Intel's Core Ultra 7 265K and 265KF CPUs Dip Below $250

[Daven]

They are doing a refresh because they just don't have anything better to launch other than higher clocks on a mature node. The last time that intel launched something "new" in a hurry was with Raptor lake. And we all know how that eventually went down.

The thing that surprise me, is the amount of people on tech forums who seems to believe that it's that easy to make a strong µarch. It took 3 generation of Ryzen before the arch became a good allrounder. Yet people won't give intel new cpu design philosophy time to mature. Let them figure out how to improve the latency issue on their non monolitic design. Throwing money at the problem doesn't always work, sometimes the solution to a problem depends on the evolution of other technologies that might not be ready to market yet.

The first gen pentium 4 also had a negative IPC vs the pentium III. The difference with Arrow lake vs the pentium 4 is that Arrow lake is being compared to a makeshift architecture that ended up having many issues in order to reach a target performance. The pentium 4 was a regression from a very good µArch. So much so that the core µArch took principles from the P III and became a strong product.

I consider Rocket Lake, Alder Lake, Raptor Lake, Raptor lake refresh and Arrow Lake all part of the same next gen architecture after Skylake. Intel has had almost five years. They can have five more but I don’t know if it will help.

 

[dgianstefani]

But that link shows it at $259.99, and Keepa doesn't have any trace of it having been at $239.99. What gives?

That's a link to amazon, the article quotes microcenter, which is a walk in shop in the USA.

Article source if you care to click through...

 

[tfdsaf]

It is super unpopular in DIY, but that's a subset of the real market.

I'm struggling to understand why anyone would go for a 9700X instead at $305, current pricing. Perhaps 9600X at $180, but I mean, $60 for more than 3x the cores and cheaper mobos meaning it's more like $30 more for the ARL chip...
The "AMD is much better for gaming" is mostly from the X3Ds, which are almost twice the price, especially if you consider mobos. Against standard Zen 5? The 265K is faster than the 9900X in applications, and is essentially a 7700X in games, the 9700X is 5% faster with a 5090. That's with essentially the same efficiency, and with 200S (warranty) boost turned off, and ARL running slower RAM than it's rated for. Anyone able to argue for Zen 5 in this case? I find it a weak choice besides at the high end, with 9800X3D/9950X3D. Maybe 9600X3D at ~$250 changes things...

The advent of gaming performance charts/results generated with an RTX 5090 really throws off people's understanding of the actual relative performance with the GPUs they have I think. Besides the whole general ignoring of "application performance" charts.

They were garbage and still are garbage at $400 dollars, which is what they were. This is some sort of a deal where you can get them at $240 or $270, which is absurdly good, but up till now they were absurdly bad. At $400 dollars or the equivalent in euros they are utter garbage, overexpensive turds!

If these prices stick and we see them worldwide they will become very popular, but again this seems to be deal from microcenter at their physical stores, most likely everywhere else in the world they are around $400.

Just did a quick search they are still $410 in my country. So clearly worthless.

 

[TheDeeGee]

Keeping my 11700 for a little longer, maybe i'll jump on the new Intel CPU's when the 3th gen is out, meaning 475K or 485K.

 

[Daven]

They were garbage and still are garbage at $400 dollars, which is what they were. This is some sort of a deal where you can get them at $240 or $270, which is absurdly good, but up till now they were absurdly bad. At $400 dollars or the equivalent in euros they are utter garbage, overexpensive turds!

If these prices stick and we see them worldwide they will become very popular, but again this seems to be deal from microcenter at their physical stores, most likely everywhere else in the world they are around $400.

Just did a quick search they are still $410 in my country. So clearly worthless.

On top of what you just said, you can find the 9900X for under $400. At Newegg right now, it goes for $367.

https://www.newegg.com/amd-ryzen-9-9000-series-ryzen-9-9900x-granite-ridge-socket-am5-desktop-cpu-processor/p/N82E16819113842?Item=9SIBYT0KFH9648

This 12C/24T chip is only 1% (basically a tie) slower than the 265K at 8P/12E cores according to TPU's review.

