Lian Li Launches the V3000 PLUS Case Offering Endless Possibilities

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
No wheels for 500.us range so guess you need a fork lift to move it

 

[claes]

Case makers should design around airflow instead of looks, so yeah fans larger than 120mm are better fro cases.

IDK, it seems to me that there are diminishing returns after 180mm. It’d be interesting to see some thick 200mm fans, but most chassis that include 200mm either offer an inch of space in front of the fans for filters or are poorly designed to begin with (machined for 140mm and then 200mm is used but obstructed by mounting rails).

Also, smaller fans are generally better at procuring pressure, where PQ curves are overlooked into a simplified “airflow fans for intake/exhaust vs pressure fans for heat sinks/radiators,” both of which miss the point of assessing these qualities in the first place (and the fact that most case intakes have a lot of pressure to overcome).

 

[MentalAcetylide]

lol, nope.
500$ and still stuck at 120mm fans like 15y ago.
other brands have large case, Tt even offers stackable stuff for same/less without forcing all fans to be 120.

Imo, you would need a large & very roomy case with little obstruction inside to get the most out of 200mm fans. You're not going to have much room if you have a bunch of components or dual system installed, which is probably why they opted to keep the supported fan sizes down to 120-140mm. You tend to get higher static pressure with more air hitting all of the components when using smaller fans compared to using bigger ones. It doesn't make much sense to purchase larger cases just for the sake of being able to use bigger fans when a smaller case with smaller fans would suffice and probably run quieter. I could see it being useful for something like a 400-600mm(very extreme) radiator with multiple 200mm fans, but again, there's the noise problem.

Hi,
No wheels for 500.us range so guess you need a fork lift to move it

heh, Digital Storm's Aventum X case is such a thing. iirc, it weighs like 150 lbs. loaded & they ship it on a wooden pallet.

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

(machined for 140mm and then 200mm is used but obstructed by mounting rails)

This. Its likely leftover cases that didnt sell they would do this to. Its not like there are any new basic designs coming anytime soon. Square is Square (or rentangle for those retentive folk).

Anything larger than 180mm fans could allow filters to work without diminishing flow as much as on 140mm fans. IMO.

Also, smaller fans are generally better at procuring pressure,

This is where the difference weasels its way into the case fan debate, do SP fans work as well for case fans as fans designed for high cfms (intended as case fans). As of late there doesnt seem there is much difference, but cheap fans remain cheap.

 

[dicobalt]

I heard you like computer cases so I put two computer cases in your computer case.

 

[WhateverAnotherFreakingID]

Mode 2 - Rotated Mode
In rotated mode, the motherboard tray is installed with the rear I/O located at the PSU shroud, with a pass-through channel for the ports to the rear of the case. Maintaining the same cooling support as in Standard mode, upright GPU mounting is also supported for a tower-like look. This mode allows for a unique PC look and direct ventilation of the GPU from the front panel, ensuring optimal thermal performance.

I was quite excited for this mode, for I've used for long now a Silverstone Raven series case with a 90° rotated MB, or what is also called a "chimney layout". I was indeed very pleased reading about the Alta F1, just that won't fit E-ATX MBs, anyway reading through and looking at the images it appears that the MB is rotated 90° in the opposite direction, so it looks like in this Lian Li case the back IO panel is facing down which I find utterly nonsensical, opposite to having it on the top side of the case which makes it even easier to access.

So I guess no deal.

 

[claes]

It’s only the GPU, the MB IO goes out the back

 

[Waldorf]

I meant being limited to 120mm fans on a 590$ case is a joke, not anything about 180 or 200 mm fans.

guess not many have heard of rads/loops using 280 (420) stuff.

the X9 ould be had for 180$, almost completely customizable when it comes to layout and/or removing parts (doubt lian has it the same way)
iirc, those can be stacked, so even with another case it would still be cheaper than the Lian
Tt X9

 

[claes]

It supports 140mm fans though?

 

[MxPhenom 216]

Case makers should design around airflow instead of looks, so yeah fans larger than 120mm are better fro cases.

Looks is what sells a case in the DIY by a huge margin.

