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Who'll be the better president?

Who'll be the better president?

  • Barack Obama

    Votes: 1,290 57.9%
  • John McCain

    Votes: 333 14.9%
  • But I want George W. Bush

    Votes: 177 7.9%
  • Don't care

    Votes: 429 19.2%

  • Total voters
    2,229
  • Poll closed .
Status
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intel igent

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if NO ONE voted the problem's would be solved.

tell as many people as you can NOT TO VOTE, what are they gonna do elect themselve's? the people of the world need to take a stand against against these big corporation's (that's what a country/government is) and put thing's in proper perspective.

why should we/i continue to support a system that continually f*ck's us/me over?

take the wool off from over your eye's people! we do not need government's

democracy is the polite word for communism.

the only people that can control the people ARE the people!
 

Psyon

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Well... But it's the party you vote, isn't it? Surely not directly and the president will be the most powerful (maybe to powerful if I look at G.W. Bush) person, but the politics an obama does, doesn't make huge difference to the politics a hillary does, does it? They all get adviced from their party and will fight to get them satisfied / keep them friends.

Maybe it's a wrong point of view b/c here in germany we just vote for a party and the leading party (or parties) vote their chancelor/president. So with your vote you give a vote on aa direction but not directly on the person in charge.

I somehow thought it would be an easy decission to ppl who voted for hillary changing to obama now. I mean it's the same politics with just a different face. Yea, sure not all the same, but changing from democrates to republican is a complete different direction, isn't it?
 
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democracy is the polite word for communism.

That was the one logical thing you said - a true democracy can only exist if the economy is subjected to the will of the people - instead our 'democracy' is an illusion that simply represents the will of the economic elite who founded this country.

"The executive of the modern state is but a committee for managing the common affairs of the whole bourgeoisie." - Marx
 

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if NO ONE voted the problem's would be solved.

tell as many people as you can NOT TO VOTE, what are they gonna do elect themselve's? the people of the world need to take a stand against against these big corporation's (that's what a country/government is) and put thing's in proper perspective.

why should we/i continue to support a system that continually f*ck's us/me over?

take the wool off from over your eye's people! we do not need government's

democracy is the polite word for communism.

the only people that can control the people ARE the people!

Well, i'm glad to have goverments in charge, which I can control a bit, although its not much. If we had no goverments the global players/companies would dictate our lives. I don't like that idea... Anarchy sounds good in small, but doesn't work in a globalized world.
 

Odin Eidolon

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Yeah -- I'm pretty sure in Europe most of you get to vote on the weekends, right? In America, it's a Tuesday -- most people either have to work or are too busy. This isn't an accident -- Tuesday was picked for a reason.

(Yes, by law, Americans have to be given "reasonable time off to vote," but this isn't enforced very strongly, and I'm pretty sure the law is vague as to just how much time is "reasonable.")

i think that if someone is REALLY interested in voting, and he has a reasonable time off to vote, as you say, he/she votes. Even if its the 30th of February :D.
 

Odin Eidolon

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Well, i'm glad to have goverments in charge, which I can control a bit, although its not much. If we had no goverments the global players/companies would dictate our lives. I don't like that idea... Anarchy sounds good in small, but doesn't work in a globalized world.

true, anarchy would be the best thing if only all the people were honest... utopia.
 
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i think that if someone is REALLY interested in voting, and he has a reasonable time off to vote, as you say, he/she votes. Even if its the 30th of February :D.

That's the thing -- they're not given a reasonable amount of time off to vote. Half a day should be reasonable -- America's a big place, and a lot of people live many miles away from infrastructure (like voting booths :p). You combine that with having to work all day (Americans work a lot longer than Europeans, remember :p) and the fact that voting booths in America close at 7pm, and you've got a recipe for low voter turnout.
 
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I vote Obama !

But, ''he doesnt know the diffence between a stretgy and a tactic'' lol

Well according to Obama hes been to all 58 states. So maybe with the help of Acorn who he gave 900,000 dollars to from his campain and was trying to give 25 percent of the first bailout returned intrest funds to maybe he can get some extra votes in those none existing states.

here is article about ACORN a leftist group that has been convicted of voter fraud that Obama patronizes More great Obama friends.

