USB-C Chargers Are the Future: European Union Signs Common Charging Standard Into Law

[bug]

Apple's "Lightning" cable is way more convenient than USB.

Because it's like 1mm narrower?

It also reduces drastically damage on the ports.

Source, or I'm calling BS.

 

[Mussels]

Ah. Personally I don't see a reason why it should be C on the charger as A is fine. But well, nobody asked me though.

Because USB A can only send 2.5W of power on the official specs?
It's stupid to have everyone using custom cables and standards because that's why shit like macs exploding when a USB hub were connected to them occurs

Apple just want to sell products that can't be used for any competing devices, so that you stay with them out of fear of losing your 'investment' in chargers, accesories and app purchases that cant be used on other platforms

 

[Prima.Vera]

Knowing Apple, they will just keep the Lighting port on the phone, and offer an adaptor. For extra charge, naturally.

 

[Keullo-e]

Because USB A can only send 2.5W of power on the official specs?
It's stupid to have everyone using custom cables and standards because that's why shit like macs exploding when a USB hub were connected to them occurs

Apple just want to sell products that can't be used for any competing devices, so that you stay with them out of fear of losing your 'investment' in chargers, accesories and app purchases that cant be used on other platforms

I bolded that what I meant. Who cares about the official limits? :S

 

[bug]

I bolded that what I meant. Who cares about the official limits? :S

When it comes to power delivery, pretty much everyone.

 

[trsttte]

Knowing Apple, they will just keep the Lighting port on the phone, and offer an adaptor. For extra charge, naturally.

They'll be loosing access to a market with almost half a billion people in the EU (and UK) and soon enought another cool billion and half when the USA and maybe India roll out the same rules.

Not a great plan...

 

[R0H1T]

They'll eventually switch over to type C anyway, likely before US or India mandates it. Apple knows where the bean counters are & they'll usually do everything in their power to not slay the golden goose!

 

[Valantar]

Knowing Apple, they will just keep the Lighting port on the phone, and offer an adaptor. For extra charge, naturally.

That won't be sufficient to achieve compliance, so if that's what they did they'd have to leave the EU market. Not likely.

I am all for standardized and intercompatible cables & chargers, but regulating connectors is just dumb. It hinders inovation,

Citation needed

creates monopolies

Citation needed

& has like no impact on e-waste.

Citation needed

Hope Apple just throws a USB/Lighting adapter in the box & tells the EU to FuuOff when they're threatening with fines.

See above. They could do that, and they'd enjoy the consequences of being unable to sell their products to one of the largest markets in the world. Rather unlikely.

Seriously though, none of your "arguments" here are anything beyond FUD and scaremongering. How, exactly, does standardizing USB-C "create monopolies"? For whom? How? How does it hinder innovation, precisely? And how does standardizing chargers and charging cables not have the potential to reduce e-waste? Sure, some of this benefit has already happened through debundling chargers, but this would never have happened unless the industry had already been moving towards standardization of USB-C and PD.

 

[MarsM4N]

So you're against standardising electrical wall outlets too? Maybe every city/region should have their own sockets and plugs? They could still use the same type of cables after all...

We have no globally standardized wall outlets. It's a jungle out there: AC power plugs and sockets

Because it's like 1mm narrower?

Source, or I'm calling BS.

A "Apple Lightning" connector is only around 1mm thick, so it's by design the "weakest link in the chain".
If you manage to break it, it's usually the connector that breaks first. The Lightning connector is also very rounded on the tip, which reduces it happening. It also slips in & out way easier.

Here are some examples from broken Lighting connectors. Couldn't find anything about broken Lighting ports. Broken USB ports however en mass, where it's very often straight rips off the USB port from the board. So you see, what reduces e-waste more, a broken cable or a device with a broken USB port (which very often isn't worth it getting it fixed)?

Charger broke off inside iPhone 7
How to tell if your iPhone Lightning charging cable is a fake
Remove Broken Cable From iPhone/iPad Easily!

