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Windows 98....

Ongaku

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#1
Well, the bf and I are building a computer for my mom in the next week or so. She has $350 to go towards the computer. We can build it the way they want it for about that price with shipping. The only thing is she wants to use her HDTV as the monitor and the only OS I have left to give away is Windows 98 SE or Windows ME :laugh: Can Windows 98 or Windows ME handle HD or am I going to have to submit her to the torture of Linux?

It's torture to her because the only thing she really knows how to do is check Ebay and check her e-mails, and just yesterday I taught her how to burn CDs :laugh: and I really don't want to teach her how to use Ubuntu lol

She'll be able to get XP later on
 
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#2
windows ME is unspeakably bad. 98 can be good tho... some good advice is to hit up used computers for oem XP stickers yay but 98 is technicly capible, and way better than ME for sure.
 
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#3
Yea 98 alone Pwns ME and 98SE blows them both outa the water for stability
 
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#4
If all she wants to do is check Ebay and check her emails, you don't even need to buy new hardware -- just get a fancy case and throw some old stuff into it. :p

And it all depends by what you mean as "handle HD" -- I'm pretty sure most OS's don't care what kind of output the monitor is -- HDTV, big LCD computer monitor -- it shouldn't matter, if I remember correctly.
 
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#5
one thing you fail to mention is the hardware of the computer. This is CRUCIAL as new hardware does not have drivers for 98/ME anymore. Some hardware (nforce4 chips) are just flat out incompatible with windows 98 to the point of not even being able to complete the OS install.
 

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#6
What toastem said is the only thing you need to be worried about. Since those operating systems are no longer "supported" you may not be able to find a driver for a video card that can output in HD.

As far as operating system installs, you can always "find" a copy of XP or vista...it's not that hard =) Or, if you're a student, you can request a free copy of XP or vista.
 

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#7
umm nothing even reasonably new will run on 98/SE anything nforce 4 and up wont run off 98/se
 
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#8
And really -- just give them Linux. Use Linux Mint -- it's based on Ubuntu and looks exactly like Windows XP (or as close as you can get it). Great for those older folks that are used to a Windows world.

Just set it where it automatically logs in, show them how to start up the Web Browser, and leave them to it. :p
 
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#9
honestly i dont think itd be hard to get xp for free, i mean, if you find a computer someone threw away and it had an xp sticker on it, then is there anything wrong with that? legaly i mean... huh i wonder
 
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#10
Find someone giving away /selling an old XP box for cheap and take the number. :p
 
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#11
honestly i dont think itd be hard to get xp for free, i mean, if you find a computer someone threw away and it had an xp sticker on it, then is there anything wrong with that? legaly i mean... huh i wonder
There is if you use it with another computer than that one (assuming it would even work). ;)

Windows OEM licenses are tied to the machine, though of course there's a million ways of dubious legality to get around them.
 
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#12
HD is based on video card drivers, not the OS.
 

DaMulta

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#13
Foxconn A7GM-S AM2+/AM2 AMD 780G HDMI Micro ATX AMD Motherboard- Retail Your Price:$69.99

Has a HDMI port on the motherboard to hook up to her HD/TV

Link Depot 16 ft. HDMI TO HDMI A/V Cable Model HDMI-HDMI-5 - OEM Your Price:$9.99



Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium SP1 64-bit English for System Builders 1pk DSP OEI DVD - OEM Your Price:$99.99


Vista 64 will do everything she wants it to do.

AMD Athlon 64 X2 5000+ Brisbane 2.6GHz Socket AM2 65W Dual-Core Processor Model ADO5000DOBOX - Retail * Free 3 Business Day Shipping
* Your Price:$59.99


SILVERSTONE ST400 400W ATX 12V 2.2 Power Supply - Retail Your Price:$29.99


Crucial 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 667 (PC2 5300) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model CT2KIT12864AA667 - Retail Your Price:$29.99

LITE-ON 20X DVD±R DVD Burner Black IDE Model DH-20A4P-08 - Retail Your Price:$22.99

Microsoft M7A-00001 Black USB Wireless Standard Optical Desktop 700 v2 Mouse Included - Retail Your Price:$23.99


