Updating fans on AIO, is it worth the trouble ?

[OxSteve]

Hello Tech guys,

I'm running an i9 14900K on a Silent Loop 2 360MM Aio. During full load, ie stress test, shader compiling on some games, installing repack games, ... the CPU termal throttles, reaching 100°C, going from 5.7Ghz to 5-5.2Ghz.

My question : Would there be any benefit in updating the Silent Wing 3 High Speed fans on my AIO with better ones ( faster RPM, better airflow, better air pressure) to achieve better cooling ?
Any feedback on this process ?

Any other suggestions are welcome...

Thanks !

 

[Vya Domus]

It's not going to make much of a difference.

 

[Ruru]

Perfectly normal temps for that heater CPU, even Intel said that 100C is fine.

 

[OxSteve]

Perfectly normal temps for that heater CPU, even Intel said that 100C is fine.

OK, so that means that I cannot have my CPU running @ 5.7Ghz at full load, and it is by design ? I probably miss a point here with the frequencies of 14th gen : i noticed when in the bios, the CPU is @3.2Ghz, and it is also referenced in datasheet as a 3.2Ghz processor with max speed 5.7Ghz (even 6Ghz on 2 Cores) using turbo technologies. Do I have to understand that this 5.7Ghz are not guaranteed at all ?

 

[Ruru]

OK, so that means that I cannot have my CPU running @ 5.7Ghz at full load, and it is by design ? I probably miss a point here with the frequencies of 14th gen : i noticed when in the bios, the CPU is @3.2Ghz, and it is also referenced in datasheet as a 3.2Ghz processor with max speed 5.7Ghz (even 6Ghz on 2 Cores) using turbo technologies. Do I have to understand that this 5.7Ghz are not guaranteed at all ?

Practically they're "up to" frequencies and you'll practically need really beefy cooling for those clocks to stay longer for a blink of an eye. 14900K is practically a rebranded 13900KS which was already factory-overclocked to the max as those emergency editions do.

I guess they allow their max temp to be bumped but since 13th/14th gen CPUs are known to fail, I wouldn't play with fire.

 

[Upgrayedd]

Turn off the motherboard vendor's all core turbo if it's on. And update your bios if you haven't

 

[OxSteve]

Practically they're "up to" frequencies and you'll practically need really beefy cooling for those clocks to stay longer for a blink of an eye. 14900K is practically a rebranded 13900KS which was already factory-overclocked to the max as those emergency editions do.

I guess they allow their max temp to be bumped but since 13th/14th gen CPUs are known to fail, I wouldn't play with fire.

Thanks for you answers, I realize I was on a wild goose chase with the frequencies/termal throttle , the behaviour i noticed is normal for a 14th gen, so be it !

Turn off the motherboard vendor's all core turbo if it's on. And update your bios if you haven't

Yes, Bios is with microcode 0x12B since day one availability on MSI site.

I never thought of disabling the turbo , so i check on my BIOS, I have 3 occurrences of "turbo" in the OC tab :
Intel Turbo Boost [Enabled/Disabled]
Intel Turbo Boost Max Technology 3.0 [Enabled/disabled]
Enhanced Turbo [Auto/Enabled/Disabled]

The latter is only available if the foirst is Enabled.

I tried all combinaisons Enabled / Disabled, the result :
If the 1rst is disabled, the CPU only run @3.2Ghz , so no termal issue , but this not what I need
If 2nd is disabled and 1rst enabled : no difference, Run @ 5.7ghz low load, and 5Ghz high load
I havn't seen a difference when disabling the 3rd

The description on MSI bios is cryptic, I don't see what the 2nd and 3rrd are supposed to do.

 

[Ruru]

Thanks for you answers, I realize I was on a wild goose chase with the frequencies/termal throttle , the behaviour i noticed is normal for a 14th gen, so be it !


Yes, Bios is with microcode 0x12B since day one availability on MSI site.

I never thought of disabling the turbo , so i check on my BIOS, I have 3 occurrences of "turbo" in the OC tab :
Intel Turbo Boost [Enabled/Disabled]
Intel Turbo Boost Max Technology 3.0 [Enabled/disabled]
Enhanced Turbo [Auto/Enabled/Disabled]

The latter is only available if the foirst is Enabled.

