NASA Achieves milestone Solid State Battery

[dgianstefani]

NASA’s Solid-State Battery Research Exceeds Initial Goals, Draws Interest - NASA

NASA researchers are making progress with developing an innovative battery pack that is lighter, safer, and performs better than batteries commonly used in

www.nasa.gov

Pretty incredible stuff.

Can't wait for this tech in phones and electronics. But will be revolutionary everywhere.

 

[Wirko]

If NASA says "temperatures nearly twice as hot", it's on the Kelvin scale, right?

 

[Dr. Dro]

That they can operate damaged is simply remarkable. It could even save lives. Nice!

 

[LabRat 891]

That they can operate damaged is simply remarkable. It could even save lives. Nice!

I've seen videos of Solid State Batteries used under load while being literally cut up by scissors. No sparks, no interruptions.
Yeah, they're pretty neat.

I have often wondered if large 'sheet cells' could be made and 'stamped' out for assembling 3D-geometry Batteries from many near-2D sheets.

 

[Dr. Dro]

I've seen videos of Solid State Batteries used under load while being literally cut up by scissors. No sparks, no interruptions.
Yeah, they're pretty neat.

I have often wondered if large 'sheet cells' could be made and 'stamped' out for assembling 3D-geometry Batteries from many near-2D sheets.

It should be possible, Apple already does something like that with current generation technology on some of their newer laptops to maximize estate (all the while making third party repairs a nightmare)

 

[dgianstefani]

John B. Goodenough actually pioneered the solid state battery, as he did lithium ion batteries. I hope he sees them going into mass production before he passes. What a man. NASA is applying his tech in good ways, but they didn't invent it.

 

[KLiKzg]

You can't have safety with Lithium...but you could with Sodium.

Still, looking forward for this research.

 

[bonehead123]

NASA says: "We can build it, make it better, faster, stronger".

Hopefully it will be cheaper than the Bionic man/woman were, hehehe

Just another reason to increase their operating budgets.....hopefully the bureaucrotchers will be able to comprehend this too !

 

[maxfly]

It can't get here soon enough!

 

[wNotyarD]

John B. Goodenough actually pioneered the solid state battery, as he did lithium ion batteries. I hope he sees them going into mass production before he passes. What a man. NASA is applying his tech in good ways, but they didn't invent it.

I thought you were kidding over the scientist's name. Then I googled and found it is really his name.

 

[Assimilator]

Toyota claims battery breakthrough in potential boost for electric cars

Japanese firm believes it could make a solid-state battery with a range of 745 miles that charges in 10 minutes

If this is true it changes everything. I'm not particularly hopeful because the industry is littered with companies claiming to make the next leap forward in EVs, only to fizzle out; but on the other hand Toyota is hardly a startup from nowhere.

 

[dgianstefani]

Toyota claims battery breakthrough in potential boost for electric cars


If this is true it changes everything. I'm not particularly hopeful because the industry is littered with companies claiming to make the next leap forward in EVs, only to fizzle out; but on the other hand Toyota is hardly a startup from nowhere.

Lots of them are bought for their patents/designs then shelved, so manufacturers can continue to make profits selling batteries year on year.

Think about it, a battery that lasts 10+ years with little to no degradation isn't good for business.

How else would Apple and other smartphone makers convince you to buy a new $1-1500 phone every year?

So fascinating how we've had working solid state batteries for more than a decade yet not a single mass produced one, despite so many continuous advancements and milestones in density and BOM.

Most of the research these days is funnelled into making existing tech level batteries cheaper, such as lithium iron phosphate, rather than making better batteries that have more energy density and longevity. It's not hard to see why.

The next thing we'll be sold is the "circular economy" where we pretend we don't know how to make things that last decades anymore, and that it's some kind of environmental genius to recycle and remanufacture things using "clean" energy every 3-5 years.

Cynical moment of the day has passed now, I'm off to gym then campus.

