Time for a new computer?

[currahee440]

Hey guys I was just wondering. I was thinking about making a new computer. Some people have been suggesting my Core 2 Duo was old now and I have a friend willing to buy that computer which means potential $$$ for a new computer.

But I have two questions before I want to make up my mind.
1: How old IS the Core 2 Duo now anyway? In relation to game performance today
2: Is the Core i5 Quad Core a good choice?

Most games have been running fine. I suppose I'll find out how old my Core 2 is when I get my Radeon HD 5770 which I heard may get bottlenecked by the Core 2 Duo.

I've also looked extensively at the Anandtech CPU charts and it seems like I should get the Core i5 to get ANY worthwhile performance benefit. Core i3 is more of a don't bother. I've looked into the Phenoms and they're also more of a "meh, why bother?" CPU which is kinda shocking...

 

[enaher]

C2D is still fine by today standards for gaming, that E8200 can be oc to 3.4 by increasing its fsb the thing is your mobo probably won't have oc options, still if you can sell your current system you might want to go AMD buy a cheaper board and proc and try to go for the 5850 and will get overall better performance, or if you prefer intel go for the i5 750 at least and the best card you can get.

AMD Athlon II 635 + Asrock extreme 890gx + HD5850 is a good choice for gaming

I5 750 + MSI P55 GD65 + 5770 quite bit less gamin performance but better overall at other tasks...

 

[Hayder_Master]

right now C2D looks ok but not too long, games going to quad starting with BC2 and who is know maybe all games in end of this year use quad, core i5 it's really nice for gaming with good overclock range, 5770 is a good card but more money for 5850 isn't waste

 

[Mussels]

core 2 duo is fine, the problem is that yours is one of the cut back models with lower cache - without overclocking, its going to be a low end gaming CPU, not the midrange it could have been.


My opinion is definitely to save up for a new PC, but you dont need to do it in any big hurry. Take your time and dont take shortcuts this time (dont get a cutback CPU, dont get a budget motherboard, and dont get a weird amount of ram that stops you running dual channel)

 

[roast]

I agree with Mussels there. For the moment, I dont think theres any games which are going to force you to upgrade, but nevertheless it would probably be best to start saving up for a new rig now.
The P55 platform would suit you fine, I think.

 

[mosheen]

isn't a e8200 just a slower e8400??
It should still have 6MB cache.

I would suggest you try get that FSB as high as possible.
That low multi would definitely make overclocking a challenge on that board.

+1 saving for a new PC in about 6 month.

 

[Mussels]

actually, you're right - its got the 6MB, and the low multiplier. it must be the quads that have the cache (Q9200)

so yeah, its performance isnt the issue, the overclocking is (and with a G33 from a prebuilt, zero chance of OC)

 

[qubit]

If you see my system specs, you'll see that I've got an E8500 o/c to 4.11GHz, which still runs any game you throw at it very well. This CPU can actually do something like 4.8GHz (I tried it) but I don't have the cooling to run it like that for more than a few minutes.

An i5-750 may actually show a performance loss in games compared to this, it all depends on how far you can overclock it. It does give you 4 threads however. This is nice to have, but still isn't really taken advantage of with today's software. I know your CPU is slower than mine, but I don't think it changes the equation all that much. All C2Ds are capable CPUs.

The more important thing about the i5-750 is that it comes in an LGA 1156 socket. There is no upgrade path to 6 and 8 core CPUs from there and is slowly being phased out in favour of LGA 1366. You'll have to get a new motherboard to upgrade from it.

If I were you, I'd wait a while before spending significant money on a new rig.

 

[mosheen]

I suggest you look into software overclocking in windows itself.
You might raise the fsb a bit, but dont expect too much.

 

[Fourstaff]

You might want to take a look at the core i3's if you are aiming for budget gaming, its 2 core beats the 4 core Athlons. However, if you are doing things like video encoding and other multithreaded apps, then you should look at i5's and Phenom II X4's.

 

[currahee440]

My opinion is definitely to save up for a new PC, but you dont need to do it in any big hurry. Take your time and dont take shortcuts this time (dont get a cutback CPU, dont get a budget motherboard, and dont get a weird amount of ram that stops you running dual channel)

Lol I got my PC from HP. I actually like the G33 they gave me. At least it has a PCIe slot and four memory banks. I was anticipating having only 2 memory banks that cheapo mobos have. You know what they used to do back in the days oef AGP? they would actually remove the AGP slot. Quite dickish of them to do. And even in 5GB it runs in dual channel. I think what it does is that (I've looked this up) 4GB is running in dual channel while the remaining 1GB in the 2GB ram I have runs in single channel. I actually had 3 1GB ram sticks. If I could run 4GB why not have 5? Not that it needs even 5GB to run Windows 7.

isn't a e8200 just a slower e8400??
It should still have 6MB cache.

