AM 2+ Biostar processor switch from Phenom to Phenon II AM3

[suckthebunny]

I recently decided after some research that I could switch out the processor on my Biostar TA790G AM2+ from the Phenom Quad 9850 Black Edition to the Phenom II x6 1055T 2.8ghz. My BIOS says its up to date. The Phenom II x6 is registering to my PC only 800 Mhz. Using KSTAT10 I can get the speed up but it wont stay. Upon reboot the setting revert back to 800 Mhz and I have to do it all over again. I cant even update windows ...even when clocked to 3 Ghz Update says I need at least 1 Ghz...its not seeing the clock as it is in real time...it only sees the 800 Ghz, Can anyone here tell me what Im doing Wrong?

 

[GoldenX]

TA790GX or TA760G? Because if it is the latter, it can only run 95W CPUs, and there are both 95 and 125W 1055Ts.

 

[suckthebunny]

I have the GX. The 1055T i just put in is a 95W.

 

[john_]

While this will not fix the problem with updates, you can try this method to autostart K10stat.

K10STAT AMD Griffin Processor UnderVolting Guide

FAQ Why UnderVolt? Because when a lower voltage can sustain your clockspeed, a stress tested undervolt will preserve battery life a...

microsoft-laptop.blogspot.com

And I would also advice into testing you CPU with undervoltage. Mine could do 3.6GHz with less voltage than stock.


Now for that update.

Try changing in K10Stat the multiplier for the lower power state to push frequency at or over 1GHz. That could do the trick. Looking at my settings here for the 1075T, with FID 0 and DID 1 I get 800MHz in P3. Changing FID to 4 I get 1GHz. If for some reason windows looks at the lowest power state, because the motherboards locks to it, changing that setting might do the trick.

Try disabling Cool and Quiet in the BIOS.

PS https://www.biostar.com.tw/app/en/mb/introduction.php?S_ID=377#download
There are some beta BIOSes there (I guess I found the correct model - check revision) that could help. While updating the BIOS does come with a risk, it might be your only option.

 

[suckthebunny]

ill try those and and see what happens. thank you

 

[GoldenX]

I've used that in the past, it should work. But still, why do you get wrong default clocks?

ED: found it, of all the 790GX models, only this one supports X6 CPUs: https://www.biostar.com.tw/app/en/mb/introduction.php?S_ID=408#cpusupport
Any other model only supports quad core Deneb ones.

 

[Mr.Scott]

ED: found it, of all the 790GX models, only this one supports X6 CPUs: https://www.biostar.com.tw/app/en/mb/introduction.php?S_ID=408#cpusupport
Any other model only supports quad core Deneb ones.

Right on. Only the GXE supports hex cores.

 

[suckthebunny]

I found out why the clock speed is wrong. Phenom II Tweaker guide states that these processors wont report actual speed unless you reset TSC in windows

It has to do with P-States

 

[john_]

It has to do with P-States

There is one more P-State in the X6 models, the Turbo. But I would have tried the latest beta BIOS anyway, the one talking about RAID to see if I will be lucky. That BIOS is the only BIOS with a date AFTER the X6 announcement. Even while not saying about X6 support it could offer some kind of support.

 

[suckthebunny]

you know i saw that last night and actually didnt notice the date. im going back to check it out.

i appreciate the help. im hoping the data i put in the task manager is correct to run k10stat with clock control every startup. ive been working on this for 2 days. you can tell im real tech savvy. lol

 

[GoldenX]

It took me a couple of tries too back in the day.

 

[suckthebunny]

the p states on this software doesnt effect the clock speeds. being the 1055t

Yeah its not gonna work. the ta790gx was only compatible up to the phenom II x4. took me forever to find that out.

 

[Ripcord]

if it was me i would look to see if i could add the x6 microcode the gx bios.

 

[Mr.Scott]

if it was me i would look to see if i could add the x6 microcode the gx bios.

Not that easy this time. Bios has no provisions for the added P states nor turbo core.

 

[suckthebunny]

yea im gonna buy a motherboard to fit it i guess. which manufacturer do you guys recommend out of the options i have?