I tried all combinaisons Enabled / Disabled, the result :
If the 1rst is disabled, the CPU only run @3.2Ghz , so no termal issue , but this not what I need
If 2nd is disabled and 1rst enabled : no difference, Run @ 5.7ghz low load, and 5Ghz high load
I havn't seen a difference when disabling the 3rd

The description on MSI bios is cryptic, I don't see what the 2nd and 3rrd are supposed to do.

I'd try disabling the enchanced turbo first.

 

[OxSteve]

I'd try disabling the enchanced turbo first.

Indeed, I rechecked the BIOS description for that feature and it reads : Enables or disables Turbo function for all CPU cores to boost CPU performance.
The default value is Auto, I also tested Disabled and Enabled.
-Disabled, the behavior is pretty much the same, when at full load, the CPU thermal throttled and frequencies swing back and forth around 5.4Ghz
-Enabled, the temperature is near 100°C, but the frequencies are more stable around 5.6Ghz, even on 1 or 2 core up to 5.8Ghz ! never seen that before @ full load.
Auto seems to be disabled, but i would not bet on my life on it.

So I guess I will let it on enabled, and see if it is stable on the long range...

 

[Upgrayedd]

Indeed, I rechecked the BIOS description for that feature and it reads : Enables or disables Turbo function for all CPU cores to boost CPU performance.
The default value is Auto, I also tested Disabled and Enabled.
-Disabled, the behavior is pretty much the same, when at full load, the CPU thermal throttled and frequencies swing back and forth around 5.4Ghz
-Enabled, the temperature is near 100°C, but the frequencies are more stable around 5.6Ghz, even on 1 or 2 core up to 5.8Ghz ! never seen that before @ full load.
Auto seems to be disabled, but i would not bet on my life on it.

So I guess I will let it on enabled, and see if it is stable on the long range...

The last one is giving you your hot temps. Instead of boosting behaving as Intel intended, the motherboard's vendor is using its own definition of boosting, which is run every single p core at full blast. As cores see usage the speed should step down as more cores are engaged.
1-2 cores is that advertised max freq on the box. As more get engaged the speed comes down on all cores so the processor behaves more efficient and consumes less energy, less heat, this is the ntended way to run. Turn it off. Intel's boosting should be left on, the motherboard vendor's gets turned off.

 

[OxSteve]

The last one is giving you your hot temps. Instead of boosting behaving as Intel intended, the motherboard's vendor is using its own definition of boosting, which is run every single p core at full blast. As cores see usage the speed should step down as more cores are engaged.
1-2 cores is that advertised max freq on the box. As more get engaged the speed comes down on all cores so the processor behaves more efficient and consumes less energy, less heat, this is the ntended way to run. Turn it off. Intel's boosting should be left on, the motherboard vendor's gets turned off.

Ok I get it, that 's clear..
In the meantime, I launched OCCT stability test for 1 hour, and I got errors, so I reversed back to Intel recommended setting in the BIOS, this boost is no longer enabled .
Thanks for the answers.

 

[AleXXX666]

Good Noctua fans could help tho.

 

[DirtyDingusMcgee]

It can't hurt. I never turn down cooling enhancement. it's a pretty cheap upgrade.

 

[cvaldes]

I have experimented replacing AIO factory fans with others (typically Noctua NF-12 units) and I've never seen any drastic cooling improvement with an aftermarket fan.

I did keep the Noctuas when the acoustics were improved over the factory original fans. Namely I have Noctua fans on a discontinued EVGA CLC24 as well as an older Cooler Master MasterLiquid 240.

I am satisfied with the performance and acoustics of the factory fans on Arctic LiquidFreezer II & III AIOs as well as the newer Cooler Master MasterLiquid AIO.

 

[stahlhart]

I have a Lian Li 360 in the i5 build where the stock fans were noisy at higher RPMs; swapping them out for Arctic P12s made for a significant audible improvement, but no real change in cooling performance that I can detect.

 

[OxSteve]

Thanks for the feedback guys ! so no noticeable cooling improvement when changing fans, that is the info i was looking for !