried about airflow.
 
Joined
Feb 20, 2020
Messages
9,162 (6.11/day)
Location
Louisianna
System Name Ghetto Rigs z490|x99|Acer 17 Nitro 7840hs/ 5600c40-2x16/ 4060/ 1tb acer stock m.2/ 4tb sn850x
Processor 10900k w/Optimus Foundation | 5930k w/Black Noctua D15
Motherboard z490 Maximus XII Apex | x99 Sabertooth
Cooling oCool D5 res-combo/280 GTX/ Optimus Foundation/ gpu water block | Blk D15
Memory Trident-Z Royal 4000c16 2x16gb | Trident-Z 3200c14 4x8gb
Video Card(s) Titan Xp-water | evga 980ti gaming-w/ air
Storage 970evo+500gb & sn850x 4tb | 860 pro 256gb | Acer m.2 1tb/ sn850x 4tb| Many2.5" sata's ssd 3.5hdd's
Display(s) 1-AOC G2460PG 24"G-Sync 144Hz/ 2nd 1-ASUS VG248QE 24"/ 3rd LG 43" series
Case D450 | Cherry Entertainment center on Test bench
Audio Device(s) Built in Realtek x2 with 2-Insignia 2.0 sound bars & 1-LG sound bar
Power Supply EVGA 1000P2 with APC AX1500 | 850P2 with CyberPower-GX1325U
Mouse Redragon 901 Perdition x3
Keyboard G710+x3
Software Win-7 pro x3 and win-10 & 11pro x3
Benchmark Scores Are in the benchmark section
Joined
Jul 25, 2006
Messages
12,014 (1.86/day)
Location
Nebraska, USA
System Name Brightworks Systems BWS-6 E-IV
Processor Intel Core i5-6600 @ 3.9GHz
Motherboard Gigabyte GA-Z170-HD3 Rev 1.0
Cooling Quality case, 2 x Fractal Design 140mm fans, stock CPU HSF
Memory 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4 3000 Corsair Vengeance
Video Card(s) EVGA GEForce GTX 1050Ti 4Gb GDDR5
Storage Samsung 850 Pro 256GB SSD, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB SSD
Display(s) Samsung S24E650BW LED x 2
Case Fractal Design Define R4
Power Supply EVGA Supernova 550W G2 Gold
Mouse Logitech M190
Keyboard Microsoft Wireless Comfort 5050
Software W10 Pro 64-bit
to get maximum pressure directly over the area where heat is produced.
Its not about achieving maximum "pressure". I hope you carefully read my last post. I spent some to time to carefully write it.

Remember, that heat shield is also a heat spreader. It distributes the heat from the die so you need to extract the heat from the whole spreader. And again, any excess TIM is in the way!

and I don't trust myself with spreading anything over a $450 chip
Okay, I understand this but you need to get over it! Seriously!

First, there is a MUCH GREATER RISK of damage to the CPU just by you touching and mounting the CPU. So you posed a much greater risk when you took the CPU out of the box and mounted it. You risked damaging a pin or pad through physical abuse or accident. You risked zapping it with ESD (static discharge from your fingers). And there is a MUCH GREATER RISK of damage to the CPU (and/or socket) when you mounted the cooler because, if done wrong, can result on uneven distribution of pressure.

Note that once mounted in (and grounded through) the socket, the potential for ESD damage is almost nonexistent.

In other words, you already did the hard and risky stuff. If you trust yourself there, the rest is a piece of cake! :)

I recommend you practice to build up your confidence. If you have an old CPU and motherboard, practice there. If no spare, use a piece of aluminum foil or any flat, hard surface.

***

Nice video TrashZone. I would say to notice how much time it takes to get full coverage. I also noticed he had to press and wiggle that piece of glass/plastic pretty hard, and even pressed in different places to distribute the TIM. Not sure that represents how everyone mounts the cooler.

And again, a CPU can go from cool to overheated in just a few clock cycles. I personally want full protection starting with the instant I power on.
 