 

[john_]

Trying to find an AM2+ motherboard is not going to be easy. Because, if I take as example the second hand market in Greece, people ask ridiculous money for motherboards. Even old. It makes sense of course because usually motherboards end up broken not CPUs, so most people search for motherboards.

Going for a new one is a no go for so many reasons and even then you will have to find a motherboard that supports X6 and if possible 140W CPUs. What I do know is that you'll better avoid MSI, at least most of their models. Their motherboards for the AMx+ platform where not having reliable VRMs. At least two died in my hands with CPUs that they where in their support list and at stock speeds.

Maybe you could try to find an AM3+ motherboard and sell your RAM, buy DDR3. You could even buy really cheap "AMD only" RAM on eBay to save money. But then again investing in the AM3+ platform today, doesn't make sense either. The Gigabyte I am using is an excellent motherboard, but then again if you find it, it will probably be expensive.

[boring part]
In your place and if I was financially limited and at the same time more than fine with the X6 performance I would try to see if I could evade my problems. I would put K10stat to auto start with windows to fix my frequency problem and then try to see if I could make Windows believe that I have a CPU that was running at least at 1GHz. If the above ideas I posted didn't worked, I would have tried to overclock the frequency bus to get a minimum speed of 1GHz. That means moving the frequency from 200MHz to 250MHz, forcing that lower power state to go from 800MHz to 1GHz. That of course wouldn't be a permanent overclock, just a temporary one to do my windows updates. So, I would lower multiplier and memory frequency at the same time to avoid, if possible, instability. Another idea is putting temporary the 9850 on the socket, do the updates then swap again the 9850 with the X6. Probably the updates for the Phenom processors are the same, so putting the X6 back I imagine would not end up with Windows saying that there are still new updates to be installed. That of course would be a task that I would be doing once every 6 months or so. Not swap the CPU every time a new update is available.

Of course the only logical choice is to go with AM4. If you are not running Windows 7 but you are already on Windows 10, buying a cheap A320 motherboard (the best choice here for a cheap option would be a B450), 8GB or DDR4 and a cheap APU, like the 2200G/3200G would offer you much better performance for both CPU and iGPU, with only minimal extra cost. If you have a graphics card, you could go with a 1600 AF or a 3100.

 

[Mr.Scott]

yea im gonna buy a motherboard to fit it i guess. which manufacturer do you guys recommend out of the options i have?

Only option you have is to buy used.
Gigabyte 790 or 890 board would be great. Good luck finding one, and if you do, plan on it being 75 bucks or higher.

 

[suckthebunny]

Thanks guys i appreciate the input...i believe what i have decided to do is ...and its weird that john mentioned it because i just started looking at it right before i read you guys recommendations...is the AM4 Ryzen 5 3600 w/ a B450 board and trade the Phenom II with a friend for some various components. Not sure what Ill do with the Biostar board and the Phenom 9850....perhaps hang it on my wall? haha.

 

[Ripcord]

Not that easy this time. Bios has no provisions for the added P states nor turbo core.

maybe force flash the gxe bios to the gx board. its the same chip set and the boards look identical so i would risk it its pretty old so not risking alot really

 

[john_]

Not sure what Ill do with the Biostar board and the Phenom 9850....perhaps hang it on my wall? haha.

With an SSD this setup can still be a nice office PC. You could donate it in a school or something if they really need one more PC. Or just sell it in you town for $30-$50. The X6 also could be sold for about $40 I think. You could get that B450 motherboard with that money.

