The TPU UK Clubhouse

[TheMailMan78]

bah! those images are old.
http://chzmemebase.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/memes-your-retarded.jpg

lol I read that in his voice.

 

[WhiteLotus]

Pedophiles and career criminals do not change. Have you ever seen the stats at where a pedophile commits another crime after being "rehabilitated"? It was almost 98% back in 1997. Really who cares if someone "changes" if they rapped 20+ children or if a scumbag kills a family for a gang initiation? What do they "change" to and why should society care at that point?

The damage they have already done will be felt for generations. Supporting them for decades to come takes the chance away from children who could use the guidance that money could have provided them. So in essence you are perpetuating the problem for generations by not solving it with the ease of an injection or the pull of a trigger.

As for a Biblical take on it I don't think you wanna go there. A) Tatty will have to do some serious cleaning in just a few posts. B) I can show you dozens of examples in the Bible where capital punishment is not only allowed but sanctioned by the almighty himself.

Personally I am looking at this from a logical point of view. Why should a society support someone convicted of a crime and condemned to serve a life sentence? Its like getting a cancer and putting a band aid on it. No its better to cut it out so that the wound may heal and promote growth. Same thing with capital punishment. Why should tax money go to support something that gives nothing back in return when, supporting education has proven to reduce crime? Why?

No really, our justice system is based on the Christian value of reform and repenting. I never said I like it, but that's just the way it is.

That gets expensive really fast.

Not if you stop giving them xbox/sky/whatever.

 

[MilkyWay]

The death penalty is the corner stone of a successfully society. You guys have not lasted 800 years being afraid to punish people with extreme prejudices. Problem is with the US is we don't do it publicly anymore. A few good hangings of some pedophiles and gangbangers and I bet a lot of bullshit would slow down.

Yeah thats why your country has a low crime rate

Corporal Punishment, as Tatty stated many innocent people got the death penalty. Personally i don't think that killing even one innocent person is worth it. People are wrongly accused even with modern techniques, its impossible to tell 100% beyond a doubt. To me how do you determine when someone is guilty? this isn't just vandalism its a serious crime for example. I don't take someone's life lightly.

I don't want people dying in my name, i also wouldn't die for anyone because that's what it amounts to when you have a death sentence would you your self accept the sentence? If you where wrongly accused would you find that acceptable?

But really who are we to decide who dies? When does it just turn into revenge killings? That isnt really what our judicial system is about.

The problem is repeat offenders who cost the most to the system you have to stamp out a culture. Cutting costs where applicable it doesn't really solve the problem the crimes still get committed you have to solve the issues that create the crimes. Prevention is the best medicine.

 

[WhiteLotus]

Yeah thats why your country has a low crime rate

Corporal Punishment, as Tatty stated many innocent people got the death penalty. Personally i don't think that killing even one innocent person is worth it. People are wrongly accused even with modern techniques, its impossible to tell 100% beyond a doubt. To me how do you determine when someone is guilty? this isn't just vandalism its a serious crime for example. I don't take someone's life lightly.

I don't want people dying in my name, i also wouldn't die for anyone because that's what it amounts to when you have a death sentence would you your self accept the sentence? If you where wrongly accused would you find that acceptable?

But really who are we to decide who dies? When does it just turn into revenge killings? That isnt really what our judicial system is about.

The problem is repeat offenders who cost the most to the system you have to stamp out a culture. Cutting costs where applicable it doesn't really solve the problem the crimes still get committed you have to solve the issues that create the crimes. Prevention is the best medicine.

US crime rate has plummeted in the last decade or so

 

[erocker]

US crime rate has plummeted in the last decade or so

Indeed. That's because all of the criminals are locked up, playing Xbox, getting free healthcare and food.

 

[MilkyWay]

Louis Theroux program on BBC 2 Miami Mega Jail didn't exactly show people playing xbox and lounging, aye well that maybe happens in our prisons lol.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Theroux:_Miami_Mega_Jail

It was interesting to see the boot camp that some offenders go to go to.

At the end they showed another prison that some people moved to and there was a lot less fights there.

EDIT: Here is an analogy, if you support the death penalty then what about shooting pow's in war. Id love to hear someone's opinion on that.

 

[TheMailMan78]

Louis Theroux program on BBC 2 Miami Mega Jail didn't exactly show people playing xbox and lounging, aye well that maybe happens in our prisons lol.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Theroux:_Miami_Mega_Jail

It was interesting to see the boot camp that some offenders go to go to.

