Should i switch to an AIO?

[DookieNukie]

Hello,

So im in the process of making a monster of a build ( full specs below ) and i decided for my CPU i'd run a i9 13900k and as everyone knows they tend to run ludicrously hot even at an idle rate. That being said i'm looking to figure out if i should switch over to an AIO. At the moment the builds not yet completed i have to get my Mobo and Gpu so i haven't tested to see what my temps are. But the cooler i picked is a Cooler Master Hyper 212, that being said im a bit skeptical about using a air cooler for a rig thats pumping out so much heat. Anyone else have this combo of cooler/ cpu?


Specs:

Case: Lian Li Dk04f
Ram: 128 GB DDR5 Gskill Trident Z5
CPU: i9 13900K
Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 Black Edition
PSU: 1300W EVGA Supernova
GPU:RTX 4090 Suprim LiquidX
Motherboard:ASUS ROG Maximus Z790 Hero

 

[dgianstefani]

Noctua U12A or custom loop.

AIOs are ewaste.

EK and Alphacool have loop kits that are hybrids of AIO/custom loop.

Avoid anything aluminium/copper, find a pure copper cooling system or just use high end air.

212 is a budget cooler for budget chips.

 

[Vya Domus]

That 212 is almost certainly insufficient, AIOs are fine but for that CPU I would not go below one with a 360 radiator.

 

[DookieNukie]

That 212 is almost certainly insufficient, AIOs are fine but for that CPU I would not go below one with a 360 radiator.

ahh ok thank you this is my first build in several generations so i just googled best CPU coolers for i9 13900k and it popped up so thank you

Noctua U12A or custom loop.

AIOs are ewaste.

EK and Alphacool have loop kits that are hybrids of AIO/custom loop.

Avoid anything aluminium/copper, find a pure copper cooling system or just use high end air.

212 is a budget cooler for budget chips.

Thank you its been a very long time since i made a set up custom so i really wasn't sure

 

[Vya Domus]

Why not buy a 4090 with a block on it already and add both to the loop.

It's clearly a waste to buy a GPU with an AIO if you want to go for a custom loop on the CPU.

 

[dgianstefani]

If you're doing a custom loop the best fans are Phanteks T30 and the best radiators are from Corsair/Hardwarelabs. Singularity computers and Optimus watercooling do good pump/res combos. EK have good fittings but the rest of their stuff is overpriced. Corsair and Watercool blocks are good - Optimus are best.

 

[Selaya]

disagree w/ the t30.
noctua's still king - the relevant metric to normalise your testing for is db(a), not rpm. the t30 might perform better at x rpm compared to the a12, but it's also louder.
when you normalise for db, the a12 actually comes out (very slightly) ahead.
and it's 5mm thinner.

so phanteks actually managed to waste an additional 5mm to still fail to beat noctua's a12.
yeah, that's a big no-go

EDIT: look here: https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/phanteks-t30-120-fan.285366/page-3#post-4583071

 

[dgianstefani]

disagree w/ the t30.
noctua's still king - the relevant metric to normalise your testing for is db(a), not rpm. the t30 might perform better at x rpm compared to the a12, but it's also louder.
when you normalise for db, the a12 actually comes out (very slightly) ahead.
and it's 5mm thinner.

so phanteks actually managed to waste an additional 5mm to still fail to beat noctua's a12.
yeah, that's a big no-go

EDIT: look here: https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/phanteks-t30-120-fan.285366/page-3#post-4583071

Phanteks T30-120 Fan Review - One Fan to Rule Them All?

Phanteks' take on the ultimate PC fan is finally out! The T30-120 is a 30-mm thick fan that has a feature set to make many others blush, including the use of LCP blades and frames, Sunon's magnetic levitation bearing, three operating modes for different use cases, and fantastic performance...

www.techpowerup.com

Phanteks T30-120 Fan Review: Beating the Noctua NF-A12x25 at its Own Game!

 

[MrHartmann]

Hello,

So im in the process of making a monster of a build ( full specs below ) and i decided for my CPU i'd run a i9 13900k and as everyone knows they tend to run ludicrously hot even at an idle rate. That being said i'm looking to figure out if i should switch over to an AIO. At the moment the builds not yet completed i have to get my Mobo and Gpu so i haven't tested to see what my temps are. But the cooler i picked is a Cooler Master Hyper 212, that being said im a bit skeptical about using a air cooler for a rig thats pumping out so much heat. Anyone else have this combo of cooler/ cpu?


