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Throttlestop - What is the default value for a PC with Speed Shift setting? Does TS work even after client is closed?

DrixlRey

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Please help!

I checked Speed Shift and changed the value to test, but now that I don't want to use it anymore, am I suppose to uncheck Speed Shift? What I'm really asking is, does a CPU default have Speed Shift ON? And does TS simply let you control it? If I uncheck it does it turn Speed Shift OFF is it a problem?

Secondly I find that after I check a profile and close TS completely, my undervolt + settings is still happening, is this true? I would have to restart the computer to get back to my defaults then?

Lastly, I was told I should have a C0% of less than 1 which would be best. But mine is constantly jumping between 10-30. Is this okay?
 

unclewebb

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Once Speed Shift is enabled within the CPU, the only way to disable it is to reboot. You cannot use software to disable Speed Shift while you are in Windows. When ThrottleStop is open, if it says SST in green on the main screen, Speed Shift is enabled.



In general, ThrottleStop does not reset anything when you exit. Whatever changes you made to your CPU will remain until Windows or some other software comes along and makes changes. If nothing else on your computer makes any changes, your ThrottleStop settings will continue to persist until you reboot. Resuming from sleep or hibernate should also reset your CPU but some times the bios does not always reset the CPU the way it should.

To see what control ThrottleStop has over Speed Shift, open up the FIVR window and look in the monitoring table at the top right. It shows you the Speed Shift EPP value that the CPU is currently using. Depending on how Windows 10 and ThrottleStop are setup, either Window or ThrottleStop will be in control of the Speed Shift EPP value. The value shown in the FIVR window should confirm who is in charge.

If you want to get back to default voltage without rebooting, create a profile in ThrottleStop, check the Unlock Adjustable Voltage box and setup a profile with all of the offset voltage values set to zero. Now you can change to that profile before exiting ThrottleStop and your voltages will be reset to their default values with zero offset. Have a look at the FIVR monitoring table to confirm that your offset voltages have been reset.

When your computer is supposedly idle, if C0% is jumping around from 10% to 30%, that means you have a pile of crap running in the background.

Is this okay?
It might be OK on your computer but this is definitely not OK on any computer I own. I am OCD about crap running on my computer that does not need to be running. Use the C0% data along with the Task Manager to get to the bottom of this problem if you wish to join the OCD club with me.



From this example, you can see that when you pay attention to what you install on your computer, Windows 10 can be extremely efficient. Individual threads are not jumping all over the place because they literally have nothing to do.

Edit - The default Speed Shift EPP value depends on the computer and it depends on what Windows power profile you are using. Do not check the Speed Shift EPP box on the main screen of ThrottleStop and you can have a look in the FIVR window to see what EPP value your computer is using.
 
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DrixlRey

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Thank you for such informative post! I was able to control the undervolting now after your instructions, you were able to answer all my questions!

As far as C0% goes, I can't seem to go under about 1-2 on idle. I disabled pretty much everything that can start including services.

Also your watage is at an incredible 1.5? I can't even get it under 10! What's going on?

I am seeing the realtime undervolt correctly under FIVR, however, am I suppose to see a change in VID and the #W next to PKG Power? When I choose an undervolted profile vs regular, those numbers don't seem to change much. They stay around 1V and 10-20W. No where near as low as yours? What are those?

This is the best I got:
1575857568509.png
 

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unclewebb

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When a CPU is idle, the percentage of time it has to spend working in the C0 state processing background tasks is going to depend on how many cores / threads are available and how fast those cores / threads are running. In my example, the idle workload is being spread out among 8 threads while in your example, the same sort of idle load is being spread out among only 4 threads. Hopefully It makes sense that if only 4 threads are available, they are going to be twice as active compared to a CPU with 8 threads. On modern desktop 6 and 8 core CPUs, the workload is going to be spread out even more so individual threads will need to spend less and less time when idle working in the C0 state.

The next difference in your comparison between our CPUs is that my CPU when idle is being forced to run fast. Most people automatically assume that this is a terrible thing to do. The reality is that Intel CPUs work more efficiently when running fast compared to when running slow. When a CPU has something to do, it can get the job done faster and more efficiently if it is not being held to a slow speed. There is very little reason to slow down an idle CPU as long as it has access to the low power core C states, preferably core C7.

Your idle temps look great so try doing this test. Click on the Speed Shift - EPP box. The value to the right of this box shows 128. You can edit that value. Try changing the EPP value to 0. This tells the CPU to always use maximum performance regardless of CPU load. When idle, you should see that your CPU is running much faster. Now have a look at your idle temperature. Did a huge change in MHz make a huge difference to your idle temps? Probably not. If you do see a significant increase in temperature, have a look to see if your low power C states are enabled.

Try clicking on the C1 button and open up the ThrottleStop C State data window. If the C states are enabled in the bios, you should see your idle CPU cores spending a significant amount of idle time in the core C7 state. If you disabled the C states, reported power consumption will be much higher. That might be a reason why your CPU is reporting 12.2 Watts when idle.

The power consumption data that all Intel CPUs produce is intended to control the turbo boost feature when there is a significant load on the CPU. This data is not the same as measured power consumption. It is just a calculated estimation and is not accurate when a CPU is idle. It should not be used to make comparisons between different CPU generations.
 

