Debating multi gpu? Just do it!

[Orijin16]

Some of you will know that over the past few months I've been itching to buy a second MSI R9 380 Gaming 4G for crossfire, and I wasn't sure whether to do it or buy a GTX 980 TI and try to sell my first card at a loss.

Well after months of consideration and being constantly told that the latter option was the only sensible choice, I went for the insane and bought another 380 (I used the £200 I saved to buy an Enthoo Primo).

Best decision ever! I've had precisely ZERO issues with crossfire, running benches today and at 2560x1440 with every possible setting maxed I'm seeing fps around the desirable 60fps in every game, the lowest I've seen was 43fps in Crysis 3 but that's still more than smooth enough to be playable.

Don't let anyone put you off buying a multi gpu set up if it's more financially viable for you to do so, from what I've seen the scare stories about it not working are just that, scare stories!

 

[trog100]

the people that dont like sli or cf are the people that dont have it and have just read all the negative bollocks from other people that dont have it..

tis the sensible and obvious gpu ugrade..

trog

 

[cadaveca]

the people that dont like sli or cf are the people that dont have it and have just read all the negative bollocks from other people that dont have it..

tis the sensible and obvious gpu ugrade..

trog

I've run multiple GUs since it was possible, and wouldn't recommend it to anyone. I have GTX980 SLI right now, usually take one card out so I don't have to deal with the problems.

I also use a 2560x1600 Dell WFP3008, so until recently decent performance on such a panel was only possible with multi-GPU. But that performance came with many caveats. I've tried many platforms to go along with Multi-GPU tech, since I get so many samples for reviews, and nothing has remedied the issues present. I mean, after all, many of my rigs are posted here on the forums, in the "Sexy Hardware Clubhouse" and "My PC ATM" threads.

I hope DX12 and newer apps solve the problems.

 

[RCoon]

I concur with Dave. Multi GPU should be avoided where possible. I'm on 4K so it simply isn't possible right now.

Coming from a serial crossfire/SLI user for the past few years.

 

[Frag_Maniac]

Sorry OP, but while I respect your right to an opinion, it's hard to believe Crossfire works consistently well when there's SO many people that have tried it and SLI that say SLI works far better. Plus you didn't even bother to mention which or how many games it's worked well with for you.

There's also a LOT of people that don't want to have to wait months if not years for driver updates that fix Crossfire not working. It's pretty common to see AMD release drivers that FINALLY enable proper Crossfire in games that released several months ago. For those whom don't mind buying after price drops on games, it's fine, but for the majority of avid gamers, esp those into MP, it's a deal breaker.

Bottom line, I get the feeling you're raving more about the price you got by with, than the end result, and that is also indicative of one whom plays older vs current games, esp since the only one you mentioned is over 3 years old now.

 

[JrockTech]

I'm thinking about doing it with my R9 380 as well. Which games do you play that you got good results in? Do you have any measurements on the power you're using? I'm already peaking @ 600 watts with 1 GPU.

 

[neatfeatguy]

I've ran SLI since 7600GT. Ran it on 8800GTS 640MB, 8800GTS 512MB, GTX 280 and GTX 570...

I've had very few issues running it. This probably stems from the fact that I'm not one to buy games as soon as they release. I usually pick up games 6-18 months after they release and drivers have matured for games.

I moved away from SLI this generation and got a single GTX 980 Ti. Less power, less heat and I haven't had any of the odd issues that SLI presented me with. I've had a handful of drivers over the years that didn't work with my SLI setups. I've ran into a few games that didn't support SLI or had major issues with SLI enabled (only takes about 20 seconds to disable or enable SLI, so it's not a huge issue).

While I don't miss SLI, it just feels a tad odd to not be running it since that's how I've configured my builds for so many years in the past. I can not comment on Crossfire, but I usually hear folks have more issues on it over SLI, but that's just hearsay on my part since I've never used it.

 

[Kanan]

I guess you're a AAA gamer, @op? Crossfire has many problems, but if you only play the most expensive games (where developers have more money to optimize the engine) it's more likely to have no problems with CF.

The thing with Crossfire is also, while it may be less well optimized in drivers than compared to SLI, it is more effective too. That said, I switched from a Crossfire card (HD 5970) to a GTX 780 Ti and don't miss it a bit. It worked only in the best programmed games really well (BF4, Crysis 3, Tomb Raider, GTA 5, Alan Wake, LoL) while it had issues in games like Path of Exile (stutter, no CF at times, stutter), Diablo 3 (no Crossfire function), Payday 2 (stutter because DX9 has no frame pacing). So if you're someone who really wants to play a lot of different games and don't worry about problems, Crossfire isn't something for you. I will not talk about SLI, because I never tried it, but what I read here and on other sites tells me that it has the same issues, just less often.

