• Welcome to TechPowerUp Forums, Guest! Please check out our forum guidelines for info related to our community.

Samsung, Micron, and Hynix Accused of DRAM Price Fixing

bug

Joined
May 22, 2015
Messages
13,163 (4.07/day)
Processor Intel i5-12600k
Motherboard Asus H670 TUF
Cooling Arctic Freezer 34
Memory 2x16GB DDR4 3600 G.Skill Ripjaws V
Video Card(s) EVGA GTX 1060 SC
Storage 500GB Samsung 970 EVO, 500GB Samsung 850 EVO, 1TB Crucial MX300 and 2TB Crucial MX500
Display(s) Dell U3219Q + HP ZR24w
Case Raijintek Thetis
Audio Device(s) Audioquest Dragonfly Red :D
Power Supply Seasonic 620W M12
Mouse Logitech G502 Proteus Core
Keyboard G.Skill KM780R
Software Arch Linux + Win10
I only meant, even those that bashed may have been right, in a way. But yes, this is the internet, they were probably just talking/typing crap.
 
Joined
Apr 12, 2013
Messages
1,187 (0.30/day)
Processor 11700
Motherboard TUF z590
Memory G.Skill 32gb 3600mhz
Video Card(s) ROG Vega 56
Case Deepcool
Power Supply RM 850
I only meant, even those that bashed may have been right, in a way. But yes, this is the internet, they were probably just talking/typing crap.

Indeed even a broken clock is right twice a day.
 

deu

Joined
Apr 24, 2016
Messages
493 (0.17/day)
System Name Bo-minator (my name is bo)
Processor AMD 3900X
Motherboard Gigabyte X570 AORUS MASTER
Cooling Noctua NH-D15
Memory G-SkiLL 2x8GB RAM 3600Mhz (CL16-16-16-16-36)
Video Card(s) ASUS STRIX 1080Ti OC
Storage Samsung EVO 850 1TB
Display(s) ACER XB271HU + DELL 2717D
Case Fractal Design Define R4
Audio Device(s) ASUS Xonar Essence STX
Power Supply Antec HCP 1000W
Mouse G403
Keyboard CM STORM Quick Fire Rapid
Software Windows 10 64-bit Pro
Benchmark Scores XX
The KIT that I actually use in my computer has 50% higher price than a year ago, when I bought it. Time is passing, faster and bigger DRAM kits coming month to month, yet all the prices are rising. Building a computer from new, op-to-date components is starting to become a luxury. DRAM prices because high demand, VGA prices because mining, M/B prices because the shrinking market, CPU is the only thing where you have something, but only because AMD finally got a good one too.

But you are kinda saying it: Lack of competition (includes pricefixing) = higher prices. I can accept supply and demand, but the problem is with the companies uses a "woaw demand is high because x and y, so we all just add 20% to the price. I am sure that these companies would LOVE for this to continue (+100% price = 200-xxxx% added profit). Again it would be increditably naive NOT to think that agreements could have been made to fixe the price to ensure each company multiple billions of dollars extra. :) In regard to the speed we know that RAM speed is mostly timing loosening, så 3200mhz is the "most" you can benifit unless you have some specific workload. Again; we have had more or less the same everyday performance for the last 5 years. (2400mhz DDR3 compared to 3200mhz DDR4). Its not like they have made their process more expensive (quite the oppersite).

Ill bet my kneecap that they have made some level of "gentleman agreement" over a dinner or a skypecall (it does take more than 5 seconds to say: "Are you in? follow my lead!" :D
 
Joined
Nov 7, 2016
Messages
158 (0.06/day)
Processor 5950X
Motherboard Dark Hero
Cooling Custom Loop
Memory Crucial Ballistix 3600MHz CL16
Video Card(s) Gigabyte RTX 3080 Vision
Storage 980 Pro 500GB, 970 Evo Plus 500GB, Crucial MX500 2TB, Crucial MX500 2TB, Samsung 850 Evo 500GB
Display(s) Gigabyte G34WQC
Case Cooler Master C700M
Audio Device(s) Bose
Power Supply AX850
Mouse Razer DeathAdder Chroma
Keyboard MSI GK80
Software W10 Pro
Benchmark Scores CPU-Z Single-Thread: 688 Multi-Thread: 11940
And there hasn't been any editorial piece about DRAM's price from TECHPOWERUP on these times.
 