I'm just pissed I'm still using my S10+ Ceramic 512 GB Snapdragon, because I vowed not to replace it until solid state batteries were put in Galaxy phones. Not that it's a bad phone, battery lasts two days since I replaced it and ADB'd away the bloat.

 

[Mussels]

That they can operate damaged is simply remarkable. It could even save lives. Nice!

Lithium has been great for lifepo4 batteries solving the biggest problems from lead acid/nimh batteries but safety was always an issue with it


Good to see a replacement tech is finally here, maybe those new phones the EU are mandating to have replacement batteries can get some shiny dropins in the coming years

 

[dgianstefani]

Toyota Unveils New Technology That Will Change the Future of Cars | Corporate | Global Newsroom | Toyota Motor Corporation Official Global Website

Toyota Motor Corporation (Toyota) recently held a technical briefing session, "Toyota Technical Workshop," under the theme "Let's Change the Future of Cars" and announced a variety of new technologies that will support its transformation into a mobility company.

global.toyota

2027.

 

[Kapone33]

Just like how NASA introduced the compact PC so too they may solve one of the fundamental issues with EVs.

 

[mechtech]

Interesting....................I wonder how long for actual prototypes.....as in consumer prototypes?

Toyota claims battery breakthrough in potential boost for electric cars


If this is true it changes everything. I'm not particularly hopeful because the industry is littered with companies claiming to make the next leap forward in EVs, only to fizzle out; but on the other hand Toyota is hardly a startup from nowhere.

Hmmmm I believe it might be possible in the future......................but kW.hr is kW.hrs

 

[freeagent]

Batteries are pretty good these days if you take care of them.. my iPhone from 2018 is still on the original battery, currently at 82% max capacity.. so its almost done

I bought a Segway Ninebot S-Plus last year, and currently have 2200km on it

 

[Mussels]

Batteries are pretty good these days if you take care of them.. my iPhone from 2018 is still on the original battery, currently at 82% max capacity.. so its almost done

I bought a Segway Ninebot S-Plus last year, and currently have 2200km on it

You've got one of the rare ones then, most batteries in phones dont even last 2 years before failure - being at 82% capacity means it's basically dead already, as once lithium batteries start to lose capacity they go downhill fast

Interesting....................I wonder how long for actual prototypes.....as in consumer prototypes?


Hmmmm I believe it might be possible in the future......................but kW.hr is kW.hrs

lots of designs come out looking good, but then run into complications - maybe a battery has a capacity, but can only discharge really low rates, or like SLA's they can only discharge to about 50% total capacity before taking damage (lifepo4 is 20%)

without lifepo4, batteries needed to be twice as large and heavy and that was the big issue with electric cars - as the bigger battery meant more weight to push, making the battery drain higher...
(Weight-effective batteries matter the most for cars, while size to capacity matters for phones)


People act like some secret cabal is shutting down new and innovative tech, but it's also simply that they're only pieces to the puzzle and we need more pieces

 

[Dr. Dro]

Batteries are pretty good these days if you take care of them.. my iPhone from 2018 is still on the original battery, currently at 82% max capacity.. so its almost done

I bought a Segway Ninebot S-Plus last year, and currently have 2200km on it

Phone batteries last around 500 cycles before they begin to rapidly deteriorate, that turns out to be around 2 years of use assuming one charge every 1.5 days or so.

If the battery isn't subject to rapid discharge/charge cycles (gaming, fast charging, etc.) a good quality battery pack will last around 1000 cycles at 80% capacity, but my experience with iPhones (SE 1st gen) is that by 89% on that battery health meter the SOT was already badly affected and phone experienced sudden shutdowns. Thankfully that was around the time Apple offered replacement for $30 or so.

Had the battery replaced on the S10+ too. Phone's a little over 4 years old. Battery life doubled with the new pack, and phone feels less sluggish as well.

 

[P4-630]

Not just NASA....

