Sudden "shadow acne" on modern hardware

[yesyesloud]

Yes, I have looked long and hard especially at your Tomb Raider video (fullscreen 1080p) and to be fair, the only error I can distinguish is the 'acne' (for lack of a better term..., it still doesnt sit well with me, call me stubborn) in Lara's hair, specifically between the strands of hair and even more specifically, ONLY when you turn to look around, which to me is an indication that this is very likely game specific, or driver related.

Shimmering balls all over my face but ONLY when the camera is moving, so pleasing

Did I behold a remarkable leap from game specific to driver related issues?

I'll spare my home schooled peers from an analogy to such precise diagnosis as I'm still collecting stars to make my forehead shine brighter among us... With overlapping glitches hopefully.

The problem is taking place in most games on my setup. Can't turn DX issues into game specific. Pick one or the other.

I have tried different drivers and fresh Windows installs as mentioned - just making it clean-air-clear since crystal-clear wasn't enough.

Still gotta try even older drivers as a long shot, thanks to people actually willing to help.

Although you're really special and tasteful, I'm sorry to break it to you but no one likes "shadow acne" in itself or as a term.

The water? I don't see an issue, its not pixelated, its just the way water is rendered, with several transparent flat textures that move over each other, the lowest layers being low-res texture. A perfect example of how developers use all sorts of trickery to save resources.

Nope, water is screwed up in many places including that one.

It gets worse on the still water within a lot of tombs to a point that people quite indifferent to artifacts wouldn't dismiss the thing as a native rendering quirk.

I'll record the issues zoomed in for further analysis in hopes of receiving more education on the matter.

I have yet to record the same footage with my good old 7990 and further expose the "shadow acne".

Ah, so challenging I wish I weren't sad about the aberrations.

The reason to try monitor is because you can distinguish for yourself if there are other artifacts caused by the TV's refresh rate trickery, which is a very common issue. Call it education of sorts, for yourself and this thread
NVCP settings are interesting because you 've gone through clean installs and it may be worthwhile comparing settings combined with several Nvidia drivers, most notably, comparing same settings on an old one that gave you no issues and the most recent.

What have we here?

Fellow home schooled worldwide, unite... Sit back in awe before some precious teachings.

Oh, I assumed there were a million reasons to try a "regular monitor". Input delay maybe? Perhaps the higher contrast ratio of a few monitors will save my life?

Actually, I think not, but I'm so disappointed I'm willing to try anything.

Yeah... I'll plug my pc to a 60Hz LED monitor just to compare it with my 60Hz LED dumb TV. A real 144Hz monitor set to 120Hz? Let's do it too.

There's no "refresh rate trickery" for HDMI input on my TV, its technical specifications are so plain I doubt it features any trickery at all. There is hardly - if any - difference in HDMI input handling between my current displays and your average monitor, but I'm really open to ruling out anything at the moment.

I've seen a fair share of graphical anomalies in my gaming years and I do know that a vast majority is very simply just engine/game related, OR attributable to how the engine and the API work together. Given the fact that DirectX is undergoing active development, well... 1+1

As for the set of screenshots with ultra low graphics quality on dated games with huge anomalies - that is another issue entirely, and yes, if you get this, it needs work.

That's what I love about gurus. They've seen it all. In a humble way.

That's not "another issue entirely". Not at all, in case describing the issue with minimal accuracy is somewhat intended here.

If you don't see how similar the shadow stripes on those screenshots behave when compared with 3D shadow problems in general (especially that on Lara's hair you could spot yourself), regardless of game release date, then we diverge entirely.

My younger brother is having very similar issues with his 4k TV being used as a monitor. Try a real monitor. TV's do all sorts of fancy image enhancing stuff, and not all of it can be disabled most of the time. I think the rest of the discussion is a moot point until we rule out the obvious oddity, which is using a TV for a monitor.

Can barely relate.

My main LED TV is a 60Hz 1080p dumb display, practically a monitor, featuring about the same specs as many monitors apart from screen size.