Intel Core Ultra 7 265K Review

The Intel Core Ultra 7 265K offers eight strong Lion Cove cores, just like the 285K, and merely four E-Cores fewer, for an almost 50% price difference. Despite the "Ultra 7" branding it offers plenty of application performance that can beat even the Ryzen 9 9900X. Things don't look so good in...

www.techpowerup.com

At similar pricing and performance, most customers in the know will go for platform longevity and all P-core architectures. Also Intel hurt their reputation massively with Raptor Lake.

 

[dgianstefani]

They were garbage and still are garbage at $400 dollars, which is what they were. This is some sort of a deal where you can get them at $240 or $270, which is absurdly good, but up till now they were absurdly bad. At $400 dollars or the equivalent in euros they are utter garbage, overexpensive turds!

If these prices stick and we see them worldwide they will become very popular, but again this seems to be deal from microcenter at their physical stores, most likely everywhere else in the world they are around $400.

Just did a quick search they are still $410 in my country. So clearly worthless.

Literally $260 on Amazon US, £265 Amazon UK (no deal, standard price). Even if you can't pop to a microcenter for that extra $20 discount, its still a no brainer over the $45-65 more expensive 9700X.

Amazon US $305, Amazon UK £275 for 9700X.

Performance wise, the 265K competition is the 9900X, price wise, it's between 9600X and 9700X.

With a 4090, the gaming performance difference to non-X3D Zen 5 is 5%, when the Intel CPU is limited to 6000 MT RAM for the benefit of the AMD platform, which cannot reliably run faster than that, and with 200S boost off. The current gen X3D chips start at $472 (9800X3D), so almost twice the price, for ~25% better gaming perf at 720p, with a 4090.

This is clear cut stuff to me in terms of what is best option at these prices, especially considering equivalent AM5 mobos are still 10-20% more expensive.

 

[Daven]

Literally $260 on Amazon US, £265 Amazon UK (no deal, standard price). Even if you can't pop to a microcenter for that extra $20 discount, its still a no brainer over the $45-65 more expensive 9700X.

Amazon US $305, Amazon UK £275 for 9700X.

Performance wise, the 265K competition is the 9900X, price wise, it's between 9600X and 9700X.

With a 4090, the performance difference to non X3D Zen 5 is 5%, when the Intel CPU is limited to 6000 MT RAM for the benefit of the AMD platform, which cannot reliably run faster than that, and with 200S boost off.

This is clear cut stuff to me in terms of what is best option at these prices, especially considering equivalent AM5 mobos are still 10-20% more expensive.

At under $300, the 265K is a good deal but this will just hurt Intel in the long run. Super low margins and the perception that you are the budget company hurt AMD in the past. Remember their FX bulldozer chips. You could buy the flagship FX-9590 originally at $920 but quickly dropped below $300 as it couldn't beat Core i5 chips at the time. I wouldn't see these massive price drops as a win for Intel or customers as it will hurt Intel's ability to release better chips in the future.

 

[dgianstefani]

At under $300, the 265K is a good deal but this will just hurt Intel in the long run. Super low margins and the perception that you are the budget company hurt AMD in the past. Remember their FX bulldozer chips. You could buy the flagship FX-9590. It launched originally at $920 but quickly dropped below $300 as it couldn't beat Core i5 chips at the time.

Yes, yes, I know. No matter what it's bad for Intel. Ok, moving on Mr. "11th gen to 15/16th gen (depending on if you consider meteor lake) Intel is the same architecture". If they don't do discounts it's bad, if they do do discounts it's bad. Nuanced analysis.

Meanwhile I don't see you stating the same argument when AMD does the exact same pricing strategy (NVIDIA - $50) for their GPU division.

 

[phanbuey]

This is the right price for them. Shame that the platforms are so short lived - whoever decided to stick to the new socket every gen/refresh cycle at intel lost them alot of customers with ARL.