 

[suckthebunny]

You guys are on point. it seems you read my mind. Having said that i am going to DONATE...weird again that u guys mention it...very weird...im going to donate my ta790gx and x4 processor to a girl i know here in louisville whose son needs a better PC than the j9200 intel...i think i have that right...j2900...very slow...that will be a def upgrade for her...ill install it...and solve the rest im sure...ive come this far...it will be a great tool for his schooling with the current pandemic issues and it will be better than his current intel j29whatever setup as long as this ATX isnt replacing a micro ATX which i think her box...no pun intended...will fit this biostar

john_ you have a weird 6th sense buddy...weird 6th sense...i know its common sense to you but from where im sittin...its unnncanny

This techpowerup.com forum has been the best thing ive possibly ever done in my pursuit of genuine help. i have not been made fun of...i have not been made to feel stupid and you have all helped me learn. I thank you all for being so fair to me in this unfair world. A breath of fresh air you all are in being humanitarian in what appears to me...in all that you do. Hats off to you all!

Im sure ill be back as soon as i get that ryzen 5, x570 mobo and RAM in a room together...cus i got a feelin...windows and these guys...they are gonna wanna fight!
\

my home setup works like this...i have an i5 that i keep online so i can dig through vst's. i have the ta790gx offline solely to write music with. i have them connected via an ethernet cable. Microsoft updates mess that up so i keep those paused until i have time to deal with them. so here is what im doing

obviously i need a machine to outpace the i5 to make this work

i have recording contract to boot...pun intended...so time is often not on my side...but they pay for my stuff so theres that

everything i write goes directly to an HDD i have setup under the i5. i have ssd in both boxes for windows obviously but the HDDs store the brunt of the data and theres 2 of them 1 in the Ta box and the other in the i5 box,

im sure theres a better way but i like having the 2 OS and the HDDs seperate. it gives me some byzantine fault tolerance in some way but not others and yes i am 100% a bitcoiner. lol

i need to be able to create my own videos for these songs or the youtube channel goes to waste. the label will not do that for me. its up to me how far this goes. the youtube channel was not created by me, its a natural thing that happens when you land a distributor. the image that you see on youtube is just the artwork i submiitted. i need video to go with that. i need a GPU guys. what do i do??????

i currently have an nvidia 9600 series

 

[john_]

The J2900 is an Intel Atom CPU, so it is cr@p. It does have a huge advantage over 9850. It only consumes about 1/10th of power. The 9850 it might be old but it is about 60-80% faster based on PassMark. And I bet it feels much faster in reality. Especially if it is paired with at least a decent low end GPU, even a old one, it will definitely offer a much better desktop experience.

Now, the Phenom X6 that you where trying to install in ta790gx would have brought that system probably at the same level as your i5, except if we are talking about a really really old i5. The 1075T overclocked at 3.8GHz is very close to the i5 4460 at 3.2/3.4 GHz. I have both systems. The desktop feels a little smoother on the X6, but apps/games look a little faster on the i5.

I modern Ryzen setup will make both the X6 and the i5 look like a J2900.

 

[suckthebunny]

well said john well said. ill keep you updated on my progress as im sure i will need to return here to solve impending issues. my new mobo and ryzen 5 will arrive on tuesday

 

[suckthebunny]

Well just to give an update to put this thread to a close. I built a great machine for doing what im doing. I got a Ryzen 5 3600 on a GiGabyte mobo X570 UD, Prizm LED fan, 16 Gigs uh Corsair Vengence RGB 3600 and a Radeon RX570. I gave my lil girlfriend and her son my I5 but I put an extra hard drive in there and did some mirroring . I'll put in an ssd pretty soon. I decided to keep the Phenom x4, bought a used case and threw it in there with a brand new outta the box Asrock N68C-GS4 FX ...i dont think those are available in the states but i could be wrong. A chinese guy had it and it fits the Phenom but the RAM situation is...well i dont like it...it fits DDR2 and 3. I like the board tho. I kept the NVidia 9600 ...old but Im only using this machine for online. Thanks for everyones help you guys are awesome and you got me on the path to learning. A month ago I didnt know the difference tween a chipset and a mobo. Heres what the setup looks like. I like alot of tiny lights so i can write my music in the dark

 

[GoldenX]

Power consumption will be a bit higher since old nforce boards don't support digital control of voltages, nor can provide separate voltages for CPU and CPU-NB. Plus there may be a performance loss due to the HT clock being limited to 1000MHz instead of 1800-2200MHz.
Besides that, it will work fine.