Vista gaming will be 10 to 15 per cent slower than XP

[AshenSugar]

When I installed 2003 server a few months ago I stuck a 300 gig drive in and was stopped at 175 I believe(Its been a few months)

Damn Owned on 2k, I have all my reinstall files on other drives and always install on a 80 gig. Its just when I have always installed 2k I can never get to the Internet with out the drivers on my other hard drive. I HATE CDS I HATE THEM, I Hate them. I always go buy a 200 gig and up load all my cds to them. Hence the reason I have 4 200 setting on my desk right now.

must have been a bug on 2k3 then as i installed it on a 320gb drive(pre sp1 2k3) a few weeks ago for a buddy(2k on one drive 2k3 on the other.)

as to 2k my advice slipstream sp5(avalable on a few leigal download sites) using nlite, it will help alot its got most of the current updates since the rollup was done, the latest rollup also now supports slipstreaming.

yet another time ms fooked us, they said they would suppot 2k and give it at least 1 more sp when xp came out then desided to screw 2k users(companys as well) and give it a pathetic rollup.....bastages.....

 

[Deleted member 3]

The bad about 2k 137 gig limit, there is a way around it but damn it. Had the same issue with 2003 I think it was a little bit larger tho.

The 137GB limit has to do with the LBA, for larger drives you require to enable 48Bit LBA. Not only Windows has this limit by default.

As for this thread, yes it's one big bashing thread. I'm currently wondering why I'm not closing it.

 

[AshenSugar]

probbly because we arent bashing eachother really and we are having a meaningfull dialog not flaming

 

[Slater]

probbly wont see one unless ms makes it.

vista core is diffrent layout then xp, things are not backword compatable, such as driver and dx versions.

sorry to say but unless ms changes its tune xp aint getting dx10.

You seem smart but make a lot of spelling errors.

 

[AshenSugar]

i have never claimed to have good spelling or grammer, at least not online, i passed eng 97 with a B- dispite missing so many days i should have failed, passed 101 with a c+ once again dispite missing to many days, but it takes ALOT of efford for me, im mildly dyslexic and that REALLY dosnt help at all.

try having things look fine then re reading them later and seeing how baddly you spelled/spaced something, then you will understand....

 

[Slater]

Didn't know you were dyslexic, sorry

 

[AshenSugar]

np m8, i get shit for spelling all the time, dosnt bother me really, and you wherent rude about it.
the only time it bothers me is when somebody uses it as a way to try and disscredit me because they dont like something i say

 

[Alec§taar]

probbly because we arent bashing eachother really and we are having a meaningfull dialog not flaming

I'll agree on that account: AshenSugar hasn't been rude to anyone, & is just putting out his viewpoints & such.

Heck - I don't think anyone flamed anyone... have they?

APK

P.S.=> I don't know WHAT to think of VISTA @ this point though... after this thread & a few others around this forums @ this point.

I do like the fact that "the squeaky wheel's got the grease" for OpenGL 2.x native support though, & not done via "wrapper" (OpenGL API function call translators to DirectX 10 ones)... I am NOT crazy, however, about the whole "DRM" thing.

Hopefully? You guys who want DirectX 10 WILL get a copy for XP, much as how this worked out for OpenGL on VISTA itself, which is great news to me... apk

 

[Alec§taar]

np m8, i get shit for spelling all the time, dosnt bother me really, and you wherent rude about it.

Spelling's only a problem for folks if they cannot draw/infer the meaning of what you're saying... then, it's THEIR problem... imo @ least.

(This isn't legal correspondence, or your last will & testament in other words!)

the only time it bothers me is when somebody uses it as a way to try and disscredit me because they dont like something i say

I bust on the "spelling nitpickers" @ SLASHDOT (or, other sites) for that myself... if you cannot infer the meaning by the context in which a word is used (misspelled or not)? It's the nitpicker w/ the problem.

Ad-Hominum attack (attacking the poster himself, but not the issue @ hand): It's TOO easy to fall into, especially when you're on the "losing" end of a technical debate. Once it starts up? You KNOW you're "getting the better" of an opponent, imo @ least.

Still, good spelling does help... but, it's NOT mandatory on forums. Nice to see, but not a requirement, lol... especially today, in the era of "L33tSp33k" & acronyms!

APK

P.S.=> IN any event? This has been an 'enlightening' conversation w/ many disparate viewpoints & GOOD INFO (especially about OpenGL being in VISTA from now on, NATIVELY, w/ out a wrapper layer which slows it down) brought up!

These are the BEST kinds of conversation online imo (as long as they don't degenerate into arguments & flames): When you learn something & plus, when they make you THINK! apk

 

[Ketxxx]

The 137GB limit has to do with the LBA, for larger drives you require to enable 48Bit LBA. Not only Windows has this limit by default.

As for this thread, yes it's one big bashing thread. I'm currently wondering why I'm not closing it.

because it may be bashing, but it also has useful info in it and will no doubt continue to have useful info documented at various stages.