Specs:

Case: Lian Li Dk04f
Ram: 128 GB DDR5 Gskill Trident Z5
CPU: i9 13900K
Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 Black Edition
PSU: 1300W EVGA Supernova
GPU:RTX 4090 Suprim LiquidX
Motherboard:ASUS ROG Maximus Z790 Hero

Get a good 360mm or 420mm AIO and the 13900k will be fine..
But man, you really need 128gb of ram? Is it for work? Because for games, 32gb is more than enough this days..

 

[AusWolf]

AIOs are ewaste.

I disagree. Only single-fan AIOs are ewaste. Not everybody has the skill or willingness to take risks building a custom loop, and not every chassis can (or should) fit a large tower.

For a 13900K, I'd say, a 240 mm AIO is meh, a 280 mm one should be adequate, but 360 or 420 mm would be nice if space allows.

The CM 212 is an old cooler for much lower power CPUs, I agree with that.

 

[Arco]

I disagree. Only single-fan AIOs are ewaste. Not everybody has the skill or willingness to take risks building a custom loop, and not every chassis can (or should) fit a large tower.

For a 13900K, I'd say, a 240 mm AIO is meh, a 280 mm one should be adequate, but 360 or 420 mm would be nice if space allows.

The CM 212 is an old cooler for much lower power CPUs, I agree with that.

A 280, 360, or 420 would work. Arctic makes some good stuff.

 

[dirtyferret]

Noctua U12A or custom loop.

I'm very pleased with mine

best CPU coolers for i9 13900k and it popped up so thank you

"best" can mean a lot of different things, sure at max RPM it may be slightly cooler but will you be running the cooler at max RPM and how loud will it be at that RPM? At a lower RPM your best cooler may be just as good as another one making the real world difference nothing while spending more money to get better benchmarks.

disagree w/ the t30.
noctua's still king - the relevant metric to normalise your testing for is db(a), not rpm. the t30 might perform better at x rpm compared to the a12, but it's also louder.

I think phanteks fans are very well built and perform well, I've tried to use several of them over the years but I completely agree with you; I found each and every one of them too loud and quickly swapped them out for a Noctua fan or returned them.

 

[dgianstefani]

I disagree. Only single-fan AIOs are ewaste. Not everybody has the skill or willingness to take risks building a custom loop, and not every chassis can (or should) fit a large tower.

For a 13900K, I'd say, a 240 mm AIO is meh, a 280 mm one should be adequate, but 360 or 420 mm would be nice if space allows.

The CM 212 is an old cooler for much lower power CPUs, I agree with that.

They're all e-waste because the pumps wear out and are irreplaceable, same with the liquid inside having a useful life of the chemical treatments (most AIOs use mixed metals so require chemicals to prevent reactions, which have a limited life).

A real loop uses a modular pump that isn't running close to its limits all the time, and facilitates easy expanding or replacing of components as they wear out, in addition to topping up or changing liquid.

High end air is fine for a 13900K, but if you're going to liquid cool, save yourself and the planet some grief by doing it properly.

 

[AusWolf]

They're all e-waste because the pumps wear out and are irreplaceable, same with the liquid inside having a useful life of the chemical treatments (most AIOs use mixed metals so require chemicals to prevent reactions, which have a limited life).

A real loop uses a modular pump that isn't running close to its limits all the time, and facilitates easy expanding or replacing of components as they wear out, in addition to topping up or changing liquid.

High end air is fine for a 13900K, but if you're going to liquid cool, save yourself and the planet some grief by doing it properly.

Modern pumps have a much higher life expectancy than old ones used to have, and some AIOs (like my Be Quiet) are refillable. Even when an AIO fails (which doesn't happen as often as people think), it's recyclable.

 

[dgianstefani]

Modern pumps have a much higher life expectancy than old ones used to have, and some AIOs (like my Be Quiet) are refillable. Even when an AIO fails (which doesn't happen as often as people think), it's recyclable.

Most won't "fail", the performance will just continually degrade, and unlike your air cooler heatsink, you can't just clean out the dust or at most re-paste.

