Who'll be the better president?

[farlex85]

Fairtax would be excellent. I wish it could gain more steam.

 

[ManofGod]

Then I find that for those who are willing, the government can go ahead and take what they want. (I do not really agree with that but just for this discussion I mentioned that.) However, for those who are not willing, then only the taxes that are required should be assessed against them. That way, for those who do not agree, they can go the direction they want and for those that do not mind being taxed above and beyond, well, good for them.

IE: Taxes to upkeep the infrastructure and maintain our military among others things.

 

[trt740]

Fairtax would be excellent. I wish it could gain more steam.

It never will happen because our entitlement system is based off taxed breaks through donation given by the rich that in turn supports well fair and entitlement programs. In a flat tax that systems will collapse. In our system the rich don't give money to entitlement programs out of kindness it because if they don't donate taxes will kill them and in a flat tax system that all goes away. I'm pro flat/ fair tax but we are stuck in a rut now.

 

[farlex85]

Still so much w/ taxes, I don't get it. Do you (some of those fighting the conservative fight) really believe everything you have and all your money was 100% earned and gotten by you, and you alone are fully responsible and entitled to every bit of it. Where does the money come from? Do you forget we live in a society, w/o which you could never have such a thing as money? Are you so egotistical as to think you are somehow an island is totally independent when you want to be, but free to be excluded if you so desire? I mean come on, libertarianism works great w/ individuals, but this is society, and yes you must give and take, tax and be taxed. If you don't like it, as mdm said, your free to live off the land somewhere.

 

[mdm-adph]

Fairtax would be excellent. I wish it could gain more steam.

Aye, I know -- the only candidate I can think of that even supported it was Mike Huckabee, former Governor of Arkansas. A charismatic man, spiritual yet not fundamentalist -- he even had a personal success story about losing something like 140lbs or so without the aid of drugs or surgery. The Republicans were idiotic not to elect this man for their nominee, and now it looks like they'll suffer the consequences.

Then I find that for those who are willing, the government can go ahead and take what they want. (I do not really agree with that but just for this discussion I mentioned that.) However, for those who are not willing, then only the taxes that are required should be assessed against them. That way, for those who do not agree, they can go the direction they want and for those that do not mind being taxed above and beyond, well, good for them.

IE: Taxes to upkeep the infrastructure and maintain our military among others things.

No -- the government will take what you want -- you elect them. If you elect candidates who don't support something like the Fair Tax, then you get taxed out the wazoo -- it doesn't matter which party you elect.

Those who don't like being taxed should be free to form their own government, like you say -- the US states of Montana or Colorado would be good places to start.

 

[mdm-adph]

It never will happen because our entitlement system is based off taxed breaks through donation given by the rich that in turn supports well fair and entitlement programs. In a flat tax that systems will collapse. In our system the rich don't give money to entitlement programs out of kindness it because if they don't donate taxes will kill them and in a flat tax system that all goes away. I'm pro flat/ fair tax but we are stuck in a rut now.

True -- with the way the system is managed in America now. I'm sure it could be tweaked to accommodate a fair tax -- America has some of the greatest thinkers in the world, and I'm sure they could think of something if they wanted to.

 

[trt740]

Still so much w/ taxes, I don't get it. Do you (those fighting the conservative fight) really believe everything you have and all your money was 100% earned and gotten by you, and you alone are fully responsible and entitled to every bit of it. Where does the money come from? Do you forget we live in a society, w/o which you could never have such a thing as money? Are you so egotistical as to think you are somehow an island is totally independent when you want to be, but free to be excluded if you so desire? I mean come on, libertarianism works great w/ individuals, but this is society, and yes you must give and take, tax and be taxed. If you don't like it, as mdm said, your free to live off the land somewhere.