Good luck with it you'll need it

 

[Naito]

I wouldn't recommend a multi-GPU setup either. Niggles always pop up here or there and on rare occasions games just refuse to use SLI/Crossfire. Looking at you CoH2...

 

[trog100]

i have run a pair of 970 cards and pair of 980ti cards over the last few months without any of the problems some folks claim to have..

a bit odd how some folks have problems and some dont.. maybe its the games.. i can list the ones i have played recently..

far cry 4.. mad max.. far cry primal.. fall out 4.. sniper elite 3.. metal gear solids phantom pain.. shadow of mordar.. witcher 3.. painkiller hell and damnation.. just cause 3.. crsis 3.. plus a few others i cant remember..

never a problem with any of them..

i could play them all with just one card so maybe it has something to do with that.. i can only speak from my own sli experiencing.. which is problem free..

i would not call the odd game that dosnt take full advantage of more than one card a problem with sli or cf and must admit i might not notice because as i say i can play them all with just the one card..

but for me.. sli is problem free.. i cant say a lot else..

i first tried CF nearly 10 years ago.. back then it was a waste of space and i did turn one of my cards off.. but now i would say the opposite.. for me it works and works well..

mind you i often dont gell with what i read on the internet.. i recon most of it is bollocks.. he he..

trog

ps.. sli or cf makes the most sense as an upgrade path.. starting from scratch a decent single card makes more sense.. but even then the upgrade path for me would be to add another one and still end up with two..

 

[cadaveca]

a bit odd how some folks have problems and some dont.. maybe its the games.. i can list the ones i have played recently..

i could play them all with just one card so maybe it has something to do with that.. i can only speak from my own sli experiencing.. which is problem free..

Yeah, you've hit two of the nails directly on the head. It depends on the game, and whether a single card is enough already. If one is enough, then you actually add in a bit of latency using two cards. This became really evident to me when I had 2900XT Crossfire on the same monitor, I got decent frames with two cards, but things where smoother and better matched to my inputs with just one card, even though I only had half the FPS, and most times around 30 FPS.

The whole frame pacing thing was well documented. Since then, that particular issue has been not such a problem, but it still exists depending on the driver used.

And that's the other factor.. which drivers are in use.


Since there are all these factors that can come into play, and none of them are an issue when one card is used, I do have to stand my ground on my position of not recommending multi-GPU usage. One card usually just works fine no matter what game you are playing, and leads to a better overall experience, provided your GPU can push your monitor. That's why when I see threads asking what parts to use, my first question is always "which monitor?" because that's also an important factor as well, and is really the biggest factor to consider when building a system. Well, at least in the way I do things it is.

You do also need to keep in mind I now have about a decade of multi-GPU use documented here on these forums. It is only recently after having tried newer cards from both AMD and NVidia that I simply gave up for the most part. I still like to play racing games on three monitors, and that's why I have dual GTX980's.

 

[Toothless]

I'm kinda regretting diving into Sli for the first time. I love the performance when it works but its just that. When.

 

[Mussels]

i ran crossfire for years with minimal drama, the main problem is the space and heat.

as an example, firing up youtube would turn on the second card and add upto 100W of extra power usage - for someone who pays their own bills, or dealing with 40C+ summer heat that was a nightmare.

 

[Vellinious]

I've run several SLI setups and never ran into any issues. If the games won't use SLI, then don't try to use SLI in them. If they do? Profit...

The better solution is almost always the single, more powerful card, but.....I find NO fault in adding a 2nd card to run in a multi-GPU platform as a less expensive upgrade path.

 

[Orijin16]

Wow so many replies lol!
The games I've tried are:
Crysis 3 (45-55fps)
Tomb raider 2013 (~100fps built in bench)
GTA V (55-75 smooth in game, stuttery as hell in built in bench)
Alien Isolation (120-160)
BF4 (~80)
Fallout 4 (not measured yet, some micro stutter but had that on single card as well)
Assassins Creed Black Flag (crashes with fps overlay enabled, but smooth gameplay)
Far Cry 4 (~65 in game, broken fps in cut scenes showing 300-1600)

All run at 2560x1440 with every thing at max, including NVIDIA hairworks etc where applicable.

With a single card I had to drop settings to play these games at native res, so I'm happy.

This thread was not meant as (yet another) NVIDIA v AMD or "if you don't run multi gpu you're stupid", it's simply to offer reassurance to people considering it for budget reasons that it is a viable option.

As for power usage I've no idea, but not had any psu cut out issues with the specs below. I believe the eteknic review of crossfire 380 2GB reported somewhere short of 300w full system draw.

