When will gpu prices return to normal.

ARF · Jul 23, 2022

AMD Zen 4 / Ryzen 7000 Series [updated]

Release Date: Fall 2022, possibly Sep 15 2022
Launched around same time as RDNA3 GPU architecture

Upcoming Hardware Launches 2022 (Updated Jul 2022) | TechPowerUp

_JP_ · Jul 25, 2022

ARF said:
I don't think anyone demands "price wars".
Price wars was meant to keep AMD afloat when it was the underdog with Radeon HD 3870, and previously the mediocre Radeon HD 2900 XT.
Back then, you could buy the high-end Radeon HD 4890 for as low as $195.

Today, even the crappiest, entry level, shit card Radeon RX 6400 costs as much.

Undercutting the price of a competitor provides long-term market-share but above all, benefits the consumer. I think all consumers demand it otherwise it wouldn't be so common for things like vouchers and "on sale" (now every freaking day, because that's what we now call normal price fluctuations) to exist and being sought after.

The HD 4890 was not released at $195, more like +$250, and went as low as that price you mentioned by the time the HD5870 was already around, which launched at the same price-point. Hence, you had numerous rebrands of the G92 core for nVidia and only dual-chip cards rose above the $400-mark. Things were kept "sane" between the $250 ~$350 price levels.
It's when the GTX980 (above $500 in some variants, nevermind the "Ti"s) and later, the R9 390X (something like +$400) came about that things got stupid, because suddenly there was no justification to make below-$100 cards since iGPUs were carving that market so there was an excuse to "bump" the market segments by an order of two. "Your new entry model is now $150. Deal with it. But we still sell that very desktop-rendering-capable chip (insert rebrand #11 of the HD4370 and the Vista Certified™ GT 8400 GS)".
AIBs made it worse with the special versions that had that mindblowing 5~15MHz crazy extreme OC tuning (/s), but charged you anything between $25 to $75 more on top of an already expensive chip, even though cost-cutting was already there, since it was no longer a reference card. What followed that was the crypto boom and subsequent first major shortage of GPUs.
Nobody asked for that, but instead for the market to exist as it could and did until that point.

Morgoth · Jul 25, 2022

back in the day i bought a sapphire 1950 pro AGP brand new for 150 euro that was a pre order and droped in price to 100 on launch... those where some prices

HD64G · Jul 25, 2022

The GPU prices for the present X60 and X70 models will be forced to drastically decrease once the next gen launches or after 1-2 months, once availability will become normal. And then it will be a good time to buy if interested for those performance tiers. The higher performance tiers that are for 4K high settings will remain high no matter what. My 5c.

Lei · Aug 1, 2022

So here comes the report for July 31st:

ETH profitability and price going up. Could we see 85% msrp for nvidia in 3 weeks?
nvidia geforce twitter posted an ultimate countdown on August 10 2020. This time their company is 23 years old

source link

_JP_ · Aug 8, 2022

Honestly, over here, the market is still riding some kind of wave because the cards are not below MSRP yet.
Sure, the prices did drop, but I wouldn't say even a peg.
Considering "middle-range", cards that have trackers over 10+ stores and closest to not be a "Special OC version":
PowerColor RX 6700 XT Fighter

MSI RTX 3060 TI VENTUS

Black line is avg. and the orange line is the lowest price at the given dates.
MSRP would be below the €499 for these two, more like €399 for the nVidia and €449 for the Radeon, according to what I could gather.
EDIT: Sure, VAT here is 23% so there is always some pricing over the nominal value but before the hikes it was not that much, usually 5~10% more.

Lei · Aug 8, 2022

_JP_ said:
Honestly, over here, the market is still riding some kind of wave because the cards are not below MSRP yet.
Sure, the prices did drop, but I wouldn't say even a peg.
Considering "middle-range", cards that have trackers over 10+ stores and closest to not be a "Special OC version":
PowerColor RX 6700 XT Fighter
View attachment 257343
MSI RTX 3060 TI VENTUS
View attachment 257342

Black line is avg. and the orange line is the lowest price at the given dates.
MSRP would be below the €499 for these two, more like €399 for the nVidia and €449 for the Radeon, according to what I could gather.
EDIT: Sure, VAT here is 23% so there is always some pricing over the nominal value but before the hikes it was not that much, usually 5~10% more.

thanks for the graphs.

I got a used 3090 on August 4th. It comes with double layer watercooling. cost me 1020$ including the blocks.
Seller said the block was never used. Seems true since it was sealed and clean as lemon. He said the card was used for half an hour. Can trust him:

Temps at 4k stress:

Could also OC to Board Power Draw of about 404 watts
Seller even forgot to put thermal paste under the waterblock. So When I received it, the GPU was idling at 70°. But that proves he never used it

80-watt Hamster · Aug 15, 2022

Milestone achieved.