Joined
Dec 16, 2017
Messages
2,722 (1.19/day)
Location
Buenos Aires, Argentina
System Name System V
Processor AMD Ryzen 5 3600
Motherboard Asus Prime X570-P
Cooling Cooler Master Hyper 212 // a bunch of 120 mm Xigmatek 1500 RPM fans (2 ins, 3 outs)
Memory 2x8GB Ballistix Sport LT 3200 MHz (BLS8G4D32AESCK.M8FE) (CL16-18-18-36)
Video Card(s) Gigabyte AORUS Radeon RX 580 8 GB
Storage SHFS37A240G / DT01ACA200 / WD20EZRX / MKNSSDTR256GB-3DL / LG BH16NS40 / ST10000VN0008
Display(s) LG 22MP55 IPS Display
Case NZXT Source 210
Audio Device(s) Logitech G430 Headset
Power Supply Corsair CX650M
Mouse Microsoft Trackball Optical 1.0
Keyboard HP Vectra VE keyboard (Part # D4950-63004)
Software Whatever build of Windows 11 is being served in Dev channel at the time.
Benchmark Scores Corona 1.3: 3120620 r/s Cinebench R20: 3355 FireStrike: 12490 TimeSpy: 4624
And there hasn't been any editorial piece about DRAM's price from TECHPOWERUP on these times.

Editorials, no... but I think there were quite a few implicit complaints in some news pieces.

here
This 5% drop in pricing has prompted industry analysts to review their profit estimates for 2018, and expect that the memory industry's growth rate will fall by more than half this year to 30 percent. You read that right - investors are scared because growth rates will be 30 percent instead of 60 percent. Oh the joys of inflated pricing, and slower-than-usual ramp-up to keep demand higher than supply. The joys of economic capitalism, where prices for consumers go up, and an industries' value skyrockets by more than 70$ in a single year (2017).
Raevenlord didn't seem real happy here.


And here btarunr mentioned the problem too, although in the context of cryptomining boom.
DRAM prices continue to torment gaming PC builders, with memory prices seeing triple-digit inflation over what they should be (a 32 GB dual-channel DDR4 memory kit, which should have ideally been priced around $200, is going for $500 these days)

So, yeah. Maybe they didn't see the need for editorials. It's been talked about and discussed all over TPU...
 
Joined
Apr 18, 2015
Messages
234 (0.07/day)
They will find ways to recover the loss. Consumers will pay for it anyway.

The only option is for some government to fine them really hard as a percentage of company revenue (not profit) and to monitor them for 10 years.
On any small misbehavior the fine should be automatically applied once more without aditional court order or something else.
For example for Hynix which as per wiki it does 15.98 B revenue and 3.67 B profit a good fine would be 5%*15.98B=0.799 Billion.

Holly molly, now that I look at this company they make shitload of profit for the revenue.
I'm not in finance but that 22% percent profit reported to revenue seems huge doesn't it?
 
Joined
Jan 27, 2015
Messages
451 (0.13/day)
System Name Marmo / Kanon
Processor Intel Core i7 9700K / AMD Ryzen 7 5800X
Motherboard Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Pro WiFi / X570S Aorus Pro AX
Cooling Noctua NH-U12S x 2
Memory Corsair Vengeance 32GB 2666-C16 / 32GB 3200-C16
Video Card(s) KFA2 RTX3070 Ti / Asus TUF RX 6800XT OC
Storage Samsung 970 EVO+ 1TB, 860 EVO 1TB / Samsung 970 Pro 1TB, 970 EVO+ 1TB
Display(s) Dell AW2521HFA / U2715H
Case Fractal Design Focus G / Pop Air RGB
Audio Device(s) Onboard / Creative SB ZxR
Power Supply SeaSonic Focus GX 650W / PX 750W
Mouse Logitech MX310 / G1
Keyboard Logitech G413 / G513
Software Win 11 Ent
I wish I lived in the US so I could sign up immediately. Those greedy tightasses deserve the punishment.
 