I5 4690k @stock
MSI Z97 Gaming 5
2x MSI R9 380 Gaming 4G
16GB (2x8GB) Corsair vengeance pro 2400Mhz DDR3
500GB Samsung EVO 850
120GB Samsung EVO 840
2TB Seagate HDD
8x Phanteks SP120 led fans
3x Phanteks SP140 fans
XSPC D5 dual bay pump/res combo (setting 2)
2x flashing red LEDs on CPU block

All running off a 750W Seasonic EVO.

 

[Batou1986]

I've tried both and as others have said its great when it works properly, to bad properly is maybe 60% of games after 6 months of patches or waiting for AMD/Nvidia to fix it.

 

[Orijin16]

The last multi card config I tried before this was SLI 8800gts 320MB back in the day, that worked flawlessly besides ridiculous amounts of screen tearing by simply being too much power for anything out at the time. Ended up selling one of them and the other stayed in my rig for years until the solder started cracking and it inevitably died like most cards in that series did.

I've always managed to get by with fairly low end cards since then as was gaming on a 1680x1050 monitor until I bought my new one a month ago.

For me personally I chose crossfire primarily due to cost as I already had one card, I don't buy the latest titles at release due to most being buggy messes and ridiculously over priced, so it made the most sense.

Cost to performance wise it's awesome, only paid about £340 for both cards and the performance is somewhere between a gtx 980 and ti (going by card reviews compared with my own testing) both of which are more expensive.

Given that I haven't experienced any of the issues that I've read about, it just "works" in everything I've tried, I really do think I made the right choice.

Maybe one day I'll run into an issue that makes me change my mind... But today is not that day!

 

[Vayra86]

Some of you will know that over the past few months I've been itching to buy a second MSI R9 380 Gaming 4G for crossfire, and I wasn't sure whether to do it or buy a GTX 980 TI and try to sell my first card at a loss.

Well after months of consideration and being constantly told that the latter option was the only sensible choice, I went for the insane and bought another 380 (I used the £200 I saved to buy an Enthoo Primo).

Best decision ever! I've had precisely ZERO issues with crossfire, running benches today and at 2560x1440 with every possible setting maxed I'm seeing fps around the desirable 60fps in every game, the lowest I've seen was 43fps in Crysis 3 but that's still more than smooth enough to be playable.

Don't let anyone put you off buying a multi gpu set up if it's more financially viable for you to do so, from what I've seen the scare stories about it not working are just that, scare stories!

Inb4 the first game with lacking or non-existant Crossfire support and a high graphical fidelity.

You will remember this thread. And you will suffer eventually

Been there done that bro. Never going SLI again, the gain is never worth the inherent downsides. Even though it's more perf/dollar, it's just not worth it. Better to have a good plan/upgrade path set up for yourself with single card switches. And even if there IS a profile, the risk of microstutter is always there. And when you run a high performance rig, stutter is unacceptable in my book.

Oh, and I forgot the *other* downsides:
- more noise (even at lower RPM, two sets of fans is more than one and you DO hear it)
- requires more power (= more strain on PSU = more noise for cooling it unless you go overkill on wattage - and when you do thát, you are buying a more expensive unit which kinda destroys the whole point of buying that second GPU. There is also the slightly higher power bill there)
- case requirements (better case airflow is a must, more heat inside the case, unless you go blower/exhaust, in which case you have again, louder cooling @ similar or worse temps than with open air)
- another component = another possible point of failure in the system. If 'half' your GPU setup breaks down, what are you gonna do? Buy another underpowered GPU? Replace the set? It's a higher price tag whichever way you twist it, which negates the perf/dollar advantage you once had.
- lower OC headroom. The top card in the system will always be hotter than the bottom one. This results in lower OC headroom on BOTH cards, because they are limited by the slower card.

So yeah

 

[trog100]

some have problems and some dont.. the debate could go on for ever..

i dont have problems but i think its because i have sli but dont really need or rely on it.. i have two choices.. turn one card off if it isnt needed .. i did use to do this.. cos mostly it isnt needed..

the other choice is.. run both cards but at less than full power.. i now go for the second choice.. i run a 75-ish frame rate cap..

the valley benchmark at around 75 fps.. it look exactly the same at 75 fps as it does at 144.. as do all my games..

i recon i know the secret of problem free sli.. dont be in position where you really need or rely on it.. maybe two crap (weak) cards struggling to generate high enough frame are more problematic than one single card doing the same thing.. i would guess it is this way..

sli works for me but maybe its how i use it..

trog

 

[Vayra86]

some have problems and some dont.. the debate could go on for ever..

