What do you do for a living?

[A&P211]

retirement is only rough if you don't have a house to inherit (I may, I don't know for sure to be honest, if not well it is what it is and I will adapt), my relatives in England inherited their house at a young age, its been in their family line for 500 years I believe. it's not much, but it needs 0 repairs, I guess they just built things better back then, I don't know. the generational wealth they have accumulated from never having rent though is quite astounding.

that being said, being around them has taught me that wealth is not everything, in fact it disconnects you from a greater reality imo. me personally as long as I have enough savings to live content and enjoy a few hobbies I am good with that. Happiness is really all about perspective and how you spend your time, for me I just want enough in savings to know I will have stability long term (rent is a big factor in that, so your concerns are valid 100%). One example of excess wealth though, I got my shorts for like at $15 Costco, they are great and I like them, my relative in England wears $250 shorts... I mean congrats I guess... not throwing shade at it or anything, people are free to do as they choose, but it does imo blind them to a greater reality sometimes.

some wealth is important, but excess is not. once I reach a point of knowing my rent, property taxes, utilities, food, healthcare, and a few hobbies once all of that is taken care of in my current lower middle class lifestyle - I am a happy camper, I don't need a 200k a house, a 130k house is fine, a 75k SUV, no thanks a 20k Kia Forte is fine, and it will last me just as long if I take care of it. so don't mistake me saying wealth is not important for happiness, it is to some degree, but I don't need the riches that many seek. as long as I have my books and games I am good (and I already have most of those on backlog to last me a life time lol)

I buy pants or shorts at goodwill, pants for $10, shorts for 5-$8. I make a nice living but I'm cheap, there I said it, "I'm cheap". My house was $52k 8yrs ago, its a small 2/1 house. Did $30k into a rehab 4yrs ago, now its perfect for 2 people. My car is 14yrs old, still running, still love it. I wont inherit anything, I'm a 1st generation American with parents that retired poor living on SSI and a small pension. House and rehab did cash payment. I dont even own a credit card.
Free games on epic. I'm still playing some of those.

Was a decent mechanic for 8 years after leaving school @ 16 , then after being made redundant twice I went on to study engineering @ HND level ,then worked in PC's building servers and system for RSA and other large companys (also built Jobserve's webserver circa 1999 as it was getting 4.5Million hits a month) was head of RMA's and overclocking.
Then moved to Aus -1 year working holiday visa on KENO and the New South Wales lottery machines( AWA then Jupiters.)
Back to UK worked in filtration @ places like Jonson Matthey/Pilkingtons/etc(Mortelecque)
Moved to Spain opened an internet cafe on dial up! yup 4 machines including a mac on dial up 56k also did some cooking (panninis etc) later that year a chef who had worked @ Le Gavroche took over the building and i moved out, he asked if i could help him in the kitchen.
1 year later he leaves i take on a his restaurant with my wife, we do 6+ years there (rented) and decide to find our own place and start building our own restaurant.
Moving on to now we have had our own custom built restaurant for 10+ years, semi retired as we live in a sleepy seasonal mountain village.

Find whats right for you, do your best, but dont kill yourself doing it!
Love, life and happiness

Hug

I'm killing myself now doing 4 12hrs per week, sometimes I'll add a 5th day, but its for a purpose. 2 more yrs as a airframe and powerplant mechanic and I'm out. I cant wait for the spring to arrive.

 

[kilo]

Without too many details, I'm about your age and I'm doing system engineering for a very large corporation now.

I had a not-ideal childhood and a very late start figuring out what I was going to do in life. Bounced around several terrible minimum wage jobs, ended up working 2nd shift making $900/mo after my hours were cut a few months in and living in a sketchy area with 3 roommates from craigslist. Budget was tight. Some days I would cry in my car in the grocery store parking lot cause I needed to figure out the cheapest stuff to eat and life was trash and I had no one I could fall back on. But working evenings allowed me to take classes during the day. Looking back, that was worth it.

I started my IT "career" about 11 years ago with no degree and an A+ cert. My first job was in a warehouse where they started me at one pay rate, then cut my rate before my first pay check. I stuck around too long (just over a year) while I was working towards other goals and night school. When I left, I didn't give notice. I finished a 2 year degree and more certifications during this time.

Next job was a desktop support role. I stayed there for 2.5 years and got lucky cause my coworker liked me and mentored me. I got a Jr. Sys Admin position with much support from my coworker, which lasted a year. I'll abbreviate the story there.