Caveat: Only Newegg has this pricing, and only with rebate. But I'd said earlier that "normal" could be considered 6[XX]-series performance for USD250, and here we (sort of) are. If I hadn't already scored a deal on a 3050, one of these would probably be inbound (probably the Sapphire; there's another $10 discount available). Though that's not preventing me from seriously considering throwing out a lowball offer for a $200 2060 KO on CL.

ppn · Aug 15, 2022

Can't settle for less than a 6800., currently at 599, but 2 years later 299 should be the new norm, in 2 just months. it's normal, but also double.
so waiting for the 7800 it is.

P4-630 · Aug 15, 2022

ppn said:
so waiting for the 7800 it is.

Or RTX 4070... Because it just works!

Valantar · Aug 15, 2022

P4-630 said:
Or RTX 4070... Because it just works!

Lol, so do AMD GPUs. Stop regurgitating nonsense, please. Do their drivers run problem free 100% of the time? Obviously not, but neither do Nvidia's. AMD GPUs being difficult, problematic, unstable etc. is a myth that does nothing but harm consumers and should have died long ago.

(just to preempt the most obvious response: yes, the 5700 XT had (has?) severe issues, which were surprisingly widespread but still only affected a small percentage of users (still too high, obviously), and has not been positively identified to be a pure driver issue. It is also the only AMD GPU to have had such issues in ages, with it being one example against dozens and dozens of examples of perfectly working models - and it's not like Nvidia has never fucked up a design either.)

SOAREVERSOR · Aug 16, 2022

Valantar said:
Lol, so do AMD GPUs. Stop regurgitating nonsense, please. Do their drivers run problem free 100% of the time? Obviously not, but neither do Nvidia's. AMD GPUs being difficult, problematic, unstable etc. is a myth that does nothing but harm consumers and should have died long ago.

(just to preempt the most obvious response: yes, the 5700 XT had (has?) severe issues, which were surprisingly widespread but still only affected a small percentage of users (still too high, obviously), and has not been positively identified to be a pure driver issue. It is also the only AMD GPU to have had such issues in ages, with it being one example against dozens and dozens of examples of perfectly working models - and it's not like Nvidia has never fucked up a design either.)

Once burned twice shy. The issue is AMD/Raedeon has had issues all over the place on chipsets and GPUs. At the "enthusiast" level which is now more "RGB land, where is my RGB, why does my closed loop not have RGB, I need that RGB" this does not matter but at the enterprize level you simply don't buy their products, it will cost you a job sooner or later. Sure, they can make a SOC for a gaming system but at the large scale they are LOL. That's why they have a nasty reputation. It's no go, period. Yeah every now and then they come out with a product that is crazy enough to risk the risk, but mostly might as well not exist.

AMD is shit for quality control in the big leagues.

Valantar · Aug 16, 2022

SOAREVERSOR said:
Once burned twice shy. The issue is AMD/Raedeon has had issues all over the place on chipsets and GPUs. At the "enthusiast" level which is now more "RGB land, where is my RGB, why does my closed loop not have RGB, I need that RGB" this does not matter but at the enterprize level you simply don't buy their products, it will cost you a job sooner or later. Sure, they can make a SOC for a gaming system but at the large scale they are LOL. That's why they have a nasty reputation. It's no go, period. Yeah every now and then they come out with a product that is crazy enough to risk the risk, but mostly might as well not exist.

AMD is shit for quality control in the big leagues.

That's the thing: the business world is slow, and reputations - deserved or not - are hard to shake, regardless of how long it has been since they were relevant. AMD has had problems. Do they have more than Intel today? Probably a bit more, yes, as they simply have less experience operating at that scale. Enough for it to matter at that type of scale? No. I mean, once again, you're making it out as if Intel (or Nivida, depending on the segment we're talking about) have a sterling reputation for being problem free and only offering smooth sailing, as if Intel hasn't seen a half-dozen security fixes with significant performance effects, various hardware bugs on shipping chips, etc. Things vary, but a reputation that has cemented itself is hard to shake, and that's what we're seeing.

Lei · Aug 16, 2022

SOAREVERSOR said:
Once burned twice shy. The issue is AMD/Raedeon has had issues all over the place on chipsets and GPUs. At the "enthusiast" level which is now more "RGB land, where is my RGB, why does my closed loop not have RGB, I need that RGB" this does not matter but at the enterprize level you simply don't buy their products, it will cost you a job sooner or later. Sure, they can make a SOC for a gaming system but at the large scale they are LOL. That's why they have a nasty reputation. It's no go, period. Yeah every now and then they come out with a product that is crazy enough to risk the risk, but mostly might as well not exist.