Joined
Mar 6, 2017
Messages
3,204 (1.24/day)
Location
North East Ohio, USA
System Name My Ryzen 7 7700X Super Computer
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 7700X
Motherboard Gigabyte B650 Aorus Elite AX
Cooling DeepCool AK620 with Arctic Silver 5
Memory 2x16GB G.Skill Trident Z5 NEO DDR5 EXPO (CL30)
Video Card(s) XFX AMD Radeon RX 7900 GRE
Storage Samsung 980 EVO 1 TB NVMe SSD (System Drive), Samsung 970 EVO 500 GB NVMe SSD (Game Drive)
Display(s) Acer Nitro XV272U (DisplayPort) and Acer Nitro XV270U (DisplayPort)
Case Lian Li LANCOOL II MESH C
Audio Device(s) On-Board Sound / Sony WH-XB910N Bluetooth Headphones
Power Supply MSI A850GF
Mouse Logitech M705
Keyboard Steelseries
Software Windows 11 Pro 64-bit
Benchmark Scores https://valid.x86.fr/liwjs3
Too bad I bought after February 1, 2018, I guess no scraps for me.
 
Joined
Oct 25, 2005
Messages
193 (0.03/day)
Location
Long Island, NY
Processor 9700K
Motherboard Asrock Z390 Phantom Gaming-ITX/ac
Cooling Alpenfohn Black Ridge
Memory 32GB Micron VLP 18ADF2G72AZ-3G2E1
Video Card(s) 3090 FE
Display(s) Samsung G9 NEO
Case Formd T1
Power Supply Corsair SF750
I called this months ago...
 

Gilhooligan

New Member
Joined
May 1, 2018
Messages
1 (0.00/day)
last time this happend i paid £98 for 8gb then samsung was caught out and the same 8gb went down to £30
 
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
85 (0.01/day)
Oh sure... let's have a class action lawsuit where us regular folks will be lucky to get a few dollars meanwhile the lawyers walk away with bank.
It does seem lawyers cut is always way to high and that they are the real winners . But we also have to consider that while people are sitting in their armchairs waiting years for that very small check you still were invited to participate in something you didn't bring forth so you are not risking much . Meanwhile the firm still has to pay their overhead which should be substantial , like rent, salaries , insurance , research , experts , transportation , and much more . And this overhead is for whatever number of years it takes , and I don't know if this type of case can have postpones , appeals , etc.. But win or lose the consumer should benefit going forward because now the industry has been put in check , Which by the way does not stop companies from cheating ( Proof being the multitude of like cases ) but from being so blatant about it ( 47% rise! ) . Man did I just defend lawyers ...I'm surely going to hell now .
 
Joined
May 19, 2009
Messages
1,818 (0.33/day)
Location
Latvia
System Name Personal \\ Work - HP EliteBook 840 G6
Processor 7700X \\ i7-8565U
Motherboard Asrock X670E PG Lightning
Cooling Noctua DH-15
Memory G.SKILL Trident Z5 RGB Black 32GB 6000MHz CL36 \\ 16GB DDR4-2400
Video Card(s) ASUS RoG Strix 1070 Ti \\ Intel UHD Graphics 620
Storage 2x KC3000 2TB, Samsung 970 EVO 512GB \\ OEM 256GB NVMe SSD
Display(s) BenQ XL2411Z \\ FullHD + 2x HP Z24i external screens via docking station
Case Fractal Design Define Arc Midi R2 with window
Audio Device(s) Realtek ALC1150 with Logitech Z533
Power Supply Corsair AX860i
Mouse Logitech G502
Keyboard Corsair K55 RGB PRO
Software Windows 11 \\ Windows 10
Fingers crossed for reduction in prices at least...
 

