• Welcome to TechPowerUp Forums, Guest! Please check out our forum guidelines for info related to our community.

USB Type-C with DisplayPort+USB Wiring Could Get a Big Push by NVIDIA

btarunr

Editor & Senior Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Oct 9, 2007
Messages
43,738 (7.99/day)
Location
Hyderabad, India
System Name RBMK-1000
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 5700G
Motherboard ASUS ROG Strix B450-E Gaming
Cooling DeepCool Gammax L240 V2
Memory 2x 8GB G.Skill Sniper X
Video Card(s) Palit GeForce RTX 2080 SUPER GameRock
Storage Western Digital Black NVMe 512GB
Display(s) BenQ 1440p 60 Hz 27-inch
Case Corsair Carbide 100R
Audio Device(s) ASUS SupremeFX S1220A
Power Supply Cooler Master MWE Gold 650W
Mouse ASUS ROG Strix Impact
Keyboard Gamdias Hermes E2
Software Windows 11 Pro
With its GeForce "Maxwell" family, NVIDIA, riding on the multi-monitor fad, began equipping its graphics cards with up to three DisplayPort connectors, besides an HDMI, and optionally, a legacy DVI connector. Prior to that generation, AMD dabbled with equipping its cards with two mini-DisplayPorts, besides two DVI and an HDMI.

With the latest GeForce RTX "Turing" family, NVIDIA could push for the adoption of USB type-C connectors with DisplayPort wiring, and perhaps even USB-PD standards compliance, pushing up to 60 Watts of power from the same port. This USB+DP+Power connector is called VirtuaLink. This could make it easier for VR HMD manufacturers to design newer generations of their devices with a single USB type-C connection for display and audio input form the GPU, USB input from the system, and power. We reckon 60W is plenty of power for a VR HMD.



View at TechPowerUp Main Site
 
Joined
Feb 18, 2013
Messages
2,098 (0.60/day)
Location
Federal Territory Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
System Name Rainbow Puke Machine :D
Processor Intel Core i5-11400 (MCE enabled, PL removed, "OC" all-core boost at 4.4GHz stable)
Motherboard ASUS STRIX B560-G GAMING WI-FI mATX
Cooling Corsair H60i RGB PRO XT AIO + HD120 RGB (x3) + SP120 RGB PRO (x3) + Commander PRO
Memory Corsair Vengeance RGB RT 2 x 8GB 3200MHz DDR4 C16
Video Card(s) Zotac RTX2060 Twin Fan 6GB GDDR6 (Stock)
Storage Corsair MP600 PRO 1TB M.2 PCIe Gen4 x4 SSD
Display(s) LG 29WK600-W Ultrawide Monitor (primary display) + Dell U2417H Monitor (set to Portrait orientation)
Case Corsair iCUE 220T RGB Airflow (White) w/Lighting Node CORE + Lighting Node PRO RGB LED Strips (x4).
Audio Device(s) ASUS ROG Supreme FX S1220A w/ Sonic Studio 3
Power Supply Corsair RM750x 80 Plus Gold Fully Modular
Mouse Corsair M65 RGB FPS Gaming (White)
Keyboard Corsair K60 PRO RGB Mechanical w/ Cherry VIOLA Switches
VR HMD wish I own one if it wasn't for the whole Meta BS...
Software Windows 10 Professional x64 (Update 21H2)
the future is coming... if a single USB-C can drive VR headset, then setting it up would be much easier.
 