AMD is shit for quality control in the big leagues.

On a side note:
Where do we plug the RGB cable

mine has one hanging there.
Where should I plug the RGB cable into?

pcwolf · Aug 16, 2022

So ... does TPU have a For Sale forum where I can hawk my slightly used retail box video cards?

80-watt Hamster · Aug 16, 2022

pcwolf said:
So ... does TPU have a For Sale forum where I can hawk my slightly used retail box video cards?

Yup.

claes · Aug 16, 2022

SOAREVERSOR said:
Once burned twice shy. The issue is AMD/Raedeon has had issues all over the place on chipsets and GPUs. At the "enthusiast" level which is now more "RGB land, where is my RGB, why does my closed loop not have RGB, I need that RGB" this does not matter but at the enterprize level you simply don't buy their products, it will cost you a job sooner or later. Sure, they can make a SOC for a gaming system but at the large scale they are LOL. That's why they have a nasty reputation. It's no go, period. Yeah every now and then they come out with a product that is crazy enough to risk the risk, but mostly might as well not exist.

AMD is shit for quality control in the big leagues.

I don’t think this is true, especially since Epyc. AMD has been seeing huge yoy increases in server sales, even with supply issues, while Intel’s share has been decreasing. From what I know the only reason that Intel had the server/HPC market locked was because they were faster, not more reliable.

Count von Schwalbe · Aug 17, 2022

claes said:
I don’t think this is true, especially since Epyc. AMD has been seeing huge yoy increases in server sales, even with supply issues, while Intel’s share has been decreasing. From what I know the only reason that Intel had the server/HPC market locked was because they were faster, not more reliable.

Agree. AMD's CPU market has no issues with reliability, at least in the enterprise market.

I have a old R7 450 in my work computer - no issues*. I have a laptop with a Maxwell Quadro and it is impossible to update drivers unless Windows sees fit. Anecdotal, yes, but AMD consumer drivers have given me less issues than Nvidia Enterprise drivers.

*Ok, one issue but that was my fault.

Valantar · Aug 17, 2022

It's also worth pointing out that up until the past few years - maybe as little as two - there were significant differences in the engineering and product design efforts and quality put into Intel and AMD products by OEMs, for a variety of reasons. From platform familiarity (and thus ease of tuning/tweaking/troubleshooting) to Intel having a cemented reputation as "the premium brand" (and AMD as "the budget brand") to Intel paying for exclusivity in more premium form factors in various ways (which AMD through their recent growth and no longer being on the verge of bankruptcy are able to better match or respond to), to a bunch of other stuff. When one brand is only found in cheap, bargain-level, "value" products and the other is found across a wide range, including high-effort, high-cost, "premium" products, it's a given that the latter will get a better reputation for both performance and quality - unless they really mess up, that is.

ARF · Aug 18, 2022

P4-630 said:
Or RTX 4070... Because it just works!

No, AMD Radeon gives better image quality.

But the prices will not go back to normal, will they? :kookoo:

As of August 16, 2022:
Radeon RX 6400 - 168.82 euro
Radeon RX 6500 XT - 169.00 euro
Radeon RX 6600 - 294.00 euro
Radeon RX 6600 XT - 394.13 euro
Radeon RX 6650 XT - 402.34 euro
Radeon RX 6700 XT - 479.90 euro
Radeon RX 6750 XT - 549.00 euro
Radeon RX 6800 - 639.00 euro
Radeon RX 6800 XT - 769.00 euro
Radeon RX 6900 XT - 929.00 euro
Radeon RX 6950 XT - 1181.50 euro

AMD Radeon RX 5600 XT Specs | TechPowerUp GPU Database

ASRock Radeon RX 5600XT Phantom Gaming 2 OC 6 GB OC Mid Range Grafikkarte kaufen (computeruniverse.net)

mechtech · Aug 18, 2022

I am really starting to wonder if anything purchased new will ever return to pre-pandemic prices….

P4-630 · Aug 18, 2022

ARF said:
No, AMD Radeon gives better image quality.

That's what I said always 16 years ago, I only bought ATi back then, but since 2010 only bought Nvidia. :laugh:

ARF · Aug 18, 2022

P4-630 said:
That's what I said always 16 years ago, I only bought ATi back then, but since 2010 only bought Nvidia.