Junk product class borne of compromise and marketing piggybacking off the image of water-cooling with the single advantage being cost. As usual with those parameters, the result only works in the imaginary world of finance.

Why do you think they're popular? Because marketing loves them, they're cheap to produce and can be sold for more than high end air which isn't exactly cheap.

At best, (and bear in mind the EK Elite is basically a custom loop hybrid AIO class, so far from the average unit in cost and quality) they're 8% better than high end air. Wow.

Even less, if you normalize noise.

 

[Selaya]

i wouldnt say its just cost since doing a custom loop is legit effort, but yeah on the whole i'd agree w/ you.
if you want water, do custom. otherwise stick to air.

 

[freeagent]

From the temps that I see people posting, or describing with an AIO.. they are not that good. I am talking on hardware that I am using or have used..

I watched my AIO perform fantastically when it was new, then the slow decline that never got better.

If you don't load your CPU and just play games and stuff it will probably be ok. But if you fold or something like that, you will not get good life from your AIO.

I saw one review where my air cooler was performing as well as an LFII 360.

 

[dgianstefani]

i wouldnt say its just cost since doing a custom loop is legit effort, but yeah on the whole i'd agree w/ you.
if you want water, do custom. otherwise stick to air.

It's really not that hard, couple of power connectors to connect, cut some flexible tubing, screw in some fittings and fans. The time and skill has been overblown by youtubers who do hardline fancy builds.

 

[Selaya]

partially true, but tell that to the average person who's got trouble plugging in their gpu ...

 

[freeagent]

partially true, but tell that to the average person who's got trouble plugging in their gpu ...

1-800-CALL-DELL

 

[dirtyferret]

partially true, but tell that to the average person who's got trouble plugging in their gpu ...

when it says "6+2 pin PCIe" I just plug in the 8 pin EPS cable right?

 

[Selaya]

1-800-CALL-DELL

Dell's Dumpster Fire: Bloatware Uses 30% GPU (G5 5000 Review & Benchmarks)

 

[AusWolf]

Most won't "fail", the performance will just continually degrade, and unlike your air cooler heatsink, you can't just clean out the dust or at most re-paste.

Junk product class borne of compromise and marketing piggybacking off the image of water-cooling with the single advantage being cost. As usual with those parameters, the result only works in the imaginary world of finance.

Why do you think they're popular? Because marketing loves them, they're cheap to produce and can be sold for more than high end air which isn't exactly cheap.

At best, (and bear in mind the EK Elite is basically a custom loop hybrid AIO class, so far from the average unit in cost and quality) they're 8% better than high end air. Wow.

View attachment 281036

Percentages don't mean a thing when you're talking about temperatures.

Liquid behaves very differently than pure aluminium/copper, that's the advantage of it. It can endure much more heat soak before saturation. That's why you typically don't need high RPM fans for AIOs.

They're popular because they have all these advantages without the need to assemble and test a full custom loop. If they were overpriced pieces of garbage, they wouldn't be, don't you think?

 

[dgianstefani]

Percentages don't mean a thing when you're talking about temperatures.

Liquid behaves very differently than pure aluminium/copper, that's the advantage of it. It can endure much more heat soak before saturation. That's why you typically don't need high RPM fans for AIOs.

They're popular because they have all these advantages without the need to assemble and test a full custom loop. If they were overpriced pieces of garbage, they wouldn't be, don't you think?

And yet despite all these advantages they're still within 5-10% when noise normalized.

They're popular because they're marketed hard and are used as status symbols. RGB fans are popular too while being objectively worse than non-RGB fans. Lots of things are popular while also being overpriced pieces of garbage? Have you looked online recently lmao.

Nothing is pure aluminium or copper, hence the existence of vapour chambers and heatpipes.

 

[AusWolf]

If you don't load your CPU and just play games and stuff it will probably be ok. But if you fold or something like that, you will not get good life from your AIO.

That I agree with. They don't contain enough liquid for a constant 24/7 heat soak situation.

And yet despite all these advantages they're still within 5-10% when noise normalized.

Like I said, % doesn't mean anything. °C and dBa do.

I forgot to mention that unlike high-end air, an AIO doesn't put pressure on the motherboard, and doesn't heat the case up when the rad is doing exhaust.

Not every technology is entirely stupid that you personally don't like.