Obama’s ACORN: A Leftist Social Reform Group

Obama’s most questionable tie is to a leftist organization called ACORN. His connection to this group begins with a woman named Madeleine Talbot. She embraced Obama and taught him the ropes. He remained a part of this group’s training cadre. Obama taught leadership conferences for the group while working for Miner, Barnhill & Galland. His connections don’t end there. Obama actively sought and received the endorsement by ACORN for his local campaigns. He has now done the same in his bid for the USA presidency.

According to its web site ACORN (an acronym for Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now), is the nation’s largest community organization of low- and moderate-income families, working together for social justice and stronger communities. At first glance, this organization seems to be benign. This is not true since it uses very aggressive tactics to get its work done.

Some recent reports about their activities include the following things. They have disrupted and blocked activities within the Chicago City Council during living wage discussions. In Baltimore, MD, they burst into the scene of a private law dinner. They bussed four loads of protesters to the site of a mayor’s house, where they spewed profanities at the mayor and his family. And these are just the ones we know about. Their thuggery is over the line by far.

These are not their only questionable actions. In the past they have been tied to illegal voter registration in at least three states. These three states are Washington, Missouri, and North Carolina.

In Missouri, the voter fraud case was tied to at least one campaign, the senate campaign of Claire McCaskill.

In 2004, the Washington state Secretary of State described ACORN’s illegal activity as the “largest case of voter fraud in the state’s history”.

They were fined $25,000 and promised to instruct their paid canvassers on the state election requirements. In 2005, according to the complaint filed with Mecklenberg County, North Carolina, the voter fraud involved the registration of homeless people. ACORN agrees they break the law but said “no one told us”. In 2006, in Kansas City, MO, five low-level operatives were charged with voter fraud. Four pleaded guilty, with the fifth person released because it came out that an ACORN worker had stolen her identity.

This is just the first layer of radicalism. According to Sol Stern’s 2003 City Journal article, “ACORN’s Nutty Regime for Cities,” this group is the key modern successor of the 1960 ’s “New Left” with a 1960’s-bred agenda of anti-capitalism to match. While ACORN still uses the old tactics of the National Welfare Reform Organization to get things done, the targets and strategy have changed. They prefer to fly under the radar, taken their tactics to liberal urban areas like Chicago and now here in Kansas. Their national goals are municipal “living” wage laws, targeting big companies like Costco, rolling back welfare reform, and regulating banks.

ACORN drives companies like Costco from urban areas that actually need jobs. Their opposition to welfare reform tends to keep the people in poverty in these areas, while causing family breakdown. The worst of their tactics is the regulation of banks. They protest “predatory lending,” putting pressure on banks to make large donations to them to finance their “non-partisan motor voter drives.” Stern says that these tactics tend to be “undisguised authoritarian socialism.”

Don’t let its tactics fool you though. According to Kurtz, “ACORN is a savvy and exceedingly effective player.” They prefer to take over the system from within rather than overthrowing the system from without. Stern calls this a political version of the Invasion of the Body Snatchers. In Chicago, where the largest organization exists, an ACORN member won a seat on the Board of Alderman as candidate of the leftist New Party.

Obama in his pre-law days was a community organizer. He was supposed to teach the residents to press for improvements in places like their parks which were eyesores back in his day. Part of Obama’s employment was to organize demonstrations, much in the same way groups like ACORN do. Some of Obama’s claims, in his book Dreams from My Father, about his actions to remove asbestos are false. It was actually a woman named Hazel Johnson who discovered the asbestos problem and who led the removal efforts.

Once again, Madeleine Talbot, Obama’s ACORN mentor, reappears on our radar screens. It turns out Talbot was in some sense responsible for the attempted unsuccessful coup of the Chicago City Council meeting on the living wage issue in 1997. Two hundred ACORN supporters were present. While the actions did disrupt the meeting, six members were arrested that night, charged with “mob action and disorderly conduct.” Among those six was Talbot, Obama’s ACORN mentor.

Does it mean Obama used these tactics? I highly doubt it since he would have been above those tactics in order to protect his political future. He wouldn’t have wanted to break the law with such aggressive behavior. I do believe by this time Obama was well aware of their tactics and understood them, maybe even teaching them in his leadership conferences.

It seems that in reality that Obama is ACORN’s way to overthrow the system from the inside. This jives with his words such as “I am for hope and change, I am for a new Washington, D.C.” While Axelrod coined the term “Hope and Change,” ACORN is fully behind Obama’s opportunity to overthrow our government, if you will, from the inside. They are not alone in their quest for this because it seems that the Service Employee’s International Union is one of ACORN’s strange bedfellows.