At the end they showed another prison that some people moved to and there was a lot less fights there.

lol I was in that jail! Dade County.

Here is an analogy, if you support the death penalty then what about shooting pow's in war. Id love to hear someone's opinion on that.

Not the same thing. Not even remotely. No POW should be shot, tortured or anything without a fair trial if even under suspicion. Most soldiers do what they are told and if nothing they did was "morally" corrupt (Rape, Purposely killing civilians etc.) then they should he held until the war is over and released back to their respective nation. They are not criminals.

 

[Tatty_Two]

Death penalty assumes that the person can't change. And our society is based on the fact that people can change and should be given the chance to do so. You know those good old Christian values. I find it very strange that the US, a country that is so fearful of God, is willing enough to take his position in deciding who dies and who does not. All for the sake of, it seems, convenience.

I am glad we no longer have the death penalty but we should definitely have some better prisons/length in time/ justice system.

More importantly to some, Christianity beleives that people can change.... good point though!

 

[FreedomEclipse]

More importantly to some, Christianity beleives that people can change.... good point though!

Depending on their mental state. Not everyone can change. Look at people like Pete Doherty and Amy Winehouse, always going to rehab but going back to the same bad habits as soon as they come back out.

then theirs worse cases such as serial killers and pedophiles and such who are mentally maladjusted to society because they cant stop killing or touching up little kids.

And speaking of touching up little kids. didnt Catholic priests do the same thing behind closed doors and the pope tried to cover it up?

Even if your christian. doesnt mean you cant walk down a dark road like the catholic priests

 

[MightyMission]

i saw amy in a shaka dance over at dingwalls camden-she was licking rocks in a dance
what a waste

 

[FreedomEclipse]

what a waste

Not really. I dont find her particularly attractive. i dont like her singing voice. and with her life style i wouldnt get down and dirty with her if she was the last woman on earth.
I find her just totally repulsive and a total waste of space

shes been to rehab more times then pete doherty's been caught for drug posession. the only reason why hes not in the papers now its because hes found a damn good hiding place and the media are currently up in arms about phone hackings. He will definitely have some crack stashed away somewhere nearby.

she cant be helped. because she cant help herself. its like a mangled dog thats been hit by a car and mangled by a pack of foxes and left for dead. the only humane thing you can do is just end its suffering buy lethal injection or putting a chunk of hot lead right between its eyes.

Rehab isnt where she gets help. its where she goes for a holiday

 

[Tatty_Two]

Depending on their mental state. Not everyone can change. Look at people like Pete Doherty and Amy Winehouse, always going to rehab but going back to the same bad habits as soon as they come back out.

then theirs worse cases such as serial killers and pedophiles and such who are mentally maladjusted to society because they cant stop killing or touching up little kids.

And speaking of touching up little kids. didnt Catholic priests do the same thing behind closed doors and the pope tried to cover it up?

Even if your christian. doesnt mean you cant walk down a dark road like the catholic priests

However thats's irrelivant, the point is they CAN change (if they want to). As I said, I am actually a supporter of the death penalty, being a father and grandfather I think any offenses of a sexual nature against minors should be punishable by death, I just don't necessarily think that is a strong moral standpoint and to be honest, I smell hypocracy when I hear about so called Christian government/parties/leaders supporting the death sentance. Damn we criticise some 2nd and 3rd world countries for their lack of human rights and the way they treat both their innocent and guilty citizens and yet some so called western "Christian" governments do equally oppresive things against Human rights but label that as acceptable.

I could rant on some more, like how we (UK) and the (US) turn round to Pakisatan, North Korea and iran about developing a Nuclear weapons strategy when we have them sat in our own back yard.... ohhhh dear hypocracy again End of rant!

 

[scaminatrix]

Hey peeps - I've been offered a second hand U2UFO (silver) for £100. Is this a good deal?

 

[FreedomEclipse]

Nice deal seeing as they cost $360

 

[MilkyWay]

Thats a big mountain mods case!

EDIT: Actually we might have nukes but maybe not for long as we cant afford to keep them and i doubt people will want to refund a deterrent in this economic climate especially when there is no conventional enemy these days. Things might also change if Scotland ever went independent, like England would then be stumped with all the costs and housing the submarines.

