Need a new graphics card £200-£220ish

[HexagonalBolts]

Hello everyone,

My old graphics card died and I'm in need of a new one, I'm really struggling to work out what to buy. My price range is £200-£220ish. I'm not particularly keen to overclock. I do a lot of gaming.

It seems to be a show down between a GTX 560 and the HD 6950 2gb...? I read reviews that praise both, but the 6950 has an extra gigabyte of RAM which will surely be more useful in the future, especially given that I play at 1920 x 1080.

If you could provide me a link to a specific graphic card model (especially on ebuyer) that would be really helpful.

The other parts of the computer are:

Asus P5K Premium | Corsair 4GB DDR2 XMS2 Dominator PC2-8500C5 | Q6600 "Energy Efficient SLACR 95W Edition" 2.40GHz | CM690 | Corsair HX Series 520W Modular PSU | 1TB HDD | Windows 7 x64 | Blu-ray drive | 1920x1080 27" LG monitor

 

[WhiteLotus]

You are about to get about 10 people say that you should get the 560, and about 10 people say you should get the 6950.

Don't listen to any of them.

Do you like a quiet card? One that doesn't produce much heat, or consume tonnes of power? What games do you play? Will you get a bigger monitor in the future? Would you consider a cheaper card so you can crossfire/SLI them?

Work out what it is you want from the card, and then go look at all the reviews you can find. Then make your own decision.

 

[MoonPig]

Get Paul's GTX570 in the FS

 

[HexagonalBolts]

You are about to get about 10 people say that you should get the 560, and about 10 people say you should get the 6950.

Don't listen to any of them.

Do you like a quiet card? One that doesn't produce much heat, or consume tonnes of power? What games do you play? Will you get a bigger monitor in the future? Would you consider a cheaper card so you can crossfire/SLI them?

Work out what it is you want from the card, and then go look at all the reviews you can find. Then make your own decision.

I don't particularly mind about heat, volume and power as long as it's nothing outrageous - and the two cards don't seem to have a great deal of difference between them. I don't plan on getting a bigger monitor. I'd rather just get a single card for now and maybe get a second in a year or twos time.

For me it then mostly comes down to performance, and then I'm faced with a huge array of statistics and contradictory reviews/opinions that go well over my head

Get Paul's GTX570 in the FS

Thank you very much for the well spotted offer but I'd rather buy from a shop for various reasons

 

[Dent1]

HexagonalBolts,

If that is you full system spec, consisting of a Q6600 sitting at stock (2.4GHz). You might very well bottleneck a 6950 2GB or GTX 560!

Which card did you run previously?

 

[BarbaricSoul]

HexagonalBolts,

If that is you full system spec, consisting of a Q6600 sitting at stock (2.4GHz). You might very well bottleneck a 6950 2GB or GTX 560!

Which card did you run previously?

There's no might about it. A stock q6600 WILL BOTTLENECK with anything faster than a GTX260/HD4870. Time to start to consider a full system over-haul if you want to use a newer GFX card to it's full potential.

 

[the54thvoid]

Hey dude,

Think outside the box.

You dont care as much about noise? (though the later drivers and revisions helped that anyway...)

What about this:

Gigabyte GTX 480 Rev1 1536MB GDDR5 Dual DVI HDMI P...

You said ebuyer, i listened. And at stock it performs better than a stock 6970 2GB (source: http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/HD_6970_Lightning/23.html)

 

[HexagonalBolts]

There's no might about it. A stock q6600 WILL BOTTLENECK with anything faster than a GTX260/HD4870. Time to start to consider a full system over-haul if you want to use a newer GFX card to it's full potential.

Hey dude,

Think outside the box.

You dont care as much about noise? (though the later drivers and revisions helped that anyway...)

What about this:

Gigabyte GTX 480 Rev1 1536MB GDDR5 Dual DVI HDMI P...

You said ebuyer, i listened. And at stock it performs better than a stock 6970 2GB (source: http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/MSI/HD_6970_Lightning/23.html)

HexagonalBolts,

If that is you full system spec, consisting of a Q6600 sitting at stock (2.4GHz). You might very well bottleneck a 6950 2GB or GTX 560!

Which card did you run previously?

I previously ran a GTS 8800. I'm sure these cards will be bottlenecked by my current computer but I plan to upgrade the rest in a year or two's time, and perhaps at that point go SLI / crossfire.