bug

Joined
May 22, 2015
Messages
13,163 (4.07/day)
Processor Intel i5-12600k
Motherboard Asus H670 TUF
Cooling Arctic Freezer 34
Memory 2x16GB DDR4 3600 G.Skill Ripjaws V
Video Card(s) EVGA GTX 1060 SC
Storage 500GB Samsung 970 EVO, 500GB Samsung 850 EVO, 1TB Crucial MX300 and 2TB Crucial MX500
Display(s) Dell U3219Q + HP ZR24w
Case Raijintek Thetis
Audio Device(s) Audioquest Dragonfly Red :D
Power Supply Seasonic 620W M12
Mouse Logitech G502 Proteus Core
Keyboard G.Skill KM780R
Software Arch Linux + Win10
In a way, it's like AMD can't catch a break. Last time they had a great CPU, Intel plays dirty and AMD can't sell as many as they would like. Now AMD has Ryzen, Intel plays nice (as far as we know), yet high RAM and GPU prices still stop many users from buying or upgrading.
A coincidence, for sure, but quite an unfortunate one for AMD.
 
Joined
Mar 4, 2011
Messages
165 (0.03/day)
Location
Israel
System Name Negra5
Processor i5 6500
Motherboard ASUS Z170M-Plus
Cooling Cooler Master Hyper TX3
Memory Kingston HyperX 16GB DDR4
Video Card(s) PNY GTX-1070, XFX RX480
Storage Gigabyte 256GB SSD, WD 1TB HDD, WD 4TB HDD.
Display(s) SAMSUNG 32" FullHD
Case GAMING EAGLE WARRIOR CG-06R1
Audio Device(s) nVidia HD Audio
Power Supply Corsair GS800W 80 Plus Bronze
Mouse Cooler Master Devastator MS2k
Keyboard Cooler Master Devastator MB24
Software Windows 10 20H2
Benchmark Scores Pfft
Does this mean that prices of RAM should go down?
 

bug

Joined
May 22, 2015
Messages
13,163 (4.07/day)
Processor Intel i5-12600k
Motherboard Asus H670 TUF
Cooling Arctic Freezer 34
Memory 2x16GB DDR4 3600 G.Skill Ripjaws V
Video Card(s) EVGA GTX 1060 SC
Storage 500GB Samsung 970 EVO, 500GB Samsung 850 EVO, 1TB Crucial MX300 and 2TB Crucial MX500
Display(s) Dell U3219Q + HP ZR24w
Case Raijintek Thetis
Audio Device(s) Audioquest Dragonfly Red :D
Power Supply Seasonic 620W M12
Mouse Logitech G502 Proteus Core
Keyboard G.Skill KM780R
Software Arch Linux + Win10
Joined
Dec 16, 2017
Messages
2,722 (1.19/day)
Location
Buenos Aires, Argentina
System Name System V
Processor AMD Ryzen 5 3600
Motherboard Asus Prime X570-P
Cooling Cooler Master Hyper 212 // a bunch of 120 mm Xigmatek 1500 RPM fans (2 ins, 3 outs)
Memory 2x8GB Ballistix Sport LT 3200 MHz (BLS8G4D32AESCK.M8FE) (CL16-18-18-36)
Video Card(s) Gigabyte AORUS Radeon RX 580 8 GB
Storage SHFS37A240G / DT01ACA200 / WD20EZRX / MKNSSDTR256GB-3DL / LG BH16NS40 / ST10000VN0008
Display(s) LG 22MP55 IPS Display
Case NZXT Source 210
Audio Device(s) Logitech G430 Headset
Power Supply Corsair CX650M
Mouse Microsoft Trackball Optical 1.0
Keyboard HP Vectra VE keyboard (Part # D4950-63004)
Software Whatever build of Windows 11 is being served in Dev channel at the time.
Benchmark Scores Corona 1.3: 3120620 r/s Cinebench R20: 3355 FireStrike: 12490 TimeSpy: 4624
They will find ways to recover the loss. Consumers will pay for it anyway.