 

[WhateverAnotherFreakingID]

It’s only the GPU, the MB IO goes out the back

Does it? I thought the same but from this picture

it looks like the ram banks are top side, so the MB should be rotated 90° counter-clockwise , or anyway the back IO panel should go against the RBG lit fans ath the back of the case, so it looks like the back IO panel is really facing down to me.


Unfortunately I couln't find any actual manual to download to verify, so of course this is the best I can appraise from looking at the PR pictures only.

 

[claes]

Whoops, no, you’re correct. I just saw the heatsink on the left and made an assumption, didn’t see the second heatsink and what is clearly the IO pointing downwards. My bad.

 

[Scrizz]

I meant being limited to 120mm fans on a 590$ case is a joke, not anything about 180 or 200 mm fans.

guess not many have heard of rads/loops using 280 (420) stuff.

the X9 ould be had for 180$, almost completely customizable when it comes to layout and/or removing parts (doubt lian has it the same way)
iirc, those can be stacked, so even with another case it would still be cheaper than the Lian
Tt X9

If you click the little spec sheet, it supports 280 and 420 rads...

 

[Waldorf]

but seems only a single spot (top), and rest of case fans still limited to 120.
even if, i can have 2 (completely modular) cases with 140mm sized openings, for less.

 

[claes]

but seems only a single spot (top), and rest of case fans still limited to 120.

I think you’re having trouble reading?

even if, i can have 2 (completely modular) cases with 140mm sized openings, for less.

Sure, if you’re fine with steel, poor tooling, generally mediocre quality, and a larger volume. Could’ve only gotten one CaseLabs case if you want a real comparison.

 

[Waldorf]

@claes
i was refering to the post about the product, which should include all proper info,
at least when its about introducing a product, as +80% of readers will have made a yes/no decision by then,
which might be differ, depending on what info they gotten..
i personally read spec sheets once im down to final few to choose from.

guess you havent used one of the "nicer" Tt, i have, and dont see the problems you listed,
completely ignoring that i never talked about size and/or volume (or material)
which i prefer anyway, as it makes working on things easier, especially with LC, but thats just me.

someone that needs 2 systems, usually has the space for it as well,
again ignoring i can get 2 cases from other brands for same/less that are also stack-able,
which has the benefit of being able to "work" (repair etc) on one rig, while the other one is still up and running.
harder when its all installed in a single case.

 

[claes]

@claes
i was refering to the post about the product, which should include all proper info,

It did; you didn’t read it though, even after being corrected twice :shrug:

at least when its about introducing a product, as +80% of readers will have made a yes/no decision by then,
which might be differ, depending on what info they gotten..
i personally read spec sheets once im down to final few to choose from.

Your mistake?

guess you havent used one of the "nicer" Tt, i have, and dont see the problems you listed,
completely ignoring that i never talked about size and/or volume (or material)
which i prefer anyway, as it makes working on things easier, especially with LC, but thats just me.

Oooookay, sounds like you’re just dismissing a case because it doesn’t suit your needs and you didn’t actually consider it in the first place. Believe it or not, other users might have other interests and needs.

Having worked on a few X9’s and maybe a dozen Mercury’s I have my opinions, glad TT is working out for you but, for me, they’re garbage bin rip-offs of better designs.

someone that needs 2 systems, usually has the space for it as well,
again ignoring i can get 2 cases from other brands for same/less that are also stack-able,
which has the benefit of being able to "work" (repair etc) on one rig, while the other one is still up and running.
harder when its all installed in a single case.

So you don’t want a dual-system, you want two systems — this case is not for you. Gotcha

 

[ffolekram]

I wonder if the crosshair viii impact (the dtx board) would fit in the second system spot

 

[MRW332]

Case makers should design around airflow instead of looks, so yeah fans larger than 120mm are better fro cases.

I don't think you understand how case fans actually work. Two things:
1. You can use 120 or 140mm fans in this case - So up to 480mm rads for 4x120s or 420mm rads for 3x140s.
2. 4x120mm fans is superior for watercooling (cooling radiators) than larger fans given the higher static pressure per fan. Given this case is clearly designed for an overkill custom loop build, it would actually make less sense to try and incorporate larger fans that A. would not perform as well as more 120mm fans for cooling radiators and B. would not have much availability for radiators to even utilize a >140mm fan type.