Like i said before having the death sentence becomes mostly about revenge killings "paedophiles should be hanged because i have a daughter". I thought the judicial system was made to be impartial so it could be fair to both parties. You know people get convicted even if they didn't do it, what if you where wrongly accused? Would find that okay? Probably not. Like i said before its like having ones cake and trying to eat it.

As for pow's not that i support this but i cant see how anyone can support the death penalty and not killing pow's. See a country gets invaded it has a right to defend itself from an aggressor, lets say the aggressor kills one of your buddies in the regiment? Maybe you want revenge for that? They killed your mate, hows killing pow's any different to putting a murder to the death sentence, if it happened in your home town or something and it wasn't an opposing army it was another one of your friends in the heat of passion? No to me all the type of killing are the same wrong including the government sanctioned stuff that's done in my name that i never consented to. Death penalty pros state cost and the harm the criminal has done, exactly like a pow hows it any different? They done harm they cost money to keep.

I don't see how anyone can morally say they have the upper hand when it comes to supporting corporal punishment, its either about revenge killings or money. Also i don't believe governments should be based on Christian ideals especially when there are people who don't believe in God or are part of another religion.

Maybe next we can discuss euthanasia or assisted suicide? Btw Im being sarcastic because these type of topics are best not discussed on a tech forum especially when people have ideals and will probably never change them which can lead to arguments and such.

 

[scaminatrix]

It's perfect condition aswell. I should have said - I know it's a good deal, I'm just wondering how good a deal lol
I'll have a look at some FS threads on other forums, see what they've gone for recently.

 

[FreedomEclipse]

For some reason my mind was relating Tatty to 'noob tubes' in Call of duty..... (no idea why) I was gonna say something stupid like "tatty!! release the noobtubes!!"


Random thought

 

[scaminatrix]

Bloody hell, $350 on Hardforums this year. Anyone wanna buy a U2?

j/k, I'm keeping it

 

[Fourstaff]

So I heard people talking about death penalty and stuff like that. I personally support death penalty, because it does gives a strong message to the public. If they got the wrong person? When you fail, try again as mom always say. Call me cruel and heartless etc, but I believe in absolute efficiency.

 

[TheMailMan78]

However thats's irrelivant, the point is they CAN change (if they want to). As I said, I am actually a supporter of the death penalty, being a father and grandfather I think any offenses of a sexual nature against minors should be punishable by death, I just don't necessarily think that is a strong moral standpoint and to be honest, I smell hypocracy when I hear about so called Christian government/parties/leaders supporting the death sentance. Damn we criticise some 2nd and 3rd world countries for their lack of human rights and the way they treat both their innocent and guilty citizens and yet some so called western "Christian" governments do equally oppresive things against Human rights but label that as acceptable.

I could rant on some more, like how we (UK) and the (US) turn round to Pakisatan, North Korea and iran about developing a Nuclear weapons strategy when we have them sat in our own back yard.... ohhhh dear hypocracy again End of rant!

Certain types of people have been proven scientifically not to change or even be capable of change. Yet we keep them alive after causing harm draining the resources for the next generation. It has nothing to do with religion. Its just common sense.

Thats a big mountain mods case!

EDIT: Actually we might have nukes but maybe not for long as we cant afford to keep them and i doubt people will want to refund a deterrent in this economic climate especially when there is no conventional enemy these days. Things might also change if Scotland ever went independent, like England would then be stumped with all the costs and housing the submarines.

Like i said before having the death sentence becomes mostly about revenge killings "paedophiles should be hanged because i have a daughter". I thought the judicial system was made to be impartial so it could be fair to both parties. You know people get convicted even if they didn't do it, what if you where wrongly accused? Would find that okay? Probably not. Like i said before its like having ones cake and trying to eat it.

As for pow's not that i support this but i cant see how anyone can support the death penalty and not killing pow's. See a country gets invaded it has a right to defend itself from an aggressor, lets say the aggressor kills one of your buddies in the regiment? Maybe you want revenge for that? They killed your mate, hows killing pow's any different to putting a murder to the death sentence, if it happened in your home town or something and it wasn't an opposing army it was another one of your friends in the heat of passion? No to me all the type of killing are the same wrong including the government sanctioned stuff that's done in my name that i never consented to. Death penalty pros state cost and the harm the criminal has done, exactly like a pow hows it any different? They done harm they cost money to keep.