The pricing is great though - I would pick one of these up if I was building now at this price, really the 285K at $420 would be nice.

https://www.amazon.com/Intel-Ultra-Desktop-Processor-265K/dp/B0DZHBQ9WK/ref=sr_1_14?crid=QN2FIT8VLH1W&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.PleyyzprHbX5K8I3YbD4-m0TiAr5jpMtofj9kTcc1oLARb0M5QSUaXwvxcCikQV7WWHwwQP1b63tbSzshntRnNKFfGJ4CYF9XNxGeJIoXLoUeyXS0J3wn7nvdXq3LhzHXs_LZa8thISWK36Ce9Vm9x2TBtjOVC9kzoNpG5d2Xc7RS75SXb0zT5nOXjZqvrzUilvd38EqBN_nGcRJQyUX3QVpM8c7BqxBYRdE8OZ3Oso.mz7uojbWdoggY-sRLPAd5AcQXntDMVFEdDfmJrnGCzQ&dib_tag=se&keywords=265k&qid=1750426034&sprefix=265k%2Caps%2C144&sr=8-14

^ that's kind of awesome.

But the issue is - if you're already on a 14700 or even a 13700k it's a bit of a sidegrade for $430.

 

[Phayzon]

Since the motherboard is the only part replacement requiring a drive reformat and OS reinstall, going through that hassle nowadays with all the customized setup is a turn off.

It doesn't, though. The last fresh install on my main machine was Windows 7 when I built a 3570K based system when that CPU was new. It's since been upgraded to 10, cloned to 4 new SSDs, and moved across all my machines since then (4790K, 7700K, 9900K, 11700K, and now 5800X3D).

 

[dgianstefani]

It doesn't, though. The last fresh install on my main machine was Windows 7 when I built a 3570K based system when that CPU was new. It's since been upgraded to 10, cloned to 4 new SSDs, and moved across all my machines since then (4790K, 7700K, 9900K, 11700K, and now 5800X3D).

IIRC the 10 upgrade didn't really care if you switched mobos, you get a free upgrade from 7 to 10 regardless, MS just wanted people off Win 7.

 

[Tek-Check]

Great price, indeed. Dirt cheap, and on dead platform, for one off purchase.

What does this price tell us about what's going on at Intel? Has anyone seen other i7 this cheap just a few months after release?

 

[dgianstefani]

Great price, indeed. Dirt cheap, and on dead platform, for one off purchase.

What does this price tell us about what's going on at Intel? Has anyone seen other i7 this cheap just a few months after release?

What's going on is the refresh parts are coming later this year and they're clearing stock.

Next year is Nova Lake vs Zen 6 which will be interesting.

 

[phanbuey]

Great price, indeed. Dirt cheap, and on dead platform, for one off purchase.

What does this price tell us about what's going on at Intel? Has anyone seen other i7 this cheap just a few months after release?

I think the new CEO is rebuilding the entire management stack there... which is good - this is what needs to happen.

 

[dgianstefani]

I think the new CEO is rebuilding the entire management stack there... which is good - this is what needs to happen.

Funnily enough this is still Pat's plan, so whatever happens in next couple years is due to decisions of last couple years, but short term upper management line go up/line go down stuff meant he got kicked out. Still, the new guy seems OK.

 

[Tek-Check]

What's going on is the refresh parts are coming later this year and they're clearing stock

Has refresh been firmly confirmed? It's end of June already.

 

[dgianstefani]

Has refresh been firmly confirmed? It's end of June already.

Nothing is confirmed till they are on shelves, but it seems to be the case refresh is coming from consistent leaks etc. I mean, ARL now and ARL at launch are two different things already both pricing and performance wise, so there's that.

 

[Zazigalka]

280eur in Poland, 9700x is 290eur. still not enough of a price drop, given how much better 9700x is in terms of power efficiency and platform support.

 

[Daven]

What's going on is the refresh parts are coming later this year and they're clearing stock.

Next year is Nova Lake vs Zen 6 which will be interesting.

Talk about revisionism. In the pre coffee lake days, Intel chips never dropped in price to clear inventory before a new release. In fact, older chips sometimes went up in price. This price drop is clearly the result of their poor popularity.

