Possible to enable SLI on any chipset?

[newtekie1]

Ok, before I begin, I know it is not possible for SLI to work on any chipset currently. So if you came in here to comment about that, don't.

Now, I was thinking. Since the 9800GX2 drivers basically allow you to enable SLI on any chipset. It is possible that we might start seeing some hacked drivers to allow SLI on real dual card setups with any chipset?

The reason I am thinking this is that when nVidia bought ULi, they added SLI support for ULi chipsets, and this allowed the driver hackers to figure out a way to enable SLI for many other chipsets(I believe this is how the famous 975X hacked drivers originated, but I could be wrong).

So I just wanted to get everyones opinions on it, do you think it might be something we will see in the future?

 

[kylew]

I'd expect so, HP/Voodoo have done it too, but they're keeping quiet on what it took for them to get it working.

 

[mk_ln]

iirc, there was the HP Blackbird 002 which allowed crossfire on the 680i chipset, so I would think that the other way around would be possible (i.e. SLI on an intel chipset).

 

[xylomn]

it has been done before (i think) with modified drivers, they were buggy though. If i remember correctly thats also how hp enabled crossfire on an nvidia chipset..

 

[Deleted member 3]

There are some ancient drivers out there that allow SLI on any chipset, those drivers don't support the 8 (and 9) series though. It proves that it can be done though.

 

[JrRacinFan]

I don't beleive this is what newtekie is posting about. What you are saying newtekie, if there isn't an "extra bridge" on the 9800GX2 to strictly only allow SLi to be enabled, it would have to be down to drivers to enable it.

So then the question intact is it possible to mod the drivers for it for "SLi on any chipset"?

This is very interesting as I myself also would like to know, due to primarily using nV cards and have an Intel 8X+8X crossfire board.

See that is how I took your question and your post. Oh and great question by the way.

EDIT: I am pretty sure everyone is aware of the Forceware 84 & 85's BigSam SLi hack, and that's what is being referred to in the previous posts more than likely.

 

[newtekie1]

Yeah, I referenced the BigSam SLI hack, which was based on the ULi patch that allowed SLI on ULi chipsets. The BigSam took that patch and modded it to work on all chipsets.

nVidia "fixed" the whole in the drivers that allowed the ULi patch after the 84 and 85 series drivers, and effectively killed the BigSam hack at the same time.

However, it seems they might have oppened up the possibility for a similar patch again. I don't think there is a specific chip on the 9800GX2 to allow SLI, someone correct me if I am wrong as I haven't actually taken the cards apart to look at them, I'm just going on what I have seen of the card taken apart on the net. So, it has to be down to the drivers to allow it.

So I am thinking, given enough time, some people smarter than I might figure it out and modify the 9800GX2 capable drivers to enable SLI with any cards on any chipset.

 

[GSG-9]

I believe the 9800GX2 has an onboard chip/bridge interface. I dont believe the sli even works with the motherboard if im correct, the driver communicatets directly with the chip on the card. (I dont know any of this lol, it just makes more since to me). Isent there a brand of cards that work in crossfire on any chipset?

 

[JrRacinFan]

Yeah, that's what I was exactly referring to in my earlier post. Whether or not the GX2 has an onboard SLi chipset bridge.

But, I doubt the GX2 drivers would open up a hole like that, would be very cool though if nVidia decides "Too much hassle to input driver security".

 

[GSG-9]

would be very cool though if nVidia decides "Too much hassle to input driver security".

We can hope

 

[newtekie1]

I believe the 9800GX2 has an onboard chip/bridge interface. I dont believe the sli even works with the motherboard if im correct, the driver communicatets directly with the chip on the card. (I dont know any of this lol, it just makes more since to me). Isent there a brand of cards that work in crossfire on any chipset?

The onboard bridge chip used is the nForce 200 PCI-E 2.0 bridge, the same chip used on the 780i motherboards to adapt the 780i chipset to PCI-E 2.0. That chip might be what allows SLI to be enabled on any chipset with this card.

Though it is just a PCI-E bridge chip, it doesn't have anything to do with SLI AFAIK.

It would be nice to see some modders out there figure out a way to do it, but I know I am just dreaming.

 

[JrRacinFan]

Ahh hah! I gotcha now tekie. Could be possible but still unlikely. I wonder if BigSam is working on them currently in secret.

 

[GSG-9]

The onboard bridge chip used is the nForce 200 PCI-E 2.0 bridge, the same chip used on the 780i motherboards to adapt the 780i chipset to PCI-E 2.0. That chip might be what allows SLI to be enabled on any chipset with this card.

Though it is just a PCI-E bridge chip, it doesn't have anything to do with SLI AFAIK.

It would be nice to see some modders out there figure out a way to do it, but I know I am just dreaming.

So you also get the advantage of pcie 2.0 between cards or will it bump back to pcie if you do not have a pcie2 motherboard?

 

[JrRacinFan]

Same as any other PCIe 2 card. Backwards compatible.

 

[GSG-9]

Same as any other PCIe 2 card. Backwards compatible.

but the bridge and cards are pcie 2.0, i wounder at what speed they will communicate.