And when was the lastime a poor person gave someone a job? If you tax the Rich to death , remember the top 10 percent income earners already pay 85 percent of the income taxes in the USA how can you expect them to employ workers. What you do is use tax break incentives to make it more attractive for the rich to give money to support social programs then close any and all loop holes. The loop holes and offshore accounts are what is killing us. We need to hold these companies accountable and not let them get away without paying taxes. If we can lower taxes but have more buisnesses to tax I'm good with that aswell. We also need a honorable man whos not in league with theses banks ( both Barrack and Mccain are) they are both mixed up in this banking scam. I say we redo the whole damn nomination. We use a muligan.

look at these fxxckers they need to go to prison for this http://current.com/items/89364220_aig_subsidiary_parties_in_style_in_oc_two_weeks_after_bailout


Imagine watching the international company you run fall apart. Now imagine you’ve got to work double time to keep the company from destroying the global economy because you’ve involved your company in many businesses around the world.

Everyday you wake up and the newspaper is hammering your boneheaded decisions. Meanwhile CNBC has ten people on the screen at once talking about your failures. Finally, you go hat in hand to the government who reluctantly gives you the money you need to protect the world against the mess you made.

Ugh, feels stressful just thinking about it. Afterwards, you probably want “Me” time to recuperate, correct? Okay, good. Now that you’ve been through what the AIG execs have been through, we hope you won’t judge them too harshly:

ABC: Less than a week after the federal government committed $85 billion to bail out AIG, executives of the giant AIG insurance company headed for a week-long retreat at a luxury resort and spa, the St. Regis Resort in Monarch Beach, California, Congressional investigators revealed today. …AIG documents obtained by Waxman’s investigators show the company paid more than $440,000 for the retreat, including nearly $200,000 for rooms, $150,000 for meals and $23,000 in spa charges.

“Less than one week after the taxpayers rescued AIG, company executives could be found wining and dining at one of the most exclusive resorts in the nation,” said Waxman as he prepared to question AIG executives.

Hey, it’s been a tough couple a weeks, give em’ a break will ya.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[farlex85]

And when was the lastime a poor person gave someone a job? If you tax the Rich to death , remember the top 10 percent income earners already pay 85 percent of the income taxes in the USA how can you expect them to employ workers. What you do is use tax break incentives to make it more attractive for the rich to give money to support social programs then close any and all loop holes. The loop holes and offshore accounts are what is killing us. We need to hold these companies accountable and not let them get away without paying taxes. If we can lower taxes but have more buisnesses to tax I'm good with that aswell. We also need a honorable man whos not in league with theses banks ( both Barrack and Mccain are) they are both mixed up in this banking scam. I say we redo the whole damn nomination. We use a muligan.

Remember the top 10% also make over 90% of the money. That's a pretty big disparity, and you can't tell me the bottom 90% are too lazy to make more.

 

[trt740]

Remember the top 10% also make over 90% of the money. That's a pretty big disparity, and you can't tell me the bottom 90% are too lazy to make more.

I agree with this aswell, but the botton 30 percent don't pay any income taxes. Also both Mccain and Obama said they would not vote for pork in bills and laws, shoot Mccain said he would "make them Famous" well the bail out plan had a race car track in it that both voted for, WTF, and the first draft had a attachment giving returned profits to ACORN Obama wanted it and Mccain didn't. They are both full of shit.

 

[farlex85]

I agree with this aswell, but the botton 30 percent don't pay any income taxes.

I know that's no good either, but it still doesn't make me feel sorry for the top 10%. Fairtax is a great example of a wonderful idea staring us right in the face but "our" government knows better.....

 

[TheMailMan78]

Why should I bother if you obviously have no single clue what socialism means How low do you have to sink to compare him to a duck!? You could as well work for McCain's voting thingy, the same level of childishness.

I never said socializing is good (said this thousand times now), but he's not a damn socialist. If he's a socialist I could call McCain a nazi as well, makes as much sense.