The only option is for some government to fine them really hard as a percentage of company revenue (not profit) and to monitor them for 10 years.
On any small misbehavior the fine should be automatically applied once more without aditional court order or something else.
For example for Hynix which as per wiki it does 15.98 B revenue and 3.67 B profit a good fine would be 5%*15.98B=0.799 Billion.

Holly molly, now that I look at this company they make shitload of profit for the revenue.
I'm not in finance but that 22% percent profit reported to revenue seems huge doesn't it?

As much as I'd like to see something like that, it probably won't happen. What you'd get is this: there is an investigation, it's determined that these companies incurred in price fixing, they get their day in court, and if they are found guilty, they are fined. If they incur in price fixing again, there must be another investigation, more legal procedures and another court order. There won't be automatic fines.

Of course, it is much more likely that, should the courts find them guilty, the fine could be quite the number. Hundreds of millions, maybe. I, for one, want to see a massive fine applied on each of them. And some prison time too.
 
Joined
Jun 10, 2013
Messages
161 (0.04/day)
Location
H-town
What kind of prison are we talking here? The one where they are with the rest of the regular inmates or one where they have butlers cut their food, change their clothes, where they live the same lifestyle at their own homes just behind metal bars?
I'm more for prices coming down.
 
Joined
Feb 18, 2013
Messages
2,178 (0.54/day)
Location
Deez Nutz, bozo!
System Name Rainbow Puke Machine :D
Processor Intel Core i5-11400 (MCE enabled, PL removed)
Motherboard ASUS STRIX B560-G GAMING WIFI mATX
Cooling Corsair H60i RGB PRO XT AIO + HD120 RGB (x3) + SP120 RGB PRO (x3) + Commander PRO
Memory Corsair Vengeance RGB RT 2 x 8GB 3200MHz DDR4 C16
Video Card(s) Zotac RTX2060 Twin Fan 6GB GDDR6 (Stock)
Storage Corsair MP600 PRO 1TB M.2 PCIe Gen4 x4 SSD
Display(s) LG 29WK600-W Ultrawide 1080p IPS Monitor (primary display)
Case Corsair iCUE 220T RGB Airflow (White) w/Lighting Node CORE + Lighting Node PRO RGB LED Strips (x4).
Audio Device(s) ASUS ROG Supreme FX S1220A w/ Savitech SV3H712 AMP + Sonic Studio 3 suite
Power Supply Corsair RM750x 80 Plus Gold Fully Modular
Mouse Corsair M65 RGB FPS Gaming (White)
Keyboard Corsair K60 PRO RGB Mechanical w/ Cherry VIOLA Switches
VR HMD Pico 4 128GB AIO VR Headset* (* = in consideration of getting one)
Software Windows 10 Professional x64 (Update 22H2)
Well I expected this would happen... bet Samsung & Hynix will either start firing those who are involved in this scandal OR "reform" a part of their divisions & sweep everything under the carpet, pretending nothing ever happened.
 

hat

Enthusiast
Joined
Nov 20, 2006
Messages
21,731 (3.43/day)
Location
Ohio
System Name Starlifter :: Dragonfly
Processor i7 2600k 4.4GHz :: i5 10400
Motherboard ASUS P8P67 Pro :: ASUS Prime H570-Plus
Cooling Cryorig M9 :: Stock
Memory 4x4GB DDR3 2133 :: 2x8GB DDR4 2400
Video Card(s) PNY GTX1070 :: Integrated UHD 630
Storage Crucial MX500 1TB, 2x1TB Seagate RAID 0 :: Mushkin Enhanced 60GB SSD, 3x4TB Seagate HDD RAID5
Display(s) Onn 165hz 1080p :: Acer 1080p
Case Antec SOHO 1030B :: Old White Full Tower
Audio Device(s) Creative X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty Pro - Bose Companion 2 Series III :: None
Power Supply FSP Hydro GE 550w :: EVGA Supernova 550
Software Windows 10 Pro - Plex Server on Dragonfly
Benchmark Scores >9000
RAM prices haven't budged. I thought this would bring them down?
 