If you want a great air cooling case you should be looking at something like a Fractal Torrent - Not a custom loop case like this. This case would be incredibly pointless and overkill for an air cooled PC build. It only make sense for an overkill monster custom loop build, and for that it is pretty impressive.

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

I don't think you understand how case fans actually work. Two things:
1. You can use 120 or 140mm fans in this case - So up to 480mm rads for 4x120s or 420mm rads for 3x140s.
2. 4x120mm fans is superior for watercooling (cooling radiators) than larger fans given the higher static pressure per fan. Given this case is clearly designed for an overkill custom loop build, it would actually make less sense to try and incorporate larger fans that A. would not perform as well as more 120mm fans for cooling radiators and B. would not have much availability for radiators to even utilize a >140mm fan type.

If you want a great air cooling case you should be looking at something like a Fractal Torrent - Not a custom loop case like this. This case would be incredibly pointless and overkill for an air cooled PC build. It only make sense for an overkill monster custom loop build, and for that it is pretty impressive.

I understand perfectly well. There is no such thing as overkill when it comes to cooling. I personally dont like nmost of Fractalss cases but thats not the point here.

 

[MRW332]

I understand perfectly well. There is no such thing as overkill when it comes to cooling. I personally dont like nmost of Fractalss cases but thats not the point here.

"Case makers should design around airflow instead of looks, so yeah fans larger than 120mm are better fro cases."

Well it's just that your comment doesn't really make sense then if you understand that this is a water-cooling case (designed around radiator airflow and not case airflow)and that 4x120mm fans cool radiators better than 3x140 or any larger fan, which is going to have lower static pressure per mm of fan.
480mm radiators is actually the optimal form factor for this case... Unless you went even bigger with like a 560mm radiator form factor, but then the case would have to be even more niche and humongous than it already is. So really, they designed it optimally, which makes sense given all of the QA and design refreshes done in conjunction with GGF Events over the last couple years as Lian LI was developing this case.

Ergo your comment of 'should design case for better airflow with bigger fans '... Is not accurate as that would result in a more suboptimal radiator cooling case... So this WAS function over form, not vice versa.

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

"Case makers should design around airflow instead of looks, so yeah fans larger than 120mm are better fro cases."

Well it's just that your comment doesn't really make sense then if you understand that this is a water-cooling case (designed around radiator airflow and not case airflow)and that 4x120mm fans cool radiators better than 3x140 or any larger fan, which is going to have lower static pressure per mm of fan.
480mm radiators is actually the optimal form factor for this case... Unless you went even bigger with like a 560mm radiator form factor, but then the case would have to be even more niche and humongous than it already is. So really, they designed it optimally, which makes sense given all of the QA and design refreshes done in conjunction with GGF Events over the last couple years as Lian LI was developing this case.

Ergo your comment of 'should design case for better airflow with bigger fans '... Is not accurate as that would result in a more suboptimal radiator cooling case... So this WAS function over form, not vice versa.

some people like niche things in context, my comment makess sense but I understand your point, I bought my case with every intention to also build a custom loop, its fan placement makes for great airflow without the loop. Static pressure per MM is a non-issue, that really depends on how cheap you go on fans, the question than becomes, if you want or need higher SP, are you not buying quality SP fans?

 

[MRW332]

some people like niche things in context, my comment makess sense but I understand your point, I bought my case with every intention to also build a custom loop, its fan placement makes for great airflow without the loop. Static pressure per MM is a non-issue, that really depends on how cheap you go on fans, the question than becomes, if you want or need higher SP, are you not buying quality SP fans?

It doesn't matter... I mean yes, better quality fans will perform better generally speaking, but just the design of 120mm is always going to push more SP than a comparable larger fan. But you actually bring up yet another good reason to focus on 120mm fans over any other form factor that I neglected to mention: the highest quality fans from each manufacturer come in 120mm form factor either first or exclusively: Noctua NF-A12x25, Phanteks T30, all of Lian Li's fans (new 140 variants have lower performance than the 120s), etc... So if you want a case full of the best fan you can possibly buy per square millimeter, then it's going to be in a 120mm form factor. Static pressure per square mm is never a non-issue for a custom loop running 60mm thick radiators. You want all the SP you can get to move air across all of the fins with as low of RPM/noise as possible and ideally without needing to do push-pull. This was the entire design philosophy really around some of the most popular performant new fans today such as the T30 and their new RGB D30 being 30mm thick but getting the static pressure of what would've required a push-pull setup 10 years ago to match the airflow over the fins.
As for the niche thing, sure but that's a matter of taste not suboptimal design. This case is already ridiculously niche and making it even bigger would not make it a better case for most people in my opinion.