 

[phanbuey]

280eur in Poland, 9700x is 290eur. still not enough of a price drop, given how much better 9700x is in terms of power efficiency and platform support.

i would have to agree --- spending money on ARL with all the Nova Lake announcements feels like flushing it down the toilet.

 

[Daven]

Funnily enough this is still Pat's plan, so whatever happens in next couple years is due to decisions of last couple years, but short term upper management line go up/line go down stuff meant he got kicked out. Still, the new guy seems OK.

Pat was the worst CEO in Intel's history. Hopefully they scrap any and all plans he might have had.

Yes, yes, I know. No matter what it's bad for Intel. Ok, moving on Mr. "11th gen to 15/16th gen (depending on if you consider meteor lake) Intel is the same architecture". If they don't do discounts it's bad, if they do do discounts it's bad. Nuanced analysis.

Meanwhile I don't see you stating the same argument when AMD does the exact same pricing strategy (NVIDIA - $50) for their GPU division.

Actually, I hope Intel pivots completely to a fab for hire model only. I think they would do quite well. The CPU business is just too competitive for them to return to their former glory. TSMC is making almost $25B per quarter, close to 2.5 times Intel's quarterly revenue. Fabbing other company chips is Intel's future now. Hopefully they get there before going bankrupt.

 

[phanbuey]

Pat was the worst CEO in Intel's history. Hopefully they scrap any and all plans he might have had.


Actually, I hope Intel pivots completely to a fab for hire model only. I think they would do quite well. The CPU business is just too competitive for them to return to their former glory. TSMC is making almost $25B per quarter, close to 2.5 times Intel's quarterly revenue. Fabbing other company chips is Intel's future now. Hopefully they get there before going bankrupt.

For the fab maybe, for chip division I would disagree -- if anything, Pat tried to turn it around after Krzanich wasted 5 years doing nothing but staffing upper managament with propagandists and playing games. They lost Apple under Krzanich. Alder lake was the first successful re-design intel had since Sandy Bridge and it took the crown on an objectively inferior node.

Pat's downfall was not realizing just how broken the Intel processes between fab and design were, and how slow and opaque the decision making at middle management had become -- the AI aquisitions failed horribly due to mismanagement, and the fab continued to underperform - but all that was set in motion under Krzanich.

Krzanich just got a new job - here's the take of a former engineer:

Ex-Intel CEO Brian Krzanich gets blasted over landing a new job at automotive AI company

It all started with an official Cerence statement last week, proudly touting Krzanich's appointment as CEO and board member, highlighting his success and 36-year tenure at Intel....

www.techspot.com

 

[JustBenching]

The very reason I criticize Intel so much has to do with the way they see their role in the market. Arrow Lake is super unpopular. Price cuts are just further evidence of this. But instead of moving heaven and earth to launch something better, Intel is going to release an Arrow Lake refresh later this year.

The old Intel would have recorrected by now but the current Intel just pours crap plus one model number higher into a box annually to win their dying corporate and government IT contracts business.

There is nothing better that can be released. They are winning in actual performance in the majority of segments for the past 4 years. With arrowlake they are winning in efficiency too, and not by a small margin, mixed workloads has arrowlake sipping power next to amds chips which go full alcoholic on watts.

Unless you are getting an x3d going for amd makes no sense.

a refresh is not a new architecture. zen6 is going to have more ipc and more cores. not just a 100mhz speed bump.

When was the last time a new zen generation offered more cores at the same price? Did it ever actually happen?

 

[_roman_]

They may be an alternative for microsoft windows. For the gnu userspace I would buy something else. Those E-Cores will not execute my code.

Feel free to buy an outdated processor where most cores can not execute not any modern code. Go for it

Where is avx512? Gone? Ah still no avx512!