SmoothOperator

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It might be OK on your computer but this is definitely not OK on any computer I own. I am OCD about crap running on my computer that does not need to be running. Use the C0% data along with the Task Manager to get to the bottom of this problem if you wish to join the OCD club with me.

I feel like every time I try to get rid of all the windows I find a mountain of new stuff or things I've deleted in the past get re-installed with windows update. And things like Cortana and OneDrive I don't even use them but they are a pain in the butt to actually get rid of. Do you know of any programs or scripts that can remove every that's not necessary in one or two clicks? I've tried programs like system mechanic, Norton, AVG, etc. Works decent for start up programs but doesn't get rid of all the bloated services and registry items.

Do you have any recommendations other then doing the leg work manually? There's got to be a powershell script that can do this much faster, right?
 
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Tarik2719

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Your idle temps look great so try doing this test. Click on the Speed Shift - EPP box. The value to the right of this box shows 128. You can edit that value. Try changing the EPP value to 0. This tells the CPU to always use maximum performance regardless of CPU load. When idle, you should see that your CPU is running much faster. Now have a look at your idle temperature. Did a huge change in MHz make a huge difference to your idle temps? Probably not. If you do see a significant increase in temperature, have a look to see if your low power C states are enabled.
Hi, i know this is a year old but, when i set my speedshift epp to 0 I get really high temps was wondering if you could help me out? idk much about throttlestop or undervolting in general.
 

unclewebb

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idk much about throttlestop or undervolting in general.
You seem like you are interested in this subject. There are a pile of YouTube videos available that discuss using ThrottleStop to undervolt your CPU. Spend a week getting to know the program and what it can do. There are links in the ThrottleStop download to guides and a 1200 page forum on Notebook Review where everything ThrottleStop related has been discussed. Try using the Search button in the ThrottleStop forum at Notebook Review and try using the search feature here at the TechPowerUp forums.

This thread was started last December. Best to start a new thread. Include lots of pictures of ThrottleStop. Show me what testing you have done and ask specific questions. I do not even know what CPU model you have.

I am always willing to help but you have to spend some time getting to know the program.
 
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Once Speed Shift is enabled within the CPU, the only way to disable it is to reboot. You cannot use software to disable Speed Shift while you are in Windows. When ThrottleStop is open, if it says SST in green on the main screen, Speed Shift is enabled.



In general, ThrottleStop does not reset anything when you exit. Whatever changes you made to your CPU will remain until Windows or some other software comes along and makes changes. If nothing else on your computer makes any changes, your ThrottleStop settings will continue to persist until you reboot. Resuming from sleep or hibernate should also reset your CPU but some times the bios does not always reset the CPU the way it should.

To see what control ThrottleStop has over Speed Shift, open up the FIVR window and look in the monitoring table at the top right. It shows you the Speed Shift EPP value that the CPU is currently using. Depending on how Windows 10 and ThrottleStop are setup, either Window or ThrottleStop will be in control of the Speed Shift EPP value. The value shown in the FIVR window should confirm who is in charge.

If you want to get back to default voltage without rebooting, create a profile in ThrottleStop, check the Unlock Adjustable Voltage box and setup a profile with all of the offset voltage values set to zero. Now you can change to that profile before exiting ThrottleStop and your voltages will be reset to their default values with zero offset. Have a look at the FIVR monitoring table to confirm that your offset voltages have been reset.

When your computer is supposedly idle, if C0% is jumping around from 10% to 30%, that means you have a pile of crap running in the background.


It might be OK on your computer but this is definitely not OK on any computer I own. I am OCD about crap running on my computer that does not need to be running. Use the C0% data along with the Task Manager to get to the bottom of this problem if you wish to join the OCD club with me.



From this example, you can see that when you pay attention to what you install on your computer, Windows 10 can be extremely efficient. Individual threads are not jumping all over the place because they literally have nothing to do.

Edit - The default Speed Shift EPP value depends on the computer and it depends on what Windows power profile you are using. Do not check the Speed Shift EPP box on the main screen of ThrottleStop and you can have a look in the FIVR window to see what EPP value your computer is using.
One question about this old post and Speed Shift EPP vs Speed Step...
I have i7-8750h and at default Speed Shift EPP is not checked in main window (but SST is green).
Should I try set this ON and also from TPL enable Speed Shift checkmark (unchecked at default)?
In case, should I also disable old Speed Step from main window?

Or should I simply ignore everything since SST is green?
Thank you
 
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unclewebb

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SST in green indicates that the BIOS has enabled Speed Shift Technology. When Speed Shift is enabled, having the older SpeedStep enabled or disabled seems to make no difference to anything. SpeedStep is no longer used when Speed Shift is enabled.

Or should I simply ignore everything since SST is green?
That is usually best.

When the Speed Shift EPP box is not checked on the main screen of ThrottleStop, use ThrottleStop to switch between the Windows High Performance power plan, the Windows Balanced power plan and the Windows Power Saver power plan. Each time you make a change, open the FIVR window, look at the monitoring table in the top right corner and see if the Speed Shift EPP value changes. Most recent computers will automatically change the EPP value to control the CPU. The High Performance power plan typically sets EPP to 0, Balanced sets EPP to 84 and Power Saver sets EPP to 153. If this is working correctly, there is no need to check the Speed Shift EPP box in ThrottleStop.
 
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Thank you for reply. Yes, I can see it changing from 0-84 when I'm at desktop so everything seems ok leaving it as it is.
 
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