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

but just the design of 120mm is always going to push more SP

apples and oranges, you're not being clear here are you referring to only general purpose fans or only those designed to push higher SP? any fan model that doesnt say its specifically for static pressure is general purpose. SP fans are preferred for radiators while GP fans for cases, if the buyer is aware they will buy the fans they want to suit the purpose, which I will say 140mm fans are better over all, all factors considered not just static pressure.

the highest quality fans from each manufacturer come in 120mm form factor

this would require proof, I dont see that size matters when it come to quality. (pun unintended). so I only know of Gamers Nexus able to do legitimate quality tests on fans.

 

[MRW332]

apples and oranges, you're not being clear here are you referring to only general purpose fans or only those designed to push higher SP? any fan model that doesnt say its specifically for static pressure is general purpose. SP fans are preferred for radiators while GP fans for cases, if the buyer is aware they will buy the fans they want to suit the purpose, which I will say 140mm fans are better over all, all factors considered not just static pressure.


this would require proof, I dont see that size matters when it come to quality. (pun unintended). so I only know of Gamers Nexus able to do legitimate quality tests on fans.

I'm referring to the physics of how fans work. At 120mm the fan is able to generate more static pressure per sq mm of surface area than at 140, 160, 180 etc. This is the main reason why 360 rads consistently outperform 280 rads despite having similar volume/surface area... Same for 480 vs 420. Take model variations out of the equation and just look at the specs of any fan that has a 120/140 variant and you will see that SP doesn't scale like CFM does - applies to SP specific fans as well as general and CFM fans.

Size doesn't matter when it comes to quality. What I'm saying is that the best PC fan manufacturers prioritize 120mm fan sizing over 140 or any other size. This is evident by just looking at Noctua or Phanteks or Lian Li (3 of the larger quality fan manufacturers, but feel free to add in others) fan releases. For the sake of simplicity let's just take Noctua for example - generally regarded as the highest quality PC case fan manufacturer. Their newest and best design was released only as 120mm and is still only available in 120mm years later. Supposedly they are developing a 140mm variant, but also presumably by then the years old tech they carried over from the 120mm variant will have incrementally improved and there will be a newer better 120mm design released. That's the noctua NF-a12x25, which they marketed as performing like a 140mm fan in a 120mm format. Another highly regarded fan is the Phanteks T30 - also only available in 120 format. Lian LI released both, but look at the spec sheet and you'll see that their 120 fans generally produce more SP than their 140s... And that's per fan, not even taking into account per mm squared of actually surface area - so it's even worse when factoring that in.

Are there good 140mm fans? Sure, but just not with the same best case tech employed by the highest end newest 120mm fans. Why is this the case? Presumably because the market for 120mm fans is much larger than 140 and other sizes, so most of the R&D goes into 120mm fans... Therefore you're typically going to have the best performing fans per sq mm in the 120mm form factor. On top of this, physics is also in your favor with 120mm over 140, 160 etc. Specifically in regards to static pressure.

So yes, if you are not cooling radiators and want lots of case CFM, you can get better results with larger fans. For radiator cooling though, you're always going to be better off using 3x120mm fans vs one or two larger 140mm, 160, etc fan. That's not me speculating. You can find plenty of tests done on radiator performance across the different form factors and you'll see that, fan quality being equal you still get better cooling with 120mm form factor rads than 140 or larger when accounting for overall surface area... Now if your choice is between a 240 or 280 rad, then you will likely get better performance from the 280 with 140mm fans, but this is because per individual fan you can get more airflow from a 140 vs a 120 and a 280 rad has significantly more surface area/volume than a 240... However you would be better served adding an extra 120 fan vs. two 140 fans for similar volume/surface area.