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Who'll be the better president?

Who'll be the better president?

  • Barack Obama

    Votes: 1,290 57.9%
  • John McCain

    Votes: 333 14.9%
  • But I want George W. Bush

    Votes: 177 7.9%
  • Don't care

    Votes: 429 19.2%

  • Total voters
    2,229
  • Poll closed .
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No way.
Hes' calling bullshit on that fart head liberal obama supporting name calling union supporting goon FudFighter (hey, I can toss names just as good as any liberal! Imagine that!)

I worked a paintshop for Federal Signal in Illinois, during the summers, when I was in college. The union dudes were always telling me "Slow down, you're making us look bad", but I didn't. I worked through... this was in the 80's, and my output was 150-200% of the "union guys". For 70% of union wage... And I enjoyed it, worked it, and respected the pay I got as I used it for college.
*phew, whipes sweat off brow*

I worked in a Union Environment before, and i know the feeling. And unfortunately the Boss told me that if it wasn't for the fact that they were unionized, i would have been promoted to management, instead of the other guy who was in the Union. I worked my ass off, and the managers knew i was bright, i made suggestions and helped improve there product movement and what not. and they made them, to bad i didn't get promoted to management, that would have made it for me.
 

DaMulta

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What pisses me off is this is nothing new. Democrats (and some Independants/Republicans) are just that damn ignorant. Instead, they try to argue "support the troops" but boo the war. FFS! The TROOPS are the the WAR. Without troops, you haven't got a war! :nutkick:
WTF?

Ok if you DON'T agree with the war that your country is in, and supporting the troops are two fucking different things.


So it makes me not American to use my freedom to say I do not agree with this war. And turn around to my brothers(Fellow fucking Americans following fucking ORDERS) and say I can't support you there, even tho OUR government that we SHARE that is FOR THE PEOPLE and we share the same fucking responsibility's in the war for our nation in total?

For the people is fucking everyone.

I can not say hey I don't like the way the big vote went, and then turn around and say fuck you to my fellow Americans(That are also there FOR THE PEOPLE).

You can support the troops and be against the war. The two are not one!!!!


I am an American, I have my right to voice my option. I have a right to stand out with my fellow Americans and change the way we look at things if we all agree. I do not have to push my fellow American away because the vote ended in a way I didn't agree with. We are going with the vote My Fellow Americans(we the people)are going to war end of story. If you are in the military at the time it's not DO YOU WANT TO GO TO WAR? Do You Agree With Your Commander. No you fucking go to war because not one person makes that call.


It's more Un-American to say that you can't support the troops if your against the war. Than it is to say I do not support the war, but I support(my fellow American)that went for me when the vote was made.


If you see it any other way you are not American and do not believe in your freedoms to stand with your fellow man.

We the People
Are One Nation
That stand together in someway from the start of our government that WE SHARE.
 
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WTF?

Ok if you DON'T agree with the war that your country is in, and supporting the troops are two fucking different things.
I think what he was saying was, without soldiers, there is no war. And the dems do say they support the war, however many democrats have vetoed bills that would allow for more funding and borrowing of money to help protect our troops, because it goes against the war. It is this political line drawing that i hate, and thus is why i boo just about any wars fought these days, they are all political, and play by stupid rules that didn't exist years ago. If we are going to go to war, do it right.
 

DaMulta

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I think what he was saying was, without soldiers, there is no war. And the dems do say they support the war, however many democrats have vetoed bills that would allow for more funding and borrowing of money to help protect our troops, because it goes against the war. It is this political line drawing that i hate, and thus is why i boo just about any wars fought these days, they are all political, and play by stupid rules that didn't exist years ago. If we are going to go to war, do it right.
Most people don't go really fucking deep into this. Whats really bad is that WE THE PEOPLE do not see everything!!! WE can but we don't/


We vote on who will be there to be the YES OR NO MAN

The bill that they are signing is not just the fucking title. There is other stuff in there. For us all to get along we have to agree to do things for the other person. It's like that in every bill. It keeps a balance in the system.

Do you see I to I with your friends 100% of the time? Do you think about this do you see I to I with him or her 100% of the time?