I don't see how anyone can morally say they have the upper hand when it comes to supporting corporal punishment, its either about revenge killings or money. Also i don't believe governments should be based on Christian ideals especially when there are people who don't believe in God or are part of another religion.

Maybe next we can discuss euthanasia or assisted suicide? Btw Im being sarcastic because these type of topics are best not discussed on a tech forum especially when people have ideals and will probably never change them which can lead to arguments and such.

Its not about revenge. Its about thinning out the heard of bum stock so new stock can eat.

 

[FreedomEclipse]

So I heard people talking about death penalty and stuff like that. I personally support death penalty, because it does gives a strong message to the public. If they got the wrong person? When you fail, try again as mom always say. Call me cruel and heartless etc, but I believe in absolute efficiency.

so youre happy to watch innocent people get hanged or sent to the electric chair due to overzealous (or just plain useless) cops?

what if it was you who was innocent and being strapped into the electric chair? would you just shrug your shoulders and say to yourself that they wont make the mistake again or would you be kicking and screaming while they drag you to the chair and strap you in, proclaiming your innocents and that they have the wrong guy??

because if thats the way you think then thats just wrong. because every one knows that the London MET police falls far from the tree when it comes to other police forces in dfferent countries. they dont always get their shit right. granted no police force has a 100% track record. but the UK seem to make a lot more errors then anywhere else Ive seen

 

[Fourstaff]

so youre happy to watch innocent people get hanged or sent to the electric chair due to overzealous (or just plain useless) cops?

Not happy, but you cannot have anything if you are not willing to trade something in return. The trade currently stands at: 1 innocent life every so often to stamp down crime. A price I am willing to pay, even if I am the sacrificial goat. I will gladly put my life on the line if it means that lots of other people can benefit from it. (Whether I have the balls to face it when that happens is another matter, courage takes time and experience to build). The Met fails, but that is another matter again. I believe in the principle, executing the plan (pun intended) not of my concern.

 

[FreedomEclipse]

well if your happy to die for other peoples mistakes and Incompetence then more power to you!!

I will not however. youre not a soldier. you have no obligation to anyone asside from yourself. you have a choice. it would be a sad waste of a life if you were to be publicly or privately executed because the cops had the wrong guy. Just like the de Menezes case (stockwell shooting)

the police fucked up. killing an innocent man is an injustice and it would make the MET police even more Complacent because guilty or not. if youre a suspect in a serious crime. they will execute you anyway, and not only is that only wrong. it is the wrong picture to show to the rest of the world. and that makes the UK no better then any country run by a ruthless homicidal mass-murdering dictator that slaughters their own people and dumps them into mass unknown graves.

Learn from their mistakes you say?? the MET police is a joke. Mi5 is also a joke. How many times have you heard on the news that Mi5 recieved tip offs from multiple sources but never acted on it?? so many times have i heard the same thing. If Mi5 or the police had acted. then the london bus bombing probably would have never happend.

you may feel fine about 'sacrificing' yourself for somebodys incompetence. but im not going to take it sitting down if the finger was pointed at me.

 

[Fourstaff]

I don't expect anyone to have the same ideals as me.

However, if I am made the prime minister of UK, one of the first things I get rid of is Health and safety Death Penalty is another one, you must need to have absolute proof for that, eg caught stabbing someone. No wishy washy details like "oh by inference you are the killer". There must be absolute proof to for you to execute a person. Prisoners have to earn their own keep would be another one, I dont expect prisoners to sit in their cells for 20 hours a day "reflecting". What bullshit. Trimming down the public sector will be next, and with that I expect to fire myself by the end of my 5 year tenure.

 

[cheesy999]

believe it or not health and safety laws are no where near as severe as some people make them out to be, they only require companies to take 'reasonable steps' to prevent injury, so alot of these things companies say health and safety won't let them do is often just them looking for an excuse to not do it.

if you were to make a death penalty i would keep it for repeat offenders, not first timers


Going off-topic seeing as this topics now 2 days old, does anybody know how easy it is to go to japan?, cause i really want to go there, a lot!!!

i also want to learn Japanese but i don't know where i could do that...

AND THEY CANCELLED THE NEWS OF THE WORLD, THIS IS TURNING OUT TO BE A REALLY GOOD DAY!!!