The extent of his ties is often dismissed. They are however covered in another article found in the journal Social Policy entitled “Case Study: Chicago - The Barack Obama Campaign” by Tom Foulkes. In this article, Foulkes claims that ACORN specifically sought out Obama’s representation in the “motor voter case,” remembering him from his pre-law days and his work with Talbot. He also trained many of the new volunteers and employees in Leadership Training Conferences even as he was working as a law professional.

This is only the beginning of his continued use and cooperation on the part of ACORN. Obama used them as volunteer “thugs” for his first bid for the Illinois state senate in 1996 and again in his failed 2000 bid for Congress. Obama doesn’t forget his old friends, many of his newly trained volunteers, and used them again in his 2004 successful bid for the United States Senate. By this time ACORN and Obama were like old friends.

ACORN as well as other groups were the recipients of foundation money from both the Woods Fund and Joyce Foundation. Why is this important? Obama sat on both boards. Through his board positions, he was able to assist in the funneling of many millions of dollars in grant money to various ultra-liberal organizations like Chicago’s ACORN. It may not be illegal but it gives me pause.

It would be illegal for Obama to funnel money to his main “get out the vote” volunteers in his position on those boards. So it would seem, at least on the exterior, that ACORN probably did observe the “rule of law” in its non-partisan efforts. It claims that its get-out-the-vote drives are segregated from its political arm. I am certain that much grant money has been received from these two foundations. And I am left with a nagging question. Where does ACORN get the money for its never-empty war chest? Could it be they receive funding from someone like George Soros, who has poured millions into presidential campaigns like Obama and even Howard Dean, according to a blog piece at No Quarter, “Hitler and the New Democratic Party.”

According to Kurtz in his NRO article, while these questions about funding and partisanship are important, what is more troubling are Obama’s ties to ACORN, “arguably the most politically, radical, large-scale activist group in this country.” ACORN sneaked its first political insider on the Board of Alderman in Chicago as a “New Party” candidate elected to that board. As ACORN has managed to sneak its operatives within the system legally through elections, one would think that Obama is able to do the same. Why do we know this? Because Obama has trained many of their current leaders.

The LA Times returned to that same Chicago neighborhood where Obama worked as a community organizer to take a look at the same neighborhood. What they found was a real disappointment. They found one of those parks that Obama “helped” restore to its natural beauty is now overrun by drug dealers and thugs again. It seems nothing changed for very long in the old Obama stomping grounds.

The best finish to this article is Stanley Kurtz’s own words. “The community organizer may generate feel-good moments and best selling books, but I suspect that a Costco as the seed bed of a larger shopping complex would have done far more to save the neighborhood where Obama worked to organize in the progressive fashion.” Unfortunately, Chicago ACORN is blocking that effort.
 
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Odin Eidolon

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That's the thing -- they're not given a reasonable amount of time off to vote. Half a day should be reasonable -- America's a big place, and a lot of people live many miles away from infrastructure (like voting booths :p). You combine that with having to work all day (Americans work a lot longer than Europeans, remember :p) and the fact that voting booths in America close at 7pm, and you've got a recipe for low voter turnout.

are you given only half a day??????
 

intel igent

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Well, i'm glad to have goverments in charge, which I can control a bit, although its not much. If we had no goverments the global players/companies would dictate our lives. I don't like that idea... Anarchy sounds good in small, but doesn't work in a globalized world.

you control the government's? never! that is one of the MOST ridiculous thing's i have ever heard in my life. :roll::roll: they let you THINK you have control, but in reality there is none! it's called a "false sense"

FYI government's are controlled (for the most part, if not all) by the global "player's"/companies, you'd be lying to yourself if you thought otherwise.

they do dictate our live's for the most part, as much as i hate to admit it. we are free to do what they tell us we can do :laugh:

i'm not saying "anarchy" DO NOT GO MISCONSTRUING MY WORD'S AGAIN!

proletariandan don't go quoting Marx from your morning politic's/economic's class :shadedshu

good day to all :D

:toast:
 

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Americans don't really understand politics very well. The Republicans are socially conservative, economically liberal, and generally extremely nationalistic and militaristic. The Democrats are socially liberal, economically centric, and slightly more internationalist and diplomatic. Both parties have their extremes - fascists and libertarians in the Republicans and social democrats in the Democrats - but the center of both parties are nearly identical except on social issues and foreign policy, which is how elections are generally decided. There is no 'left' in the US (other than a minority faction within the Democrats) since our political economy is strangled by the two corporate-backed parties and a history of violent anti-labor repression/legislation.
Thx for explaining. It's a bit as I thought it was like, although it stays hard to explain for me.