FordGT90Concept

"I go fast!1!11!1!"
Joined
Oct 13, 2008
Messages
26,254 (5.14/day)
Location
IA, USA
System Name BY-2021
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 5800X (65w eco profile)
Motherboard MSI B550 Gaming Plus
Cooling Scythe Mugen (rev 5)
Memory 2 x Kingston HyperX DDR4-3200 32 GiB
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon RX 6800 XT
Storage Samsung 980 Pro, Seagate Exos X12 TB 7200 RPM
Display(s) Nixeus NX-EDG274K (3840x2160@144 DP) + Samsung SyncMaster 906BW (1440x900@60 HDMI-DVI)
Case Coolermaster HAF 932 w/ USB 3.0 5.25" bay
Audio Device(s) Realtek ALC1150, Micca OriGen+
Power Supply Enermax Platimax 850w
Mouse SteelSeries Sensei RAW
Keyboard Tesoro Excalibur
Software Windows 10 Home 64-bit
Benchmark Scores Faster than the tortoise; slower than the hare.
USB-C (10 gbps) has less bandwidth than DisplayPort (26 gbps) and USB-C gen 2 (10 gbps) only has 1m cable length for that speed (far from enough for VR). I think the VR headsets are going to be using Thunderbolt (up to 40 gbps and if fiber optic, cable length doesn't really matter). If the cables are just copper, this is going to be a serious problem for future headsets.

USB-C powered monitors have the same bandwidth issue. There's also a lot of monitors that 27w wouldn't be enough to drive. I don't think USB-C powered monitors were really the intent or NVIDIA would have put at least two on the card. In general, DisplayPort is the better connector for monitors (better signal separation, longer cable lengths, cheaper to manufacture, and locking mechanism) even though it only has minimal power supply. Supplying monitor power via GPU just relocates power supply from a brick/internal to the monitor to the computer's power supply, motherboard, and GPU. VR headsets are about the only scenario where that's a preferable arrangement.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jan 2, 2018
Messages
209 (0.12/day)
I would really like my monitor get it's power through a signle cable coming from MB or the GPU. Thats a dream.

10 years ago, monitors could be connected to a PSU, as they had input and output slots. This lets for better cable managment and an empty slot in the outlet.

Having it power through a single cable would be a dream.
 
Joined
Apr 30, 2012
Messages
3,881 (1.02/day)
USB PD standards have been around since 2012 afaik

mini connectors are limited up to 60w & regular are up to 100w if they comply with the profiles. cables too.

Slow adoption is probably because very few want to add whats needed to support the added power. Phones adopted it to charge the battery.
 
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
74 (0.03/day)
USB-C (10 gbps) has less bandwidth than DisplayPort (26 gbps) and USB-C gen 2 (10 gbps) only has 1m cable length for that speed (far from enough for VR). I think the VR headsets are going to be using Thunderbolt (up to 40 gbps and if fiber optic, cable length doesn't really matter). If the cables are just copper, this is going to be a serious problem for future headsets.

USB-C powered monitors have the same bandwidth issue. There's also a lot of monitors that 27w wouldn't be enough to drive. I don't think USB-C powered monitors were really the intent or NVIDIA would have put at least two on the card. In general, DisplayPort is the better connector for monitors (better signal separation, longer cable lengths, cheaper to manufacture, and locking mechanism) even though it only has minimal power supply. Supplying monitor power via GPU just relocates power supply from a brick/internal to the monitor to the computer's power supply, motherboard, and GPU. VR headsets are about the only scenario where that's a preferable arrangement.
According to VESA you're wrong
 
Joined
Jun 14, 2010
Messages
582 (0.13/day)
Location
City 217
Processor AMD Phenom II X4 925
Motherboard Asus M4A78LT-M
Cooling Ice Hammer IH-4***
Memory 2x4GB DDR3 Corsair
Video Card(s) Asus HD7870 2GB
Storage 500GB SATAII Samsung | 500GB SATAII Seagate
Display(s) 23" LG 23EA63V-P
Case Thermaltake V3 Black Edition
Audio Device(s) VIA VT1708S
Power Supply Corsair TX650W
Software Windows 10 x64
You guys want more juice pushed through the GPU instead of using an external power supply?
 