Nobody compared Obama to a duck. You apparently dont have a grasp on American culture or are to young to have heard the term before. Ether way you didn't comprehend what I said. You just assumed it was an insult. As for knowing what a socialist is I can guarantee you without going into detail I know exactly what it is. Iv seen it first hand and Obama sounds like a broken record of past socialists. Again show me how Obamas redistribution of wealth isn't a socialist policy and since we are now calling McCain a "Nazi" I would like you to prove this also.

You miss the point dude. You call terrorists what exactly? Killing your troops in Iraq? Killing your troops in Afghanistan? Muslims? People revenging on war crimes the US made? Most actions nowadays have a reason, you'd better think about that instead of 'z0mfg, the muslims shot our innocent soldiers'.

Lets put it this way, they hate you for a reason and if you wake up from your American Dream you clearly see why.

I call terrorists people who kill people with no cause but to instill terror. I never said anything about only "muslims" are terrorist. A true Muslim will tell you its a religion of peace and not of war. But since you think we are only attacked in retaliation I would like to see you prove the justification of 9-11. I mean you must have a good reason to kill 3000+ American men women and children don't you?

Listen you NEED to understand something about the United States. Only Russia has the same equivalent of a nuclear arsenal and if we were NOT trying to help in Iraq and we only wanted oil then we wouldn't even have to put one troop on the ground. Hell we don't even have to leave our borders. We can end life on this planet or just a section with the push of a button. If we as bad as you say we are you wouldn't be on here talking crap.

TBH, if I here people about "God's will" and "the devil", be it from my couch or not (btw, wake up, we've extremist christians here too) I know more than enough. Also Ive met more than enough American tourists to know what Im talking about regarding that.

I'm glad you have it all figured out.

I dont not say Im against guns anywhere? I do support air marshals with guns? And what has the fact that Im indeed pretty much anti-israel to do with your whole argument?

Everything. Why do you hate Isreal? What have they done to you? Or is it just more of your mob mentality?

You really have this much of a plate in front of your head? The only threat is the US its self. Iran wouldnt have a single reason to attack the US, nor would N-Korea, especially not Russia and the war against Iraq was based on a crapload of lies. But because our lovely Bush sees a threat in them he's brainfarting around and treathening them with wars etc...

Iran wouldn't have a single reason to attack the United States? Hmmm do you even know who Mahmūd Ahmadinejād is? You talk about Bush threatening countries you should take a better look at the situation.

Also I dont see how you can use Darwin's theory in your argument since 75~90% of the American civilization is religious, get a clue:shadedshu

IM AMERICAN! I CAN DO AND SAY ANYTHING I WANT! IM ALSO REPUBLICAN! I DRINK THE BLOOD OF PUPPIES AND MAKE BABY SOUP! (Thats for you Odin Eidolon)

 

[mdm-adph]

I agree with this aswell, but the botton 30 percent don't pay any income taxes.

Though this is often said, I don't think it's actually true -- I really don't think that the US government lets anyone get away from paying income tax, to be honest. Think about it -- trust me, they're paying some form of tax on income. It's probably small, but it's there. I wouldn't think that Uncle Sam would let anyone get away, regardless of how much money they make.

 

[zithe]

Why do you hate Isreal? What have they done to you? Or is it just more of your mob mentality?

Yeah... I want to know, too.

Though this is often said, I don't think it's actually true -- I really don't think that the US government lets anyone get away from paying income tax, to be honest. Think about it -- trust me, they're paying some form of tax on income. It's probably small, but it's there. I wouldn't think that Uncle Sam would let anyone get away, regardless of how much money they make.

Below 18, you don't pay income tax. You file exempt.

Nobody compared Obama to a duck.

IM AMERICAN! I CAN DO AND SAY ANYTHING I WANT! IM ALSO REPUBLICAN! I DRINK THE BLOOD OF PUPPIES AND MAKE BABY SOUP!

So many things about that post to quote...

 

[Tatty_Two]

The only candidate anyone need be concerned with is Dennis Kucinitch, because, even though he didn't get his party's nomination, his wife is unbelievably hot.

(Though he is about a foot shorter than her.)