THE PERSON THAT WAS VOTED IN TO MAKE YOUR VOTE is supposed to support what his voters voted him in to pass and do. Why should he be forced to sign a Bill that he did not see I to I on with someone else if he feels it's the wrong thing to do? He was voted in because we the people trusted him or her.

It was not that they didn't want to fund the war, the war got funded DID IT NOT? Is it still not going on? They wanted compromise to sign a Bill that they didn't totally agree with, and the other party did not want to give them the compromise.


To think that those people voted in to make our most important decisions do not think about u and me when they pass something for Federal Government issues. That would be madness. If that person feels that he should not sign a bill, then he should not sign it. He was trusted to be there when he was voted in. Why can't he be trusted when he is there to make a choice on a tough call?
 
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DaMulta

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This has nothing to do media. It has nothing to do with fear. It has nothing to do with television. It has nothing to do with newspapers. It has nothing to do with research. It has nothing to do with me being afraid. It has everything to do with being prepared for anything. We have a right to bare arms and the choice is in your hands. Should something happen, are you going to be the victim or are you going to own the situation?

Terrorist, murder, arsonist, robber, etc. very little separates them. They're all criminals and they all bleed.

Some day, all the Republicans and Independents are going to have to save the Democrat's asses. It doesn't matter when that day will come, it is inevitable. We are not immune to attack but we are smarter than they are. ;)


It's one thing to screen goods for illicit materials--it's something completely different to evaluate individuals for psychopathy. Need I remind you, all the perpetrators involved in 9/11 made it through multiple security measures include border/port security and airport security. We cannot look at an individual and accurately decide if they have criminal activity on their mind or not. The 2nd Amendment is about giving the people the opportunity to fight back and not be victimized. 9/11 wouldn't have happened if any and everybody was allowed to carry firearms on the aircraft. If someone wants to take over an aircraft, all they had to do in the past was find and incapacitate the air marshal: the only person previously permitted to carry a firearm.
LOL

Greedy Republicans why do you think that the WHOLE WORLD is in this mess right now? It's because YOU and the MEN on top, and say they create all the jobs. They support America and that's what it's about. We need more money to do that(BS)

Lets have no higher Government making sure that the rich are not taking advantage of the lesser. :roll:


When it's Americans in the lower class that make America what it is for those people on top. Instead today it's all about the man on top and not the lower man like it should be. In the older days if you had a job, and that job ended they would find another one for you now. Min wage was worth about 300% more than it is now. We have let the top go and go and go.

Now we shipping all are jobs off overseas, and just selling the products here. I'm sorry but isn't that what used to make us great? When did we become consumers instead inverters and producers of the some of the best products.

During the rain of Republicans over the past 8 years we made to much fucking money to handle it all. When you where yelling less regulation on the markets to keep it steady you just let it be. More money the more jobs, but just let it get out of control when we should of had government over site.

Just Greed

We have to force tax paying money back into the system because we could not handle all of our savings. That's going to take taxes to pay for the mess. To say that we don't owe the money that bad, and lower taxes is crazy.

Would it not be nice to have no national dept? We all owe 34,000 dollars A PERSON KID CHILD EVERY ONE 11 Trillion about to go to 12 Trillion as it stands NOW. BUT we are adding about 4 billion to it a day......(Only a few years ago total world savings was around 34 trillion dollars)

Why can we not pay off our shit, and make money like China does? Hell why the hell do we have to borrow money from a communist party.....and a ton of it. It's CRAZY.

You Republics have really really put us back. Our dollar is falling, and if the EU take control over the oil because of it......Then we are going to be Fucked

The people that can pay need to pay in and get us out of this mess need to. If not for us, for our kids, and there kids kids.
 

FudFighter

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DaMulta, WoW, Just WoW......

I guarntee that you will get a responce that "prooves" the dem's are to blame, after all librals are a blite on the country according to them.......

this contry has become a nation of consumers, I have been saying that for years, it sucks but its fact.

Prepare your self for them to be told that the minimum wadge is to blame and that we need to abolish it.

the rethuglicans will blame anybody but themselves and their partys greed......after all, they are the only true americans, just ask them.
 
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this contry has become a nation of consumers,
WHAT? "become"? consumerism has been rife for about 50 years.