 

[wolf]

i think if there are 2 - pci-e slots that can run at the same speed, i.e 4x - 4x, 8x - 8x, or 16x - 16x, then its totally possible. it might never happen, but i think its "possible"

 

[Kursah]

I think it would be a good move for NV to release drivers to support SLI on any chipset, or more than it currently does. They should just recommend for best performance and support, an SLI Certified Chipset/MB be used...but beyond that they should go for it. That would help greatly with their customer base and give them an ever sharpening edge. We can just hope, and probably wait for hacked drivers...but damn it would be a good move on NV's part...I'm sure there would be some sort of legal issues to be found by someone tho.

 

[muka3d]

iirc, there was the HP Blackbird 002 which allowed crossfire on the 680i chipset, so I would think that the other way around would be possible (i.e. SLI on an intel chipset).

You can't do SLI on every chipset, since it works through the board and depends on the MCPs. CrossFire works quite differently than SLI, and yes at VoodooPC (where I work) we do have CrossFire running on SLI-based boards like the Blackbird 002's. How we do it, I can't say . Though without major changes to NVIDIA's SLI architecture, it won't be possible to run it on just any given chipset. I'm just going by the GeForce 8 series here.

Both of them (SLI and CrossFire), though, are more than just driver-level enhancements. Modded drivers alone won't do the trick for either case.

 

[Dia01]

Yeah, that's what I was exactly referring to in my earlier post. Whether or not the GX2 has an onboard SLi chipset bridge.

But, I doubt the GX2 drivers would open up a hole like that, would be very cool though if nVidia decides "Too much hassle to input driver security".

If that is true that the GX2 has an onboard SLI chipset, would it then be possible to make a SLI bridge (connecting both cards) that has an integrated chipset to communicate both cards. MOBO manufactures could supply them or purchase them seperately.

 

[newtekie1]

You can't do SLI on every chipset, since it works through the board and depends on the MCPs. CrossFire works quite differently than SLI, and yes at VoodooPC (where I work) we do have CrossFire running on SLI-based boards like the Blackbird 002's. How we do it, I can't say . Though without major changes to NVIDIA's SLI architecture, it won't be possible to run it on just any given chipset. I'm just going by the GeForce 8 series here.

Both of them (SLI and CrossFire), though, are more than just driver-level enhancements. Modded drivers alone won't do the trick for either case.

It was possible using just a driver hack with the 7 series, I can't see that SLI has changed that much in the 8 series that it also wouldn't just be a driver issue.

 

[btarunr]

The 9800 GX2 functions on any chipset because of the NForce 200 chip onboard. So the GPU's don't directly communicate with the system, they get their PCI-E lanes from this switch chip.

 

[GSG-9]

You can't do SLI on every chipset, since it works through the board and depends on the MCPs. CrossFire works quite differently than SLI, and yes at VoodooPC (where I work) we do have CrossFire running on SLI-based boards like the Blackbird 002's. How we do it, I can't say . Though without major changes to NVIDIA's SLI architecture, it won't be possible to run it on just any given chipset. I'm just going by the GeForce 8 series here.

Both of them (SLI and CrossFire), though, are more than just driver-level enhancements. Modded drivers alone won't do the trick for either case.

Diamond! Diamond ATi cards from the 1900 and on can work in crossfire on any motherboard.
Edit: Its called xDNA

The 9800 GX2 functions on any chipset because of the NForce 200 chip onboard. So the GPU's don't directly communicate with the system, they get their PCI-E lanes from this switch chip.

And since it does not communicate with the system is the bandwith between cards @ 2.0 or 1.0 if you have a 1.0 mobo?

 

[btarunr]

And since it does not communicate with the system is the bandwith between cards @ 2.0 or 1.0 if you have a 1.0 mobo?

Irrespective of what it is, if you run it on a PCI-E 1.1 slot, you're limiting the bandwidth anyway because a level of abstraction is created by the NForce 200.

Think of it this way: Your ADSL router connects to the internet at 8 Mbps and the the ethernet line between this ADSL router and your computer is 100 Mbps. What will your internet bandwidth be?

 

[GSG-9]

Irrespective of what it is, if you run it on a PCI-E 1.1 slot, you're limiting the bandwidth anyway because a level of abstraction is created by the NForce 200.

Think of it this way: Your ADSL router connects to the internet at 8 Mbps and the the ethernet line between this ADSL router and your computer is 100 Mbps. What will your internet bandwidth be?

Reguardless I would still like to know for the sake of knowing, my computers bottleneck would be the cpu still not the videocard anyway.

 

[newtekie1]

The 9800 GX2 functions on any chipset because of the NForce 200 chip onboard. So the GPU's don't directly communicate with the system, they get their PCI-E lanes from this switch chip.

But the drivers still have to allow SLI to be enabled on any chipset, the NForce 200 is just a PCI-E bridge, it isn't a chipset.

And since it does not communicate with the system is the bandwith between cards @ 2.0 or 1.0 if you have a 1.0 mobo?

The communication between the cards is most likely at PCI-E 2.0. However, it doesn't matter since PCI-E 1.1 provides more then enough bandwidth.