I think success comes down to a few things.

1. If you aren't working towards a promotion or new job, you need to be learning something. Learning a new skill in your free time can become a new job. But it doesn't always need to be something for a career. I got interested in gardening during lock downs after being bored to tears of movie and video games all the time. Hobbies/interest/skills give you networking with new people.

2. "Put that sh*t on your resume" is a phrase I use often with friends. In the US, it's not common to put life skills or interests in resumes. But when I hired people, I didn't care if you had a MS, I was looking for other qualifications. "Have you built a PC? Then you'll like this job." My thinking was at the time, a person with an advanced degree will treat you like McDonalds and not care or put in effort before they leave in a few months. I have told friends: put your home lab on your resume! Put your first PC build on your resume! Worst case scenario, it's ignored. Best case is, the interviewing manager wants to see how you act about a passion of yours.

3. Stay in touch with people. If you like a coworker who leaves, text them every few months. I'm still in touch with a former coworker I haven't seen in 6 years. He's probably on this forum and I don't know it, lol.

4. Accept that you will have hard times at some point in your life. And that you will overcome those challenges.

5. If you aren't extroverted, learn to pretend to be extroverted. Like every skill, with enough practice you will learn how to do it right. Learn how to be courteous when someone screws up. Learn how to politely talk to someone on the side who was a jerk to you. One thing I've noticed is that most people are jerks because they think "it's just a joke" and the more public of a jerk someone is, the more of a coward they are one on one.

Edit:

6. Don't worry about turning a hobby into work. I've been very happy in IT and I basically started with a Phenom 9850 BE

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Investments are awesome if you have a financial type of brain. Sadly, I don't.

It's easy if you have a 401k or open an IRA. Just look at the 10&20yr returns for the index funds. Pick one with low expense ratio and high rate of return. Fidelity and Vanguard both have good offerings. Your position is long, that is you can keep contributing to it, but never take any until you are in your 60s and there is no penalty to do so. There is a joke that the investors that have the best returns are the ones that forgot their login info. Moving the money around is where it gets tricky and you have to be savvy about it. So just go long/be in it for the long haul. History is on your side, you WILL make a nice return over the course of decades by staying in that index fund.

If your employer offers 401K with a match it's free money, don't pass that up. Some require years to be fully vested and keep their contribution, so that's something to consider if you don't know you will be there in 2-3yrs or whatever. The money is tax deferred so for some, being able to max contribute can put them in a lower tax bracket which helps them out too. I was in that position before. ROTH means the money is after you paid your taxes i.e. taxed going in. So they can't tax it again in retirement. when you withdraw. It allows access to the money early without penalties too, making it perhaps the most flexible. The traditional ones you will pay income taxes on in your golden years when you take it out.

The only times the tax deferred ones suck is if -

1. You need to withdraw some of the money for whatever reason after reaching retirement age.
2. You have reached 72yrs old which is now the RMD = required minimum distribution age for most retirement investments that are not ROTH, here in the U.S.

And the market is down significantly in that timeframe. You still made profit on that money over the years, but it is never fun or desirable to get less than you could have. The other time it can suck is if you have to take a loan from yourself before retirement age. Most require aggressive repayments to yourself that make it untenable, being as you must have been in dire straights to raid the investment funds in the first place. That means you likely can't afford it because the repayments are so high. So you have to show proof you are hurting badly enough to get a hardship loan from yourself. Either of those, and even the ROTH are terrible to withdraw from because that money is no longer in play making you money. Again, If you took it out when the market was down significantly that hurts even more. Buy low sell high as the meme goes. Selling low sucks.

That's about all you need to know -
1. Pick an Index fund with low expense ratio and high returns over the history of the fund.
2. Let it ride and keep adding to it.
3. Never touch it before retirement.
4. Avoid cashing any out when market is down significantly if at all possible. For example: People doing the RMD now can't complain, they are cashing out near historic highs.

 

[lilhasselhoffer]

It's easy if you have a 401k or open an IRA. Just look at the 10&20yr returns for the index funds. Pick one with low expense ratio and high rate of return. Fidelity and Vanguard both have good offerings. Your position is long, that is you can keep contributing to it, but never take any until you are in your 60s and there is no penalty to do so. There is a joke that the investors that have the best returns are the ones that forgot their login info. Moving the money around is where it gets tricky and you have to be savvy about it. So just go long/be in it for the long haul. History is on your side, you WILL make a nice return over the course of decades by staying in that index fund.

