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Ok so im attempting my 2nd build.....

omslemming

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Make sure you take a look at AMD's business line of processors (B93/B97) and take a good long time thinking about piledriver. AS for the Biostar mobo I have been very impressed with all of their boards. I am currently toying with the idea of ditching my long loved choice of Asus and finally moving all the way over to them. The past 4 or so rigs I have built for people have all been Biostar based. All are very stable well written Bios's with good strong designs.

When is piledriver expected to be released then? and is there any news on expected cost? thing is I want to have my build finished within a month or so as getting fed up of my current desktops problems and want it ready for a few new games coming out in the next month or so, so if piledriver isnt going to be along for a while then id rather stick with the bulldozer.
 

Aquinus

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When is piledriver expected to be released then? and is there any news on expected cost? thing is I want to have my build finished within a month or so as getting fed up of my current desktops problems and want it ready for a few new games coming out in the next month or so, so if piledriver isnt going to be along for a while then id rather stick with the bulldozer.

What is your current desktop?
 

omslemming

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What is your current desktop?

Intel Core 2 Quad Q8300 2.5GHz

ASUS P5QL PRO iP43 Socket 775 8 channel audio ATX Motherboard

Arctic Power 700W PSU

Sapphire HD 5750 Vapor-X Edition

Corsair 4GB (2x2GB) DDR2 800MHz/PC2-6400 XMS2 Memory Kit

Samsung HD103SJ Spinpoint F3 1TB Hard Drive

Processer doesnt run at even 2.5ghz half the time according to cpu z(running it at the mo and its jumping between 1.997 and 2.497 ghz-adding to that when I tried to overclock it using the asus ai suit utlity and putting it on oc performence setting the ghz didnt even increase lol), graphics card ive had driver issues since day 1, ram ive had to replace due to faulty sticks, motherboard dont even get me started, had no end of issues caused by asus`s software, the realtek audio driver and others.

Yeah id say im looking forward to ditching this and getting a new build on the go haha.
 
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Durvelle27

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Cheapness and ideal for what I need, I doubt id even notice the difference anyway esp since im gonna be running my build with ssd and a powerful graphics card anyway. ive also seen some benchmarks that suggest the amd chips fare not as badly as you think esp with gaming which will be the main use for my desktop, indeed in the benchmarks ive seen the amd chips beat the i5 framerate wise on a variety of games and the 8150 of the bulldozer variety even beat the i7 on a test running dirt 3.

I'm going to echo the opinion that since you're spending what, $1500? The idea of cheapness is wayyyyy behind you. AMD CPU's aren't terrible, but if you want the best performance for you money, Intel seems to be the way to go until we get a good look at Piledriver.

As for Gaming Performance, Intel CPU's tend to edge AMD out due to the fact that most Game's only run on 1-4 Threads, so having 8 "Cores" is of minimal benefit, and Intel's per-thread performance is hugely better. Dirt 3 tends to be a game that AMD tests and recommends testing a lot with, they even ship copies of it with their GPU's, so I'm pretty certain it's very much AMD-optimized.

They also have to potential to overclock higher then anything you could achieve with an i5 which attracted me as thats something I want to get into(may upgrade my cooler to a water cooling block if I decide to run with it)

Higher != Better. Yes, Bulldozer can run at a higher frequency than SB\IB, it can also eat substantially more power than those two and require freakishly high clocks to reach an equivalent level of performance.

Im wary of any advice on processers, not to offend anyone but I know the intel/amd rivalry is almost like android/apple in terms of fanboyism so I try not to pay much attention to either side, ive had grief before when talking about builds with an amd base, seems some intel heads dont like compeition heh heh

For me it comes down to objectively picking the highest performing parts, which at this point tend to be Intel. I wanted Bulldozer to be on par for SB, but it just wasn't, and plugging your ears and screaming isn't going to change that fact. You can either spend more money in the long run on power and extra parts and overclock the crap out of a BD CPU, wait for PD which looks to be viable competition for Intel, or go Intel and just enjoy the high level of performance they currently offer.

It has nothing to do with Intel getting competition, if anything they are experiencing a lack of it from AMD. It took AMD what, like 3-5 years to get BD out after Phenom II launched? And it was met with really harsh criticism. When it comes to APU's and to a degree Server CPU's AMD is on the right course. I hope PD is better so Intel actually does have some competition, but BD is far from it.
 

omslemming

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Ok well ive done a bit more research and ive been swung a little, luckly Ive only got the processer so far not the motherboard, and considering I got that for 90 quid off ebuyer on special and theyre going for about 110-120 quid on ebay I should be even able to swing a profit on it if I sell it.

So my next question, What is the best for gaming? ivybridge or sandybridge? I know they each have there benefits for different kinds of systems, and is it worth paying a bit more for i7? does the performence difference between that and i5 make it worth it or not? Also as far as overclocking goes, id like to buy the unlocked version of whatever I get as I know one of the downsides of intel is the stupid restrictions they place on there locked processers to force people to upgrade earlier(thats one reason I went amd) ive seen processers advertised as say Intel Core i7 3770 but then ive seen Intel Core i7 3770s and Intel Core i7 3770k is the s and k versions the unlocked ones or am I looking at something completly different?
 

nikko

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2nd and 3rd gen I5/I7 are indistinguishable performance-wise. There is no question about it.

I would take the i7-3770K and Z77 Extreme3 very soon and use it for about 3-5 years with 1-2 video card upgrades. Other I5/I7 non-K combined with Z77 are partially unlocked default+600Mhz.The 3570 for example is in fact 4.0Ghz (not sure about this. it should have +400Mhz partial unlock +200 turbo +default 3400Mhz). not a record breaking frequency still pretty strong performance +-10% apart from decent 4.4 overclock. nobody is being forced to upgrade sooner, the improvement since the first gen core i7 is mostly lower power consumption. Don't expect anything new. Don't expect 6Ghz 6 core mainstream anytime soon.
 
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Ivy-Bridge is slightly better performance-wise, but don't overclock as well. If you're planning on Overclocking they are largely identical. As for i5 vs. i7 it's really a matter of opinion and budget. Very few games benefit from the extra threads of an i7, so if you want to trim some cost the i5 is a more than viable alternative. If you have the money I recommend the i7 so in the long run you are prepared if Game Developers get off their ass and start optimizing games for more than 1-4 threads.

For motherboard I suggest Z77 Extreme3 or Pro3 if you want to save some money.
 

Aquinus

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if Game Developers get off their ass and start optimizing games for more than 1-4 threads.

edit: Greetings, fellow New Englander. :p

You make it sound like multi-threading is easy. Also, I'm willing to bet that a lot of the games you play right now are running with more than 4 threads. It's a matter of being able to offload certain parts that are more demanding than others. I'm going to defend game developers on this one since I'm a developer myself and I understand that there are a lot of difficulties to make a quad-core run at 100% on all cores for a complicated task such as a game.

As for i5 vs i7, it's really preference. An i5 will do just as well as an i7 for gaming. For single-threaded tasks, the i7 has a very slight advantage by having a larger L3 cache, which means the CPU will hit the cache more often giving it more time to compute and less time waiting on system memory (since on-die static ram is a lot faster than dynamic memory, it is also closer to the rest of the CPU which has a better latency as well).

To use my i7 3820 as an example (keep in mind that it might be a little bit slower than SB's 8Mb or 6Mb since I have 10Mb and it takes a little longer to address.):
cachemem.JPG


Cache is definitely a selective performance boost though. It really depends on how often memory is accessed, how much, and how often so it varies from application to application.
 
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