I understand at least that socialistic parties anywhere in the capitalistic countries wont have anything to do with communism. It will more try and back up the labors vs the 'mean managers'. Although Ive to admit in certain areas managers are getting way too much money for doing nothing (like gouvernments:p), there are more managers working their asses off and getting flamed over by socialists.

Ironic how "pure" capitalists label the people who are trying to preserve a balance in the economy as commie regulators.
Well, the 'communisphobia' so to say in USA is huge in the first place. In combination with the huge nationalistic groups in USA, the communism from basicly the arch-enemy of those nationalists (Russia) and the ease to get corruption involved doesnt have to raise any questions. However, communism is a very nice theory, it's simply going to fail sooner or later. However, so does capitalism as we see now. And in the end, both need each other to solve its own failing.

Whether there's a perfect balance? No, I dont think there will ever be found a balance to prevent a crisis.

You, my friend, seem to have a good grasp of the situation. There is only one real political party to me in America, with two sides: Nationalist (Republicans), and slightly more Socialist (Democrats). Maybe they should get together and form some sort of "National Socialist" party or something.

Maybe then the trains would run on time, at least.
Really, there's no need for the 'Socialist' add-on;). Nationalistic is already an extreme form, no matter what you put behind or in front of it, it all comes down to one major point, country first.

Look at it this way, what's the difference between extreme christians and extreme muslims? Nothing, the context, the idea behind their religion ideology is the same, they've the best religion and everyone should become a member of it.

And dont flame me over for this, but I think conservatism, at least certain groups of it, contain huge comparisons with the National Socialism from the 2nd WW. As said, not all, but still quite a huge group of it.

And regarding trains, seriously, that wont ever happen. It's in here (NL) the very same, they never run on time and I doubt this will ever happen.
 

intel igent

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That's the thing -- they're not given a reasonable amount of time off to vote. Half a day should be reasonable -- America's a big place, and a lot of people live many miles away from infrastructure (like voting booths :p). You combine that with having to work all day (Americans work a lot longer than Europeans, remember :p) and the fact that voting booths in America close at 7pm, and you've got a recipe for low voter turnout.

Everyone in America has enough time to vote on Tuesday. Most employers make it a point that thier employees go out and vote. Voting booths do not all close at 7pm either, I don't know where you got that information. Believe me, if someone really wants to vote, they will vote.
 
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Obamas homepage has some really good videos.. after watching 2 of them i think that he would be a good president for america..
 
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A list of recent fraud commintted by ACORN Obamas friends

Well according to Obama hes been to all 58 states. So maybe with the help of Acorn who he gave 900,000 dollars to from his campain and was trying to give 25 percent of the first bailout returned intrest funds to maybe he can get some extra votes in those none existing states.

here is article about ACORN a leftist group that has been convicted of voter fraud that Obama patronizes More great Obama friends.

Obama’s ACORN: A Leftist Social Reform Group

Obama’s most questionable tie is to a leftist organization called ACORN. His connection to this group begins with a woman named Madeleine Talbot. She embraced Obama and taught him the ropes. He remained a part of this group’s training cadre. Obama taught leadership conferences for the group while working for Miner, Barnhill & Galland. His connections don’t end there. Obama actively sought and received the endorsement by ACORN for his local campaigns. He has now done the same in his bid for the USA presidency.

According to its web site ACORN (an acronym for Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now), is the nation’s largest community organization of low- and moderate-income families, working together for social justice and stronger communities. At first glance, this organization seems to be benign. This is not true since it uses very aggressive tactics to get its work done.

Some recent reports about their activities include the following things. They have disrupted and blocked activities within the Chicago City Council during living wage discussions. In Baltimore, MD, they burst into the scene of a private law dinner. They bussed four loads of protesters to the site of a mayor’s house, where they spewed profanities at the mayor and his family. And these are just the ones we know about. Their thuggery is over the line by far.

These are not their only questionable actions. In the past they have been tied to illegal voter registration in at least three states. These three states are Washington, Missouri, and North Carolina.