That's an interesting proposition on that GTX 480, it seems strange that I have not heard anything else about this card in other similar situations though, and given that it has no ratings on ebuyer at all...

I've just found the GTX 560 with 2GB for £215, would that outclass the 6950, and would that run on my PSU?

 

[BarbaricSoul]

A GTX560 is just under a 6950(1% less performance with the GTX560). Your PSU will be fine with a single GTX560, but I doubt it'll handle two of them.

 

[the54thvoid]

I previously ran a GTS 8800. I'm sure these cards will be bottlenecked by my current computer but I plan to upgrade the rest in a year or two's time, and perhaps at that point go SLI / crossfire.

That's an interesting proposition on that GTX 480, it seems strange that I have not heard anything else about this card in other similar situations though, and given that it has no ratings on ebuyer at all...

I've just found the GTX 560 with 2GB for £215, would that outclass the 6950, and would that run on my PSU?

Just noticed the psu you have - the 480 would wreak havoc on it. But it is a good card, despite it's detractors. For £200 you will not get a more powerful card. The cpu bottleneck issue isn't too relevant, it's not like you're running a pentium. (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/build-balanced-platform,2469.html)

At your resolution, the 560 and 6950 are pretty much equal. You wouldn't be disappointed in either card. Ignore everybody's advice and just choose one. Neither card is worse.

 

[HexagonalBolts]

A GTX560 is just under a 6950(1% less performance with the GTX560). Your PSU will be fine with a single GTX560, but I doubt it'll handle two of them.

What about the GTX 560 2GB?:

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/72gb...2mhz-shader-1645mhz-384-cores-2x-dvi-hdmi-vga

 

[BarbaricSoul]

The cpu bottleneck issue isn't too relevant, it's not like you're running a pentium. (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/build-balanced-platform,2469.html)

Ok, I got to ask, WTF are you smoking? His stock speed q6600 will bottleneck the hell out a HD6000 or GTX500 card. The article you linked is 2 years old, and even in it, it shows the I7 920 kicking the crap out of a q9550(which is considerably faster than a q6600) when it's paired with GFX cards closer to todays performance levels (GTX295/HD4870X2). He won't get any better performance out of a GTX560 or a HD6950 then he would get out of a GTX 285(which he could get used for about half the money as a GTX560).

 

[BarbaricSoul]

What about the GTX 560 2GB?:

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/72gb...2mhz-shader-1645mhz-384-cores-2x-dvi-hdmi-vga

the 2gb cards really only offer better performance when running very high resolutions like 2560*1600 or higher

 

[ZenZimZaliben]

You need to buy a nice universal cpu cooler that will support your socket 775 and future sockets. 1155, AM3.. Then OC the crud outa that SLACR to 3.8Ghz - 4.0ghz. That should allow you to see a major improvement with little money and then get either of the cards you want. IF you can unlock the 6950 it would be the better card. Otherwise pretty much the same.

 

[HexagonalBolts]

Ok, I got to ask, WTF are you smoking? His stock speed q6600 will bottleneck the hell out a HD6000 or GTX500 card. The article you linked is 2 years old, and even in it, it shows the I7 920 kicking the crap out of a q9550(which is considerably faster than a q6600) when it's paired with GFX cards closer to todays performance levels (GTX295/HD4870X2). He won't get any better performance out of a GTX560 or a HD6950 then he would get out of a GTX 285(which he could get used for about half the money as a GTX560).

I will be updating the rest of my system over the next two years and possibly over clocking the CPU (if that would make a difference)

 

[ZenZimZaliben]

It would make a massive difference, and you shouldn't wait, get a good cooler. Your board is solid and will hit 400-450 FSB. Those Q6600 can easily clock to 3.8Ghz, that would open a whole new world for you and your newly purchased GPU.

Old thread, but good details. http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36996

 

[the54thvoid]

I'm smoking nothing my friend. Yes it's two years old but so is my i7. And my PC is still cranking out massive fps.

The bottleneck clearly appears at the Pentium level but the jump from dual to quad core shows far less. Even the i7 set up isn't massively superior. Them be mostly straight lines. The sli/xfire scaling is much better with a better processor but the merits are in the chart. Everyone goes on about cpu bottlenecks but it's not really an issue with a quad core unless your set up is scaling dependent.