Joined
May 5, 2020
Messages
58 (0.04/day)
I feel like just not bothering anymore

pea sized dot it is, who cares that 25% of it wont be covered
 
Joined
Feb 20, 2020
Messages
9,162 (6.11/day)
Location
Louisianna
System Name Ghetto Rigs z490|x99|Acer 17 Nitro 7840hs/ 5600c40-2x16/ 4060/ 1tb acer stock m.2/ 4tb sn850x
Processor 10900k w/Optimus Foundation | 5930k w/Black Noctua D15
Motherboard z490 Maximus XII Apex | x99 Sabertooth
Cooling oCool D5 res-combo/280 GTX/ Optimus Foundation/ gpu water block | Blk D15
Memory Trident-Z Royal 4000c16 2x16gb | Trident-Z 3200c14 4x8gb
Video Card(s) Titan Xp-water | evga 980ti gaming-w/ air
Storage 970evo+500gb & sn850x 4tb | 860 pro 256gb | Acer m.2 1tb/ sn850x 4tb| Many2.5" sata's ssd 3.5hdd's
Display(s) 1-AOC G2460PG 24"G-Sync 144Hz/ 2nd 1-ASUS VG248QE 24"/ 3rd LG 43" series
Case D450 | Cherry Entertainment center on Test bench
Audio Device(s) Built in Realtek x2 with 2-Insignia 2.0 sound bars & 1-LG sound bar
Power Supply EVGA 1000P2 with APC AX1500 | 850P2 with CyberPower-GX1325U
Mouse Redragon 901 Perdition x3
Keyboard G710+x3
Software Win-7 pro x3 and win-10 & 11pro x3
Benchmark Scores Are in the benchmark section
Hi,
I've always swirled the cpu block as much as it can with all four mounts started so this is normal to me
Some do it after running and getting the timm heated up a little
As for pressing the glass you have to take into consideration mounting pressure can not be done on a piece of glass unless you drill four holes in it :)

The issue with spreading it can leave lots of air trapped which is obvious in the video but i have had prety good results spreading hydronaut.
 
Joined
Jul 25, 2006
Messages
12,014 (1.86/day)
Location
Nebraska, USA
System Name Brightworks Systems BWS-6 E-IV
Processor Intel Core i5-6600 @ 3.9GHz
Motherboard Gigabyte GA-Z170-HD3 Rev 1.0
Cooling Quality case, 2 x Fractal Design 140mm fans, stock CPU HSF
Memory 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4 3000 Corsair Vengeance
Video Card(s) EVGA GEForce GTX 1050Ti 4Gb GDDR5
Storage Samsung 850 Pro 256GB SSD, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB SSD
Display(s) Samsung S24E650BW LED x 2
Case Fractal Design Define R4
Power Supply EVGA Supernova 550W G2 Gold
Mouse Logitech M190
Keyboard Microsoft Wireless Comfort 5050
Software W10 Pro 64-bit
Wow. Okay. As you noted, it is your $450 chip. Good luck.
 
Joined
May 10, 2020
Messages
733 (0.52/day)
Processor Intel i7 13900K
Motherboard Asus ROG Strix Z690-E Gaming
Cooling Arctic Freezer II 360
Memory 32 Gb Kingston Fury Renegade 6400 C32
Video Card(s) PNY RTX 4080 XLR8 OC
Storage 1 TB Samsung 970 EVO + 1 TB Samsung 970 EVO Plus + 2 TB Samsung 870
Display(s) Asus TUF Gaming VG27AQL1A + Samsung C24RG50
Case Corsair 5000D Airflow
Power Supply EVGA G6 850W
Mouse Razer Basilisk
Keyboard Razer Huntsman Elite
Benchmark Scores 3dMark TimeSpy - 26698 Cinebench R23 2258/40751
There are several tests online demonstrating that as long as you use a decent thermal paste it just doesn’t matter the way you put it.
 
Top