In Missouri, the voter fraud case was tied to at least one campaign, the senate campaign of Claire McCaskill.

In 2004, the Washington state Secretary of State described ACORN’s illegal activity as the “largest case of voter fraud in the state’s history”.

They were fined $25,000 and promised to instruct their paid canvassers on the state election requirements. In 2005, according to the complaint filed with Mecklenberg County, North Carolina, the voter fraud involved the registration of homeless people. ACORN agrees they break the law but said “no one told us”. In 2006, in Kansas City, MO, five low-level operatives were charged with voter fraud. Four pleaded guilty, with the fifth person released because it came out that an ACORN worker had stolen her identity.

This is just the first layer of radicalism. According to Sol Stern’s 2003 City Journal article, “ACORN’s Nutty Regime for Cities,” this group is the key modern successor of the 1960 ’s “New Left” with a 1960’s-bred agenda of anti-capitalism to match. While ACORN still uses the old tactics of the National Welfare Reform Organization to get things done, the targets and strategy have changed. They prefer to fly under the radar, taken their tactics to liberal urban areas like Chicago and now here in Kansas. Their national goals are municipal “living” wage laws, targeting big companies like Costco, rolling back welfare reform, and regulating banks.

ACORN drives companies like Costco from urban areas that actually need jobs. Their opposition to welfare reform tends to keep the people in poverty in these areas, while causing family breakdown. The worst of their tactics is the regulation of banks. They protest “predatory lending,” putting pressure on banks to make large donations to them to finance their “non-partisan motor voter drives.” Stern says that these tactics tend to be “undisguised authoritarian socialism.”

Don’t let its tactics fool you though. According to Kurtz, “ACORN is a savvy and exceedingly effective player.” They prefer to take over the system from within rather than overthrowing the system from without. Stern calls this a political version of the Invasion of the Body Snatchers. In Chicago, where the largest organization exists, an ACORN member won a seat on the Board of Alderman as candidate of the leftist New Party.

Obama in his pre-law days was a community organizer. He was supposed to teach the residents to press for improvements in places like their parks which were eyesores back in his day. Part of Obama’s employment was to organize demonstrations, much in the same way groups like ACORN do. Some of Obama’s claims, in his book Dreams from My Father, about his actions to remove asbestos are false. It was actually a woman named Hazel Johnson who discovered the asbestos problem and who led the removal efforts.

Once again, Madeleine Talbot, Obama’s ACORN mentor, reappears on our radar screens. It turns out Talbot was in some sense responsible for the attempted unsuccessful coup of the Chicago City Council meeting on the living wage issue in 1997. Two hundred ACORN supporters were present. While the actions did disrupt the meeting, six members were arrested that night, charged with “mob action and disorderly conduct.” Among those six was Talbot, Obama’s ACORN mentor.

Does it mean Obama used these tactics? I highly doubt it since he would have been above those tactics in order to protect his political future. He wouldn’t have wanted to break the law with such aggressive behavior. I do believe by this time Obama was well aware of their tactics and understood them, maybe even teaching them in his leadership conferences.

It seems that in reality that Obama is ACORN’s way to overthrow the system from the inside. This jives with his words such as “I am for hope and change, I am for a new Washington, D.C.” While Axelrod coined the term “Hope and Change,” ACORN is fully behind Obama’s opportunity to overthrow our government, if you will, from the inside. They are not alone in their quest for this because it seems that the Service Employee’s International Union is one of ACORN’s strange bedfellows.

The extent of his ties is often dismissed. They are however covered in another article found in the journal Social Policy entitled “Case Study: Chicago - The Barack Obama Campaign” by Tom Foulkes. In this article, Foulkes claims that ACORN specifically sought out Obama’s representation in the “motor voter case,” remembering him from his pre-law days and his work with Talbot. He also trained many of the new volunteers and employees in Leadership Training Conferences even as he was working as a law professional.

This is only the beginning of his continued use and cooperation on the part of ACORN. Obama used them as volunteer “thugs” for his first bid for the Illinois state senate in 1996 and again in his failed 2000 bid for Congress. Obama doesn’t forget his old friends, many of his newly trained volunteers, and used them again in his 2004 successful bid for the United States Senate. By this time ACORN and Obama were like old friends.