Joined
Dec 16, 2017
Messages
2,722 (1.19/day)
Location
Buenos Aires, Argentina
System Name System V
Processor AMD Ryzen 5 3600
Motherboard Asus Prime X570-P
Cooling Cooler Master Hyper 212 // a bunch of 120 mm Xigmatek 1500 RPM fans (2 ins, 3 outs)
Memory 2x8GB Ballistix Sport LT 3200 MHz (BLS8G4D32AESCK.M8FE) (CL16-18-18-36)
Video Card(s) Gigabyte AORUS Radeon RX 580 8 GB
Storage SHFS37A240G / DT01ACA200 / WD20EZRX / MKNSSDTR256GB-3DL / LG BH16NS40 / ST10000VN0008
Display(s) LG 22MP55 IPS Display
Case NZXT Source 210
Audio Device(s) Logitech G430 Headset
Power Supply Corsair CX650M
Mouse Microsoft Trackball Optical 1.0
Keyboard HP Vectra VE keyboard (Part # D4950-63004)
Software Whatever build of Windows 11 is being served in Dev channel at the time.
Benchmark Scores Corona 1.3: 3120620 r/s Cinebench R20: 3355 FireStrike: 12490 TimeSpy: 4624
RAM prices haven't budged. I thought this would bring them down?

They are only being accused of price fixing for now. Until the courts say that they are guilty, don't expect anything to change.
 
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
13,210 (3.83/day)
Location
Sunshine Coast
System Name Black Box
Processor Intel Xeon E3-1260L v5
Motherboard MSI E3 KRAIT Gaming v5
Cooling Tt tower + 120mm Tt fan
Memory G.Skill 16GB 3600 C18
Video Card(s) Asus GTX 970 Mini
Storage Kingston A2000 512Gb NVME
Display(s) AOC 24" Freesync 1m.s. 75Hz
Case Corsair 450D High Air Flow.
Audio Device(s) No need.
Power Supply FSP Aurum 650W
Mouse Yes
Keyboard Of course
Software W10 Pro 64 bit
I know when prices of DDR4 will drop....right after I buy some. :shadedshu:
 
Joined
Dec 16, 2017
Messages
2,722 (1.19/day)
Location
Buenos Aires, Argentina
System Name System V
Processor AMD Ryzen 5 3600
Motherboard Asus Prime X570-P
Cooling Cooler Master Hyper 212 // a bunch of 120 mm Xigmatek 1500 RPM fans (2 ins, 3 outs)
Memory 2x8GB Ballistix Sport LT 3200 MHz (BLS8G4D32AESCK.M8FE) (CL16-18-18-36)
Video Card(s) Gigabyte AORUS Radeon RX 580 8 GB
Storage SHFS37A240G / DT01ACA200 / WD20EZRX / MKNSSDTR256GB-3DL / LG BH16NS40 / ST10000VN0008
Display(s) LG 22MP55 IPS Display
Case NZXT Source 210
Audio Device(s) Logitech G430 Headset
Power Supply Corsair CX650M
Mouse Microsoft Trackball Optical 1.0
Keyboard HP Vectra VE keyboard (Part # D4950-63004)
Software Whatever build of Windows 11 is being served in Dev channel at the time.
Benchmark Scores Corona 1.3: 3120620 r/s Cinebench R20: 3355 FireStrike: 12490 TimeSpy: 4624
I know when prices of DDR4 will drop....right after I buy some. :shadedshu:

Alright, then. In the name of all consumers, go buy some :D
 
Top