Subtotal: $366.91
Shipping to me was Grand Total: $396.23

Damn for got HDD
Big HDD

Seagate ST3640323AS 640GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM Your Price:$74.99

Subtotal: $441.90
Grand Total: $471.22
Small HDD
HITACHI Deskstar 7K160 HDS721616PLA380 (0Y30006) 160GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM$41.99
Subtotal:$408.90
Grand Total:$441.80

To add to this I know I'm already over, but this is for her HD/tv


AVerMedia AVerTV Combo PCIe MCE ATSC/NTSC/QAM Tuner Card w/MCE Remote & L-P Bracket 7 95522 96066 5 PCI-Express x1 Interface - Retail $109.99

TV Tuner ATSC / ClearQAM / NTSC

QAM tuner
"
In North American digital video, a QAM tuner is a device present in some digital televisions and similar devices which enables direct reception of digital cable channels without the use of a set-top box.[1] QAM-based HD programming of local stations is sometimes available to analog cable subscribers, without paying the additional fees for a digital cable box. The availability of QAM HD programming is rarely described or publicized in cable company product literature. QAM stands for "quadrature amplitude modulation," the format by which digital cable channels are encoded and transmitted via cable. QAM tuners can be likened to the cable equivalent of an ATSC tuner which is required to receive over-the-air (OTA) digital channels broadcast by local television stations; many new cable-ready digital televisions support both of these standards. QAM carries nearly twice the data of over-the-air ATSC 8VSB but since it requires a significantly cleaner signal path it is appropriate for digital cable. An integrated QAM tuner allows the free reception of unscrambled digital programming sent "in the clear" by cable providers, usually local broadcast stations or cable radio channels. Which channels are scrambled varies greatly from location to location and can change over time; the majority of digital channels are scrambled because the providers consider them to be extra-cost options and not part of the "basic cable" package.[2] In the United States a television that is labelled digital cable ready can have a CableCARD installed by the cable provider to unscramble the protected channels, allowing subscribers to tune all authorized digital channels without the use of a set-top box.[3]"]In North American digital video, a QAM tuner is a device present in some digital televisions and similar devices which enables direct reception of digital cable channels without the use of a set-top box.[1] QAM-based HD programming of local stations is sometimes available to analog cable subscribers, without paying the additional fees for a digital cable box. The availability of QAM HD programming is rarely described or publicized in cable company product literature. QAM stands for "quadrature amplitude modulation," the format by which digital cable channels are encoded and transmitted via cable. QAM tuners can be likened to the cable equivalent of an ATSC tuner which is required to receive over-the-air (OTA) digital channels broadcast by local television stations; many new cable-ready digital televisions support both of these standards. QAM carries nearly twice the data of over-the-air ATSC 8VSB but since it requires a significantly cleaner signal path it is appropriate for digital cable. An integrated QAM tuner allows the free reception of unscrambled digital programming sent "in the clear" by cable providers, usually local broadcast stations or cable radio channels. Which channels are scrambled varies greatly from location to location and can change over time; the majority of digital channels are scrambled because the providers consider them to be extra-cost options and not part of the "basic cable" package.[2] In the United States a television that is labelled digital cable ready can have a CableCARD installed by the cable provider to unscramble the protected channels, allowing subscribers to tune all authorized digital channels without the use of a set-top box.[3]
Windows Media Center

Windows Media Center
Enjoy your entire digital entertainment library in full glory on your PC or even on your TV with Windows Media Center.M View your photos in a cinematic slide show, browse your music collection by cover art, easily play DVDs, watch and record TV shows, download movies, and project your home videos—then pass the remote to let friends and family join in the fun!


Windows Media Center is a feature in Windows Vista Home Premium and Windows Vista Ultimate. It is an easy-to-use place to store all of your photos, music, and home videos. Best of all, you can make Windows Media Center fill your screen, and navigate through its menus using either a mouse and keyboard or a remote control.

Take another step and add a TV tuner to your PC, and Windows Media Center becomes a DVR! Watch, pause, and rewind live TV, and record your favorite shows right to your PC. There is no monthly fee, and the electronic programming guide shows you what will be on for the next two weeks.
Subtotal: $518.89
Grand Total: $551.79

TV signals that are supported by Windows Media Center


BlueRay player and the system is a full out TV monster.
Removed LITE-ON 20X DVD±R DVD Burner Black IDE Model DH-20A4P-08 - Retail $22.99 from the list the blue ray player burners everything but blue ray.