What changed in 2010? :confused:

P4-630 · Aug 18, 2022

ARF said:
What changed in 2010?

No more desktop for a while only laptops and they had Nvidia graphics, then in 2016 I built a desktop again and at that year Pascal just came out and that seemed the better choice back then and got a GTX 1070.

Then got myself a G-Sync monitor, and since then kinda stuck with Nvidia.
My last ATi GPU was a HIS 4870 in 2010, I gave my dad my socket 775 desktop and he's been using it since then.
The HIS 4870 died last year in 2021 iirc and then my dad bought a cheap Nvidia GPU for display output.

r9 · Aug 18, 2022

SOAREVERSOR said:
Once burned twice shy. The issue is AMD/Raedeon has had issues all over the place on chipsets and GPUs. At the "enthusiast" level which is now more "RGB land, where is my RGB, why does my closed loop not have RGB, I need that RGB" this does not matter but at the enterprize level you simply don't buy their products, it will cost you a job sooner or later. Sure, they can make a SOC for a gaming system but at the large scale they are LOL. That's why they have a nasty reputation. It's no go, period. Yeah every now and then they come out with a product that is crazy enough to risk the risk, but mostly might as well not exist.

AMD is shit for quality control in the big leagues.

I think we've must have watched a different movie.

On the price thing we the consumers are what drives the pricing full stop period.
AMD and NVIDIA can ask $5k for entry level GPUs if they want but if they get it it's all on us.
If we can take anything from the shortage is that people have more money than common sense.
Anybody complaining about the pricing but reached in their wallet and paid the scalper price it's on you brother.
Food and water are necessities GPUs are not.

System Name	LenovoⓇ ThinkPad™ T430
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Software	MicrosoftⓇ WindowsⓇ 10 x86-64 (22H2)

System Name	Wopr "War Operation Plan Response"
Processor	5900x ryzen 9 12 cores 24 threads
Motherboard	aorus x570 pro
Cooling	air (GPU Liquid graphene) rad outside case mounted 120mm 68mm thick
Memory	kingston 32gb ddr4 3200mhz ecc 2x16gb
Video Card(s)	sapphire RX 6950 xt Nitro+ 16gb
Storage	300gb hdd OS backup. Crucial 500gb ssd OS. 6tb raid 1 hdd. 1.8tb pci-e nytro warp drive LSI
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Audio Device(s)	sony stereo mic, logitech c930, Gulikit pro 2 + xbox Series S controller, moded bt headphone 1200mAh
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Benchmark Scores	cine23 20000

System Name	LenovoⓇ ThinkPad™ T430
Processor	IntelⓇ Core™ i5-3210M processor (2 cores, 2.50GHz, 3MB cache), Intel Turbo Boost™ 2.0 (3.10GHz), HT™
Motherboard	Lenovo 2344 (Mobile Intel QM77 Express Chipset)
Cooling	Single-pipe heatsink + Delta fan
Memory	2x 8GB KingstonⓇ HyperX™ Impact 2133MHz DDR3L SO-DIMM
Video Card(s)	Intel HD Graphics™ 4000 (GPU clk: 1100MHz, vRAM clk: 1066MHz)
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Keyboard	6-row, 84-key, ThinkVantage button, spill-resistant, multimedia Fn keys, LED backlight (PT Layout)
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System Name	Office
Processor	Ryzen 5600G
Motherboard	ASUS B450M-A II
Cooling	be quiet! Shadow Rock LP
Memory	16GB Patriot Viper Steel DDR4-3200
Video Card(s)	Gigabyte RX 5600 XT
Storage	PNY CS1030 250GB, Crucial MX500 2TB
Display(s)	Dell S2719DGF
Case	Fractal Define 7 Compact
Power Supply	EVGA 550 G3
Mouse	Logitech M705 Marthon
Keyboard	Logitech G410
Software	Windows 10 Pro 22H2