ACORN as well as other groups were the recipients of foundation money from both the Woods Fund and Joyce Foundation. Why is this important? Obama sat on both boards. Through his board positions, he was able to assist in the funneling of many millions of dollars in grant money to various ultra-liberal organizations like Chicago’s ACORN. It may not be illegal but it gives me pause.

It would be illegal for Obama to funnel money to his main “get out the vote” volunteers in his position on those boards. So it would seem, at least on the exterior, that ACORN probably did observe the “rule of law” in its non-partisan efforts. It claims that its get-out-the-vote drives are segregated from its political arm. I am certain that much grant money has been received from these two foundations. And I am left with a nagging question. Where does ACORN get the money for its never-empty war chest? Could it be they receive funding from someone like George Soros, who has poured millions into presidential campaigns like Obama and even Howard Dean, according to a blog piece at No Quarter, “Hitler and the New Democratic Party.”

According to Kurtz in his NRO article, while these questions about funding and partisanship are important, what is more troubling are Obama’s ties to ACORN, “arguably the most politically, radical, large-scale activist group in this country.” ACORN sneaked its first political insider on the Board of Alderman in Chicago as a “New Party” candidate elected to that board. As ACORN has managed to sneak its operatives within the system legally through elections, one would think that Obama is able to do the same. Why do we know this? Because Obama has trained many of their current leaders.

The LA Times returned to that same Chicago neighborhood where Obama worked as a community organizer to take a look at the same neighborhood. What they found was a real disappointment. They found one of those parks that Obama “helped” restore to its natural beauty is now overrun by drug dealers and thugs again. It seems nothing changed for very long in the old Obama stomping grounds.

The best finish to this article is Stanley Kurtz’s own words. “The community organizer may generate feel-good moments and best selling books, but I suspect that a Costco as the seed bed of a larger shopping complex would have done far more to save the neighborhood where Obama worked to organize in the progressive fashion.” Unfortunately, Chicago ACORN is blocking that effort.





Recent Fraud

State Year Details
AR 1998 A contractor with ACORN-affiliated Project Vote was arrested for falsifying about 400 voter registration cards.
CO 2004 An ACORN employee admitted to forging signatures and registering three of her friends to vote 40 times.
2005 Two ex-ACORN employees were convicted in Denver of perjury for submitting false voter registrations.
FL 2004 A Florida Department of Law Enforcement spokesman said ACORN was “singled out” among suspected voter registration groups for a 2004 wage initiative because it was “the common thread” in the agency’s fraud investigations.
MI 2004 The Detroit Free Press reported that “overzealous or unscrupulous campaign workers in several Michigan counties are under investigation for voter-registration fraud, suspected of attempting to register nonexistent people or forging applications for already-registered voters.” ACORN-affiliate Project Vote was one of two groups suspected of turning in the documents.
MO 2007 Four ACORN employees were indicted in Kansas City for charges including identity theft and filing false registrations during the 2006 election.
2006 Eight ACORN employees in St. Louis were indicted on federal election fraud charges. Each of the eight faces up to five years in prison for forging signatures and submitting false information.
2003 Of 5,379 voter registration cards ACORN submitted in St. Louis, only 2,013 of those appeared to be valid. At least 1,000 are believed to be attempts to register voters illegally.
NC 2004 North Carolina officials investigated ACORN for submitting fake voter registration cards.
NM 2005 Four ACORN employees submitted as many as 3,000 potentially fraudulent signatures on the group’s Albuquerque ballot initiative. A local sheriff added: “It’s safe to say the forgery was widespread.”
2004 An ACORN employee registered a 13-year-old boy to vote. Citing this and other examples, New Mexico State Representative Joe Thompson stated that ACORN was “manufacturing voters” throughout New Mexico.
OH 2007 A man in Reynoldsburg was indicted on two felony counts of illegal voting and false registration, after being registered by ACORN to vote in two separate counties.
2004 A grand jury indicted a Columbus ACORN worker for submitting a false signature and false voter registration form. In Franklin County, two ACORN workers submitted what the director of the board of election supervisors called “blatantly false” forms. In Cuyahoga County, ACORN and its affiliate Project Vote submitted registration cards that had the highest rate of errors for any voter registration group.
MN 2004 During a traffic stop, police found more than 300 voter registration cards in the trunk of a former ACORN employee, who had violated a legal requirements that registration cards be submitted to the Secretary of State within 10 days of being filled out and signed.
PA 2008 An ACORN employee in West Reading, PA, was sentenced to up to 23 months in prison for identity theft and tampering with records. A second ACORN worker pleaded not guilty to the same charges and is free on $10,000 bail.
2004 Reading’s Director of Elections received calls from numerous individuals complaining that ACORN employees deliberately put inaccurate information on their voter registration forms. The Berks County director of elections said voter fraud was “absolutely out of hand,” and added: “Not only do we have unintentional duplication of voter registration but we have blatant duplicate voter registrations.” The Berks County deputy director of elections added that ACORN was under investigation by the Department of Justice.
TX 2004 ACORN turned in the voter registration form of David Young, who told reporters “The signature is not my signature. It’s not even close.” His social security number and date of birth were also incorrect.
VA 2005 In 2005, the Virginia State Board of Elections admonished Project Vote and ACORN for turning in a significant number of faulty voter registrations. An audit revealed that 83% of sampled registrations that were rejected for carrying false or questionable information were submitted by Project Vote. Many of these registrations carried social security numbers that exist for other people, listed non-existent or commercial addresses, or were for convicted felons in violation of state and federal election law.