LG Black Blu-ray/HD DVD-ROM & 16X DVD±R DVD Burner SATA Model GGC-H20L - RetailYour Price:$134.99

Subtotal: $630.89
Grand Total: $663.79

About watching HD on open source O/S.
The AACS 'Digital Rights Management' system in all Blu-Ray discs attempts to stop consumers from exercising fair use rights, including:

Playing purchased Blu-Ray and HD DVD films using Open Source software.

Playing films using standard digital (DVI) or analog (VGA) cables and monitors, which generally do not support HDCP DRM, without a 75% reduction in resolution.

Fast forwarding or skipping advertisements.
Playing imported films, including when local equivalents may be overpriced or not available.

Blu-Ray or HD DVD player applications require their unique player (or 'device') key to play discs. These keys are issued by AACS-LA to approved manufacturers that implement the restrictions above. This player key can decrypt each film's volume key, which in turn can decrypt the film's content to play it.


Now this machine can game kinda, but if you really want to game with this media machine you should install.
Palit 4870 512MB

$269.99
($249.99 after $20.00 Mail-In
Rebate pdf )
Subtotal: $899.89
Grand Total:$942.75

So for under a thousand dollars, you could be playing COD4/Crysis/any game really, watching blue ray movies on your HD/TV, and or HD/TV with Windows Media Center which has a built in DVR in it. This machine would also be digital ready for the switch next year.


CASE
TV Tuner/with remote
Blue Ray/DVD burner
Motherboard
Highend Video Card
Good PSU
HDMI with audio
16ft of HDMI Cable
Wireless Keyboard and mouse



Now if all you want to do is Email check Ebay and check her e-mails

Then

I would install Suse instead of Ubuntu. It will run firefox, and do her ebay and all that. You can also install open office on it for free.

You can install the chipset/video in Ubuntu
Ubuntu Hardy Installation Guide
http://wiki.cchtml.com/index.php/Ubuntu_Hardy_Installation_Guide


The chipset is also called the 3200
http://ati.amd.com/support/driver.html
drivers

As you can see where the stand alone is.

System above(Subtotal: $366.91 Shipping to me was Grand Total: $396.23 This was with Vista) with no Windows Vista and the totals with different Hard Drives below.
HITACHI Deskstar 7K160 HDS721616PLA380 (0Y30006) 160GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard

Subtotal: $308.91
Grand Total: $341.81

Seagate ST3640323AS 640GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM Your Price:$74.99
Subtotal: $341.91
Grand Total: $371.23

Thats
Case
HDMI Cable
Motherboard
CPU
2 Gigs of ram
DVD Burner/retail
Keyboard/m
PSU 16 ft

------------

Damn this took a lot of time lol
 
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#14
windows XP oem isnt tied to a particular machine. atleast not in the same way vista is
 

DaMulta

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#15
windows XP oem isnt tied to a particular machine. atleast not in the same way vista is
actually it is.

There are two keys to a windows disc. One you type, one on the disc(hidden).

On home they only look at the key that you type in.
They can see it tho!!!!


On Pro they look for both keys the hidden one, and the one that you see.
 

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#16
excellent post DaMulta, it has a ton of good info:respect:
 
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#17
actually it is? that doesnt say anything about it... XP is tied to hardware but it lets you change some befor itl have to be re-activate, plus even if it needs to be reactivated you can just reactivate it, and they will never tell you no.

for winxp it was about piracy, and for vista its about tieing 1 copy to 1 motherboard
 
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#18
there is just no way i could recommend anything below xp when linux is so good these days that it can run fine on a old pc and still be modern

get xubuntu or open suse or summit like puppy linux or DSl(damn small linux)
 

DaMulta

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#19
excellent post DaMulta, it has a ton of good info:respect:
Thanks I forgot the blueray dvd burner link lol

added now tho :rolleyes:

and had a motherboard that was labeled wrong but linked right hahahaa fixed
----
edited a few extra things:roll:
 
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DaMulta

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#20
actually it is? that doesnt say anything about it... XP is tied to hardware but it lets you change some befor itl have to be re-activate, plus even if it needs to be reactivated you can just reactivate it, and they will never tell you no.

for winxp it was about piracy, and for vista its about tieing 1 copy to 1 motherboard
It will 2(XP) tell you no after 5 times and you have to call Microsoft. If you change out the motherboard in a XP system it will tell you that your system has change dramatically(something like that) and you have to reactivate it.