System Name	AlderLake / Laptop
Processor	Intel i7 12700K P-Cores @ 5Ghz / Intel i3 7100U
Motherboard	Gigabyte Z690 Aorus Master / HP 83A3 (U3E1)
Cooling	Noctua NH-U12A 2 fans + Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut Extreme + 5 case fans / Fan
Memory	32GB DDR5 Corsair Dominator Platinum RGB 6000MHz CL36 / 8GB DDR4 HyperX CL13
Video Card(s)	MSI RTX 2070 Super Gaming X Trio / Intel HD620
Storage	Samsung 980 Pro 1TB + 970 Evo 500GB + 850 Pro 512GB + 860 Evo 1TB x2 / Samsung 256GB M.2 SSD
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System Name	Hotbox
Processor	AMD Ryzen 7 5800X, 110/95/110, PBO +150Mhz, CO -7,-7,-20(x6),
Motherboard	ASRock Phantom Gaming B550 ITX/ax
Cooling	LOBO + Laing DDC 1T Plus PWM + Corsair XR5 280mm + 2x Arctic P14
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Power Supply	Corsair SF750 Platinum
Mouse	Logitech G603
Keyboard	Keychron K3/Cooler Master MasterKeys Pro M w/DSA profile caps
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Processor	AMD Ryzen 3950X
Motherboard	AsRock X470 Taichi
Cooling	Corsair H100x
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Mouse	Logitech MX Ergo trackball
Keyboard	Velocifier wireless mechanical
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Processor	i5-760 @ 3.8ghz + turbo ~goes wayyyyyyyyy fast cuz turboooooz~
Motherboard	P55-GD80 ~best motherboard ever designed~
Cooling	NH-D15 ~double stack thot twerk all day~
Memory	16GB Crucial Ballistix LP ~memory gone AWOL~
Video Card(s)	MSI GTX 970 ~~GOLDEN EDITION~~ RAWRRRRRR
Storage	500GB Samsung 850 Evo (OS X, *nix), 128GB Samsung 840 Pro (W10 Pro), 1TB SpinPoint F3 ~best in class
Display(s)	ASUS VW246H ~best 24" you've seen FULL HD 1O80PP SLAPS~
Case	FT02-W ~the W stands for white but it's brushed aluminum except for the disgusting ODD bays; cries
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Power Supply	850W EVGA SuperNova G2 ~hot fire like champagne~
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Keyboard	CM QF Rapid - Browns ~fastrrr kees for fstr teens~
Software	integrated into the chassis
Benchmark Scores	9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999

System Name	Work Computer \| Unfinished Computer
Processor	Core i7-6700 \| Ryzen 5 5600X
Motherboard	Dell Q170 \| Gigabyte Aorus Elite Wi-Fi
Cooling	A fan? \| Truly Custom Loop
Memory	4x4GB Crucial 2133 C17 \| 4x8GB Corsair Vengeance RGB 3600 C26
Video Card(s)	Dell Radeon R7 450 \| RTX 2080 Ti FE
Storage	Crucial BX500 2TB \| TBD
Display(s)	3x LG QHD 32" GSM5B96 \| TBD
Case	Dell \| Heavily Modified Phanteks P400
Power Supply	Dell TFX Non-standard \| EVGA BQ 650W
Mouse	Monster No-Name $7 Gaming Mouse\| TBD

Processor	Ryzen 5700x
Motherboard	Gigabyte X570S Aero G R1.1 BiosF5g
Cooling	Noctua NH-C12P SE14 w/ NF-A15 HS-PWM Fan 1500rpm
Memory	Micron DDR4-3200 2x32GB D.S. D.R. (CT2K32G4DFD832A)
Video Card(s)	AMD RX 6800 - Asus Tuf
Storage	Kingston KC3000 1TB & 2TB & 4TB Corsair LPX
Display(s)	LG 27UL550-W (27" 4k)
Case	Be Quiet Pure Base 600 (no window)
Audio Device(s)	Realtek ALC1220-VB
Power Supply	SuperFlower Leadex V Gold Pro 850W ATX Ver2.52
Mouse	Mionix Naos Pro
Keyboard	Corsair Strafe with browns
Software	W10 22H2 Pro x64

System Name	Primary\|Secondary\|Poweredge r410\|Dell XPS\|SteamDeck
Processor	i7 11700k\|i7 9700k\|2 x E5620 \|i5 5500U\|Zen 2 4c/8t
Memory	32GB DDR4\|16GB DDR4\|16GB DDR4\|32GB ECC DDR3\|8GB DDR4\|16GB LPDDR5
Video Card(s)	RX 7800xt\|RX 6700xt \|On-Board\|On-Board\|8 RDNA 2 CUs
Storage	2TB m.2\|512GB SSD+1TB SSD\|2x256GBSSD 2x2TBGB\|256GB sata\|512GB nvme
Display(s)	50" 4k TV \| Dell 27" \|22" \|3.3"\|7"
VR HMD	Samsung Odyssey+ \| Oculus Quest 2
Software	Windows 11 Pro\|Windows 10 Pro\|Windows 10 Home\| Server 2012 r2\|Windows 10 Pro

When will gpu prices return to normal.

AMD Zen 4 / Ryzen 7000 Series [updated]​

Fueled by Sapphire

AMD Zen 4 / Ryzen 7000 Series [updated]