Actually, it's been established that display related matters are the moot point in this discussion.

Artifacting from tile based rendering, welcome to the tradeoff for performance and visual accuracy.

I saw sprites and shadow errors when the 1xxx series card were released.

:/

I've been willing to quit grieving altogether and finally get to the acceptance part but it's hard...

 

[Papahyooie]

What have we here?
Fellow home schooled worldwide, unite... Sit back in awe before some precious teachings.
Oh, I assumed there were a million reasons to try a "regular monitor". Input delay maybe? Perhaps the higher contrast ratio of a few monitors will save my life?
Actually, I think not, but I'm so disappointed I'm willing to try anything.
Yeah... I'll plug my pc to a 60Hz LED monitor just to compare it with my 60Hz LED dumb TV. A real 144Hz monitor set to 120Hz? Let's do it too.
There's no TV "refresh rate trickery" for HDMI input on my TV, its technical specifications are so plain I doubt it has any trickery at all. There is hardly if any difference in HDMI input handling between my current displays and your average monitor, but I'm really open to ruling out anything at the moment.
That's what I love about gurus. They've seen it all. In a humble way.
That's not "another issue entirely". Not at all, sorry, in case describing the issue with minimal accuracy is somewhat intended here.
If you don't see how similar the shadow stripes on those screenshots behave when compared with 3D shadow problems in general (especially that on Lara's hair you could spot yourself), regardless of game release date, sorry, we diverge completely.
Can barely relate.

My main LED TV is a 60Hz 1080p dumb display, practically a monitor, featuring about the same specs as many monitors apart from screen size.

Actually, it's been established that display related matters are the moot point in this discussion.

Well fine, guy. Have it your way then. If you're going to insult people who you've asked to help you, then good luck to you sir. I could care less whether your problem is solved, but that's what a forum is for. As I said, my younger brother has very similar problems, so to me it would make sense to check. Moreover, that's how troubleshooting works. You don't dismiss a step in troubleshooting just because you don't think it could be the cause. That's a recipe for spending WAY too much time trying to fix something that might be able to be fixed with a 2 minute test. Ruling something out is a much better idea than insulting people who offer you advice. But it's your sanity. Be my guest.

 

[yesyesloud]

Well fine, guy. Have it your way then. If you're going to insult people who you've asked to help you, then good luck to you sir. I could care less whether your problem is solved, but that's what a forum is for. As I said, my younger brother has very similar problems, so to me it would make sense to check. Moreover, that's how troubleshooting works. You don't dismiss a step in troubleshooting just because you don't think it could be the cause. That's a recipe for spending WAY too much time trying to fix something that might be able to be fixed with a 2 minute test. Ruling something out is a much better idea than insulting people who offer you advice. But it's your sanity. Be my guest.

If you read it through, you'd realize I didn't really insult anyone. I've got a rather polite attitude towards people who teased me or neglected a lot of the thread info. It's a reaction.

I'm quite happy to be your guest and accept a recurrent suggestion based on problems you also observed.

That troubleshooting will be carried out. Thanks.

 

[Papahyooie]

So calling people homeschooled and the like...
"Sit back in awe before some precious teachings."
"Input delay maybe? Perhaps the higher contrast ratio of a few monitors will save my life?"

You're telling me that's not passive aggressiveness?

 

[yesyesloud]

So calling people homeschooled and the like...
"Sit back in awe before some precious teachings."
"Input delay maybe? Perhaps the higher contrast ratio of a few monitors will save my life?"

You're telling me that's not passive aggressiveness?

Calling myself homeschooled because I'm being educated by a star-filled guru? I don't think so.

 

[Papahyooie]

Calling myself homeschooled because I'm being educated by a star-filled guru? I don't think so.

My apologies... I think we might have a bit of a language barrier here. Is English a second language for you? I'm not being mean by asking that, simply trying to understand. Those phrases I quoted above can be interpreted as very sarcastic and rude. If it was not meant that way, then I apologize.