If your employer offers 401K with a match it's free money, don't pass that up. Some require years to be fully vested and keep their contribution, so that's something to consider if you don't know you will be there in 2-3yrs or whatever. The money is tax deferred so for some, being able to max contribute can put them in a lower tax bracket which helps them out too. I was in that position before. ROTH means the money is after you paid your taxes i.e. taxed going in. So they can't tax it again in retirement. when you withdraw. It allows access to the money early without penalties too, making it perhaps the most flexible. The traditional ones you will pay income taxes on in your golden years when you take it out.

The only times the tax deferred ones suck is if -

1. You need to withdraw some of the money for whatever reason after reaching retirement age.
2. You have reached 72yrs old which is now the RMD = required minimum distribution age for most retirement investments that are not ROTH, here in the U.S.

And the market is down significantly in that timeframe. You still made profit on that money over the years, but it is never fun or desirable to get less than you could have. The other time it can suck is if you have to take a loan from yourself before retirement age. Most require aggressive repayments to yourself that make it untenable, being as you must have been in dire straights to raid the investment funds in the first place. That means you likely can't afford it because the repayments are so high. So you have to show proof you are hurting badly enough to get a hardship loan from yourself. Either of those, and even the ROTH are terrible to withdraw from because that money is no longer in play making you money. Again, If you took it out when the market was down significantly that hurts even more. Buy low sell high as the meme goes. Selling low sucks.

That's about all you need to know -
1. Pick an Index fund with low expense ratio and high returns over the history of the fund.
2. Let it ride and keep adding to it.
3. Never touch it before retirement.
4. Avoid cashing any out when market is down significantly if at all possible. For example: People doing the RMD now can't complain, they are cashing out near historic highs.

You have...grossly oversimplified this.

Let me 10k' view this. When you pick an investment there are many types. Some are managed...some are time gated...and some are self controlled. Those "historic values" are only an indicator of the past performance...and mean nothing. If the market tanks, so does your investment. Your gamble here is that if you defer money, you can put it into an account without taxes and get a return rate higher than the inflation rate. Most people are too thick to see that the numbers being quoted are idiotic high...and forget that things are also inflating.

IE...let's imagine that you have a 5% investment on average...and put in $100. Let's also assume 40 years of time between plinking the money down...and cashing it out. 100*1.05^40 = $704.00. Cool...you made $604...right? Well, take about 80% of that with taxes...or $563.20. Not so great anymore...but it's still $463.20. Now...what buying power does that have? If we've got an average 3% inflation rate...100*1.03^40 = $326.20. Holy crap....40 years of investment and you have $137 more than you used to...which is the equivalent buying power of about $32.19 extra.

That's right. Money that you don't touch for 40 years of your life has effectively increased from $100 to $132.19, in terms of current buying power. To all the old farts out there that scream about saving...the young stopped caring because of this math. I remember a wonderful time when we were quoted at 9-11%...and that math after 40 years is fine...but with how little of a crap some of these investment packages offer it's basically better to just be happy today than have an extra $20 equivalent in your pocket in 40 years.


Funny that...it's why I suggest that instead of investing and trying to simplify you choose a job you like. In my lifetime the US will basically not support social security...because paying into it while they plunder it for other things means that our government basically is stealing from us. I cannot trust investing...because the raw math makes my head hurt as nobody trying to sell it to me has done the math of effective buying power when I cash out...and once I show them they look at me like I'm the idiot. They then consult their institutions...and stop talking to me because anyone smart enough to do this basic math laughs at their returns rates.
Be satisfied with your job, happy with the pay, and happy to work with the people you work with. It's not a life that will make you rich...but it is a life where you can be satisfied. Unfortunately, that's what we have to live with...because the young are now paying for decades of offshoring and artificially low inflation as we received insanely cheap labor. As that disappears...well, I don't intend to live a long life. I do hope to live a happy one.

 

[80-watt Hamster]

You have...grossly oversimplified this.

Let me 10k' view this. When you pick an investment there are many types. Some are managed...some are time gated...and some are self controlled. Those "historic values" are only an indicator of the past performance...and mean nothing. If the market tanks, so does your investment. Your gamble here is that if you defer money, you can put it into an account without taxes and get a return rate higher than the inflation rate. Most people are too thick to see that the numbers being quoted are idiotic high...and forget that things are also inflating.