EDIT: Ok, i admit it is worse than ever and getting worse by the day.....
 

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You can support the troops and be against the war. The two are not one!!!!
Try telling that to the men and women on the ground--of which, most WANT to be there. They'd kick you in the balls if they had a chance so I'll do it again, on their behalf. :nutkick:


It's more Un-American to say that you can't support the troops if your against the war. Than it is to say I do not support the war, but I support(my fellow American)that went for me when the vote was made.
There are three problems with that:
1) Nothing is "Un-American."
2) The troops are the war so you can't support one and not the other. To do so is through shear ignorance.
3) The House speaks on the behalf of the people, the people we elect. They voted in favor of intervening in Iraq. If you have a problem with that, then you need to find a Representative that stands for you beliefs.
 
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What so because you have men and women serving in Iraq and Afghanistan that makes the war justified? I never critisised the men and women who served in vietnam but i shore as hell believed the war was wrong and unjust. I suppose youll call me radical hippy or something im sorry its 2008 we shoudnt be having war after war.
 

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When it's Americans in the lower class that make America what it is for those people on top. Instead today it's all about the man on top and not the lower man like it should be. In the older days if you had a job, and that job ended they would find another one for you now. Min wage was worth about 300% more than it is now. We have let the top go and go and go.
That's why we are a republic and not a democracy: Majority rules with rights of the minority.


Why can we not pay off our shit, and make money like China does? Hell why the hell do we have to borrow money from a communist party.....and a ton of it. It's CRAZY.
Quite simply, because the Consititution doesn't mandate that they balance the budget.


You Republics have really really put us back. Our dollar is falling, and if the EU take control over the oil because of it......Then we are going to be Fucked
Over half of US spending goes to Social Security and Medicaid/Medicare. Both of those programs were authored by Democrats. Both of them combined pose the largest fiscal burden in human history. Both were founded over 30 years ago. Our debt is almost entirely Democrats to blame. I blame the Republicans for not trying harder to fix it being all "conservative" and what not.


What so because you have men and women serving in Iraq and Afghanistan that makes the war justified? I never critisised the men and women who served in vietnam but i shore as hell believed the war was wrong and unjust. I suppose youll call me radical hippy or something im sorry its 2008 we shoudnt be having war after war.
It doesn't justify the beginning but the beginning, today, is irrelevant. Having people there justifies ending it in victory, not defeat.

We had a reason to go to Vietnam and a reason to finish it but, just like today, damn Democrats wanted it to end just because their stomachs are too weak for war. Vietnam, because of the public opinion, is the largest and deepest scar on the USA.
 

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A typical 2008 TPU-Member post. Good Job. You have managed to live up to the stereotype. Did you join just to argue about politics?

There was no reason to be in Vietnam. You should turn off Faux News for a minute and read a book. Just because you are too young to know what the hell you are talking about doesn't mean you have to remain in ignorance the rest of your life.

Bone up on the facts and stop regurgitating what you've been brainwashed.
 
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i just watch Zeitgeist addendum...
 
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Everything is from a economics POV, unless otherwise notarized.

Greedy Republicans why do you think that the WHOLE WORLD is in this mess right now? It's because YOU and the MEN on top, and say they create all the jobs. They support America and that's what it's about. We need more money to do that(BS)

Now we shipping all are jobs off overseas, and just selling the products here. I'm sorry but isn't that what used to make us great? When did we become consumers instead inverters and producers of the some of the best products.
I will say this from a economics POV. Jobs have been going over seas for about 50 years now. This is because of a tax-loop hole that was created to promote capitalism. See these tax codes were written up in the 1960's. These same tax codes also gave businesses incentives to go and move their operations over seas, these very same tax codes also force outside companies to build mfg plants here in the states. For example Toyota had to build an auto plant here in America because they were required to be law, because their company HQ was not in the US. However companies like Ford, Dodge, and GM didn't have to abide by these same tax rules. It promoted the movement of jobs to other capitalist countries to promote capitalism and fight communism.

Why can we not pay off our shit, and make money like China does? Hell why the hell do we have to borrow money from a communist party.....and a ton of it. It's CRAZY.