FordGT90Concept

"I go fast!1!11!1!"
Joined
Oct 13, 2008
Messages
26,254 (5.14/day)
Location
IA, USA
System Name BY-2021
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 5800X (65w eco profile)
Motherboard MSI B550 Gaming Plus
Cooling Scythe Mugen (rev 5)
Memory 2 x Kingston HyperX DDR4-3200 32 GiB
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon RX 6800 XT
Storage Samsung 980 Pro, Seagate Exos X12 TB 7200 RPM
Display(s) Nixeus NX-EDG274K (3840x2160@144 DP) + Samsung SyncMaster 906BW (1440x900@60 HDMI-DVI)
Case Coolermaster HAF 932 w/ USB 3.0 5.25" bay
Audio Device(s) Realtek ALC1150, Micca OriGen+
Power Supply Enermax Platimax 850w
Mouse SteelSeries Sensei RAW
Keyboard Tesoro Excalibur
Software Windows 10 Home 64-bit
Benchmark Scores Faster than the tortoise; slower than the hare.
Up to, up to, up to. The longer the cable, the worse the performance.

You guys want more juice pushed through the GPU instead of using an external power supply?
Small, lower panels, why not? Large TVs, nope.

I have a very difficult time believing USB-C can handle 100w. Those cables and contacts are tiny. DC produces a lot of waste heat when the conduits are tiny. Seems like an all around bad idea. 20w? Sure.
 
Joined
Mar 10, 2014
Messages
1,789 (0.57/day)
Up to, up to, up to. The longer the cable, the worse the performance.

Small, lower panels, why not? Large TVs, nope.
I have a very difficult time believing USB-C can handle 100w. Those cables and contacts are tiny. DC produces a lot of waste heat when the conduits are tiny. Seems like an all around bad idea. 20w? Sure.

Well yeah, Virtuallink standard says up-to 27W over the connector. They also say four lanes HBR3 over the Virtuallink, which is 8.10 Gbit/s per lane thus 32.4 Gbit/sec overall. So in other words should be full Displayport 1.4 bandwidth.

VirtualLink is designed to enable a new level of immersion in VR, with power, display, and data bandwidth specified to meet the needs of future VR headsets. That includes support for four lanes of HBR3 DisplayPort for high-resolution displays, USB 3.1 Gen2 (SuperSpeed USB 10Gbps) for headset cameras and sensors, and up to 27 Watts of power delivery.
 

FordGT90Concept

"I go fast!1!11!1!"
Joined
Oct 13, 2008
Messages
26,254 (5.14/day)
Location
IA, USA
System Name BY-2021
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 5800X (65w eco profile)
Motherboard MSI B550 Gaming Plus
Cooling Scythe Mugen (rev 5)
Memory 2 x Kingston HyperX DDR4-3200 32 GiB
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon RX 6800 XT
Storage Samsung 980 Pro, Seagate Exos X12 TB 7200 RPM
Display(s) Nixeus NX-EDG274K (3840x2160@144 DP) + Samsung SyncMaster 906BW (1440x900@60 HDMI-DVI)
Case Coolermaster HAF 932 w/ USB 3.0 5.25" bay
Audio Device(s) Realtek ALC1150, Micca OriGen+
Power Supply Enermax Platimax 850w
Mouse SteelSeries Sensei RAW
Keyboard Tesoro Excalibur
Software Windows 10 Home 64-bit
Benchmark Scores Faster than the tortoise; slower than the hare.
And the only way to get that kind of bandwidth is via Thunderbolt 3 (up to 40 gbps). If VirtualLink doesn't use Thunderbolt 3 over fiber optic, bandwidth will severely suffer.
 
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
590 (0.36/day)
''besides an HDMI, and optionally, a legacy DVI connector''

DVI -?? if a dvi -d what a waste if DVI-I and analog support great . i'll assume another card that you got to support it instead of it supporting you and your needs
 

FordGT90Concept

"I go fast!1!11!1!"
Joined
Oct 13, 2008
Messages
26,254 (5.14/day)
Location
IA, USA
System Name BY-2021
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 5800X (65w eco profile)
Motherboard MSI B550 Gaming Plus
Cooling Scythe Mugen (rev 5)
Memory 2 x Kingston HyperX DDR4-3200 32 GiB
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon RX 6800 XT
Storage Samsung 980 Pro, Seagate Exos X12 TB 7200 RPM
Display(s) Nixeus NX-EDG274K (3840x2160@144 DP) + Samsung SyncMaster 906BW (1440x900@60 HDMI-DVI)
Case Coolermaster HAF 932 w/ USB 3.0 5.25" bay
Audio Device(s) Realtek ALC1150, Micca OriGen+
Power Supply Enermax Platimax 850w
Mouse SteelSeries Sensei RAW
Keyboard Tesoro Excalibur
Software Windows 10 Home 64-bit
Benchmark Scores Faster than the tortoise; slower than the hare.
DVI-I died several generations ago (they eliminated the RAMDAC on the card). If you need VGA, you might as well invest in a DisplayPort to VGA adapter.
 