IE...let's imagine that you have a 5% investment on average...and put in $100. Let's also assume 40 years of time between plinking the money down...and cashing it out. 100*1.05^40 = $704.00. Cool...you made $604...right? Well, take about 80% of that with taxes...or $563.20. Not so great anymore...but it's still $463.20. Now...what buying power does that have? If we've got an average 3% inflation rate...100*1.03^40 = $326.20. Holy crap....40 years of investment and you have $137 more than you used to...which is the equivalent buying power of about $32.19 extra.

That's right. Money that you don't touch for 40 years of your life has effectively increased from $100 to $132.19, in terms of current buying power. To all the old farts out there that scream about saving...the young stopped caring because of this math. I remember a wonderful time when we were quoted at 9-11%...and that math after 40 years is fine...but with how little of a crap some of these investment packages offer it's basically better to just be happy today than have an extra $20 equivalent in your pocket in 40 years.


Funny that...it's why I suggest that instead of investing and trying to simplify you choose a job you like. In my lifetime the US will basically not support social security...because paying into it while they plunder it for other things means that our government basically is stealing from us. I cannot trust investing...because the raw math makes my head hurt as nobody trying to sell it to me has done the math of effective buying power when I cash out...and once I show them they look at me like I'm the idiot. They then consult their institutions...and stop talking to me because anyone smart enough to do this basic math laughs at their returns rates.
Be satisfied with your job, happy with the pay, and happy to work with the people you work with. It's not a life that will make you rich...but it is a life where you can be satisfied. Unfortunately, that's what we have to live with...because the young are now paying for decades of offshoring and artificially low inflation as we received insanely cheap labor. As that disappears...well, I don't intend to live a long life. I do hope to live a happy one.

I'm not going to claim that Social Security won't become untenable in the future, but what is it being "plundered" for? To my (limited) knowledge, SS is one of the few programs whose funding is essentially sacrosanct.

 

[the54thvoid]

This thread is wildly moving off-track.

 

[xtreemchaos]

im now retired "so still work but dont really get paid" . i was a forrestry contractor for most of my life but retired from that in my 40s then built some custom choppers and streetfighters for the rest of my 40s then, did some custom Rigg building and Tech work which brings me to today but over all i could diss-cribe myself as a Bum not a low down bum just a bum.

 

[lilhasselhoffer]

I'm not going to claim that Social Security won't become untenable in the future, but what is it being "plundered" for? To my (limited) knowledge, SS is one of the few programs whose funding is essentially sacrosanct.

"...
Some people have claimed over the years that the federal government’s borrowing from Social Security equates to “stealing.” But that’s not true. Johnson called these claims “misinformation.”
The Treasury is obligated to pay back the money it borrows with interest, according to AARP and the Congressional Research Service, and the SSA says the federal government has never failed to do so.
That interest is income for Social Security, which helps to provide funding for benefits, Johnson said.
Throughout its history, Social Security has generally taken in more money than it paid out in benefits. But the program has been running cash deficits since 2010, meaning that its total tax revenue has fallen short of benefit payments, according to the Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget.
..."
Quote source
-As with you, the government cannot run things on a deficit continuously. My claims of plunder are that you pay in...for your adult life...and you may not live to see any of it by virtue of it being a program that effectively cannot be counted upon. "Social security" not providing security is the plunder of today's labor for the promise of tomorrow...that you are not responsible for.


Back to the topic at hand...planning for your job is planning for your future. After some more time to consider this...I have a few more suggestions.
1) Plumbing sucks...but it's highly lucrative.
2) Data center positions are good...if you can stomach the monotony. There are a variety of certificates most people earn over time to help (as others stated). Maybe consider a minor step down for a few months (if it even is), to get certificates that will earn you money.
3) Consider manufacturing. Inspector positions are surprisingly easy to get...and might be to your speed. I have had to teach many an inspector how to read a tape measure...so the barrier to entry is lower than you might think.
4) Consider manual labor. I've known quite a few people who put in very long days in the summer...and earn quite a bit of cash. If you can tolerate it, maybe consider a work in the summer and school in the winter progression. Later in life isn't a death sentence for learning.

 

[GamerGuy]

I'm retired now, but I'd worked as a fish farm manager during most of my working life, it was kinda fun, requires rolling up my imaginary sleeves (I wear polo or T-shirts all the time) to get to some nitty-gritty dirty work sometimes (like harvest fish and running operation in various parts of the farm with a couple of workers). I'm now 60 and trying my best to enjoy what remains of my life.....

 

[Deleted member 239770]

Chef