You Republics have really really put us back. Our dollar is falling, and if the EU take control over the oil because of it......Then we are going to be Fucked
We can make money, like china does, but we would have to force start a draft, this will enable us to lower our defense budget by using a conscript army(of which china is). Lower and fix the tax loop holes, then restructure out debt. Next we nationalize Education, and health care to be run by a government backed business. For example education would be run like a company, teachers would be reviewd and have to certified to teach, teachers salaries and jobs are depending on class room performance, there is no tenyrd get away either.
Once we have done that, we can begin to play back the debt we owe.

Typical non economic understanding. The value of the dollar is failing because of a multitude of reasons.
Reason 1:Weaker economics in the homeland
Reason 2:Lack of heavy industry(linked with1)
Reason 3:Bad government practices
Reason 4: lack of a stable economic guide(for example Oil, it used to be gold)

Reason 1. Over the last 100 years the American economy has moved over seas, as a result the trade deficit has arisen, this trade deflect is a bad thing in that it creates a weaker economy, because we import more than me manufacture. Back during the Imperial days, many countries solved this through Colonies and territories. This would allow the mother country to sell goods directly to its colonies which would create a huge trading surplus. Now what does this all mean, this symbolizes to people that more money is leaving the country then is being bough in, which in turn mean more money must be made to cover, and thus increases inflation.

Reason 2:Over the last about 50-70 years we have witnessed most of our heavy industry move over seas, unfortunately this is the very heavy industry that gave us such a huge trade surplus. As companies moved over seas, they made steel over seas, and then the steel was imported into the US, to make soup or what ever you want to call it.
Other steel like armament steel indirectly died because of a lack of military spending, for example Bethlehem Steel.

Reason3:Our government has failed and it is not a republican or a democrat to blame, it is however a range of issues between them. Pork Barrell spending, corruption, greed, all of these have helped to cause massive borrowing, which in turn shows a weeking country, and thus raises inflation. Typically this type of situation happens within a short amount of time before a country is either overthrown or falls, Don't believe what i am saying, just look to ROME, Pre-Nazi Germany, Pre-Soviet Russia, SOviet Russia, the list goes on.

Unfortunately we are showing alot of similairties to Pre-Nazi Germany, economics wise. We are reaching debt level that equal Pre-Nazi Germany (in modern dollar equivelents). However unlike Germany, we have not done mass printing which is what caused the hyperinflation. However, we are slowly have more issues selling goverment bonds, and thus can show more of a parallel line here. Now up until recently, there was a good demand for both US dollars, and Government Bonds. But with the dropping off of both, the Feds have been forced to monetize more and more of our debt, and monitize is more or less meaning to print money. Printing money caused inflation to go up, inflation right now is about 3-4% a year.

Unfortunately, the similarities between deficits and inflation is sacrosanct, meaning deficits lead to inflation and uncontrolled deficits lead to uncontrolled inflation. It is in times like these where people move to what are known as economic stabilizers, which is below.

Reason 4:For thousands of year Gold and Silver have been used to judge a governments worth and power. It does this by how much gold and silver was in that country. It was a stably sign that the economy and the government were sound, and thus a good economic choice. This is basically a gold standard. However in the 20th century, Oil became the next gold. Oil drove the economics of the world, not gold. Historically government kept billions of dollars in gold in vaults to be used in times of war, because gold was a stable economic indicator, Companies would take gold from government to produce war materials, because the company could use the gold to pay off its workers and debts. However there are cases where money was used, in the case of wars, it usually leads to inflation, because the government takes on enormous debts to fund the war, and to create inflation it either monetizes or issues bonds. If it monetizes the debt then there is more money around then there is use for, such cases are Roman emperors who repeatedly debasing their coinage, (Caused inflation in the later roman empire, Pre-split to west/east)the French revolutionary government printing a flood of currency,or the Continental Congress issuing money until it was literally not worth anything. Quite often a government in a financial crisis will find its easiest recourse is to issue more and more money until the money loses its value. The entire process is accompanied by a huge show of explanations such as propaganda and new regulations, increased internal spending, all of which will hide the true situation from the eyes of the public until they have lost all their savings, and they money is worthless.