 

[Apamedvapen]

I don't know if anyone has writen this already because there's so many posts in this thread, but that 10-15% loss of performance might be able to be lowered even more with some tweaking in Vista? It's not out yet, so you can't really say much about it yet, bet I am most certain there's loads of applications you can do without, and you can probably make the performance lost only to 5% or even less! There's always people who dedicates their time for performance gaining, so I bet there will be many tweaks to read about

 

[AshenSugar]

I don't know if anyone has writen this already because there's so many posts in this thread, but that 10-15% loss of performance might be able to be lowered even more with some tweaking in Vista? It's not out yet, so you can't really say much about it yet, bet I am most certain there's loads of applications you can do without, and you can probably make the performance lost only to 5% or even less! There's always people who dedicates their time for performance gaining, so I bet there will be many tweaks to read about

nope you cant tweak vista, little EULA info here,
4. Problem-solving prohibited. "You may not work around any technical limitations in the software." Microsoft might be referring to anticircumvention of technical protection measures here, but since it's often hard to tell the difference, from the user's perspective, between a TPM and a bug, this reads as a prohibition on user debugging and problem-solving. After all, down-rezzing HD content or refusing to allow users to copy quotes from an e-book don't strike most people as wanted features. Can you work around a document's failure to save properly?

this is the wording of the eula, the way its worded it dosnt just stop you from working around DRM bugs/liomitations but ALL limitations, including performance limitations due to vista design/services.

and 10-15% is a big hit specly for those who have lower end cards, where 10% is the diffrance between playable oblivion and a slide show.
this go's for any current game on an avrage level pc, hell it will even hit the high end market since 15% off of 30fps in oblivion=ouch for most of us.

ms is aiming to force users to get vista but they are really aiming at their own foot, cant wait to see them pull the trigger.

P.S. read the links, MS themselves said that under vista(retail vista) its 10-15% they where not talking about the trial versions!!!!

 

[cdawall]

wow this thread became much larger after i left all i got to say is i will be perfectly happy to be a test dummy for you cracked copy of dx10 ketxxx and btw f*** vista

 

[b1lk1]

its not about that, as ive said amillion times now, there is no technical reason why xpcant support dx10. even is microshit want to e anal, let them. i know there are plenty of talented coders that will rip the vista version of dx10 apart and recode it for xp. hell, i'll do it myself with some mates if m$ want to be that anal.

I'd pay to see this.

I'll take bets now that this impossible. Plain and simple.

 

[Alec§taar]

nope you cant tweak vista,

Then why did MS create the boot configuration file editor for it then, in bcdedit.exe?

http://www.microsoft.com/technet/windowsvista/library/85cd5efe-c349-427c-b035-c2719d4af778.mspx

There is no more "boot.ini" & instead, you hack @ VISTA's bootup config files w/ this tool now...

Yes, probably because SOMETIMES? You'll have to edit that file, especially network admins/techs & such (developers too)... but still, this does tend to "violate" their EULA, don't you think?

APK

P.S.=> If their OS is now "untweakable" though, in areas other than that which I show above (bcd files, & instead is services cut offs, registry hacks, etc. et al), thru SOME method of checking the registry that is unknown to me (other than scanning certain hives/keys/values areas in it)?

Well, I may steer clear of it...

I.E.-> We all know pretty much by now, that guides like the "System Optimization" sticky thread in the General Software section DO WORK, & bigtime for better performance... if they limit that?

Ah, NOT a good move by MS... imo @ least! apk

 

[Alec§taar]

I'll take bets now that this impossible. Plain and simple.

I don't know if it's IMPOSSIBLE, but I wouldn't want to try to do it... NOT w/ out sourcecode, & MS is NOT giving THAT out!

APK

 

[AshenSugar]

u know what would make me laugh, if somebody makes a dx10 wraper for ogl2.3 it would be kickass on x1k/gf6/7 cards if properly done

 

[b1lk1]

I don't know if it's IMPOSSIBLE, but I wouldn't want to try to do it... NOT w/ out sourcecode, & MS is NOT giving THAT out!

APK

Good point. We all know how tightly they hold onto that. This is just something I think a majority will learn to live without.

I will give it about 1 - 1 1/2 years for Vista to mature, then I'll buy some high end cards, then I'll get it and forget about upgrading constantly. I have started to give up this vice and thanks to Vista, I should be able to. I consider Vista the Methadone of the OS world.

 

[Casheti]

I poo on DX10. I'm upgrading my PC to high end DX9.

 

[DaMulta]

http://www.voodoofiles.com/

http://www.voodoofiles.com/type.asp?cat_id=14

The old wrappers

 

[AshenSugar]

the ngo driver sets come with a far better one damulta, let me find th name

http://www.zeckensack.de/glide/

that ones the best one avalable and is still in dev,

wraping d3d around ogl shouldnt be to hard since ogl2.x is more advanced and has so many fetures , like wraping old open gl around d3d(was done to decent success with a pay to own wraper.....looking for link now.....)

http://www.scitechsoft.com/products/ent/gld_home.php
gldirect, forgot the name, it works pretty well for what it is, specly on hardware that has shit gl support(onbord video for starters)

 

[C0mrad3]

I'm going to get Vista just in spite.

 

[Ketxxx]

I'd pay to see this.

I'll take bets now that this impossible. Plain and simple.

apparently not from what a coding guy tells me, hes ripping dx10 apart as we type

 

[i_am_mustang_man]

i just want to play crysis. you guys see the new vid?

 

[Casheti]

Yeah, it r0x. I want Crysis, but I can happily stick with DX9 games for a year or more.