Intel® Core™ Ultra 7 Processor 265K (30M Cache, up to 5.50 GHz) - Product Specifications | Intel

Intel® Core™ Ultra 7 Processor 265K (30M Cache, up to 5.50 GHz) quick reference with specifications, features, and technologies.

www.intel.com

Instruction Set Extensions
Intel® SSE4.1, Intel® SSE4.2, Intel® AVX2

https://www.amd.com/en/products/processors/desktops/ryzen/7000-series/amd-ryzen-5-7600x.html

AES , AMD-V , AVX , AVX2 , AVX512 , FMA3 , MMX-plus , SHA , SSE , SSE2 , SSE3 , SSE4.1 , SSE4.2 , SSE4A , SSSE3 , x86-64

Sienna_Cichlid /home/roman # uname -a
Linux Sienna_Cichlid 6.15.3

model name    : AMD Ryzen 5 7600X 6-Core Processor

flags        : fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat pse36 clflush mmx fxsr sse sse2 ht syscall nx mmxext fxsr_opt pdpe1gb rdtscp lm constant_tsc rep_good amd_lbr_v2 nopl xtopology nonstop_tsc cpuid extd_apicid aperfmperf rapl pni pclmulqdq monitor ssse3 fma cx16 sse4_1 sse4_2 movbe popcnt aes xsave avx f16c rdrand lahf_lm cmp_legacy svm extapic cr8_legacy abm sse4a misalignsse 3dnowprefetch osvw ibs skinit wdt tce topoext perfctr_core perfctr_nb bpext perfctr_llc mwaitx cpb cat_l3 cdp_l3 hw_pstate ssbd mba perfmon_v2 ibrs ibpb stibp ibrs_enhanced vmmcall fsgsbase bmi1 avx2 smep bmi2 erms invpcid cqm rdt_a avx512f avx512dq rdseed adx smap avx512ifma clflushopt clwb avx512cd sha_ni avx512bw avx512vl xsaveopt xsavec xgetbv1 xsaves cqm_llc cqm_occup_llc cqm_mbm_total cqm_mbm_local avx512_bf16 clzero irperf xsaveerptr rdpru wbnoinvd cppc arat npt lbrv svm_lock nrip_save tsc_scale vmcb_clean flushbyasid decodeassists pausefilter pfthreshold avic vgif x2avic v_spec_ctrl vnmi avx512vbmi umip pku ospke avx512_vbmi2 gfni vaes vpclmulqdq avx512_vnni avx512_bitalg avx512_vpopcntdq rdpid overflow_recov succor smca fsrm flush_l1d amd_lbr_pmc_freeze

Note 7600X was entry level processor in may 2023. Low end, cheap entry processor. The cheapest option available.

I searched sevearl times for cpuinfo ouput. I could not find any. Anyone willing to share cpuinfo for P and E core of the 15th intel core generation please? Than I can make a spreadsheet and compare. Especially compare with the lowest available instruction for all of those intel processors. I prefer a cpuinfo output for a 230€ intel processor incl. tax from may 2023. Not more expensive. or 180€ intel processor of may 2025 incl tax. We should stick to the same price range and DDR5 socket only.

 

[phanbuey]

There is nothing better that can be released. They are winning in actual performance in the majority of segments for the past 4 years. With arrowlake they are winning in efficiency too, and not by a small margin, mixed workloads has arrowlake sipping power next to amds chips which go full alcoholic on watts.

Unless you are getting an x3d going for amd makes no sense.


When was the last time a new zen generation offered more cores at the same price? Did it ever actually happen?

Zen 2 (3000) when they went from 4core CCX to 8core CCX - 5000,7000,9000 on 8core CCX

Zen 6 on 12 core CCX?

The problem here is AMD is iterating on a platform that's good and has a lot of room left -- it makes consistent performance gains while intel is sucking for air rn. So you can bet Zen 6 / Z6X3D is going to be good just on them using a tweaked Zen 5 core with denser CCX and even better if they improve the infinity fabric at all.

Intel has to redesign the whole chip again. The current design for ARL is crap -- If they were smart they could do HBM - like apple, or some other disaggregated design win with huge bandwith... They have to do something remarkable like 3D stacked cache or HBM.