Back to the reason. Because Oil drives the late 20, and 21 centuries, oil is the economic stabalizer. And as such oil prices went up to help keep the countries stabilized. However in a case of economic crisis people flee and take their money out of oil and pit it back into metals like gold and silver, because gold and silver will never loose value, there is always a country or a man willing to buy gold. This tumble in oil has caused oil prices to fall nearly in half, and as such the repercussions of this are wildly known and shown now. In fact against OPECS advice the G7 told OPEC to cut oil production to help raise prices and bring stability back to the World economy.

Other things.

A typical 2008 TPU-Member post. Good Job. You have managed to live up to the stereotype. Did you join just to argue about politics?

There was no reason to be in Vietnam. You should turn off Faux News for a minute and read a book. Just because you are too young to know what the hell you are talking about doesn't mean you have to remain in ignorance the rest of your life.

Bone up on the facts and stop regurgitating what you've been brainwashed.
I don't know what Fox news has to do with Vietnam, but we needed to be in Vietnam. We were winning the battles, and the war, but we pulled out at the pinnacle of the war. Ho Chi Mhin went on a 100% attack on Tet in 1968, he knew he would run out of men and supplies but his goal was not to win there, it was to destabilize America at home, which he did successfully. The Vietnamese people wanted us there, however we lost the war because of a lack of Support here at home, and the Politics of the war, and no over the fence missions like the Cambodian Incursion. We all know now that Ho Chi Mhin ran his supplies through Laos and Cambodia, where the US could not go, and there fore we could not destroy his ability to fight the war, and stabilize the country. It is this political crap that i hate, and its this very political crap that is happening in Iraq and Afghanistan right now. The terrorist are outside of Iraq and Afghanistan, and they come into the country to kill civilians and then they will flee back over the border where they are safe from Americans weaponry, how can we will a war when we can go over the wire.
 

Palit_Guy

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I spent a fair amount of time in the military, all of it with a security clearance. Not high enough to know anything really spectacular, but high enough to see there is an amazing amount of stuff going on I don't know the details of and a startling amount I don't know about at all.

The important thing about secret stuff is that, I think, there is a time and a place for the general populace to know things and that time is not always right now.

I also think it is true that, because of the need for secrecy, we require a strong leader. We need someone that can take the punches people throw at him because he KNOWS the secrets and, through a strong set of advisers, is taking a course of action that will result in a strong, safe and stable America.

There are certain things that leader has to be able to do. Just like any company he would have to be able to keep everyone on board and on task without being able to actually explain every aspect of the situation to everyone.

The whole business of running the country is not centered on war but also includes the economy, health care, education, entertainment and so on.

In the last several elections I don't believe we've had such a leader. We haven't had one since Regan. Now, many of you will scoff at the idea of Regan being a good president. He certainly wasn't the most knowledgeable but he was very good at getting people to do things AND at making the American public "feel" like the country was doing good things.

Not all of the plans he and his advisers came up with worked the way they intended but they did get implemented. The beauty of term limitations is that we are only stuck with those plans for so long.

So, personally, in deciding who to vote for in any election I look at the character of the person and not so much in their personal agenda.

At some point it no longer matters what we do as long as we're doing something. If the person we vote for doesn't have BOTH the balls AND the finesse to DO and motivate to do then it doesn't matter if the plan is good or bad because the plan will never happen.
 

Palit_Guy

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In this particular case I'm really intrigued by Sarah Palin. She has about as much business being the VP as I do but there is something interesting in that. Our legislative branch is very much a "good old boy" society that functions by mutual support and pulling and repaying favors.

At first look, she's new and so has no favors to pull. But she also carries a mighty big stick in the VP title and, because she lacks experience, doesn't know she's not supposed to just go blasting people when they screw up.

Basically she's a bull in a china shop. She's also the President's right hand man (person) and as such will be responsible for helping him gain the congressional votes required to pass his plans. I don't believe she will be intimidated by the existing infrastructure and we're about to find out about a lot of things about our congressional staff we were previously unaware of. Long story short, go along with the pres or your skeletons are coming out of the closet.

McCain himself is a pretty strong leader, has been involved in our government for quite a while and so knows just about everyone. I think this speaks to his ability to get things done very well.