 

[yesyesloud]

My apologies... I think we might have a bit of a language barrier here. Is English a second language for you? I'm not being mean by asking that, simply trying to understand. Those phrases I quoted above can be interpreted as very sarcastic and rude. If it was not meant that way, then I apologize.

Spot-on, it's not my first language indeed. I'm glad we settled our differences and found some common ground in home schooling, unless I misinterpreted something, if that's the case I also apologize...

 

[Papahyooie]

Spot-on, it's not my first language indeed. I'm glad we settled our differences and found some common ground in home schooling, unless I misinterpreted something, if that's the case I also apologize...

My apologies then, I misinterpreted your tone. Using more expressive words and exaggerations (like calling someone a guru, or saying that a refresh rate will maybe "save your life") can sound sarcastic or mocking. And "home schooled" can be an insult in some situations, insinuating that a person is uneducated. I thought you were calling other people these things as insults. I know now you were just being enthusiastic. No hard feelings, and I hope you find your fix.

 

[Vayra86]

Walls of text but no movement towards actually trying that monitor for once - or different game titles etc. A disturbing lack of will to analyze the problem yourself.

I'm done here

 

[yesyesloud]

Walls of text but no movement towards actually trying that monitor for once - or different game titles etc. A disturbing lack of will to analyze the problem yourself.

I'm done here

I thought you were done here in your first post. Sad to see you go.

Just tried my pc on two different monitors. Same issues.

Worry not, for I shall gather patience and footage from several shimmering directx titles with two different cards.

Take good care and enjoy the upcoming holidays, space cowboy.

 

[DRDNA]

I admit that I did not delve into the first link that the OP posted and did start to read this thread thoroughly but the bickering had me skimming to here. What I would do is first reinstall the newest chipset for the Mobo right over the top with out uninstalling it and reboot, then I would reinstall Direct X again right over the top with out uninstalling. Retest gaming issues, and as a last resort and your savvy and bold a re-flash of the GPU and another test. The above steps are taking for granted you already installed all the other Mobo drivers and I also believe there is a Nvidia driver release just recently that addressed some issue with Tomb Raider. Good luck and hopefully we can stay on subject. This must really f-ing suck tho!

Take good care and enjoy the upcoming holidays, space cowboy.

P.S. We use to have a member here and I'm almost certain he went by "Space Cowboy" and that had to be at least 10 years ago so I re skimmed this thread for a poster named "Space Cowboy" but was had by sarcasm....

 

[FYFI13]

Been messing around with different settings, can’t reproduce your issues no matter what. Going to try same thing with GTX 970 tonight.

 

[yesyesloud]

What I would do is first reinstall the newest chipset for the Mobo right over the top with out uninstalling it and reboot, then I would reinstall Direct X again right over the top with out uninstalling. Retest gaming issues, and as a last resort and your savvy and bold a re-flash of the GPU and another test. The above steps are taking for granted you already installed all the other Mobo drivers and I also believe there is a Nvidia driver release just recently that addressed some issue with Tomb Raider. Good luck and hopefully we can stay on subject.

I followed the steps you suggested except reinstalling DX12, I wish MS allowed us to manually repair/reinstall it. Besides re-flashing the GPU with the stock bios, I tried a newer one - the only other compatible bios image available for my model. No progress so far, but thanks for taking the time to answer properly, I'll bear in mind your advice for further troubleshooting.

This must really f-ing suck tho!

Sucks big time

Been messing around with different settings, can’t reproduce your issues no matter what. Going to try same thing with GTX 970 tonight.

What I would advise is trying a different GPU , slower or faster it doesn't matter and see what happens then.

I couldn't replicate my 1080ti issues with my Radeon HD 7990 either.

I'm beginning to think it's my particular 1080ti piece, but EVGA OC Scanner hasn't returned a single error after performing all possible tests for a good while. I wonder how accurate this tool is as it can also check VRAM.

RMA it is anyway.