Also, if programmed well, cpu isn't the issue. Often times the game coding itself is more relevant. A game that codes to the cpu will present problems but a game that codes well to the gpu will suffer far lower problems.

I'm not denying the existence of bottlenecks but with single gpu configs, it's not really a massive issue if you have a good dual core or decent quad. It's very overplayed.

All that being said, overclocking his cpu wouldn't go amiss.

 

[Dent1]

To the OP,

I think that you should avoid the today's high tier cards due to your bottleneck. It's a flawed attitude to buy a 6950 or GTX 560 today with the intention of upgrading your CPU in 2 years time because whichever "new" CPU you buy in 2 years time will over showed your aged 6950 or GTX 560.

I think your best option is to buy the last generation of high tier cards. e.g. the 6870, 5870, 6850 or 5850. These cards will shit over your old 8800 GTS and still give you great performance at a reasonable price without a huge bottleneck.

5870 £160
XFX HD 5870 1GB GDDR5 Dual DVI HDMI DP Out PCI-E.....

5850 £105
Sapphire HD 5850 XTREME 1GB GDDR5 DVI HDMI Display...

6850 £116
http://dropship.weareelectricals.co...850-%2d-1-GB-GDDR5-%2d-PCI%2dExpress-2.1.html

6870 £164 -167

Sapphire HD 6870 1GB GDDR5 DVI HDMI DisplayPort PC...

http://www.cclonline.com/product/54...E-2-1-HDMI/DisplayPort/Dual-Link-DVI/VGA0153/

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/1gb-...ce=google+shopping&utm_medium=google+shopping

Edit:

To clear things up I'm not saying that your bottleneck will affect performance detrimentally. You will still be able to game fine with your Q6600 at stock with a ATI 6950, just that if you're going to spend £200+ which is a lot of money it's a shame not to experience the 6950 at it's peak. Personally I would overclock that CPU or look into alternative and cheaper cards as listed above.

Also consider the 6950 is only a hair faster than the 5870 which is £40-50 cheaper! ---> http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/Radeon_HD_6950/29.html

 

[avatar_raq]

You need to buy a nice universal cpu cooler that will support your socket 775 and future sockets. 1155, AM3.. Then OC the crud outa that SLACR to 3.8Ghz - 4.0ghz. That should allow you to see a major improvement with little money and then get either of the cards you want. IF you can unlock the 6950 it would be the better card. Otherwise pretty much the same.

Totally agree. Best course of action IMO.

 

[HexagonalBolts]

Accidental multi-post.

 

[HexagonalBolts]

You need to buy a nice universal cpu cooler that will support your socket 775 and future sockets. 1155, AM3.. Then OC the crud outa that SLACR to 3.8Ghz - 4.0ghz. That should allow you to see a major improvement with little money and then get either of the cards you want. IF you can unlock the 6950 it would be the better card. Otherwise pretty much the same.

To the OP,

I think that you should avoid the today's high tier cards due to your bottleneck. It's a flawed attitude to buy a 6950 or GTX 560 today with the intention of upgrading your CPU in 2 years time because whichever "new" CPU you buy in 2 years time will over showed your aged 6950 or GTX 560.

I think your best option is to buy the last generation of high tier cards. e.g. the 6870, 5870, 6850 or 5850. These cards will shit over your old 8800 GTS and still give you great performance at a reasonable price without a huge bottleneck.

5870 £160
XFX HD 5870 1GB GDDR5 Dual DVI HDMI DP Out PCI-E.....

5850 £105
Sapphire HD 5850 XTREME 1GB GDDR5 DVI HDMI Display...

6850 £116
http://dropship.weareelectricals.co...850-%2d-1-GB-GDDR5-%2d-PCI%2dExpress-2.1.html

6870 £164 -167

Sapphire HD 6870 1GB GDDR5 DVI HDMI DisplayPort PC...

http://www.cclonline.com/product/54...E-2-1-HDMI/DisplayPort/Dual-Link-DVI/VGA0153/

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/1gb-...ce=google+shopping&utm_medium=google+shopping

Edit:

To clear things up I'm not saying that your bottleneck will affect performance detrimentally. You will still be able to game fine with your Q6600 at stock with a ATI 6950, just that if you're going to spend £200+ which is a lot of money it's a shame not to experience the 6950 at it's peak. Personally I would overclock that CPU or look into alternative and cheaper cards as listed above.