If there's no guns, then you'll just get stabbed (like you Brits are always getting stabbed). Removing the object doesn't remove the intent.

And don't tell me that a knife is any less dangerous -- there's been famous attacks where a knife-wielding maniac has killed over a dozen people before he was able to be stopped.

And just because the government says they can do a thing doesn't necessarily mean that it's right. They could just as easily make a law saying that the Police and Government are the only ones that can use computers -- doesn't make it right.

Do you not feel, at times that your example are kind of lacklustre? Only the police using computers is hardly remotly realistic, banning firearms in most countries of the world is anything but unrealistic.......Much more difficult to stab than shoot, you have to have the balls to confront face to face, many of these people have no balls unless they are wrapped around a trigger, I have seen it first hand all over the world in 27 years in the army, most of these terrorists talk a good fight, use suicide bombers and roadside IED's, thats just because they havent got the "crystals" to get down to business, you walk round the corner of a Kabul Street on patrol at 2am with a section of 8 men, come across 22 taliban, most of the time they will just run, if you get really lucky one of them will shoot, then you can unleash 120 grains of pure penetrating pleasure

And of course a knife is less dangerous....ffs the British Army would ditch it's firearms if the knife was more dangerous, people need to kill from a distance, that way they can kill more quicker with a lesser risk of being stopped.

Ohhhh, and my wife is hotter than her! ......and I aint no midget!

 

[trt740]

Though this is often said, I don't think it's actually true -- I really don't think that the US government lets anyone get away from paying income tax, to be honest. Think about it -- trust me, they're paying some form of tax on income. It's probably small, but it's there. I wouldn't think that Uncle Sam would let anyone get away, regardless of how much money they make.

well I payed none last year because of the way I retired but I did pay it upfront so the government does get a short term loan interest free and the money was returned to me and I'm actually considered working poor and ended up getting about 4,800 back do to child income credit more than I payed. Believe it or not you can actually get money back even if you didn't pay any income taxes with child credits.

 

[trt740]

Do you not feel, at times that your example are kind of lacklustre? Only the police using computers is hardly remotly realistic, banning firearms in most countries of the world is anything but unrealistic.......Much more difficult to stab than shoot, you have to have the balls to confront face to face, many of these people have no balls unless they are wrapped around a trigger, I have seen it first hand all over the world in 27 years in the army, most of these terrorists talk a good fight, use suicide mombers and roadside IED's, thats just because they havent got the "crystals" to get down to business, you walk round the corner of a Kabul Street on patrol at 2am with a section of 8 men, come across 22 taliban, most of the time they will just run, if you get really lucky one of them will shoot, then you can unleash 120 grains of pure penetrating pleasure

Ohhhh, and my wife is hotter than her!

mine too, mine looks like Linda Hamilton.

 

[Tatty_Two]

No, anarchy is not "all dead people" because remember, you have not RIGHT to harm another...

You want to learn more about Obama?

I thought that everyone including you was saying these people dont play by the rules, if thats the case...whats "right" got to do with it? If right had anything to do with it, the very reason why you carry a gun would be removed.

 

[Tatty_Two]

mine too, mine looks like Linda Hamilton.

Damn, and I thought yours WAS Linda Hamilton..........off topic (as if that is bothering anyone lol).......how do you guys (and me) manage to talk so much in such a short space of time, I leave for 4 hours and come back to 4 more pages!

 

[trt740]

Damn, and I thought yours WAS Linda Hamilton.

time to break out the azz powder again I'm starting to itch ya old monkey. Damn Brit gets me every time.

 

[mdm-adph]

Iran wouldn't have a single reason to attack the United States? Hmmm do you even know who Mahmūd Ahmadinejād is? You talk about Bush threatening countries you should take a better look at the situation.

An unpopular Iranian president (even among his own people) who looks just like Yakov Smirnof?

Look -- America's got enemies, and it's got problems, but Iran is not one of them. They're an easy target, relatively, and that's why they're being trumped up right now as "the next big bad guy."