• The new design can nearly double the energy density of an EV pack while significantly reducing its weight and the number of cells in pack with increased cell energy.
• LLCB samples are targeted to be delivered to European car OEMs for testing as early as the end of 2023.

ProLogium at ees Europe with World Premiere of Its Latest SSB Innovation - Large-Footprint Lithium Ceramic Battery (LLCB) - ProLogium Technology Co., Ltd

prologium.com

Toyota claims battery breakthrough in potential boost for electric cars

Japanese firm believes it could make a solid-state battery with a range of 745 miles that charges in 10 minutes

www.theguardian.com

 

[mechtech]

You've got one of the rare ones then, most batteries in phones dont even last 2 years before failure - being at 82% capacity means it's basically dead already, as once lithium batteries start to lose capacity they go downhill fast


lots of designs come out looking good, but then run into complications - maybe a battery has a capacity, but can only discharge really low rates, or like SLA's they can only discharge to about 50% total capacity before taking damage (lifepo4 is 20%)

without lifepo4, batteries needed to be twice as large and heavy and that was the big issue with electric cars - as the bigger battery meant more weight to push, making the battery drain higher...
(Weight-effective batteries matter the most for cars, while size to capacity matters for phones)


People act like some secret cabal is shutting down new and innovative tech, but it's also simply that they're only pieces to the puzzle and we need more pieces

Especially in Canada at -40 c/f. It’s a magical temperature where most things just stop or don’t like to work lol

 

[Wirko]

Especially in Canada at -40 c/f. It’s a magical temperature where most things just stop or don’t like to work lol

I get it, Canadians won't ask if a battery "can operate in temperatures nearly twice as hot as lithium-ion batteries" but rather "thrice as cold". Indeed many types of batteries don't work well in the cold, and I'm wondering if this solid state battery does.

 

[Mussels]

Phone batteries last around 500 cycles before they begin to rapidly deteriorate, that turns out to be around 2 years of use assuming one charge every 1.5 days or so.

And this works SO well when the phones have about 4 hours of screen on time a day, and people charge them 3-4 times a day - or even worse, play games on them while charging
It's like when apple did the math on their first watch by forcing their employees to use them, because they didnt WANT a smartwatch and had no fancy apps for them at that point they used them about 2 minutes an hour - so apple designed them for low usage

Then users had OS updates, app updates, and played with their new toys and had to charge them several times and this repeated every major update, or whenever the users had to sync files/data (like a factory reset) so those battery cycles got used up *fast*
Happens every time bean counters use telemetry data or user tracking to push the hardware guys to cut corners "But the stats say the users dont need that! on average we can cut the battery back even more!"


Good question on the cold, there was a mini scandal with the nest doorbells over that - they wouldnt charge below certain temperatures and google said to take them indoors to charge them and people got mad it wasnt documented
To be fair, theres not many devices that CAN charge at -20c yet, so good question on the SS batteries and their hopefully better temperature range

 

[ratirt]

That is so cool. If the capacity of batteries doubles or triples, having an electric car makes sense. If only the price for the battery isn't sky high. The safety is the most important thing especially if you know that this Lithium Ion batteries burn like crazy and you can put the fire out. I think this is a huge leap forward.

 

[AusWolf]

Batteries are pretty good these days if you take care of them.. my iPhone from 2018 is still on the original battery, currently at 82% max capacity.. so its almost done

20% lost in 5 years. That's not bad for a phone (would be even better if capacity loss was linear over time, which it isn't), but terrible for a car, imo.

That is so cool. If the capacity of batteries doubles or triples, having an electric car makes sense. If only the price for the battery isn't sky high. The safety is the most important thing especially if you know that this Lithium Ion batteries burn like crazy and you can put the fire out. I think this is a huge leap forward.

They still have to solve the charging problem. Waiting at a station is a huge inconvenience, and a lot of people (myself included) can't charge at home.