I have been told no on OEM before by MS. They told me that OEM can not be transfered over to a new system.
 
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#21
i dont believe there are any h.264 or any other HD codec for anything pre XP, hell xp barely hits the mark. Blu-ray isnt at all supported by xp, in fact, it seems like they are working against it being for XP, although with a firmware update, some INF file processing, i finally got blu-ray on XP.

Sure, windows 98 can do 1920x1080(tru HD) but good luck finding a windows 98 supported video card to stream video at that, some of the first vista machines had problems playing HD content.
 

Ongaku

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Oshkosh B'gosh
#22
one thing you fail to mention is the hardware of the computer. This is CRUCIAL as new hardware does not have drivers for 98/ME anymore. Some hardware (nforce4 chips) are just flat out incompatible with windows 98 to the point of not even being able to complete the OS install.
yes I TOTALLY forgot about that one :laugh: I guess she's going to have to deal with some Linux distro until she can get Windows XP or I'ma have to find someone that has a spare key :p
 

Wile E

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#23
i dont believe there are any h.264 or any other HD codec for anything pre XP, hell xp barely hits the mark. Blu-ray isnt at all supported by xp, in fact, it seems like they are working against it being for XP, although with a firmware update, some INF file processing, i finally got blu-ray on XP.

Sure, windows 98 can do 1920x1080(tru HD) but good luck finding a windows 98 supported video card to stream video at that, some of the first vista machines had problems playing HD content.
BD works on XP. All you need is the software. Like PowerDVD8 or WinDVD. Worked perfectly fine on my machine using my buddies external BD rom (HD DVD also works, btw)
 

Ongaku

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Oshkosh B'gosh
#24
She's not going all into the Blu-Ray nonsense and all that crap, basically she just wants to use her HDTV as a monitor via one of the HDMI ports and going on the internet and listing her stuff on Ebay and general internet browsing, stuff I used to do before I got into the wonderful world of PC gaming.

She already has a HD-DVD player, digital audio CD player, and a crazy 7.1 Dolby surround sound system from Sony (the subwoofer is HUGE), lol her bf got a settlement and he blew a lot of his money on this system that he knows absolutely nothing about, me and the bf had to hook it up :laugh:


DaMulta....

ya you got some good stuff there but it's way out of price range for what she wants. She's using my sisters old crappy Athlon XP system :laugh: but she just wants her own to have and all that because it's quite a pain in the ass to get my sister off that crap computer...lol I don't understand why my sister likes it so much, it's so damn slow! And it has an old IBM monitor that my dad brought home from work cos the previous one died...monitor has to be from the early 90s :laugh:

Basically what I'm getting her is:


GIGABYTE GA-MA78GM-S2H $85
Athlon X2 5000+ $60
2 GB DDR2 800 Gskill or 2GB of Wintec AmpX $40-45
250GB Seagate Barracuda $60
whatever CD drive is cheap probably the one I have right now $20-25
wireless keyboard and mouse $30-40
HTPC case or slimline case w/PSU $60-70

if she's got extra cash left over, she said she would buy Windows XP. If not, I'll be teaching her how to use Ubuntu until she gets XP.

and of course the prices might vary...buying all of it from newegg.

oh and now apparently it's going to be up to 3 weeks, she sold some Disney cake toppers (little figurines) from the 50s on Ebay for a couple hundred bucks, and Paypal takes forever to give her that money because of the large amount I guess.
 
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#25
if she's got extra cash left over, she said she would buy Windows XP. If not, I'll be teaching her how to use Ubuntu until she gets XP.
Don't even worry about any teaching -- just create a giant icon on the desktop and title it "CLICK HERE FOR INTERNET" :D

You can even make its icon a big blue "E" if you want.