In a letter to ACORN, the State Board of Elections reported that 56% of the voter registration applications ACORN turned in were ineligible. Further, a full 35% were not submitted in a timely manner, as required by law. The State Board of Elections also commented on what appeared to be evidence of intentional voter fraud. "Additionally,” they wrote, “information appears to have been altered on some applications where information given by the applicant in one color ink has been scratched through and re-entered in another color ink. Any alteration of a voter registration application is a Class 5 Felony in accordance with § 24.2-1009 of the Code of Virginia."
WA 2007 Three ACORN employees pleaded guilty, and four more were charged, in the worst case of voter registration fraud in Washington state history. More than 2,000 fraudulent voter registration cards were submitted by the group during a voter registration drive.
WI 2004 The district attorney’s office investigated seven voter registration applications Project Vote employees filed in the names of people who said the group never contacted them. Former Project Vote employee Robert Marquise Blakely told the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel that he had not met with any of the people whose voter registration applications he signed, “an apparent violation of state law,” according to the paper.



Wow!!! I cannot believe we are gonna elect a guy who associates with these type of people. Flat out criminals.
 

Rammsteiner

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true, anarchy would be the best thing if only all the people were honest... utopia.
:laugh:, nice one. True though:rolleyes:

I think the perfect Utopia would be a bit like Brave New World. No one knows better, or at least the majority doesnt, and just lives their life which is basicly regulated. If it would happen right now I'd go crazy, so would everyone else. But if there would be a restart or whatever and it would happen that way, I think it's the very best. I think with everyone having opinions on every brainfart in the world you've already got the reason for all the crap going on right now.

Only the theory's of freedom etc are just wrong. When is freedom freedom? In the end you cant say what you want to say. People are forced into a freedom which is in the end only based on the opinion of some gouvernment. If someone does not agree he's basicly called a facist or a dictator.

Dont get me wrong, Im not a nazi, but Im wondering what would have happened if Hitler won the war for example and he got things rolling as he wanted... Would we be all living in freedom now? Or under huge pressure? One strong leader does not have to be a wrong thing, yet like communism, it's quite reactive to corruption and comes down to what Odin say, only if...

But well, lots of things come down to 'if'. I think there will be always problems and as I said about the economic system, there wont ever be a balance. If we would forbid religions because they only cause trouble, people would believe in other things instead and the crap continues. Everything will be solved when humanity dies, but who wants that:confused: And I think we need crap in the world anyway, to see how it should not be... However you can see it does fail here and there on huge scales but time will tell.

@trt740, and how did Bush get president again? IIRC there was some corruption involved there:nutkick:
 
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Where are those articles coming from anyway? I'm kinda curious as to the source.
 
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Um no those are what we call facts.

Hmm, let me see if I can explain it again. What those people said and did are facts as far as we can tell (it's what was reported). That Obama is in cahoots w/ them and holds the same beliefs and tactics is drawing conclusions, and is typically a tool used by the media to spin something a certain way (I would suggest you received a good bit of this info from a certain famous right wing media source). Show stuff Obama did and said and then you have something, but all this "he associates w/ criminals and racists" won't really sway anyone but those who want him to be discredited.
 
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Its obvious Obama is intelligent. Look at his placement in school versus McCain who always scored at the bottom of his class.

A real question to ask is do we have a proper voting system. Because we don't.