I would suggest you try get that FSB as high as possible.
That low multi would definitely make overclocking a challenge on that board.

+1 saving for a new PC in about 6 month.

That's the thing, if I want to upgrade (I definitely can this summer) shouldI just do it now with a Core i5 quad core? or wait? Keeping in mind that a friend of mine actually wants to buy my Core 2 Duo system. He just wants to run Starcraft II on maxed settings. Which the desktop will do quite admirably.

I suggest you look into software overclocking in windows itself.
You might raise the fsb a bit, but dont expect too much.

Yup I'm looking into this.

You might want to take a look at the core i3's if you are aiming for budget gaming, its 2 core beats the 4 core Athlons. However, if you are doing things like video encoding and other multithreaded apps, then you should look at i5's and Phenom II X4's.

I looked at Anandtech's CPU benchmark chart. The results suggest that at the same clock speed, I'm better off not upgrading at all because the benefit going from a Core 2 to a Core i3 is negligible.

The system I would build would basically be a Core i5 Quad Core, 4GB RAM, and a Radeon HD 5770. On Newegg I would need to spend about $600, reusing some components before I sell off my desktop to my friend.

Someone here suggested that the LGA 1156 platform is going to be quickly outdated though with 1366 being the standard for the future. Can anyone confirm this? Although it seems to entirely make sense that Intel would do this.

I'm not going AMD because their performance per clock is HORRENDOUS. No offense to AMD fans. But at the same clock with the Core 2 Quads, the Phenom IIs are 20% slower already. And it gets even worse with Core i7s.

Thanks a lot gents

 

[Mussels]

you've got that wrong: it runs the matched channels in dual, and the non matched in single.

so with 3x1GB and 1x2GB you've got:

Channel A: 1GB + 1GB
Channel B: 2GB + 1GB

so only 2GB of your 5GB is running dual channel.

G33 may have a PCI-E slot but thats hardly something to be proud about... $50 mobos come with those.

 

[currahee440]

Really? I thought it was running in flex mode which would make the most sense to me.
I'm not saying i'm proud that there's a PCIe slot. I'm just saying I'm surprised that they at least didn't actually remove or ordered the mobo so that there isn't a PCIe slot.... because in the P4 days that's what they used to do. Remove the AGP slot physically.

 

[PaulieG]

Lol I got my PC from HP. I actually like the G33 they gave me. At least it has a PCIe slot and four memory banks. I was anticipating having only 2 memory banks that cheapo mobos have. You know what they used to do back in the days oef AGP? they would actually remove the AGP slot. Quite dickish of them to do. And even in 5GB it runs in dual channel. I think what it does is that (I've looked this up) 4GB is running in dual channel while the remaining 1GB in the 2GB ram I have runs in single channel. I actually had 3 1GB ram sticks. If I could run 4GB why not have 5? Not that it needs even 5GB to run Windows 7.


That's the thing, if I want to upgrade (I definitely can this summer) shouldI just do it now with a Core i5 quad core? or wait? Keeping in mind that a friend of mine actually wants to buy my Core 2 Duo system. He just wants to run Starcraft II on maxed settings. Which the desktop will do quite admirably.


Yup I'm looking into this.


I looked at Anandtech's CPU benchmark chart. The results suggest that at the same clock speed, I'm better off not upgrading at all because the benefit going from a Core 2 to a Core i3 is negligible.

The system I would build would basically be a Core i5 Quad Core, 4GB RAM, and a Radeon HD 5770. On Newegg I would need to spend about $600, reusing some components before I sell off my desktop to my friend.

Someone here suggested that the LGA 1156 platform is going to be quickly outdated though with 1366 being the standard for the future. Can anyone confirm this? Although it seems to entirely make sense that Intel would do this.

I'm not going AMD because their performance per clock is HORRENDOUS. No offense to AMD fans. But at the same clock with the Core 2 Quads, the Phenom IIs are 20% slower already. And it gets even worse with Core i7s.

Thanks a lot gents

The "quickly outdated" stuff is just nonsense. Obviously, both Intel and AMD are always working on new platforms, but you should have a good long while before you have to consider this. Also, there is no reason to believe that 1366 will outlast 1156, since more consumers can afford a 1156 setup. The only argument one could have about 1366 outlasting, would be the 6 core upgrade path, but even this doesn't make sense to me, since this is a very expensive upgrade, one that few consumers will take advantage of. The 1156 platform gives gives the flexibility of dual or quad core, and economical to enthusiast chips.