Joined
Dec 22, 2011
Messages
265 (0.07/day)
VirtualLink was already released a while back and it's backed by not only NVIDIA, but AMD, Valve, Oculus and Microsoft, of course it will "push through". You could do a little bit background research for these pieces.
 
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
590 (0.36/day)
DVI-I died several generations ago (they eliminated the RAMDAC on the card). If you need VGA, you might as well invest in a DisplayPort to VGA adapter.

dang, did not know my 900 card was several gen's old I thought the 10 series was the next and latest ? what series did I miss between the 900 and the 10 ?
 

FordGT90Concept

"I go fast!1!11!1!"
Joined
Oct 13, 2008
Messages
26,254 (5.14/day)
Location
IA, USA
System Name BY-2021
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 5800X (65w eco profile)
Motherboard MSI B550 Gaming Plus
Cooling Scythe Mugen (rev 5)
Memory 2 x Kingston HyperX DDR4-3200 32 GiB
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon RX 6800 XT
Storage Samsung 980 Pro, Seagate Exos X12 TB 7200 RPM
Display(s) Nixeus NX-EDG274K (3840x2160@144 DP) + Samsung SyncMaster 906BW (1440x900@60 HDMI-DVI)
Case Coolermaster HAF 932 w/ USB 3.0 5.25" bay
Audio Device(s) Realtek ALC1150, Micca OriGen+
Power Supply Enermax Platimax 850w
Mouse SteelSeries Sensei RAW
Keyboard Tesoro Excalibur
Software Windows 10 Home 64-bit
Benchmark Scores Faster than the tortoise; slower than the hare.
dang, did not know my 900 card was several gen's old I thought the 10 series was the next and latest ? what series did I miss between the 900 and the 10 ?
It was phased out of higher end cards before low end cards. HD 5870 Eyefinity 6 I think was the first mainstream card to completely do away with it. Fiji followed suit. R9 290X and beyond have DVI-D, but no RAMDAC to support analog. They've been phasing it out for a long time.
 
Joined
Jun 28, 2016
Messages
3,595 (1.57/day)
I have a very difficult time believing USB-C can handle 100w. Those cables and contacts are tiny. DC produces a lot of waste heat when the conduits are tiny. Seems like an all around bad idea. 20w? Sure.
What? ;-)
Open your PC case and check the cables that handle a much larger current.
USB-C (in 100W mode) is just 5A, so less than on a single Molex cable - really nothing special.
The cable is fairly wide and the contacts are huge. There is a margin for more. :)
 

FordGT90Concept

"I go fast!1!11!1!"
Joined
Oct 13, 2008
Messages
26,254 (5.14/day)
Location
IA, USA
System Name BY-2021
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 5800X (65w eco profile)
Motherboard MSI B550 Gaming Plus
Cooling Scythe Mugen (rev 5)
Memory 2 x Kingston HyperX DDR4-3200 32 GiB
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon RX 6800 XT
Storage Samsung 980 Pro, Seagate Exos X12 TB 7200 RPM
Display(s) Nixeus NX-EDG274K (3840x2160@144 DP) + Samsung SyncMaster 906BW (1440x900@60 HDMI-DVI)
Case Coolermaster HAF 932 w/ USB 3.0 5.25" bay
Audio Device(s) Realtek ALC1150, Micca OriGen+
Power Supply Enermax Platimax 850w
Mouse SteelSeries Sensei RAW
Keyboard Tesoro Excalibur
Software Windows 10 Home 64-bit
Benchmark Scores Faster than the tortoise; slower than the hare.
Molex is 18 gauge. USB-C are like 28 gauge.
 
Top