Let's truly hope it doesn't ultimately come down to this:

Artifacting from tile based rendering, welcome to the tradeoff for performance and visual accuracy.

I saw sprites and shadow errors when the 1xxx series card were released.

 

[DRDNA]

I followed the steps you suggested except reinstalling DX12, I wish MS allowed us to manually repair/reinstall it. Besides re-flashing the GPU with the stock bios, I tried a newer one - the only other compatible bios image available for my model. No progress so far, but thanks for taking the time to answer properly, I'll bear in mind your advice for further troubleshooting.:

MS just released a today is Tuesday windows 10 update that fixes some DirectX issue and a fix for Microsoft Graphics Component ; so maybe you will get lucky https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/4048955/windows-10-update-kb4048955

Oh and by the way you have some pretty nice hardware under the hood there!

 

[FYFI13]

Artifacting from tile based rendering, welcome to the tradeoff for performance and visual accuracy.

I saw sprites and shadow errors when the 1xxx series card were released.

Nvidia have been using tile-based rasterization since Maxwell, but i could not reproduce these graphical glitches on GTX 970 and GTX 980Ti.
I can see some shimmering here and there but I’m almost confident that is because of crappy FXAA used in this game. And it’s not even close to what i see in OP’s video.

 

[DRDNA]

Nvidia have been using tile-based rasterization since Maxwell, but i could not reproduce these graphical glitches on GTX 970 and GTX 980Ti.
I can see some shimmering here and there but I’m almost confident that is because of crappy FXAA used in this game. And it’s not even close to what i see in OP’s video.

"crappy FXAA" I wonder if he deselects all AA and retests what the results would be, almost looks like anomalies created by issues with AA selections between the game and the Nvidia control Panel.

 

[Vya Domus]

That doesn't look like AA anomalies at all.

http://www.opengl-tutorial.org/intermediate-tutorials/tutorial-16-shadow-mapping/#

Look at the problems section.

That looks exactly like the issue OP has. This is a well documented effect , question is why does this appear only for such a few number of users.

 

[DRDNA]

That doesn't look like AA anomalies at all.

http://www.opengl-tutorial.org/intermediate-tutorials/tutorial-16-shadow-mapping/#

Look at the problems section.

That looks exactly like the issue OP has. This is a well documented effect , question is why does this appear only for such a few number of users.

Okay but the OP has NO issues with OpenGL games, but has issues with some DX12 games.

EDIT
I'm having a real issue trying to figure out if its a hardware combination issue or a software issue.
No issues within the same system with the AMD card but issues with his Nvidia card in same said system. So we need to figure out is it hardware related combination or a software issue with his hardware?

 

[Vya Domus]

That's a general rendering mishandling problem in computer graphics as a whole , it doesn't matter what API is used.

That's why I am inclined to believe there is a driver bug caused by his specific hardware/software as this should only happen on a per-game basis ( if the game is poorly coded not the case here since we would all experience this ) and not across several DirectX games.

One thing he can try is maybe install Windows fresh on a new partition with the oldest drivers for the card and observe if the problem persists.

EDIT : Seems kind of trivial , but did you try updating DirectX ?

 

[yesyesloud]

"crappy FXAA" I wonder if he deselects all AA and retests what the results would be, almost looks like anomalies created by issues with AA selections between the game and the Nvidia control Panel.

I didn't mention it but I've tried AA completely off in NVCP and game settings.

Okay but the OP has NO issues with OpenGL games, but has issues with some DX12 games.

EDIT
I'm having a real issue trying to figure out if its a hardware combination issue or a software issue.
No issues within the same system with the AMD card but issues with his Nvidia card in same said system. So we need to figure out is it hardware related combination or a software issue with his hardware?

DX in general is misbehaving with my 1080ti. If I play a game in DX 9, 10, 11 or 12 I get the same issues.

However, if I run DX games on my Radeon HD 7990 on the same PC, the issues disappear.

I'll RMA my Nvidia GTX 1080ti FE to rule it out. It only bugs me that all my OpenGL games are working fine and so once were the DX ones. Also, EVGA OC Scanner returns no errors from any test.