 

[currahee440]

Well you see.... argh. I might actually consider AMD because mentioning that makes me mad. At least AMD designs their stuff so it lasts maybe 2 generations. Their 6 core CPU though is kind of attractive to me right now. Just saying that I have a 6 core CPU

 

[brandonwh64]

Im sorry currahee but a AMD 965 system with 4gb of ram would run games just as good as an I7 so i dont see were amds performance is HORRIBLE? Also you havnt noticed that AMD has the new 6 core CPUS that have been OCing pretty good. the 1090T i have seen is averaged 4ghz. A phenom II Quad with 4gb of ram and a 5850 would spank MOST games out there these days.

 

[_JP_]

I'm not going AMD because their performance per clock is HORRENDOUS. No offense to AMD fans. But at the same clock with the Core 2 Quads, the Phenom IIs are 20% slower already. And it gets even worse with Core i7s.
Thanks a lot gents

Ok, let me stop you right there!
What you just said is plain wrong. AMD processors preform quite well and while comparing side by side a AMD platform with a Intel platform, your eye won't tell the difference, trust me on this, I've seen it.

Seriously! Don't go that way! Get the best Performance to price ratio and don't make a stupid choice.

I recommend a AMD solution, because Some Intel processors are overpriced and not worth it if you're not a serious overclocker, but even if you are, you can have a lot of fun with a AMD.

"Someone here suggested that the LGA 1156 platform is going to be quickly outdated though with 1366 being the standard for the future. Can anyone confirm this? Although it seems to entirely make sense that Intel would do this."

You've just answered to your question. Intel is constantly releasing new sockets and in two years two new sockets will be released (Haswell), probably with new technology/innovations that will make the previous (Actual) ones outdated.

On a personal note, I'm quite fed up with people making wrong choices just by looking at benchmarking charts! Same with graphics cards, above the 50 FPS, the eyes don't see the difference between a game running at 80 FPS and the same running at 100 FPS.
The damn benches only matter if you masturbate to them. Other than that, there's no significant difference.

 

[mosheen]

+1 5850
If you want to upgrade do it right
9800gt to 5770
if you want to go cheap, get an i3 and clock it to 4.5ghz

 

[Mussels]

1156 is being phased out for 1155, while 1366 is going to stick around for longer.

1155 is going to have the GPU built into the CPU, for those that want it (none of us)

 

[PaulieG]

1156 is being phased out for 1155, while 1366 is going to stick around for longer.

1155 is going to have the GPU built into the CPU, for those that want it (none of us)

Mussels, do you have a good source/link on 1156 being phased out? My source tells me that it will be like 2 years before this starts to happen, which is just typical of platform changes.

 

[CJCerny]

Based on your current specs, I don't see any reason to buy a new PC. You can get a much faster video card than a 8800gt for not much jack, but it would cost you quite a bit to get a considerably faster CPU than what you have now, which would be something like an i7 920, for which the mobo and RAM still command premium prices. Save your cash on a CPU spend it only on a new video card (ATI 57xx or 58xx).

 

[Mussels]

intels CPU roadmap... they arent releasing any new chips beyond whats already out now, whereas 1366 is at least getting the 6 cores.

 

[currahee440]

Based on your current specs, I don't see any reason to buy a new PC. You can get a much faster video card than a 8800gt for not much jack, but it would cost you quite a bit to get a considerably faster CPU than what you have now, which would be something like an i7 920, for which the mobo and RAM still command premium prices. Save your cash on a CPU spend it only on a new video card (ATI 57xx or 58xx).

Hah yea hence the debate. Because going from a Core 2 to ANY recent platform will involve a new mobo + new cpu which makes it expensive.
I did order a 5770 for my new compy system. I'm getting it today but won't have a chance to plop it into my desktop until next weekend so I'll be able to figure out then if I want a new desktop or not. If you've read what I've written, a friend of mine wants to buy my old desktop. So money becomes less of an issue now.

I don't want anything overly powerful. Just something that'll handle next generation games decently. A lot of people were saying that my 5770 was a poor choice, but I only play games at 1680x1050 which I think will be more than enough for the 5770. I just don't see the logic in paying like $300 for high end chips that will become midrange within a generation or two. I'll consider the Phenom II, but I'm still a little weary on them. But let's see if my Intel rage flares up during this discussion I'm always a keen supporter of the underdogs.

 

[Mussels]

your two options with high end future proofing is:

890FX board + phenom II x6
1366 board + i7 930 (its the cheapest i7, isnt it?)

4/6GB DDR3

a new PSU if you go intel, the AMD + 5770 combo would be rather power efficient.

 

[JrRacinFan]

5770 is fine. Oh and from my personal use, I am just as happy with the X2 240 in my wife's pc as much so as when I had an e8500 for a few weeks.

I don't use that PC much, but they just feel the same to me performance wise.


^^Best suggestion you're going to get!! If you're strapped for cash lower the board to an 870 or 880G with the Phenom II X6.