Seriously though, none of your "arguments" here are anything beyond FUD and scaremongering. How, exactly, does standardizing USB-C "create monopolies"? For whom? How? How does it hinder innovation, precisely? And how does standardizing chargers and charging cables not have the potential to reduce e-waste? Sure, some of this benefit has already happened through debundling chargers, but this would never have happened unless the industry had already been moving towards standardization of USB-C and PD.

Patents & licensing fees for products using them. And of course who will get the license & who doesn't.

But "Lightning" vs. "USB-C" is a bad example. Turns out Apple is also the owner of the USB-C patent, lol.

 

[bug]

We have no globally standardized wall outlets. It's a jungle out there: AC power plugs and sockets



A "Apple Lightning" connector is only around 1mm thick, so it's by design the "weakest link in the chain".
If you manage to break it, it's usually the connector that breaks first. The Lightning connector is also very rounded on the tip, which reduces it happening. It also slips in & out way easier.

Here are some examples from broken Lighting connectors. Couldn't find anything about broken Lighting ports. Broken USB ports however en mass, where it's very often straight rips off the USB port from the board. So you see, what reduces e-waste more, a broken cable or a device with a broken USB port (which very often isn't worth it getting it fixed)?

Charger broke off inside iPhone 7
How to tell if your iPhone Lightning charging cable is a fake
Remove Broken Cable From iPhone/iPad Easily!



Patents & licensing fees for products using them. And of course who will get the license & who doesn't.

But "Lightning" vs. "USB-C" is a bad example. Turns out Apple is also the owner of the USB-C patent, lol.

So... no source.

That "insert superglue into your phone's port" is a gem though.

 

[MarsM4N]

So... no source.

That "insert superglue into your phone's port" is a gem though.

What do you want, a scientific study? It's just common sense, and the experience of folks out there breaking tons of stuff should be proof enough.
Just do some research on the web. Or send some eMails to smartphone fixing shops, bet you'll hear the same from them.

 

[Valantar]

Patents & licensing fees for products using them. And of course who will get the license & who doesn't.

But "Lightning" vs. "USB-C" is a bad example. Turns out Apple is also the owner of the USB-C patent, lol.

What? "The USB-C patent"? Did you even look at that (horribly written and worse researched) article? There is no "USB-C patent". That patent broadly describes the mode of operations of a reversible connector. USB-C is a standard controlled by the USB-IF. Licencing fees are negligible if they exist at all - as demonstrated by USB-C being adopted into literally everything. This is just not a real concern.

As for durability: what you're saying here largely applied to micro USB, but not USB-C, which is far stronger. There's an argument to be made for designing for the cable to fail first being a good approach, however there's a matching argument to be made for how lightning is designed to fail early and often to sell more cables. Durable hardware is the best of both worlds, and USB-C delivers that. No hardware is infallible, but USB-C is pretty strong.

 

[bug]

What do you want, a scientific study? It's just common sense, and the experience of folks out there breaking tons of stuff should be proof enough.
Just do some research on the web. Or send some eMails to smartphone fixing shops, bet you'll hear the same from them.

I haven't broken a USB connector in 20 years. What you're talking about is not really a problem, it's just a made up argument in favor of Apple's otherwise indefensible stance.

 

[TheLostSwede]

We have no globally standardized wall outlets. It's a jungle out there: AC power plugs and sockets

Sure, but it's still heavily regulated in your country. I mean, Germany invented the Schuko plug after all, which is used by half of Europe, the rest went with the French plugs largely, unless you're the UK (and poor Ireland), the crazy Danes or Switzerland. Even Italy is moving towards using the Schuko plug.
As this is an EU law, I think that's a fair comparison.
That said, this is also a reason why a common, global charging standard makes sense, as you can take your product, that you bought in Germany, fly to wherever in the world and know that you'll be able to charge it when you arrive. That's a pretty solid reason for making USB-C the standard charging connector in my book.
Just today, someone in my uni class asked for an iPhone charger, which no-one had with with them, while several people had USB-C chargers...

What? "The USB-C patent"? Did you even look at that (horribly written and worse researched) article? There is no "USB-C patent". That patent broadly describes the mode of operations of a reversible connector. USB-C is a standard controlled by the USB-IF. Licencing fees are negligible if they exist at all - as demonstrated by USB-C being adopted into literally everything. This is just not a real concern.