i dont have problems but i think its because i have sli but dont really need or rely on it.. i have two choices.. turn one card off if it isnt needed .. i did use to do this.. cos mostly it isnt needed..

the other choice is.. run both cards but at less than full power.. i now go for the second choice.. i run a 75-ish frame rate cap..

the valley benchmark at around 75 fps.. it look exactly the same at 75 fps as it does at 144.. as do all my games..

i recon i know the secret of problem free sli.. dont be in position where you really need or rely on it.. maybe two crap (weak) cards struggling to generate high enough frame are more problematic than one single card doing the same thing.. i would guess it is this way..

sli works for me but maybe its how i use it..

trog

Correction: you *don't* actually use the additional performance SLI offers, which kind of defeats the whole point. You are basically just guzzling away power that gets lost in your framerate cap, but does show up on your energy bill. Basically your logic is so twisted it's unreal But, that's an old discussion

 

[JrockTech]

Well if there's a thread to push you away from not getting a crossfire setup, this is the one. Lol...It honestly doesn't seem worth it. I play GTA and stuttering in the benchmark means you will stutter in game eventually. I'm almost getting 60FPS as it is and I absolutely can't stand microstutter. Maybe I'll wait and just upgrade the GPU when AMD releases their new cards.

 

[Orijin16]

Well if there's a thread to push you away from not getting a crossfire setup, this is the one. Lol...It honestly doesn't seem worth it. I play GTA and stuttering in the benchmark means you will stutter in game eventually. I'm almost getting 60FPS as it is and I absolutely can't stand microstutter. Maybe I'll wait and just upgrade the GPU when AMD releases their new cards.

By stuttering in the GTA V benchmark I mean it plays like a slide show, I thought I would have serious problems in game but when I actually fired it up it was completely smooth at all times throughout the 3hrs or so that I played it.

My guess is that something's broken in the benchmark that isn't in the actual game, the actual benchmark results looked fine, but all the fps figures I've quoted above are from in-game observations using Afterburners fps overlay, except Tomb Raider because I couldn't be bothered to actually play it.

 

[trog100]

Correction: you *don't* actually use the additional performance SLI offers, which kind of defeats the whole point. You are basically just guzzling away power that gets lost in your framerate cap, but does show up on your energy bill. Basically your logic is so twisted it's unreal But, that's an old discussion

i dont think its as you say it is.. okay i could manage without sli.. but the power saving is real not pretend and i have the power there if i need it.. with games like witcher 3 75 fps dosnt save much with other games it does..

running one card at half full power or running two at half power.. the overall power consumption is about the same.. the power used automatically adjust as required depending on the game.. my system works without all these problems i hear about on this place.. odd if my thinking is as wrong as you say it is.. cool quite and does anything i require it to.. whats to fault with that..

there aint much wrong with my logic.. only in the sense i spend more on hardware than i have to.. he he

but i enjoy buying and trying stuff.. i also like "power" in reserve..

but just cos i have it i dont feel compelled to use it.. that is the main way i differ from a lot on here.. maybe its my age.. he he

doing subjective logic checks is a bit hard though.. i recon its your logic that is off course and not mine.

we can say no more..

trog

 

[Vayra86]

i dont think its as you say it is.. okay i could manage without sli.. but the power saving is real not pretend and i have the power there if i need it.. with games like witcher 3 75 fps dosnt save much with other games it does..

running one card at half full power or running two at half power.. the overall power consumption is about the same.. the power used automatically adjust as required depending on the game.. my system works without all these problems i hear about on this place.. odd if my thinking is as wrong as you say it is.. cool quite and does anything i require it to.. whats to fault with that..

there aint much wrong with my logic.. only in the sense i spend more on hardware than i have to.. he he

but i enjoy buying and trying stuff.. i also like "power" in reserve..

but just cos i have it i dont feel compelled to use it.. that is the main way i differ from a lot on here.. maybe its my age.. he he

doing subjective logic checks is a bit hard though.. i recon its your logic that is off course and not mine.

we can say no more..

trog

See that is where the assumption goes wrong: you think that dynamic power targets actually are the same as running a single GPU, but this is not true. SLI systems ALWAYS take more power by default, because there are two GPU's running. In Idle, you use twice the idle power, at load, you have a higher base power usage. Regardless of how you limit it. I'm fine with you doing whatever you do, but I'm not fine with going along with the assumptions you connect to that, because they are simply wrong.

 

[Ferrum Master]

B something's broken in the benchmark

it ain't... it has a random factor often, as npc spawning differs. It does not have a solid score. The grass is the killer... albeit it give so much visual fidelity... a painful thing actually...