That's a general rendering mishandling problem in computer graphics as a whole , it doesn't matter what API is used.

That's why I am inclined to believe there is a driver bug caused by his specific hardware/software as this should only happen on a per-game basis ( if the game is poorly coded not the case here since we would all experience this ) and not across several DirectX games.

One thing he can try is maybe install Windows fresh on a new partition with the oldest drivers for the card and observe if the problem persists.

I did that.

Despite being API-agnostic, the issues aren't present in OpenGL games on my current setup.

 

[DRDNA]

I didn't mention it but I've tried AA completely off in NVCP and game settings.

DX in general is misbehaving with my 1080ti. If I play a game in DX 9, 10, 11 or 12 I get the same issues.

However, if I run DX games on my Radeon HD 7990 on the same PC, the issues disappear.

then I would reinstall Direct X again right over the top with out uninstalling. Retest gaming issues,

EDIT : Seems kind of trivial , but did you try updating DirectX ?

Please try reintalling DirectX https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=8109
it will only take a minute and might help! Thank you in advance.
The download is titled "directx_Jun2010_redist.exe"

 

[Sasqui]

DX in general is misbehaving with my 1080ti. If I play a game in DX 9, 10, 11 or 12 I get the same issues.

However, if I run DX games on my Radeon HD 7990 on the same PC, the issues disappear.

I see both texture (the still shots you posted) and shader problems (the video of the water in shadows). Skimming through this thread, I suspect the card, but like anything "check the cables" first, literally and figuratively. For example, @DRDNA suggestion to reinstall DX. Also, I didn't read if you had tried rolling back to an earlier driver?

 

[Vayra86]

Calling myself homeschooled because I'm being educated by a star-filled guru? I don't think so.

Look man, (yes, I'm back) I've given you a very informative response on the end of page 1 with several suggestions and most of all, means to *exclude* things on the list of possible causes, which is always helpful to narrow down to the real cause and actually fix something. I didn't even read this particular comment of yours earlier... but have you noticed how ever since I was gone, other members have ALSO pushed you towards trying to update things and actually guide us through what you've tried and what it does?

You may not like my tone of voice, but I'm not talking out of my ass here. At the same time, your tone of voice is also one that alludes to the reason you've not solved the issue yet: you gotta get a bit more open minded towards the suggestions offered.

And am I really a guru now? I feel flattered man, all I try to do is make sense. All I said was, that these issues are not new in gaming, can be card/game/API specific, and this sentiment is echoed throughout this thread.

One perhaps useful thing to add: if your card was working fine in the same games before, and still works fine in several games today that you've now also narrowed down to OpenGL titles, then your card hasn't suddenly died, it is the *least* likely issue. Save yourself the shipping cost, and look at software - or SOMETIMES - just give it some time, like a month, update your stuff again and watch magic happen as a bug has been fixed.

As for DirectX, you can try manually installing it but as far as I know, this is also part of Windows 10 upgrades and thus is already entirely up to date.

Good luck on solving this problem.

 

[DRDNA]

I see both texture (the still shots you posted) and shader problems (the video of the water in shadows). Skimming through this thread, I suspect the card, but like anything "check the cables" first, literally and figuratively. For example, @DRDNA suggestion to reinstall DX. Also, I didn't read if you had tried rolling back to an earlier driver?

I don't think it is the card in and of its self as I think the OP stated he tried the offending card in a different PC and there was no issue.

EDIT: Just reread OP posts and actually trying the card in a different PC was never mentioned but I would recommend doing so if it is possible???

 

[Steevo]

https://images.nvidia.com/geforce-c...yrie-ultra-graphics-forge-001-comparison.html

https://images.nvidia.com/geforce-c...ie-ultra-graphics-gateway-002-comparison.html

I find the blown out lighting on Ultra to be terrible, and if they are removing texture to speed up processing.......

I would honestly love it someone did a new Image Quality comparison.