On the other hand, we have Obama and Biden. Here it's just the opposite in terms of experience. I also don't think that he represents what the American people really want. Of course we want more affordable health care and we don't want to be at war with anyone. Shit in one hand and want in the other and you will quickly see which one fills up first.

The basic difference between a republican and a democrat is that republicans believe in less government and democrats believe in more. As we all know more <insert thing here> also costs more. I think when one actually thinks about what's going on here things can get a little obvious.

Both candidates want to lower taxes. Both candidates want to end the war. Both candidates want to improve the health care and retirement systems. Both candidates want to improve the economy. Well duh. Everyone wants these things.

The real question is HOW.

If you lower taxes you have less money coming in. So if you then increase spending on health care what happens? If you want to keep from going broke you have to reduce spending on other things to make up for the loss of funds. I fail to see how that id different from my own check book aside from the number of zeros involved.

The democrats have always been strong proponents of reducing spending on the military. We could use the money we recoup for something like education. While I certainly believe we need fewer stupid people running about mucking things up, I don't think we need to remove all the locks from our homes to accomplish that. A guard dog with no teeth and three legs is only an effective deterrent until the bad guys test the bite behind the bark.
 

Palit_Guy

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So to sum everything up, I think it takes a leader that can re-establish some functional plans, get rid of some things that don't work and keep everyone happy while he's doing so.

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

When deciding you to vote for I recommend we all think more about who can actually get the job done to the satisfaction of the above standard more so than who seems like a nicer guy. It's not about ending war and bringing world peace and I hope it never will be. It's not our job or place to tell the world how to live. If our ability to lead our lives in peace and cohabitation with the rest of the world is threatened by a tyrant we have little choice other than to take the fight to them. But that is the exception and not the rule.

We need a person to LEAD us through the decisions we do not understand using facts we are unaware of. We need someone who will help us as citizens to get back on our feet when we fall on our knees but not coddle us forever with welfare loop holes and the promotion of laziness.

We need a person who will not back down from a fight because it won't be popular to pop the bully in the eye when he needs it. We need a person who will effect our safety and happiness through the rule of law.

In short we need a President.
 

DaMulta

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Try telling that to the men and women on the ground--of which, most WANT to be there. They'd kick you in the balls if they had a chance so I'll do it again, on their behalf. :nutkick:



There are three problems with that:
1) Nothing is "Un-American."
2) The troops are the war so you can't support one and not the other. To do so is through shear ignorance.
3) The House speaks on the behalf of the people, the people we elect. They voted in favor of intervening in Iraq. If you have a problem with that, then you need to find a Representative that stands for you beliefs.
I guess you did not read my post, and do not understand what America is.

OUR government that we SHARE that is FOR THE PEOPLE and we share the same fucking responsibility's in the war for our nation in total

The House speaks on the behalf of the people
No shit that we voted in......which made it OUR CHOICE..........WE THE PEOPLE
SHARE WHAT THE DECIDE TO DO ON OUR BEHALF. Because every American shares ownership in our Country.

Everyone is EQUAL here in America. That's the way it is supposed to be. That's why we get to VOTE!!!!! Everyone shares that.

People that are at war get to vote
me and you at home get to vote
I could run for any place in office in our government
You cold run for any place in office in our government.

One person is not better than the other person in our country. It is one reason we have the one thing called the BILL OF RIGHTS!!!!


I can not say hey I don't like the way the big vote went, and then turn around and say fuck you to my fellow Americans(That are also there FOR THE PEOPLE).
Who is there for the people? You and Me that's who. That's what OUR MILITARY IS. You are not forced to take that roll.DO I have to hate them??????NO!!!!, because they signed on to do what it takes. When our government decides to go to war, they do what has to be done.

In my eyes, my way of thinking, I do not have to hate my fellow Americans(people in the military) that are there for us when the bad comes to worse. I can if I want to, but I feel that it is the wrong thing to do.