Think about it -- Bin Laden was able to attack America severely, and he was just bearded wacko living in the mountains of Afghanistan.

Don't you think that Iran -- a huge nation with billions of dollars worth of resources, hundreds and thousands of troops, advanced technology (most of it Russian hand-me-downs, but it's not bad) -- would have attacked America already?

Do you not feel, at times that your example are kind of lacklustre? Only the police using computers is hardly remotly realistic, banning firearms in most countries of the world is anything but unrealistic.......Much more difficult to stab than shoot, you have to have the balls to confront face to face, many of these people have no balls unless they are wrapped around a trigger, I have seen it first hand all over the world in 27 years in the army, most of these terrorists talk a good fight, use suicide mombers and roadside IED's, thats just because they havent got the "crystals" to get down to business, you walk round the corner of a Kabul Street on patrol at 2am with a section of 8 men, come across 22 taliban, most of the time they will just run, if you get really lucky one of them will shoot, then you can unleash 120 grains of pure penetrating pleasure

And of course a knife is less dangerouf....ffs the British Army would ditch it's firearms if the knife was more dangerous, people need to kill from a distance, that way they can kill more quicker with a lesser risk of being stopped.

You think Police banning computers is unrealistic? A tool that can be used for espionage, the transportation of child pornography, the collection of records used in the drug trade -- why, that's a terribly dangerous thing. Trust me -- it'll happen.

I'm not saying that banning firearms hasn't worked for those countries that have done it -- just that's it's not always necessary.

You use the tools necessary to do the job -- that's why the British Army uses guns, because their enemies do.

In America, the criminals use guns. They will always use guns, even if they're illegal. Making them illegal won't stop someone who's already made the choice to break the law.

Ohhhh, and my wife is hotter than her!

Feel free to post pics and we'll compare.

 

[trt740]

An unpopular Iranian president (even among his own people) who looks just like Yakov Smirnof?

Look -- America's got enemies, and it's got problems, but Iran is not one of them. They're an easy target, relatively, and that's why they're being trumped up right now as "the next big bad guy."

Think about it -- Bin Laden was able to attack America severely, and he was just bearded wacko living in the mountains of Afghanistan.

Don't you think that Iran -- a huge nation with billions of dollars worth of resources, hundreds and thousands of troops, advanced technology (most of it Russian hand-me-downs, but it's not bad) -- would have attacked America already?





You think Police banning computers is unrealistic? A tool that can be used for espionage, the transportation of child pornography, the collection of records used in the drug trade -- why, that's a terribly dangerous thing. Trust me -- it'll happen.

I'm not saying that banning firearms hasn't worked for those countries that have done it -- just that's it's not always necessary.

You use the tools necessary to do the job -- that's why the British Army uses guns, because their enemies do.

In America, the criminals use guns. They will always use guns, even if they're illegal. Making them illegal won't stop someone who's already made the choice to break the law.



Feel free to post pics and we'll compare.

I would post some but she would kill me.

 

[mdm-adph]

Below 18, you don't pay income tax. You file exempt.

Well, that needs to change.

 

[das müffin mann]

Iran could NEVER take America in conventional warfare, even with their Russian hand me downs, they would have to force us into a war of attrition like we're in now

just wanted to throw that in...

forgot one thing

Iran may not attack us directly (i don't think they ever will, unless Russia or china has a go at us then they may try something then) but they do fund groups that do

so they are an indirect threat to us atm

 

[ckoons1]

food for thought:
who has the best track record? talk is cheap. the proof is in the pudding so to speak.

unfortunately the masses are usually wrong.
there will always be more sheep then shepards.

 

[trt740]

bad news GM'S corp stocked dropped below 1958 levels , however, gas just dropped to 299.00 a gallon. Soon we will have gas out the ass but no cars. Boy this is great work by the goverment whoever inherits this is crazy.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20081009/ts_nm/us_autos_outlook