There's no licensing fee for USB at all, however, there is a certification cost if you want to use the USB-IF logos.

 

[windwhirl]

By the way, regarding some concerns of reduced innovation, I'll just mention that USB is made and supported by the industry at large (Microsoft, Apple, Intel, HP, etc.), so pushing for more USB adoption will likely make no difference in regards to "innovation" compared to letting everyone do whatever.

 

[bug]

By the way, regarding some concerns of reduced innovation, I'll just mention that USB is made and supported by the industry at large (Microsoft, Apple, Intel, HP, etc.), so pushing for more USB adoption will likely make no difference in regards to "innovation" compared to letting everyone do whatever.

That argument is yet another red herring. While the regulation mandates charging by means of USB-PD, it does not forbid you to offer whatever better charging scheme you can think of in addition to USB-PD.

 

[Fourstaff]

Big fan of this move, I have 2 laptop chargers and a bunch of cables on my desk just to keep everything juiced. If everything can be plugged to the same USB-C port(s) then the number of wires can be drastically reduced and I don't need to keep plugging/unplugging to charge various devices.

 

[TheLostSwede]

Big fan of this move, I have 2 laptop chargers and a bunch of cables on my desk just to keep everything juiced. If everything can be plugged to the same USB-C port(s) then the number of wires can be drastically reduced and I don't need to keep plugging/unplugging to charge various devices.

In fact, most 100 W plus GaN chargers offer better PFC and are often higher quality than lower Wattage chargers, which means they often draw less vampire power and have better power conversion.
Even a "bad" GaN charger is better than a traditional charger in almost all scenarios.
On top of that, lower output chargers can in general charge something like a laptop that comes with a 100 W charger just fine, it just takes longer.

 

[trsttte]

A "Apple Lightning" connector is only around 1mm thick, so it's by design the "weakest link in the chain".
If you manage to break it, it's usually the connector that breaks first. The Lightning connector is also very rounded on the tip, which reduces it happening. It also slips in & out way easier

And yet USB-C still has a higher reliability rating versus lightning (as in one of them provides a number - very high in fact - and certification, the other refuses to and hides behind a "look, it's a simpler design less prone to accidents!!!" and behind a licensing fee Apple is happy to collect at the same time as it bundles the most flimsy cables possible with their products.

We have no globally standardized wall outlets. It's a jungle out there: AC power plugs and sockets

Yes, outside any specific region it is, so you see the benefit of having a common standard right!?

 

[Prima.Vera]

How does it hinder innovation, precisely?

I think the following can and will happened. In a decade, when USB 5 then USB 6 will arrive, with transfer speeds of 1Tbps and over, a new cable, but also a new port will be required because of different technology . How is that going to happen then if EU only allows old ports?

 

[Mussels]

I bolded that what I meant. Who cares about the official limits? :S

you should. because apple products tend to either kill themselves or the user when they go wrong
I don't even need to provide links, it's in the news here every other month about someone getting electrocuted or a house burning down and it's always apple products
And unlike the USA, apple is a minority here so it's not because theres more of them

I haven't broken a USB connector in 20 years. What you're talking about is not really a problem, it's just a made up argument in favor of Apple's otherwise indefensible stance.

I've only seen maybe 2-3 damaged phone USB ports over the years and maybe 10 on PC's - all from users who would break *anything* they had.


I'm still using the charging cables that came with my Pixel 1, i'm yet to have a single USB C cable break on me and only one port - the port on my Fractal Define R6 which had something fall inside it and catch fire

Lightning is 480Mb and 10W

USB-C can scale from that to 80Gb and 240W, letting it be used on cheap stuff or expensive products. It's a no brainer.

One single 65W charger in my house charges:
4x phones
2x samsung tablets
2x older samsung tablets using a micro-B to C converter
3x nintendo switch
1x quest 2
1x Xbox elite S2 controller
3x nintendo switch controllers (all different types)
2x Chromecast w/ remote


I still need a 5V 1A genuine apple charger and cord here, because we have friends with iphones that are always flat, and refuse to work off generic equipment.