Also consider the 6950 is only a hair faster than the 5870 which is £40-50 cheaper! ---> http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/Radeon_HD_6950/29.html

You do make a very good point. However I *have* to buy a new graphics card now, and I expect the rest of my system will probably need replacing in a year (maybe two at a stretch) and I'm sure I'd need to buy a whole new graphics card by then at considerable expense if I opted for something that was cheaper now. The best option does indeed seem to be buying a good cooler and overclocking my CPU. Does anyone have any cooler recommendations (that would fit in the CM690)? Will My PSU be able to handle overclocking?

 

[Dent1]

You do make a very good point. However I *have* to buy a new graphics card now, and I expect the rest of my system will probably need replacing in a year (maybe two at a stretch) and I'm sure I'd need to buy a whole new graphics card by then at considerable expense if I opted for something that was cheaper now. The best option does indeed seem to be buying a good cooler and overclocking my CPU. Does anyone have any cooler recommendations (that would fit in the CM690)? Will My PSU be able to handle overclocking?

Zalman CNPS7000C, Zalman CNPS7500, Inno3D iChill X5,Scythe KATANA 3 SCKTN-3000, Arctic Freezer 13 Pro, Zalman CNPS9500A, Zalman CNPS9500A (might not fit), Zalman CNPS9500A (might not fit), Akasa Venom.

It really comes down to your motherboard as much as the cooler. Does your motherboard provide all the relevant overclocking features and can it remain stable overclocked?

What motherboard do you have?

 

[HexagonalBolts]

Zalman CNPS7000C, Zalman CNPS7500, Inno3D iChill X5,Scythe KATANA 3 SCKTN-3000, Arctic Freezer 13 Pro, Zalman CNPS9500A, Zalman CNPS9500A (might not fit), Zalman CNPS9500A (might not fit), Akasa Venom.

It really comes down to your motherboard as much as the cooler. Does your motherboard provide all the relevant overclocking features and can it remain stable overclocked?

What motherboard do you have?

Thank you very much for the recommendations.

Asus p5k premium wi-fi ap - I think is its full title.

 

[BarbaricSoul]

ASUS P5k motherboards are decent OC'ing motherboards. Cooler wise, this is all you need-

COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus RR-B10-212P-G1 "Heatp...

Inexpensive, very good performing, and will fit in your case.

 

[BarbaricSoul]

http://media.bestofmicro.com/0/G/229408/original/Totals.png

I'm smoking nothing my friend. Yes it's two years old but so is my i7. And my PC is still cranking out massive fps.

The bottleneck clearly appears at the Pentium level but the jump from dual to quad core shows far less. Even the i7 set up isn't massively superior. Them be mostly straight lines. The sli/xfire scaling is much better with a better processor but the merits are in the chart. Everyone goes on about cpu bottlenecks but it's not really an issue with a quad core unless your set up is scaling dependent.

Also, if programmed well, cpu isn't the issue. Often times the game coding itself is more relevant. A game that codes to the cpu will present problems but a game that codes well to the gpu will suffer far lower problems.

I'm not denying the existence of bottlenecks but with single gpu configs, it's not really a massive issue if you have a good dual core or decent quad. It's very overplayed.

All that being said, overclocking his cpu wouldn't go amiss.

Well I'm just gonna reply to that with a simple quote from someone on this forum that just moved from a q6600 based to a I5 2500k based system, both systems using the same HD5850.

I wouldn't be surprised if you saw a much larger performance gain than even that in some situations. I had a Q6600\4GB DDR2-800 for quite a while and went for a i5-2500k, MSI P67A-GD65, and 8GB of the same RAM you got and the biggest performance increase I saw was in gaming. Rift for example jumped from 20fps in Meridian (I have an HD5850) to upwards of 70fps on the same settings, even throwing AA on still kept me steadily above 50fps. If you do a decent amount of rendering work I believe the Z68 will interest you in the future, so keep an eye out for it.

Just got the parts, and WOW! It's impressive, awesome improvement over a 3.4GHz Core 2 Quad! I'm speechless, saw up to 100% gains on FSX / GTR² under stressful conditions. If anyone is still in doubt, the 2500k rocks HARD! Already gave it a mild overclock to 4GHz for everyday, but saw it going fine up to 4.6GHz without much effort!

Thank you guys!

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