I do not have to push my fellow American away because the vote ended in a way I didn't agree with.
I have the right to voice my option and not hate another American for voicing his. That's what makes OUR country the best. We can say what we want and not effect the other person.
It's more Un-American

I said MORE and did not say it's Un American



2) The troops are the war so you can't support one and not the other. To do so is through shear ignorance.
I do not live in Fucking China!!!!!
I have the right to say NO I DO NOT LIKE THAT!!!
I have the right to go along with my country if we do something I DO NOT LIKE!!!
EVERYONE that is an AMERICAN HAS THAT RIGHT!
We The People have the RIGHT, THE FREEDOM TO SAY WHAT WE WANT!
We are not forced to believe in anything. If it was dictated to us then we would not have freedom!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Try telling that to the men and women on the ground--of which, most WANT to be there. They'd kick you in the balls if they had a chance so I'll do it again, on their behalf. :nutkick:

.

My family FOUGHT HERE for our Freedoms!!!! Gave BLOOD so that I can have the right to say whatever I want and for your to say what ever you want.
It has been written in blood. They would kick you in the balls for saying that WE DON'T HAVE THAT RIGHT TO SAY AND BELIEVE IN WHAT WE WANT!
 
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WarEagleAU

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We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

That still rings true to this day! Well said Palit_guy.

Taking this one step further, where does most of our national debt lie? Im really curious about this as well as the trade deficit. I can tell you one thing, we have a "forgiveness" problem. Ill elaborate more on that later after a few of you answer my questions.

BTW, Im going to reach across the isle here and aside from DaMulta droppping F-Bombs:roll: (Still da Man DaMulta) I think Ive learned a whole lot about the political process that I didnt know and more information that I had forgotten. So thank you all for that.
 

DaMulta

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If me dropping the F bomb helps you wake up and see the truth then I'm going to say it.
 

WarEagleAU

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I didnt say wake up now, I think I have a fair grasp on my own ideals and beliefs. However, it is nice to see passion in folks about this.
 

Palit_Guy

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@Damulta

I'll have to disagree with you as a point of semantics. We are not all equal in the US and everyone would do well to bear this in mind.

"Are" equal means present tense, now. That just isn't the case and never has been. All men are CREATED equal. What people do beyond that determines whether or not and to what degree they maintain their equality.

This speaks to the very nature of our humanity and explains many many things when it comes to inequality.

Racism is always a hot topic and if anyone thinks it's anywhere but right in front of us they aren't paying attention. Any time a group gets special consideration that is denied to any other group you have at least some form of racism.

Placing a requirement on government and businesses to hire a certain percentage of minorities is most certainly a form of discrimination. Because the requirement is being applied to race it constitutes racism. I'm a firm believer that racism is bad and therefore racial quotas are bad.

I understand the intent is good but I disagree with the methodology in principle.

Think of it this way. You wouldn't eat a shit sandwich would you? Of course not. In this analogy racism would be the shit sandwich. But what if we took a perfectly good bologna sandwich and just hid a little bit of poo under the mayonnaise? Would that be ok to eat?

At the end of the day denying a white person a job because a non-white guy was needed to hit a quota is discriminatory. It's no more ok to discriminate against a white person than a non-white person.

The same goes for "welfare" people. We've all seen it. The family that lives in a trailer, drives a Cadillac and gets a ton of government assistance. While we may think those people have the same legal rights as everyone else most people do not consider them to be equal in a more general or across the board sense.

Why is that?

Typically that emotion comes from those of us that work very hard for a living and, from the outside looking in, think they aren't pulling their fair share. That means we think "they" and "us" aren't equal. And that is most certainly the case because they aren't working and we are.

Whether or not that is a bad thing is for the reader to decide. I'm ONLY stating the fact that while we as human beings are created equal, we don't stay that way for long and that if you really want to understand yourself, careful consideration of who you consider unequal to yourself and why is an important thing to do.
 

Palit_Guy

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@DaMulta

The F-bomb is a great tool to get people attention and liven things up. But when you use it as much as you do it just becomes another adverb and loses its effect.

Not using very often enhances your ability to "wake people up" with it. Creating a situation that brings even more attention to its use adds to the effect even more.

For example, since I work at Palit everyone typically expects me to play nice and be very professional which equates to being calm and not swearing. I typically oblige that misconception.

The impact of that shows here when I say the following:

Damulta- shut the fuck up and get a fucking dictionary.
 
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