Our voting machines are so expensive yet the software is buddy and the equipment is built cheaply and then they charge high prices to the voting boards for them.

We all know the recount in Florida didn't happen despite the law saying it should have by the percentages, because the person in charge of the voting board was part of Bush's campaign and then got promoted afterwards. Corruption got Bush into power without the popular vote in 2004.

The chad system in the democratic section of Florida was overloaded and printed improperly so democrats accidentally voted for Pat B. rather than Gore. Pat even said it on national television that the chad system made them vote for him by accident after he saw the forms and how they were printed wrong. So without a proper recount we made a serious mistake by letting the republicans file so many lawsuits it stopped it from being recounted.



Even the electronic system is messed up because its a completely unsecure machine thats used by Diebold. Diebold changed there name to sell machines to districts that were warned about how bad Diebold machines were. Diebold donates millions to the RNC (republicans), so they obviously have it in there best interest to undermine our voting system.

Corruption at its finest.
 
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are you given only half a day??????

Nope, it's usually only an hour or two.

Everyone in America has enough time to vote on Tuesday. Most employers make it a point that thier employees go out and vote. Voting booths do not all close at 7pm either, I don't know where you got that information. Believe me, if someone really wants to vote, they will vote.

Maybe in a perfect world, sure, but in reality it doesn't really work out that way. Try living in a region of the US where "virtual" poll taxes are still enforced (scaring people away from voting booths by saying that criminal records will be checked beforehand, and any outstanding fines will need to be paid before voting).

And I don't know where you live, but I've never seen a voting booth in the region of the US I used to live in that was ever open past 7pm. Apparently there's no national rule stipulating how long they have to be open.

Yes, I'm sure that if someone really wants to vote they can walk off their job and risk being fired just to vote, but is it really realistic to think that people are going to do this?

Don't you think that the fact that the voting turnout is so much lower in America vs. Europe (with its voting usually held on weekends) is testament to the fact that most Americans don't have enough time to vote on a Tuesday?
 

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Well, the 'communisphobia' so to say in USA is huge in the first place. In combination with the huge nationalistic groups in USA, the communism from basicly the arch-enemy of those nationalists (Russia) and the ease to get corruption involved doesnt have to raise any questions. However, communism is a very nice theory, it's simply going to fail sooner or later. However, so does capitalism as we see now. And in the end, both need each other to solve its own failing.

Whether there's a perfect balance? No, I dont think there will ever be found a balance to prevent a crisis.

nice post, I sign on that. The one big problem it to find the right way between capitalism and communism/socialism. The capitalism in long term will destroy itself by loosing their base, their normal 50k workers, the socialism/communism doesn't honor individual achievements, but needs industry and science. And there will be many ppl not satisfied with "that what all got". One good example is china which is more and more influenced by capitalistic thoughts.
 
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Nope, it's usually only an hour or two.


OMG! didnt know that, my bad sorry. But it is a very very very very stupid thing, i couldnt even imagine it. here we usually vote saturday AND sunday or sunday AND monday. the booths are opened from 7am to 11pm i think
 
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http://www.acorn.org/index.php?id=2756

Acorn has no connection to Obama that any real new sources show in search engines.

Acorn did push the living wage issue to help the poor people that were barely living on around $5.00 an hour(with no healthcare or benefits) and had to support there families on it. Its just a group that protests to help the impoverished people of our nation from what I can gather. If they broke any laws it hasn't shown up in real media outlets yet. I can search public record online if you would like but I have a feeling you are getting bad info from propaganda sources.

Sounds like they are using smear tactics against the poor to try to make the people oppress them even more.

TRT740... its ok if you are being fed propaganda. It happens all the time. The myth about Sarah Palin banning books was incorrect. She asked how they did it, but never got any to be banned so she didn't actually ban any books.

When the "Road to Nowhere" was voted on in Congress Obama, McCain, and Biden all voted for it. Sarah Palin was for it because she ran fund raisers for the lobbyists promoting it. Obama and Biden didn't say they voted for or against it but Palin and McCain lied and said they voted against it.

You must do fact checking trt740. Its important to make sure you haven't been lied to. Got a Source on the Copypasta?
 
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Wow!!! I cannot believe we are gonna elect a guy who associates with these type of people. Flat out criminals.

why not? you've been doing it for year's!

is the problem that he is colored? it must be since i have never seen so much discussion on the matter......
 
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