All of these type-C devices are intercompatible with accesories - all the host devices can work with the same chargers (Not always with quick charging, but they all charge off a basic 5V 1A at minimum)
They all work with USB-C headphones
Chromecast, phones, tablets, switches - all work with the same USB-C hub that adds USB ports for mice/keyboards/card readers/USB speakers. They all "just work" together.



Even apple knows it's useless, or they'd not be using type C for their laptops.
They just like having you spend money for hardware that goes in the bin if you leave them - you need to buy EVERYTHING from them so they profit, and none of it may work for another brand if you do.

Nothing like an apple user wanting to back up their 100GB of photos and videos and finding out they're stuck paying for cloud storage since you cant copy/paste over USB, and they're limited to 30MB/s if they use ghetto solutions to try and make it work

 

[Keullo-e]

you should. because apple products tend to either kill themselves or the user when they go wrong
I don't even need to provide links, it's in the news here every other month about someone getting electrocuted or a house burning down and it's always apple products
And unlike the USA, apple is a minority here so it's not because theres more of them

I've only seen maybe 2-3 damaged phone USB ports over the years and maybe 10 on PC's - all from users who would break *anything* they had.


I'm still using the charging cables that came with my Pixel 1, i'm yet to have a single USB C cable break on me and only one port - the port on my Fractal Define R6 which had something fall inside it and catch fire

Lightning is 480Mb and 10W

USB-C can scale from that to 80Gb and 240W, letting it be used on cheap stuff or expensive products. It's a no brainer.

One single 65W charger in my house charges:
4x phones
2x samsung tablets
2x older samsung tablets using a micro-B to C converter
3x nintendo switch
1x quest 2
1x Xbox elite S2 controller
3x nintendo switch controllers (all different types)
2x Chromecast w/ remote


I still need a 5V 1A genuine apple charger and cord here, because we have friends with iphones that are always flat, and refuse to work off generic equipment.


All of these type-C devices are intercompatible with accesories - all the host devices can work with the same chargers (Not always with quick charging, but they all charge off a basic 5V 1A at minimum)
They all work with USB-C headphones
Chromecast, phones, tablets, switches - all work with the same USB-C hub that adds USB ports for mice/keyboards/card readers/USB speakers. They all "just work" together.



Even apple knows it's useless, or they'd not be using type C for their laptops.
They just like having you spend money for hardware that goes in the bin if you leave them - you need to buy EVERYTHING from them so they profit, and none of it may work for another brand if you do.

Nothing like an apple user wanting to back up their 100GB of photos and videos and finding out they're stuck paying for cloud storage since you cant copy/paste over USB, and they're limited to 30MB/s if they use ghetto solutions to try and make it work

Bolded the most surprising thing, I thought that Apple is as usual there in Australia like it is in the other parts of the world

 

[Mussels]

Bolded the most surprising thing, I thought that Apple is as usual there in Australia like it is in the other parts of the world

Only america has high percentage of apple users - not the rest of the world
They're extremely USA centric

 

[bug]

I think the following can and will happened. In a decade, when USB 5 then USB 6 will arrive, with transfer speeds of 1Tbps and over, a new cable, but also a new port will be required because of different technology . How is that going to happen then if EU only allows old ports?

Yes, that's a problem because it's impossible to upgrade the requirement to USB 5 or 6 a few years from now. Plus, USB is has no forward compatibility so you won't be able to plug a USB 3.2 charger in a USB 5 device. Right?

 

[Prima.Vera]

Yes, that's a problem because it's impossible to upgrade the requirement to USB 5 or 6 a few years from now. Plus, USB is has no forward compatibility so you won't be able to plug a USB 3.2 charger in a USB 5 device. Right?

So if you have an USB3.2 port and use an USB2.0 cable, you have the speed and power of USB3.2 ??

Mussels:​

Only america has high percentage of apple users - not the rest of the world
They're extremely USA centric

View attachment 264495

Japan also has a 60+% of Apple zombies, and most of them are afraid of Android phones like plague.